Player Discussion: Vesalainen Thread

[nobody imp0rtant]

Honest mistake, everyone forgets the Jet/Thrashers drafted the wrong Klingberg!

They also got rid of the wrong Wheeler.

 

[GaryPoppins]

I’d give the kid a little more time. In his defence, he didn’t really have the greatest offensive players to play with on the Moose. It important for him to be a driver (which he started to do) but his quality of line mates weren’t the best

 

[surixon]

I think people also need to remember that if he was a player drafted out of the CHL, this past season would have been the first one that he would have been eligible to play in the AHL.

We still have two years left on his ELC, plenty of time left for development. One would think players like Harkins and Appelton would be a good reminder on being patient with prospects.

 

[GumbyCan2]

Typo, meant to write F, but was having a conversation with a friend about Heinola, so mixed it all up.
DAMN, the amount of times I have made my self look silly on here, because of bad multitasking.

They still hand out "F's". Oh my PTSD is acting up again.

 

[GumbyCan2]

What if he's Wheeler 2.0 and takes a few years to hit his stride?

Cool. We don't have to pay him much until he is 34!!
But still get to watch him fly.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I think people also need to remember that if he was a player drafted out of the CHL, this past season would have been the first one that he would have been eligible to play in the AHL.

We still have two years left on his ELC, plenty of time left for development. One would think players like Harkins and Appelton would be a good reminder on being patient with prospects.

Except ppl were hoping for a top 6 guy. Harkins and Apple have only been bottom 6.

 

[surixon]

Except ppl were hoping for a top 6 guy. Harkins and Apple have only been bottom 6.

The point is that sometimes prospects take a bit longer to develop then others.

He still easily has top 6 tools and potential. He just needs to continue to develop consistency in using the tools he has. Additional physical development will really help him to use his size and strength more.

 

[DRW204]

should have dealt him for a top 6 c years ago. now who knows what his value is around the league. don't think many scouting/prospect publications are high on him anymore

 

[snowkiddin]

I think he’s developing well. Often times last year he was the best player on the Moose, which is what we need to see from him.

He’s completely revamped his game and I think there’s still a good chance he becomes an effective middle six forward for us.

Also, speaking of the Moose, why can’t we ever have a competitive team in the AHL? It would probably help our prospects out a bit. Instead, our team is garbage in the A every year.

 

[Teemusalami204]

I think he’s developing well. Often times last year he was the best player on the Moose, which is what we need to see from him.

He’s completely revamped his game and I think there’s still a good chance he becomes an effective middle six forward for us.

Also, speaking of the Moose, why can’t we ever have a competitive team in the AHL? It would probably help our prospects out a bit. Instead, our team is garbage in the A every year.

I wonder that alas well. I think it’s because we draft players and completely change their game

Most players on the moose are being taught how to forget almost everything they ever done and learn how to play the jets way.

 

[JetsUK]

I think he’s developing well. Often times last year he was the best player on the Moose, which is what we need to see from him.

He’s completely revamped his game and I think there’s still a good chance he becomes an effective middle six forward for us.

Also, speaking of the Moose, why can’t we ever have a competitive team in the AHL? It would probably help our prospects out a bit. Instead, our team is garbage in the A every year.

As an STH, I agree that the last few years have made for painful viewing. At time the players and coaching staff have seemed to be visibly frustrated, although there have been periods of strong play. I do feel that Berdin's arrival helped with the team energy but even with the "development league" ethos it's hard to expect fans to shell out for a low-end product, and watching the Moose D get shelled night in and out made for a whole lot of early exits for us at least.

 

[10Ducky10]

should have dealt him for a top 6 c years ago. now who knows what his value is around the league. don't think many scouting/prospect publications are high on him anymore

The Athletic just did a article on 22 year olds and under and the Jets' list was Laine, Slamberg, KV, Heinola and Gus as their top five so KV is still ranked pretty high.

 

[Teemusalami204]

The Athletic just did a article on 22 year olds and under and the Jets' list was Laine, Slamberg, KV, Heinola and Gus as their top five so KV is still ranked pretty high.

Isn’t much else to fill that list. Doesn’t say much

 

[GaryPoppins]

As an STH, I agree that the last few years have made for painful viewing. At time the players and coaching staff have seemed to be visibly frustrated, although there have been periods of strong play. I do feel that Berdin's arrival helped with the team energy but even with the "development league" ethos it's hard to expect fans to shell out for a low-end product, and watching the Moose D get shelled night in and out made for a whole lot of early exits for us at least.

yeah, Moose have been hot garbage for the majority of their time since returning. Somethings gotta give.

 

[10Ducky10]

Isn’t much else to fill that list. Doesn’t say much

Ranked 16th so 15 teams better and 15 teams worse.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Ranked 16th so 15 teams better and 15 teams worse.

i meant putting kv in our top 5

Take Laine out of there and we would be almost last either way

 

[10Ducky10]

i meant putting kv in our top 5

Take Laine out of there and we would be almost last either way

Looking over most of the other teams' lists, I don't know their prospects well enough to say.

 

[tbcwpg]

should have dealt him for a top 6 c years ago. now who knows what his value is around the league. don't think many scouting/prospect publications are high on him anymore

We should have dealt a guy drafted in 2017, "years ago" for a top 6 C?

A) When did you decide he was such a bust that he should've been moved? Immediately? Because 2017 is barely years ago on its own.

B) Who was trading a top 6 C for a winger drafted in the late 1st?

 

[DRW204]

We should have dealt a guy drafted in 2017, "years ago" for a top 6 C?

A) When did you decide he was such a bust that he should've been moved? Immediately? Because 2017 is barely years ago on its own.

B) Who was trading a top 6 C for a winger drafted in the late 1st?

I actually never said he was a bust. He could be a top 9 fwd but definitely the chances of him being a high end top 6 has dwindled tremendously. And we should have almost any prospect on the table for a legit top 6 C signed under contract, not sure how this is even a question at this point.

Buffalo traded ROR for a package that included Tage Thompson who was a late 1st from 2016

 

[NotCommitted]

I actually never said he was a bust. He could be a top 9 fwd but definitely the chances of him being a high end top 6 has dwindled tremendously. And we should have almost any prospect on the table for a legit top 6 C signed under contract, not sure how this is even a question at this point.

Buffalo traded ROR for a package that included Tage Thompson who was a late 1st from 2016

Risto & Reinhart for KVes, Letestu & Sbisa. Buffalo you know you want it. On a second thought, Ehlers-Letestu-Laine would keep ELL going and maybe a veteran glue guy will make a difference.

 

[Jets]

yeah, Moose have been hot garbage for the majority of their time since returning. Somethings gotta give.

...which is odd considering the pre-Jets Moose. The old Moose teams still developed a ton of good players for Vancouver but also found a way to load up with the Jaffrays, Krogs and Keanes of the AHL to ice a playoff AHL team most years. I know we signed Logan Shaw to basically be that guy, but we should be able to sneak in at least a handful of good AHL vets every year rather than the current 1 or 2.

 

[tbcwpg]

I actually never said he was a bust. He could be a top 9 fwd but definitely the chances of him being a high end top 6 has dwindled tremendously. And we should have almost any prospect on the table for a legit top 6 C signed under contract, not sure how this is even a question at this point.

Buffalo traded ROR for a package that included Tage Thompson who was a late 1st from 2016

Oh, I agree that trading for a 2C is a top priority, I was just questioning your use of "years ago" to describe a 21 year old kid who apparently has no top 6 upside, and then also further questioning what value you think he had if he could've been traded for a signed top 6 centre.

 

[KingBogo]

...which is odd considering the pre-Jets Moose. The old Moose teams still developed a ton of good players for Vancouver but also found a way to load up with the Jaffrays, Krogs and Keanes of the AHL to ice a playoff AHL team most years. I know we signed Logan Shaw to basically be that guy, but we should be able to sneak in at least a handful of good AHL vets every year rather than the current 1 or 2.

The main difference then was while we were the farm team of the Canucks, the Moose was owned by TNSE so a balance needed to be made between development of Canuck prospects and icing a veteran team that prioritized winning over development.The current organization has made it clear the Moose is for the development of their young prospects. They aren't looking to get established AHL vets to take on the important roles and eat up ice time. They want their kids on the ice late in the 3rd when the game is on the line. They want them on the PP and PK etc. Sitting on the bench watching young prospects play the important roles is not particularly appealing to career AHLers.

 

[DRW204]

Oh, I agree that trading for a 2C is a top priority, I was just questioning your use of "years ago" to describe a 21 year old kid who apparently has no top 6 upside, and then also further questioning what value you think he had if he could've been traded for a signed top 6 centre.

he could have been included in a trade for a top 6 c years ago when he was getting hype and was ranked pretty highly among prospect analysts. What was difference between him and a value of a prospect like Tage Thompson in 2018? Vesalainen was probably higher. But now? who knows, his value and hype is definitely not the same anymore, hence why i am questioning if he could land one. not sure what the issue is here...

 

[DRW204]

The Athletic just did a article on 22 year olds and under and the Jets' list was Laine, Slamberg, KV, Heinola and Gus as their top five so KV is still ranked pretty high.

League-wide i am talking about. The Jets have a weak prospect pool right now since they have been picking later in drafts and trading picks. So he might be a top 3 prospect here, but on teams like Carolina, LA, Detroit, NJD, NYR, EDM, MTL, OTT, COL etc. not sure if this is the case

hockeynews latest affiliated prospects had him at 98 league wide, neither TSN and the Athletic had him in the top 50