Trades, Rumours + Expansion Theories: Off-Season Edition

[BertCorbeau]

You really shouldn't be shocked.. It's either he's resigned or traded it's black/white.

No I don't believe that bringing in another kid will replace a seasoned veteran and a good playoff performer. Kapanen has potential.. He's a couple years ago from becoming that kind of player.

JVR's defense is suspect, and his compete level is lackadaisical .. He's a fantastic offensive player but prospects like Kappy can bring the defense and compete much stronger than JVR. JVR does not drive the bus offensively either - Marner does - on that line. There is no urgency to mismanage assets for a long shot at the cup right now. The team still has work to be at the level where they want to be at to be a consistent powerhouse contender. JVR as a trade chip can help the team get there.

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[LeafSteel]

But guy and gals, it could be more funnier than you think if you knew the history.

Josh Manson, is the son of Dave Manson, who use to be a player in the NHL with the Chicago Blackhawks.

Guess which position the father played?

If you said, defenseman - you are correct.

What was Dave Manson the player like? Was he rough, like in really really rough, when he played in the Chuck Norris division against the Leafs?

Yes he was.

He was rough and fights all the time always in the penalty box, his teammates gave him the nickname Charles.

Obviously, when we watch how the son plays, we wonder when his teammates will give him the same nickname his father had.

Since the son plays in California, where political correctness rules, unlike Charles will be nicknamed to the son like his father had to him.

In fact, we probably should not even talk about here, where political correctness kind of rules too.

Papa Dave Manson also played defence for us in the early 2000's. Josh should "come home".

 

[OVO16]

Tough D LOL

lol I dont know you if you mocking the post or agreeing it with it fam.

I was just listing names from playoff teams this past season and who play and are known to play physical.

Im not big on having a full out physical D-core, but it's nice to have someone like a polak in the back end is all im sayin

 

[Bluelines]

JVR's defense is suspect, and his compete level is lackadaisical .. He's a fantastic offensive player but prospects like Kappy can bring the defense and compete much stronger than JVR. JVR does not drive the bus offensively either - Marner does - on that line. There is no urgency to mismanage assets for a long shot at the cup right now. The team still has work to be at the level where they want to be at to be a consistent powerhouse contender. JVR as a trade chip can help the team get there.

One thing not to lose focus on is we are still rebuilding, JVR is not a core player, Bozak is not a core player, they are both players who will be gone IMO when this team reaches its ultimate goal (if we ever do), Lou and Babcock have purposely targeted older players to move out and recruited, traded for players in their early or mid 20's.

Players who are towards their late twenties, early 30's are looking for a retirement contract where they can max out their dollars. that is not a slight against either player but that fact and the big 3 young guns will be looking for raises in a few years, those two things tell me JVR and Bozie will not be a Leaf after the next trade deadline.

Trading JVR or Bozie does not mean either player are bad players or on a decline, it simply means both players value to the Leafs long term is more in a trade than signing them to a long term contract.

 

[Al14]

Papa Dave Manson also played defence for us in the early 2000's. Josh should "come home".

Since Dave Manson played more games with the Hawks, on 2 separate occasions, "coming home" for Josh, should be with the Chicago Blackhawks.

 

[SprDaVE]

“Yeah, I mean I wrote a lot of the stuff I’m starting to hear,” began Friedman, referring to his latest 30 Thoughts column which was released over the weekend. “About Dallas. Obviously Anaheim.

“I think we’re all kind of wondering what Toronto is going to do. I think Toronto has got some space in the next two years. I think Toronto is going to look and say, ‘Okay, we’ve got two years before our cap is really crazy. What can we add to do that.’ I think they’re definitely involved in the Anaheim situation.

 

[thewave]

One thing not to lose focus on is we are still rebuilding, JVR is not a core player, Bozak is not a core player, they are both players who will be gone IMO when this team reaches its ultimate goal (if we ever do), Lou and Babcock have purposely targeted older players to move out and recruited, traded for players in their early or mid 20's.

Players who are towards their late twenties, early 30's are looking for a retirement contract where they can max out their dollars. that is not a slight against either player but that fact and the big 3 young guns will be looking for raises in a few years, those two things tell me JVR and Bozie will not be a Leaf after the next trade deadline.

Trading JVR or Bozie does not mean either player are bad players or on a decline, it simply means both players value to the Leafs long term is more in a trade than signing them to a long term contract.

Exactly. As it stands we could afford to replace both with guys at the Shatty and Oshie level but that will come down to if we want to pay the price. If I could get both of those guys for 10-11m I would go for it. If JVR and Bozak want in the 10-12 range I would say no thanks.

All said and done... If JVR and Bozie bring back 1st 1st 3rd and a couple prospects or whatever the add Oshie and Shatty to that. Well that is a huge haul for the leafs and sets us up very well for the future.

 

[BertCorbeau]

Exactly. As it stands we could afford to replace both with guys at the Shatty and Oshie level but that will come down to if we want to pay the price. If I could get both of those guys for 10-11m I would go for it. If JVR and Bozak want in the 10-12 range I would say no thanks.

All said and done... If JVR and Bozie bring back 1st 1st 3rd and a couple prospects or whatever the add Oshie and Shatty to that. Well that is a huge haul for the leafs and sets us up very well for the future.

Not for the team's future cap .. You're looking at 6 or 7 year deals for both Oshie and Shattenkirk - who will likely decline in the latter years of the deal. That could severely impact the team's ability to retain some young talent in the future and run into major issues.

 

[thewave]

Not for the team's future cap .. You're looking at 6 or 7 year deals for both Oshie and Shattenkirk - who will likely decline in the latter years of the deal. That could severely impact the team's ability to retain some young talent in the future and run into major issues.

It can be done. It means no more Martin, Komarov down the line though. It basically means those two are our luxury players paid 3million more than we would like overall.

 

[Daisy Jane]

“Yeah, I mean I wrote a lot of the stuff I’m starting to hear,†began Friedman, referring to his latest 30 Thoughts column which was released over the weekend. “About Dallas. Obviously Anaheim.

“I think we’re all kind of wondering what Toronto is going to do. I think Toronto has got some space in the next two years. I think Toronto is going to look and say, ‘Okay, we’ve got two years before our cap is really crazy. What can we add to do that.’ I think they’re definitely involved in the Anaheim situation.

that's what makes everything so interesting. A lot of people want to do a "typical Leafs fans." but with how full of parity this league is, don't you do a lot of crazy things cap willing (and not committing) to see what you can do before the cap reaper comes for us?

 

[BertCorbeau]

It can be done. It means no more Martin, Komarov down the line though. It basically means those two are our luxury players paid 3million more than we would like overall.

Yes it could be done for sure. My issue is the pressure it would put on the team to 'win now' may be premature and future cap problems/limited cap flexibility. That makes me want to avoid Oshie and to a lesser extent Shatty.

 

[rdawg1234]

Not for the team's future cap .. You're looking at 6 or 7 year deals for both Oshie and Shattenkirk - who will likely decline in the latter years of the deal. That could severely impact the team's ability to retain some young talent in the future and run into major issues.

Shattenkirk isn't worth the high price at all, farthest thing from what we need on defence. He also didn't look that great these playoffs.

Oshie would be just more of the same. I'm actually more interested in a cheap 2 year contract with Justin Williams, great vet winger who can slot on the 2nd/3rd line and knows how to win. Those kind of players rub off on the other guys. You could probably snag him for 3m per year. By the time he's done a lot of our prospects will be done growing.

 

[thewave]

Shattenkirk isn't worth the high price at all, farthest thing from what we need on defence. He also didn't look that great these playoffs.

Oshie would be just more of the same. I'm actually more interested in a cheap 2 year contract with Justin Williams, great vet winger who can slot on the 2nd/3rd line and knows how to win. Those kind of players rub off on the other guys. You could probably snag him for 3m per year. By the time he's done a lot of our prospects will be done growing.

Right but at that point we may not make the PO. That's the decision. Jvr bozak in we fight for the wildcard again. Jvr bozak out and guys like you say... We are not making the PO. Jvr Bozak out Shatty Oshie in, probably in the PO.

 

[Visnovsky]

I'm wondering, if Alzner saw the potential in Toronto when playing against them in the playoffs, and would like to join the team - he'd be a great pair for Zaitsev. Tampa got Strålman for a discount in the past, and these discount signings have happened before, makes me think about a potential signing for about the same price as Zaitsev (4.5x5). It would take Alzner through his prime with a good price. I know, I know, he's advanced stats do not look good, but I haven't seen him play a really bad game ever - but I must admin, I haven't watched too many of Washington's matches in the past few seasons.

If we'd get Alzner for a discount, we could fit another TOP4 D-man in the group. Benning said previously that he probably could think about moving Tanev, if the trade made sense for the future of the club. Isn't Kapanen something they'd need? A two-way top 6 forward prospect who's showed that he has great potential, in the games he's played with the Leafs. Anything that we could add on top of Kapanen? Someone like Valiev/Lindberg/Carrick and a pick (second next year?)? Tanev has had some injuries, I'm aware of that, but I don't think that this is something that should be passed, if it was a possibility - he's a top pairing D with a (admittedly a short) history with playing well with Rielly.

Let's say our D would be something like this to start the season:

Rielly-Tanev
Alzner-Zaitsev
Rosen/Dermott-x

That D would be around 22-23 million, depending on whose with Rosen/Dermott. There a heck of a lot of experience in that defence, and it wouldn't put a huge pressure for someone like Dermott or Rosen to succeed.

There's a big chance that nothing even close to these magnitude of changes even happen - in my eyes this is the perfect scenario.

When it comes to the forwards, Justin Williams would be a great pick up IMO, he'd bring in valuable experience for the youngsters that we have.

I'm on board if JVR is getting traded this summer, but it's gotta be for a D-man, not picks and/or prospects. A steady D, if for example, Tanev doesn't pan out (as I've fantasized).

The Tanev thing has been beaten to death, I know, but still it's our best shot for a top pairing D.

Also, I left Gardiner out for the sake of a surprise deal. Don't know who we're dealing him for, but I just have a gut feeling.

 

[Erndog]

That second pair of Alzner-Zaitsev would have such trouble moving the puck.

Really, we'd be left with Rielly and a rookie in Dermott as the puck carriers. Not sure that D is much better off.

I don't really have much of an interest in Alzner.

 

[Visnovsky]

That second pair of Alzner-Zaitsev would have such trouble moving the puck.

Really, we'd be left with Rielly and a rookie in Dermott as the puck carriers. Not sure that D is much better off.

I don't really have much of an interest in Alzner.

Yeah, that might be true, but I have faith in Zaitsev improving in his second season. He has really good puck skills, but yeah, he's not a puck carrier - which could cause problems with that pairing.

 

[Mess]

On the rumours board it claims the Ducks are interested in Connor Brown and if true then it would be a young Dman Leafs would be seeking in return.

Could Brown return Brandon Montour a young RHD puck moving Dman?

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Please no Alzner... He is going to be a major regret to anyone who signs him. Way too slow to play on this team, and arguably the majority of the NHL. Would not be surprised to see him not even be NHL quality in a few years.

 

[Walshy7]

On the rumours board it claims the Ducks are interested in Connor Brown and if true then it would be a young Dman Leafs would be seeking in return.

Could Brown return Brandon Montour a young RHD puck moving Dman?

this was Firedman speculating that Dave Nonis liked brown a lot because he drafted him. Dave Nonis isn't the one making a decision to trade for brown also. I really don't think brown brings back Montour without decent +

 

[thewave]

On the rumours board it claims the Ducks are interested in Connor Brown and if true then it would be a young Dman Leafs would be seeking in return.

Could Brown return Brandon Montour a young RHD puck moving Dman?

Never know but I would convert Brown into a young D for sure.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

On the rumours board it claims the Ducks are interested in Connor Brown and if true then it would be a young Dman Leafs would be seeking in return.

Could Brown return Brandon Montour a young RHD puck moving Dman?

I wouldn't trade Brown for Montour at all, never mind straight up. Unless it's for Manson or Lindholm, I don't see a deal with Anaheim since those two seem to be close to untouchable. Fowler, Vatanen, Theodore and Montour simply do not do it for me at this point in time. I like Theodore, but we have guys fighting for similar spots right now so it's not a great fit.

What do I know though

We don't need a pure puck mover. As long as he knows how to handle the puck, which is likely any candidate we'd consider anyways, he is more than enough considering Rielly would be doing the majority of the puck moving as it is.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Never know but I would convert Brown into a young D for sure.

It would have the be the right one, but sure. I would never trade Brown to get someone like Montour. He played well in the playoffs, but it is not like the guy was this year's Matt Murray or anything. We'd want someone who has at least played a full season in the NHL at a similar level as Brown. Finding top 4 young RD may be rare, but finding guys like Brown isn't easy either.

 

[Buds17]

On the rumours board it claims the Ducks are interested in Connor Brown and if true then it would be a young Dman Leafs would be seeking in return.

Could Brown return Brandon Montour a young RHD puck moving Dman?

Don't know if it works for either side anyway (perhaps especially with Anaheim's injuries), but Anaheim likely wouldn't want/be able to do that pre-expansion since Brown requires protection, and IIRC, Montour doesn't.

 

[Celly Hard]

It would have the be the right one, but sure. I would never trade Brown to get someone like Montour. He played well in the playoffs, but it is not like the guy was this year's Matt Murray or anything. We'd want someone who has at least played a full season in the NHL at a similar level as Brown. Finding top 4 young RD may be rare, but finding guys like Brown isn't easy either.

lol, we wouldnt get montour for brown without adding a significant +

 

[Daisy Jane]

Dorian says it's not out of the realm of possibility that they'll ask Dion to wave his NMC.