Player Discussion Thomas Vanek

[DL44]

Just like Vrbata right?

Vanek doesnt have a No Trade Clause.
If he did, i doubt he would pull a Vrbata and list non playoff teams like Az to be traded to. Allegedly.

 

[terrible dee]

We need him to have a decent year so we can flip him for something at the trade deadline.

This is the problem,

Everyone justified the singing as a means to a draft pick at the deadline

Our denial runs deep

Do you think for one second, Benning has ANY intention of flipping Vanek? Hell no! I swear to god, in Jim's mind, he is offensive depth for the playoffs this year.

Remember last year, with 5 games to go before the deadline and the Canucks a league-wide joke, Benning said "Well, I'm not looking to trade anyone now, we have 5 games to see what we've got" (can you BELIEVE he would say that?!) " We were in a playoff spot not to long ago, so we have to see what we've got"

Never for one second that Jim has been here has making the playoffs THAT year not been what he thought would happen.

This year is no different, why do you think Boesser and Virtanen's deployment has been a joke?

Because he doesn't really want either of them here this year, he wants his duct-taped-together-dumpster-diver team of F.A vets to gel AND MAKE THE PLAYOFFS

He's not trading Vanek for anything, he wants to sign him for another two years after he distinguishes himself in this years post-season,

The biggest disconnect between fans and management is that fans just can't accept that Jim is not concerned with winning a cup, he was brought in because he promised he could cheat the inevitable life-cycle stages of an NHL team, Aqua didn't like the bottom line falling, he wants the playoff revenue and he wants is FAST, that has been Jim's ONLY goal since day one, and talk to the contrary has just been to appease fans, there is no intention of a "re-build" or anything like it, what they want is two playoff rounds a year, with the maximum number of home games,

Why would Benning flip Vanek for a pick? He'd just go right back out and sign someone like him, and he's no smart enough to engineer a "Well trade you and bring you back" plan with Vanek's agent.

Make no mistake, NOTHING has changed with this management team, NOTHING,

He was forced into the deals at the deadline last year after having not done proper due diligence, consequently what we received were prospects the other team didn't care about and we're going to get rid of anyway.

Put it this way, for Burrows and Hansen we received two Nic Jenssens or Two Jordan Shreoders,

Or a Jenssen and a Shreaoder, that's how much the Sens and Sharks valued those prospects, they would have been let go of anyway.

But this year, Jim is going to act like a REAL GM and not a delusional 90's minor league GM?

Not on your life, there will be no trade at the deadline Vanek will still be here with an extension on the table.

Don't be fooled, the management in Van has not changed one bit.

 

[VanJack]

This is the problem,

Everyone justified the singing as a means to a draft pick at the deadline

Our denial runs deep

Do you think for one second, Benning has ANY intention of flipping Vanek? Hell no! I swear to god, in Jim's mind, he is offensive depth for the playoffs this year.

Remember last year, with 5 games to go before the deadline and the Canucks a league-wide joke, Benning said "Well, I'm not looking to trade anyone now, we have 5 games to see what we've got" (can you BELIEVE he would say that?!) " We were in a playoff spot not to long ago, so we have to see what we've got"

Never for one second that Jim has been here has making the playoffs THAT year not been what he thought would happen.

This year is no different, why do you think Boesser and Virtanen's deployment has been a joke?

Because he doesn't really want either of them here this year, he wants his duct-taped-together-dumpster-diver team of F.A vets to gel AND MAKE THE PLAYOFFS

He's not trading Vanek for anything, he wants to sign him for another two years after he distinguishes himself in this years post-season,

The biggest disconnect between fans and management is that fans just can't accept that Jim is not concerned with winning a cup, he was brought in because he promised he could cheat the inevitable life-cycle stages of an NHL team, Aqua didn't like the bottom line falling, he wants the playoff revenue and he wants is FAST, that has been Jim's ONLY goal since day one, and talk to the contrary has just been to appease fans, there is no intention of a "re-build" or anything like it, what they want is two playoff rounds a year, with the maximum number of home games,

Why would Benning flip Vanek for a pick? He'd just go right back out and sign someone like him, and he's no smart enough to engineer a "Well trade you and bring you back" plan with Vanek's agent.

Make no mistake, NOTHING has changed with this management team, NOTHING,

He was forced into the deals at the deadline last year after having not done proper due diligence, consequently what we received were prospects the other team didn't care about and we're going to get rid of anyway.

Put it this way, for Burrows and Hansen we received two Nic Jenssens or Two Jordan Shreoders,

Or a Jenssen and a Shreaoder, that's how much the Sens and Sharks valued those prospects, they would have been let go of anyway.

But this year, Jim is going to act like a REAL GM and not a delusional 90's minor league GM?

Not on your life, there will be no trade at the deadline Vanek will still be here with an extension on the table.

Don't be fooled, the management in Van has not changed one bit.

Really depends on the standings....in a worst case scenario they're in the thick of a playoff race, and Jimbo doesn't trade anybody because "how can you do that to the Sedins in their last year?"......best case scenario they're done by Xmas and then the exodus can start in earnest at the trade deadline.

But that's what makes it so tough being a Canucks fan these days......you always hope for your team to win, but deep down you know it isn't in the best long=term interest of the franchise if they do. And the GM seems to be in the "win-now" mode at all costs, otherwise why go out and sign six UFA's?....but then maybe he figures he wouldn't survive another 29th place finish. Who really knows?

 

[RebuildinVan]

60 points??

I’ll be amazed if he scores 40. 60 would be a dream.

If hes on pace 60 we could cash in at the trade dealine

 

[DDRhockey]

If hes on pace 60 we could cash in at the trade dealine

He is worth a 4th at most.

 

[JuniorNelson]

Adding Vanek seems counter intuitive for sure. Canucks just do not need anymore slow, soft guys. Then they bundle him with the Sedins!

Vanek's value increased when Eriksson was injured. Canucks could build a balanced attack across four lines if they want. They will keep the anchor line, though. It's foundational.

 

[Melvin]

It is going to be funny when Vanek is not traded at the deadline and we get a bunch of excuses and then next year we sign some other junk which is rationalized by the idea that he will be "flipped at the deadline." Everything new is old.

 

[topched88]

Count me as someone who really really likes the Vanek Signing.

These are the types of players and more importantly contracts we should have been targeting to "insulate" our youth and provide a "stable" environment. Vanek will be tainted by the fat that he ends up closing a spot for one of our youth players, which I agree with. However, the vanek signing was never the problem. The Ericksson, ganger, sutter, etc etc signings are the problems. It blows my mind that we had to give up term and dollars for those guys, yet they have been out shined by vanek this year. What makes it worse is I dont think this was a unique situation... there is always vanek types avaliable in the bargain bin, we just chose to blow our brains out instead.

 

[RandV]

Yeah the Vanek signing is much more appropriate than Eriksson or Gagner. But adding to what was said above if you're thinking he was acquired simply to flip at the deadline then judging by last season he's about the worse guy you could get: 48-15-23-38 for Detroit and all he got them was a 3rd. If you're focusing on rebuilding that's hardly worth the bump in the standings he'll get you lowering the rank of your 1st rounder.

 

[VancouverJagger]

What the hell were those who are hating on this signing thinking? We should continue to let Chaput and Megna take his spot? Or was it that we should throw our amazing youth to the wolves and baptize them by fire?

Like really what is the issue here? He's on a great contract and so far has been one of our better forwards this season (granted that isn't saying a lot). Quit being blinded by your anger for management and try for a second to realize that there was ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with this signing - in fact it is looking pretty good right about now.

 

[krutovsdonut]

well we do need to get a 4th back.

 

[denkiteki]

If hes on pace 60 we could cash in at the trade dealine

Something to remember...

He had 38 points in 48 games last year at the deadline. That's a 65 point pace and guess what he got? A 3rd rounder. If he keeps up this pace, he might be worth a 3rd rounder at the deadline. If he scores 20+ goals (instead of 15g/23a), maybe that bumps up to a 2nd at the deadline.

That's better than nothing but honestly i would take Virtanen/Boeser playing more vs that 3rd round pick. On top of that, if we aren't making the playoffs, Vanek also does one other negative thing for us... he MIGHT help us win a few games resulting in us being higher in the standings.

Of course if Boeser/Virtanen end up being able to play 60+ games each (assuming no injuries), then Vanek probably didn't block their development. Also one fear was Vanek taking away opportunity from Boeser with the Sedins (and he did for the first few games but it looked like Green finally decided to try Boeser/Gagner with the Twins instead of Vanek all the time).

Overall i didn't like the Vanek signing when we signed him. It looks a bit better right now because it looks like we are getting the Red Wings/Wild version of Vanek and not Florida. Of course Eriksson getting hurt probably makes this signing look a bit better too (since it frees up a roster spot... at least for today/yesterday's game, since the biggest problem with Vanek signing is him taking up a spot away from Virtanen/Boeser/Goldobin).

 

[ItalianCanuck1]

I really can't hate this signing.

You have plenty of valid reasons to say that was a mistake, but I simply enjoy watching him on the ice.

 

[Deeds26]

Just remember to keep liking Vanek, that way Benning wont try and sign him to a long, expensive extension. He only does that to players we dont like. (Sbisa, Sutter)

 

[TruGr1t]

We need some sort of trade deadline value tracker for this guy. Trending upward.

 

[LeftCoast]

I would like to give Benning credit for signing Vanek with plans to trade him at the TDL, but I've seen no evidence of Benning being that strategic. He's a Plough Horse not a Thoroughbred. If the plan, or result (either way) is that Vanek is traded at the TDL, the benefits are numerous. If Vanek garners a 3rd round pick, we improve our prospect depth for the pro-rated cost of a $2M contract. The perfect situation for a guy like Goldobin would be to absolutely dominate in the AHL and be called up mid-season full of confidence - with a coach who might actually play him. It would also open up a top 6 spot and PP time for an expanded role for Boeser, Virtanen, Goldobin, Burmistrov, etc.

But let's hear what the messaging sounds like in Feb - if Benning starts talking about making a "hockey" trade, be prepared for another reclamation project. Not that I'm against reclamation projects, but at this point, it would be far better to have more horses in the race at the draft.

 

[Ryp37]

What the hell were those who are hating on this signing thinking? We should continue to let Chaput and Megna take his spot? Or was it that we should throw our amazing youth to the wolves and baptize them by fire?

Like really what is the issue here? He's on a great contract and so far has been one of our better forwards this season (granted that isn't saying a lot). Quit being blinded by your anger for management and try for a second to realize that there was ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong with this signing - in fact it is looking pretty good right about now.

Who said anything about Chaput and Megna? It's been explained several times but you clearly glossed over it.

We didn't need both Gagner and Vanek, and it's looking like Vanek is clearly the better choice.

 

[ItalianCanuck1]

Why don't you shoot, Thomas?

 

[biturbo19]

That Buffalo game had a hysterical set of examples of a guy who just doesn't look like he gives a crap. I was getting some good laughs out of it at least. But it would be better if he'd do less of that. He does have skill that this team needs, and he can make an impact when he actually cares a little bit.

 

[MrRuin]

Why don't you shoot, Thomas?

The single biggest problem in Vanek's game since leaving Buffalo. He is always looking for the cute, tap in play. He used to shoot and score AND make plays. Now a lot of times he forgets about the first two parts of his early career game. It's mind numbingly frustrating as a long time supporter and follower. He just doesn't do it anymore and hasn't been doing it for years I am sorry to say. This part of his game will not change anymore I am afraid

His shot totals from 05 to 12/13 were 1635 shots in 585 games, 2.8 per game approximately and 204 per season of those first (his best) 8 years. Since then he has 698 shots in 300 games which comes to 2.32 shots per game and 174.5 shots per season. With his career shooting % of 14.2% this alone nets him around 4.2 fewer goals a season.

 

[Peen]

He is worth a 4th at most.

I would pay more than that for Vanek at the TDL. His offensive ability is there, doesn't play a slow game and is actually quite aggressive and willing on the forecheck. If I'm a playoff team looking for a scoring injection for my top nine, I would pay a 2nd if the market is dry or a 3rd if the market is flooded. He's a better player than Vrbata, clearly IMO.

 

[DL44]

The single biggest problem in Vanek's game since leaving Buffalo. He is always looking for the cute, tap in play. He used to shoot and score AND make plays. Now a lot of times he forgets about the first two parts of his early career game. It's mind numbingly frustrating as a long time supporter and follower. He just doesn't do it anymore and hasn't been doing it for years I am sorry to say. This part of his game will not change anymore I am afraid

His shot totals from 05 to 12/13 were 1635 shots in 585 games, 2.8 per game approximately and 204 per season of those first (his best) 8 years. Since then he has 698 shots in 300 games which comes to 2.32 shots per game and 174.5 shots per season. With his career shooting % of 14.2% this alone nets him around 4.2 fewer goals a season.

To his credit he at least understands he became more of a passer when he went to Minny and that he's actually looking to focus on becoming a finisher again here with us... It will come.. He's smart guy and with a little video work off his last few games, it should quickly be pretty obvious to him what he should do the next time he's coming down on a 2 on 1...

 

[VanJack]

I was prepared to think the worst of the Vanek signing and dump all over it, but have to admit that he hasn't been half bad so far this year....you can certainly live with him for a year while kids like Goldobin and Dahlen continue to develop.....but that Gagner signing....yikes!....looking like another clanger from Jimbo.

 

[RebuildinVan]

I did not like the signing at the time, but regretably have to say I dont mind it... at the moment

 

[F A N]

I would pay more than that for Vanek at the TDL. His offensive ability is there, doesn't play a slow game and is actually quite aggressive and willing on the forecheck. If I'm a playoff team looking for a scoring injection for my top nine, I would pay a 2nd if the market is dry or a 3rd if the market is flooded. He's a better player than Vrbata, clearly IMO.

He won't be worth that. The problem with Vanek is that like Ryan Miller, he was recently a deadline acquisition that bombed. Teams can't be sure what they are going to get out of Vanek anymore. The Panthers' version of him sucked. With that said, I'm glad that Vanek seems to have fit in well with the Canucks.