Prospect Info: The Prospect Thread

[BfantZ]

He almost made the team this year , with the season hes had/having I would be shocked if nill doesnt leave room for him next season . Disappointing to see guryanov scratched. I wonder if he’s been playing through an injury .

 

[Troy McClure]

I think he’s been trying to play through a lack of hockey ability for a few years now.

 

[Mr Misty]

Why does Jim Nill have a job?

 

[BfantZ]

I think he’s been trying to play through a lack of hockey ability for a few years now.

19 goals this year playing on the 3rd line in the ahl. I would have to disagree . Or do you have to be in the nhl at 21 to be someone with hockey ability ?

 

[MBTendy]

Shapiro: Not set in stone, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Nick Caamano join the Texas Stars during the Calder Cup Final.

 

[Troy McClure]

Why does Jim Nill have a job?

Because he was given a big extension a couple of seasons ago, and Gaglardi is too cheap to buy Nill out.

 

[Troy McClure]

19 goals this year playing on the 3rd line in the ahl. I would have to disagree . Or do you have to be in the nhl at 21 to be someone with hockey ability ?

In todays’s NHL, yes.

2015 NHL Entry Draft Picks at hockeydb.com

 

[jballa95]

In todays’s NHL, yes.

2015 NHL Entry Draft Picks at hockeydb.com

I mean it's easy to look back and criticize the team's scouts and gm for not picking the player who turned out better, but in the case of Gurianov, I think the criticism is justified. Most fans wanted Barzal and most rankings had Barzal or Connor around while Gurianov was ranked by most in the mid to late 20s and into the second round. But I'm willing to see if Nill can learn from his mistakes, and really re-adjust his scouting strategy. If not then I wouldn't be sad to see him and some of the top level scouts let go. Funny thing is Boston had 3 chances at drafting Barzal or Connor and ended up with Jake Debrusk and two busts. So the Stars weren't the only ones.

 

[Mr Misty]

I mean it's easy to look back and criticize the team's scouts and gm for not picking the player who turned out better, but in the case of Gurianov, I think the criticism is justified. Most fans wanted Barzal and most rankings had Barzal or Connor around while Gurianov was ranked by most in the mid to late 20s and into the second round. But I'm willing to see if Nill can learn from his mistakes, and really re-adjust his scouting strategy. If not then I wouldn't be sad to see him and some of the top level scouts let go. Funny thing is Boston had 3 chances at drafting Barzal or Connor and ended up with Jake Debrusk and two busts. So the Stars weren't the only ones.

What's funny is comparing Bruins picks to ours since Nill got here. The draft capital is about the same but they churn out contributors and Nill has nothing but a lottery win.

 

[BfantZ]

If your saying he hasn’t lived up to expectations of a 12 overall pick that’s understandable , but it’s not his fault he was drafted where he was and now has all this pressure on him . I would say he’s still progressing Farley well though and people wouldn’t be so sour about him if he had been a second round pick .

 

[jballa95]

What's funny is comparing Bruins picks to ours since Nill got here. The draft capital is about the same but they churn out contributors and Nill has nothing but a lottery win.

The one thing Nill has going for him is that the last 2 drafts were better than the previous 2.
In 2014 and 2015, The Stars drafted possible NHLers in Honka, Hintz, maybe but I doubt Gurianov, you could also argue for Cecconi or Nyberg but I have little faith in either, and doubt either will play more than 10 games in the NHL.

In 2016 and 2017, the possible NHLers are Tufte, Caamano, Point, Heiskanen, Oettinger, Robertson, maybe one of the several CHLers but I doubt it. So 6 possible NHLers compared to 2, so maybe some improvement? We'll see. And I realize this is a very simplified way of looking at the drafting, but it's just a thought.

 

[Smelling Salt]

Funny thing is Boston had 3 chances at drafting Barzal or Connor and ended up with Jake Debrusk and two busts. So the Stars weren't the only ones.

And I remember them being eviscerated for it on this site. Like Misty alluded to though, it's easier to forgot the bad selections when they did well with other picks.

In 2016 and 2017, the possible NHLers are Tufte, Caamano, Point, Heiskanen, Oettinger, Robertson, maybe one of the several CHLers but I doubt it. So 6 possible NHLers compared to 2, so maybe some improvement? We'll see. And I realize this is a very simplified way of looking at the drafting, but it's just a thought.

I'm also optimistic some solid players came out of those two drafts, but aside from Heiskanen there still isn't anything that gets me THAT excited. I'd like to think Dallas hit on at least one of the goalies and Robertson looks intriguing. After that though, I think Caamano gets hyped a bit because of his good camp and recent playoffs but it's not like he's a high end junior player. Tufte doesn't do it for me at all. Another "drafted cause he's big" kind of guy IMO.

Ultimately it's quite likely I don't know WTF I am talking about and I would LOVE to be wrong. I'm pretty pessimistic after Nill and co's recent drafting record and eye for young talent. In fact I think they are extremely bad at it. This could be Nill's last draft coming up if the Stars don't make the playoffs again this year.

 

[jballa95]

And I remember them being eviscerated for it on this site. Like Misty alluded to though, it's easier to forgot the bad selections when they did well with other picks.



I'm also optimistic some solid players came out of those two drafts, but aside from Heiskanen there still isn't anything that gets me THAT excited. I'd like to think Dallas hit on at least one of the goalies and Robertson looks intriguing. After that though, I think Caamano gets hyped a bit because of his good camp and recent playoffs but it's not like he's a high end junior player. Tufte doesn't do it for me at all. Another "drafted cause he's big" kind of guy IMO.

Ultimately it's quite likely I don't know WTF I am talking about and I would LOVE to be wrong. I'm pretty pessimistic after Nill and co's recent drafting record and eye for young talent. In fact I think they are extremely bad at it. This could be Nill's last draft coming up if the Stars don't make the playoffs again this year.

I agree, Heiskanen is the one prospect to be truly excited about. Caamano and Tufte, if they do become NHLers, will likely be solid middle to bottom 6 wingers. Robertson has the shot and offensive IQ to be a top 6, but he is still a big unknown, he likely couldn't adjust to become a bottom 6er. So hes a top 6 NHLer or a top 6 AHLer. And Goalies are Goalies.

 

[________]

 

[Starry Knight]

I think Caamano amounts to roughly the same player as Gemel Smith or Remi Elie. A decent 4th liner who plays a decent energy game.

 

[MrHeiskanen]

I think Caamano amounts to roughly the same player as Gemel Smith or Remi Elie. A decent 4th liner who plays a decent energy game.

Yea I see his offense translating a little bit better tho, not like some crazy scorer or anything but his shot is better overall.

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Random thought. Nill says he likes his prospects over ripe. Maybe he means smell, and then drafts stinky prospects to accelerate the over ripe process?

 

[Mr Misty]

Random thought. Nill has a terrible record of drafting but is about to be given a permanent pass because Heiskanen fell into his lap.

 

[Troy McClure]

Random thought. Nill has a terrible record of drafting but is about to be given a permanent pass because Heiskanen fell into his lap.

Yep. If they make the playoffs this coming season, his job is safe, even if none of his other draft picks show any signs of contributing.

 

[eartotheground]

Of the many Nill bitches..
Won’t play young players
Won’t draft for skill
Only hires old school retread coaches
Doesn’t develop young talent

Has not his words and actions shown an adaptation to the new NHL? He was successful in the old style seemingly bc he’s a pretty bright and passionate individual. Now he’s addressing some of the biggest concerns.. is there anyone else who has hope besides me? You can’t expect people that have been in this sport for decades to evolve overnight, but show me the GM that’s done an about face as quickly and publicly as this.

(I’m assuming that the draft for skill not size is a go forward method, the other issues, at least in stance and hires, have been corrected)

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Yeah, but the big changes are sort of a double edged sword. He was obviously hired to implement the Detroit plan here. Now, he seemingly admits a lot of that didn't work here. So, in an era when most teams take 3 years or so to turn around, he has come back full circle, almost starting again. (IF Seguin leaves, we might actually be back at square 1)

I agree with you that NOT winning the SC is not necessarily the bar, even though that is the ideal. There is only a 3% chance of that happening in any year. But constant forward progress towards that is the bar, and at the moment, we have had more up and down gyrations than the stock market.

And, my biggest Niewy complaint is he never seemed to draft for a team identity, he flip flopped back and forth. Nill has been consistent on size, at least. And, we aren't a slow team, just not the fastest. Somehow, we just haven't acquired enough skill, except under Ruff's wide open system, where they scored, but were terrible at D. Went too far the other way with Hitch, now hopefully somewhere back to the middle.

Biggest problem is, who knows with a rookie coach?

 

[Mr Misty]

The top Detroit teams played a possession style of hockey and Nill was a "scout." The point of hiring him was to get somebody who didn't need to go on a 5 year mission to discover it wasn't the 1990s anymore, he was supposed to have realized this already. And also be competent at drafting. He hasn't done any of that yet, how many years of waiting does he get to show something?

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Well, not up to you or me. Looking at bigger pictures, how many organizations are long term successes by constantly flipping GM's and coaches vs. those who change often?

Think Cowboys, I guess. While Jimmy Johnson only took 3 years to make playoffs, and 4 to win a SB, Landry stayed around forever, and took 6 years to make playoffs and 7 to win SB. They were clearly in need of change and were better off with the younger Johnson (aren't we all....) but not so much replacing JJ with BS (take that as you may) or the next 5 coaching changes.

I guess I am saying before you change out Nill, you better have a pretty good idea of who might be better at G Ming, because most change outs don't end well.

Hopefully, college coach Monty will have same results as college coach JJ, or even young Hitch.

 

[Mr Misty]

We have made zero discernible progress under his leadership. I struggle to think of a team with less to show for their drafting than us. But let's not change because it could be worse.

 

[BfantZ]

It typically takes prospects 3-4 years to develop to nhl players . If we fire him right now it’s not even giving the players from his second draft a full chance to develop. The oldest players that he’s drafted for us are only 23. How can we say anyone drafted after 2014 is a bad pick right now ? Some of you’s talk like he’s literally drafted absolute obvious garbage for players when in reality his picks are all pretty decent and your just mad because we haven’t drafted any GREAT players who can immidiately be a top 6 forward .Did no one notice that tufte led his team in goals this year . Hintz was second on Texas in goals this year , guryanov was 3rd? None of them have been Matt barzal but there all still doing pretty good .