The Athletic - 2018/19 NHL Farm system rankings

[Deficient Mode]

¨
Talking about this: https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/habs-prospects-final-ranking.2527189/
Given that it's on the Habs board I assume it's mostly Habs fans voting. 0% top 5 votes, 10% bottom 5 (leaguewide). That was with Mete still counted as a prospect.

Habs fans are notoriously pessimistic

 

[Dbrownss]

Somehow missed that lol sorry...

I'm not sure hes a better skater than Rasmussen, neither are elite but both are very good skaters. Rasmussen finished top 5 at the top prospects game in the skating drills and looks fast for a big guy especially (Frost excels at CHL’s Top Prospects Sport Testing Combine – Soo Greyhounds). I would counter Thomas's vision advantage by saying that Rasmussen is a much better scorer and a much better puck protector. I wont argue Poehling, hes an NCAA guy and the worst of that gorup I think, but I dont think skating separates Rasmussen and Thomas. Its not like Thomas is a Forementon level skater, theyre both very good, not elite skaters.

Thomas may not be a burner but he's above average but his edgework is top notch. He's very elusive with the puck. I wouldn't argue against Rasmussen being a better puck protector, he has a huge size advantage. With that said, Thomas is very good along the boards and in the corners himself.

 

[PKWeber]

¨
Talking about this: https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/habs-prospects-final-ranking.2527189/
Given that it's on the Habs board I assume it's mostly Habs fans voting. 0% top 5 votes, 10% bottom 5 (leaguewide). That was with Mete still counted as a prospect.

Some of those votes are not from hab fans

 

[Daximus]

Well every writer and scout has their own preferences.

But Yeah, most of those teams have good young teams. I think having Boston and Winnipeg d9wn there puts them in a rather precarious position though. They both have key players on the downside of their careers. Tgeir window may be shorter than you think. They may never really get a window.

Jets still have still have Vesalainen, Niku, Appleton, Lemieux, Samberg and many more in the system. It may not be a top system in the league but I feel it will line up with our window perfectly.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I never claimed that he watches more than anyone else just because he is Corey Pronman - though I will go as far to say that he is likely a better evaluator of talent than most people around here. He watches essentially every prospect in the league for every team, while you've admitted you mainly only focus on Wings prospects. As you also conceded, that can lead to some biases. In that sense, you can see why it makes more sense to take the opinions of someone who does scouting and evaluation as a career and does not have any team allegiances, over Wings fans talking about their prospects. It's totally fair to disagree, because a scout will never have a perfect record and some takes will be way off, but at the end of the day you can tell just by reading the effort and time committed to this work, and the professionalism that goes with it.

So again, it's not gospel, and I don't mean to accuse Wings fans of homerism, but after years of reading scouting reports I have found that Pronman, in my opinion, is one of the best in the business - and I think the Wings' ranking is totally fair.

And this year I found his assessment of the WHL guys wanting. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised that in a year where the WHL produced just two first round picks and four total picks in the first two rounds that he didn't seem to spend a lot of time out west. I know there were AJHL and BCHL guys that went as well but it was a weak year out west. I just get the feeling he was not exposed enough to them by his comments in the sections and some of the write up. I personally don't only focus on just the Wings guys, really a draft eligible and Wings slant in terms of when I watch. Again you cannot see everyone, I just was pointing out some of what he put with Cholowski and Rasmussen don't make sense and to me it screams of where Pronman is located and the WHL being extremely bad last year in the draft.

For instance we know the WHL is loaded for the 2019 draft. A player having the kind of second half and playoff Rasmussen had isn't going to get a comment like Corey made about not dominating because he would have likely been witness to it more than apparently he was. That is important here, if you play in a weak league in any particular year it impacts him. For instance he admitted to not seeing much in terms of Minnesota high school last year because it was a weak year and he didn't budget it in.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Some of those votes are not from hab fans

Probably true, especially after the link has been posted a few times.

 

[JohnLennon]

And this year I found his assessment of the WHL guys wanting. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised that in a year where the WHL produced just two first round picks and four total picks in the first two rounds that he didn't seem to spend a lot of time out west. I know there were AJHL and BCHL guys that went as well but it was a weak year out west. I just get the feeling he was not exposed enough to them by his comments in the sections and some of the write up. I personally don't only focus on just the Wings guys, really a draft eligible and Wings slant in terms of when I watch. Again you cannot see everyone, I just was pointing out some of what he put with Cholowski and Rasmussen don't make sense and to me it screams of where Pronman is located and the WHL being extremely bad last year in the draft.

For instance we know the WHL is loaded for the 2019 draft. A player having the kind of second half and playoff Rasmussen had isn't going to get a comment like Corey made about not dominating because he would have likely been witness to it more than apparently he was. That is important here, if you play in a weak league in any particular year it impacts him. For instance he admitted to not seeing much in terms of Minnesota high school last year because it was a weak year and he didn't budget it in.

All very fair points. I get what you're saying now. I don't know what Pronman did or didn't watch, but if you've seen these guys a lot I can totally understand why you'd have a difference of opinion with him.

This year seems massive in the development of Cholowski and Svechnikov. I'm hoping Svech stays in the AHL for a bit so he can truly dominate and bring that confidence with him in the NHL when he transitions, instead of being forced onto the NHL club. But maybe Wings staff will feel he's ready, or maybe he'll dominate at camp? Who knows, but I think if they both struggle to take a step forward this year, it's definitely not a good sign. On the bright side, I think Hronek is perfectly aligned to make a smooth transition into the NHL and make a difference on the Wings' powerplay from game 1.

 

[Mrb1p]

And this year I found his assessment of the WHL guys wanting. Maybe I shouldn't be surprised that in a year where the WHL produced just two first round picks and four total picks in the first two rounds that he didn't seem to spend a lot of time out west. I know there were AJHL and BCHL guys that went as well but it was a weak year out west. I just get the feeling he was not exposed enough to them by his comments in the sections and some of the write up. I personally don't only focus on just the Wings guys, really a draft eligible and Wings slant in terms of when I watch. Again you cannot see everyone, I just was pointing out some of what he put with Cholowski and Rasmussen don't make sense and to me it screams of where Pronman is located and the WHL being extremely bad last year in the draft.

For instance we know the WHL is loaded for the 2019 draft. A player having the kind of second half and playoff Rasmussen had isn't going to get a comment like Corey made about not dominating because he would have likely been witness to it more than apparently he was. That is important here, if you play in a weak league in any particular year it impacts him. For instance he admitted to not seeing much in terms of Minnesota high school last year because it was a weak year and he didn't budget it in.

Keep in mind Pronman was high on Whl guys like Fonstad, Smith, Addisson, Alexeyev too, so he checked them out for sure, all those guys sat in his top 50.

¨
Talking about this: https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/habs-prospects-final-ranking.2527189/
Given that it's on the Habs board I assume it's mostly Habs fans voting. 0% top 5 votes, 10% bottom 5 (leaguewide). That was with Mete still counted as a prospect.

Read around the board, or just the thread, some Habs fan are incredibly pessimistic (Kind of understandable, after being shit for so long and after being ripped apart from left and right by this management, whos always doing the wrong thing or the least expected.) and a lot of them don't follow prospects at all, in the Mock draft we have anually, one of the poster that voted 26-31 drafted Ryan McLoed third overall, in april and one of the other last place vote was by a leafs fan, lol.

 

[Wooren]

Pronman is pretty good at telling people where he travels during the year on twitter and other forms of media. He's not just at the big tournaments. Not even close.

This is without getting into the live scouting/video scouting debate that I have no real feelings one way or another on.

But the same can be said about HFBoards users. NA based fans catch some CHL or USHL games from time to time, European fans watch their domestic leagues. Pronman may very well watch more games a year than the majority of HFB, however the difference won't be so extreme where I can say his opinion is clearly superior.

Just admit it...you're conflicted that Corey Pronman is the one public persona who hasn't posted something to make the Montreal Canadiens organization look completely inept.

It's got you in your feelings.

I get it.

I don't put anymore stock into Pronman's ranking than I do another for the record.

Well, that's funny. You are the one quoting everyone who dares to disagree with Montreal being the 6th ranked team.

 

[Captain Mountain]

But the same can be said about HFBoards users. NA based fans catch some CHL or USHL games from time to time, European fans watch their domestic leagues. Pronman may very well watch more games a year than the majority of HFB, however the difference won't be so extreme where I can say his opinion is clearly superior.


...

You said:

Pronman's list is one-man work, his opinion is as good as anyone's on the HFB

He travels for, tracks and writes about prospects full-time. How many people on HF Boards watch prospects full time? His opinion is without a doubt more informed than "anyone's on the HFB".

 

[417]

Well, that's funny. You are the one quoting everyone who dares to disagree with Montreal being the 6th ranked team.

I don't have a problem with anyone who disagrees with them being ranked 6th...

I have a problem with those who disagree without any substance beyond accusing Pronman of favoring Habs fans/prospects.

It matters little to me where Corey Pronman ranks the Habs in relation to other teams, so if you think they should be ranked 31st...that's cool.

But provide sound reasoning, because Pronman, agree or disagree, has provided sound reasoning for where he has them ranked.

Otherwise, it's just hot air

 

[stl76]

Somehow missed that lol sorry...

I'm not sure hes a better skater than Rasmussen, neither are elite but both are very good skaters. Rasmussen finished top 5 at the top prospects game in the skating drills and looks fast for a big guy especially (Frost excels at CHL’s Top Prospects Sport Testing Combine – Soo Greyhounds). I would counter Thomas's vision advantage by saying that Rasmussen is a much better scorer and a much better puck protector. I wont argue Poehling, hes an NCAA guy and the worst of that gorup I think, but I dont think skating separates Rasmussen and Thomas. Its not like Thomas is a Forementon level skater, theyre both very good, not elite skaters.

Ras and Thomas probably have similar top end speed, but Thomas' edge work is elite. The kid can straight up dance east/west. His acceleration and particularly his ability to change direction on a dime in the corners and off the boards, is better than Rasmussen's IMO. Also disagree that Rasmussen, even with his large size advantage, is a much better puck protector. Ras might have a slight edge, but Thomas is an excellent puck protector in his own right.

 

[HuGo Sham]

Montreal gets #6 and the hot takes are flying all over the place.

"Pronman was overrating the Habs draft before they picked anybody" - isn't that kinda like the line in that song "Call Me Maybe?" Before you came into my life I missed you so bad

LMAO

 

[Kevin27NYI]

Going to love seeing the Isles love!

Prospects like Aho, Toews, Mitch Vande Sompel, Parker Wotherspoon

 

[TK 421]

Going to love seeing the Isles love!

Prospects like Aho, Toews, Mitch Vande Sompel, Parker Wotherspoon

Sorokin?

 

[montreal]

didn't read the article, don't follow Pronman, but I'd be shocked if the Habs have a top 15 prospect pool unless you value depth over high end skill cause there just isn't much high end skill.

 

[Legend123]

I love how other fans go the the habs board to vote us as having a bottom 5 pool. A truly wonderful phenomenon.

Once the habs compete with Hughes/Lafreniere... damn the amount of salt that will be on these boards!

 

[DieTomi]

Its garbage because you dont agree with it?

Sound familiar?

 

[smirob]

I came here to see fireworks after Habs got number 6, did not disappoint

 

[joe dirte]

I came here to see fireworks after Habs got number 6, did not disappoint

Meh. Its really only 2 or 3 posters arguing. And again, 1 scouts opinion. One which is also a bit of an outlier.

And really, why would people be upset over a bottom feeder collecting prospects anyway? That is SUPPOSED to happen.

 

[Legend123]

Meh. Its really only 2 or 3 posters arguing. And again, 1 scouts opinion. One which is also a bit of an outlier.

And really, why would people be upset over a bottom feeder collecting prospects anyway? That is SUPPOSED to happen.

Ppl truly dislike the habs. Something tells me from reading that post you are one of them.

 

[Kevin27NYI]

Sorokin?

I think when judging Isles prospects people know Dobson, Whalstrom, Bellows and Sorokin. I don't know what else they know. Dal Colle probably for busting but there are some damn good guys in there. David Quineville, Logan Cockerill, Ben Migreas, Otto Koivula. I'm very happy with the depth as well, I can't wait for them to slowly trickle in.

 

[joe dirte]

Ppl truly dislike the habs. Something tells me from reading that post you are one of them.

Not really.

The leafs have been in the same spot. I remember it. It's all cyclical.

I've been saying here it's one scouts opinion since long before the Habs were named.

Honestly, put yourself in my shoes. The leafs have an elite team. They're a contender at this point. Maybe not the favourite but a contender. Why do I care that the Habs are accumulating some good prospects? Of course they are.

To be perfectly honest I find a team lime st Louis having a good farm being impressive. They have a decent team, and have for years. To add a few more top young players is going to accomplish more than a team that is near starting from scratch.

But as far as the Habs go, they'll make their way back up the standings. It's all a matter of how soon, and how far up the standings they do manage to get when they do. It's the way it all works.

Also, I feel like every fan thinks everyone else hates them. Sone people even think the NHL hates their team. Lol.

 

[Legend123]

Not really.

The leafs have been in the same spot. I remember it. It's all cyclical.

I've been saying here it's one scouts opinion since long before the Habs were named.

Honestly, put yourself in my shoes. The leafs have an elite team. They're a contender at this point. Maybe not the favourite but a contender. Why do I care that the Habs are accumulating some good prospects? Of course they are.

To be perfectly honest I find a team lime st Louis having a good farm being impressive. They have a decent team, and have for years. To add a few more top young players is going to accomplish more than a team that is near starting from scratch.

But as far as the Habs go, they'll make their way back up the standings. It's all a matter of how soon, and how far up the standings they do manage to get when they do. It's the way it all works.

Also, I feel like every fan thinks everyone else hates them. Sone people even think the NHL hates their team. Lol.

Cuz once we collect prospects like Lafreniere and Hughes in addition to our very very deep pool including Kotkaniemi, we wont be coming after ur beloved leafs but rather the cup.... at least that's the dream. And I'm sure HF will have a collective meltdown if that ever happens. The #1 hated team on these boards imo by far.

 

[joe dirte]

Cuz once we collect prospects like Lafreniere and Hughes in addition to our very very deep pool including Kotkaniemi, we wont be coming after ur beloved leafs but rather the cup.... at least that's the dream. And I'm sure HF will have a collective meltdown if that ever happens. The #1 hated team on these boards imo by far.

Sure. If that's what you think.

I mean, I think that's probably why pronman values high end talent. You really need the upper elite talent to win a cup.

But honestly do you really think any if that fits in with the elite nhlers?

I don't know, I think the Habs NEED a couple of first overall talents before they stand a chance. They don't have that yet.

But who knows what happens in the next few years. The Habs are basically at a stage that the leafs were at before they got marner. There is a ways to go before you start claiming these things. Just take it year by year.