Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky and Dach, it's a great forward core?

[ole ole]

There were announced crowds of 15k or so last season. That was without covid restrictions.

Maybe attendance is better this year.

They averaged 17170 last season but are now at 20993 for this season.
Even without covid restrictions IMO Covid still had an effect on last seasons attendance.

 

[Xspyrit]

Every team goes through hardships. At this point they sound more like excuses. This is year 6. I truly hope we don't waste half a decade+ in our rebuild. 3 years I hope.

It's not necessarily about excuses but more about being able to see the whole perspective within the REALITY. You make statements that don't really consider that reality. It was just not realistic to expect the Sens to be competitive in 2020-21. Outside of 23 y/o Chabot and 21 y/o Tkachuk, Sens only had 26 y/o Connor Brown and 25 y/o Nick Paul as "quality veterans". All the other quality players were pure rookies.

Even for 2021-22, it was a bit early to expect them to do much as most players were still young and inexperienced. Again a team lacking depth and quality veterans. While last season was a bit disappointing with a 26th OA finish, the whole thing you're going about stands for this season pretty much?

Do I wish that things were done differently? 100%. I have been calling Pierre Dorion as the worst GM in the NHL for years now. He has thrown all these young players to the wolves without much quality veteran support. This was utterly stupid considering how the Oilers rebuild went just a few years ago. Dorion lacks foresight big time and is a really poor asset manager. Yes Ottawa has accumulated a lot of youth wealth but it could have been even better with more astute management. People have to realize that Dorion inherited an incredible situation. First, Sens already had a good pool when the rebuild started (Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, White, etc) plus he had PRIME ASSETS for trade, unlike what teams usually have when they rebuild. All of Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, Dzingel, Pageau, Ceci, Hoffman, etc were under 30 y/o and in their prime. Brassard was the oldest guy at 30

Dorion made some splashes that caught the attention this summer, but he makes roster mistakes all the time that always holds the team back. 2 years ago, he hired poor veterans that were hurting the team on the ice, last year the team was lacking depth big time and it became apparent when there was a few injuries. This year, despite Formenton's career in jeopardy, he still traded Connor Brown for a freaking 2nd round pick (sell low in a buyers market) when they could really really use him right now. Always a total lack of foresight

This is all things I criticized without the benefit of hindsight. I was calling that these mistakes were going to blow up in our faces in advance. Dorion and coaching need to go yesterday but unfortunately we'll have to wait until the team gets sold

You don't have to worry about the Habs because ownership, management and coaching is 100 times better than what Ottawa has had. There was a major weakness in the Habs organization that they finally got rid of, something I was not talking about much to keep it low profile. I was content to see a divisional rival to keep Trevor Timmins for so long

I really doubt many would argue Norris would be having a similar impact as Suzuki thus far. I think he had just 2 points in 5 games. Suzuki had like 6 or 7. Suzuki is producing at a 100+ point pace, in addition to elite defense iq and leadership. Without him, we would be staring at the bottom. I wish the NHL had a WAR Stat like mlb has...

lol the 5 games sample size. Everything points to Norris being the better player the past 2 seasons. Sure Suzuki plays really great right now but Norris doesn't have the benefit of being healthy and play on a "healthy" team coached by Martin St. Louis and co. Before going down, Sens were on their way to a 3rd convincing win in a row. Things were looking great but Norris injury was enough to derail everything. If it means that Dorion and DJ Smith are not going to be there next season, I am 100% embracing the current struggles.

 

[ole ole]

. Everything points to Norris being the better player the past 2 seasons.

Please try to explain the reasoning behind this quote.

 

[Kunta Kinte]

It's not necessarily about excuses but more about being able to see the whole perspective within the REALITY. You make statements that don't really consider that reality. It was just not realistic to expect the Sens to be competitive in 2020-21. Outside of 23 y/o Chabot and 21 y/o Tkachuk, Sens only had 26 y/o Connor Brown and 25 y/o Nick Paul as "quality veterans". All the other quality players were pure rookies.

Even for 2021-22, it was a bit early to expect them to do much as most players were still young and inexperienced. Again a team lacking depth and quality veterans. While last season was a bit disappointing with a 26th OA finish, the whole thing you're going about stands for this season pretty much?

Do I wish that things were done differently? 100%. I have been calling Pierre Dorion as the worst GM in the NHL for years now. He has thrown all these young players to the wolves without much quality veteran support. This was utterly stupid considering how the Oilers rebuild went just a few years ago. Dorion lacks foresight big time and is a really poor asset manager. Yes Ottawa has accumulated a lot of youth wealth but it could have been even better with more astute management. People have to realize that Dorion inherited an incredible situation. First, Sens already had a good pool when the rebuild started (Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, White, etc) plus he had PRIME ASSETS for trade, unlike what teams usually have when they rebuild. All of Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, Dzingel, Pageau, Ceci, Hoffman, etc were under 30 y/o and in their prime. Brassard was the oldest guy at 30

Dorion made some splashes that caught the attention this summer, but he makes roster mistakes all the time that always holds the team back. 2 years ago, he hired poor veterans that were hurting the team on the ice, last year the team was lacking depth big time and it became apparent when there was a few injuries. This year, despite Formenton's career in jeopardy, he still traded Connor Brown for a freaking 2nd round pick (sell low in a buyers market) when they could really really use him right now. Always a total lack of foresight

This is all things I criticized without the benefit of hindsight. I was calling that these mistakes were going to blow up in our faces in advance. Dorion and coaching need to go yesterday but unfortunately we'll have to wait until the team gets sold

You don't have to worry about the Habs because ownership, management and coaching is 100 times better than what Ottawa has had. There was a major weakness in the Habs organization that they finally got rid of, something I was not talking about much to keep it low profile. I was content to see a divisional rival to keep Trevor Timmins for so long



lol the 5 games sample size. Everything points to Norris being the better player the past 2 seasons. Sure Suzuki plays really great right now but Norris doesn't have the benefit of being healthy and play on a "healthy" team coached by Martin St. Louis and co. Before going down, Sens were on their way to a 3rd convincing win in a row. Things were looking great but Norris injury was enough to derail everything. If it means that Dorion and DJ Smith are not going to be there next season, I am 100% embracing the current struggles.

Norris isn't even close to be as good as Suzuki. Lay down the pipe.

 

[Legend123]

It's not necessarily about excuses but more about being able to see the whole perspective within the REALITY. You make statements that don't really consider that reality. It was just not realistic to expect the Sens to be competitive in 2020-21. Outside of 23 y/o Chabot and 21 y/o Tkachuk, Sens only had 26 y/o Connor Brown and 25 y/o Nick Paul as "quality veterans". All the other quality players were pure rookies.

Even for 2021-22, it was a bit early to expect them to do much as most players were still young and inexperienced. Again a team lacking depth and quality veterans. While last season was a bit disappointing with a 26th OA finish, the whole thing you're going about stands for this season pretty much?

Do I wish that things were done differently? 100%. I have been calling Pierre Dorion as the worst GM in the NHL for years now. He has thrown all these young players to the wolves without much quality veteran support. This was utterly stupid considering how the Oilers rebuild went just a few years ago. Dorion lacks foresight big time and is a really poor asset manager. Yes Ottawa has accumulated a lot of youth wealth but it could have been even better with more astute management. People have to realize that Dorion inherited an incredible situation. First, Sens already had a good pool when the rebuild started (Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, White, etc) plus he had PRIME ASSETS for trade, unlike what teams usually have when they rebuild. All of Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, Dzingel, Pageau, Ceci, Hoffman, etc were under 30 y/o and in their prime. Brassard was the oldest guy at 30

Dorion made some splashes that caught the attention this summer, but he makes roster mistakes all the time that always holds the team back. 2 years ago, he hired poor veterans that were hurting the team on the ice, last year the team was lacking depth big time and it became apparent when there was a few injuries. This year, despite Formenton's career in jeopardy, he still traded Connor Brown for a freaking 2nd round pick (sell low in a buyers market) when they could really really use him right now. Always a total lack of foresight

This is all things I criticized without the benefit of hindsight. I was calling that these mistakes were going to blow up in our faces in advance. Dorion and coaching need to go yesterday but unfortunately we'll have to wait until the team gets sold

You don't have to worry about the Habs because ownership, management and coaching is 100 times better than what Ottawa has had. There was a major weakness in the Habs organization that they finally got rid of, something I was not talking about much to keep it low profile. I was content to see a divisional rival to keep Trevor Timmins for so long



lol the 5 games sample size. Everything points to Norris being the better player the past 2 seasons. Sure Suzuki plays really great right now but Norris doesn't have the benefit of being healthy and play on a "healthy" team coached by Martin St. Louis and co. Before going down, Sens were on their way to a 3rd convincing win in a row. Things were looking great but Norris injury was enough to derail everything. If it means that Dorion and DJ Smith are not going to be there next season, I am 100% embracing the current struggles.

I wish the sens the best and hope they make the playoffs somehow but these 'reasonings' are reminding me too much of the Sabres complete teardown and their huge struggles to do anything.

P.S. No way ur gonna tell me Norris is better than Suzuki.

 

[Xspyrit]

Please try to explain the reasoning behind this quote.

Well the 35 goals scored and the 68 pts pace last season to begin with and the JFresh cards that were already shown in the thread. Suzuki is on another level so far this year though but not really fair for Norris who suffered a serious injury early

Norris isn't even close to be as good as Suzuki. Lay down the pipe.

You're probably just another one who can't read properly but notice it mentioned "the last 2 seasons"? Objectively, absolutely

Of course in terms of hype, Ottawa doesn't compete with Montreal duh

I wish the sens the best and hope they make the playoffs somehow but these 'reasonings' are reminding me too much of the Sabres complete teardown and their huge struggles to do anything.

P.S. No way ur gonna tell me Norris is better than Suzuki.

All right, not too bad of a discussion in the end. I don't disagree with everything, like I said I don't think the Sens are going anywhere with this coaching staff and well, management too. The hope is the team gets sold ASAP and the new ownership hire truly competent people like Montreal did.

But is the Norris vs Suzuki comment serious? Yes Norris was OBJECTIVELY better the last 2 seasons.

You guys really need to learn to read lol

 

[Legend123]

Well the 35 goals scored and the 68 pts pace last season to begin with and the JFresh cards that were already shown in the thread. Suzuki is on another level so far this year though but not really fair for Norris who suffered a serious injury early



You're probably just another one who can't read properly but notice it mentioned "the last 2 seasons"? Objectively, absolutely

Of course in terms of hype, Ottawa doesn't compete with Montreal duh



All right, not too bad of a discussion in the end. I don't disagree with everything, like I said I don't think the Sens are going anywhere with this coaching staff and well, management too. The hope is the team gets sold ASAP and the new ownership hire truly competent people like Montreal did.

But is the Norris vs Suzuki comment serious? Yes Norris was OBJECTIVELY better the last 2 seasons.

You guys really need to learn to read lol

The past two seasons, he may have been better in scoring goals but Suzuki was still better for the rest. I think most people agreed as well as if you looked at redrafting the 2017 draft, the top 5, most people had Suzuki had him in while most didnt mention Norris.

About the sens core, I think they collectively need to play better defense before they can take the next step. Also Chabot looks really awful this season. He needs to play well if the sens have any hope this season.

 

[Xspyrit]

The past two seasons, he may have been better in scoring goals but Suzuki was still better for the rest. I think most people agreed as well as if you looked at redrafting the 2017 draft, the top 5, most people had Suzuki had him in while most didnt mention Norris.

About the sens core, I think they collectively need to play better defense before they can take the next step. Also Chabot looks really awful this season. He needs to play well if the sens have any hope this season.

All this is already covered. Montreal hype.

Norris was objectively better. Scored more goals last season, paced for more points. Only advantage is Suzuki didn't miss games

The year before, graphs show that Norris had a better war% and EV offense percentile. But you don't believe in stats and advanced stats so I guess nothing will change the opinion that YOU decided to have. Objectivity just says differently. Be re-assured Suzuki is running away with it right now and Norris can't even defend himself as he's out for months

Sens won't be able to play better until the season is over and the coach let them play "more loose" and "have some fun" so they can have a run later in the season (depending on injuries as the Sens have already been ravaged by them, like almost every season)

Think about it this way. Sens are playing in permanence under Dominique Ducharme.

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

This thread is kinda sad at this point

 

[Legend123]

All this is already covered. Montreal hype.

Norris was objectively better. Scored more goals last season, paced for more points. Only advantage is Suzuki didn't miss games

The year before, graphs shows Norris had a better war% and EV offense percentile. But you don't believe in stats and advanced stats so I guess nothing will change the opinion that YOU decided to have. Objectivity just says differently. Be re-assured Suzuki is running away with it right now and Norris can't even defend himself as he's out for months

Sens won't be able to play better until the season is over and the coach let them more loose and "have some fun" so they can have a run later in the season (depending on injuries as the Sens have already been ravaged by them, like almost every season)

Think about it this way. Sens are playing in permanence under Dominique Ducharme.

advanced stats tend to "talk alot but say nothing"

Also advanced stats dont take into account the quality of the team. For more than half of last season, the habs were terrible thus and advanced stats on suzuki or any player would have looked awful

 

[Xspyrit]

advanced stats tend to "talk alot but say nothing"

Also advanced stats dont take into account the quality of the team. For more than half of last season, the habs were terrible thus and advanced stats on suzuki or any player would have looked awful

ok but Norris out goal and outproduced Suzuki last season, this is not advanced stats

Advanced stats tell Norris was better in 2020-21 when the Habs made their miracle run and the Sens were again stuck at the bottom

You don't seem to understand, Sens have been "terrible" for years thus "advanced stats on any player would have looked awful"

Your argument works more for Ottawa who have been in a FULL scorched earth rebuild then have been terribly coached for years.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Ok with the potential to be good. Don't think it'll ever be great if those are the best pieces.

I dont see that one elite superstar, playoff performer to put it over the edge into great tier. Slaf maybe, but that's quite a while away and a lot needs to go right for him.


Now if they were able to land themselves Bedard, then you're taling about a truly elite forward group, Bedard/Suzuki down the middle would be top tier with a 40 goal scoring winger and a potential PWF monster in Slaf.... Need that one extra piece though, for Habs fans hopefully they get Bedard.


Then the focus needs to immediately shift to the Defense because that looks like a mess with really nobody who projects anywhere close to a #1D yet(Guhle probably the closest as a mid tier #2).


Edit: On the Suzuki/Norris debate... Suzuki looks better right now but we're not even 20 games into the season yet, still way to small a sample size. Obviously Norris isn't playing at all right now so we have nothing to go on with him.


I'd say Norris pretty clearly had the much better year between the two last year so he was well ahead to start the year, but Suzuki is closing thay gap while Norris is hurt and he's playing quite well.

 

[Legend123]

ok but Norris out goal and outproduced Suzuki last season, this is not advanced stats

Advanced stats tell Norris was better in 2020-21 when the Habs made their miracle run and the Sens were again stuck at the bottom

You don't seem to understand, Sens have been "terrible" for years thus "advanced stats on any player would have looked awful"

Your argument works more for Ottawa who have been in a FULL scorched earth rebuild then have been terribly coached for years.

well anyways even if Norris was better before this year, Suzuki is certainly better now and by a quite good amount. I dont see why we're arguing. Norris is a sick player but during his first 5 games when he wsa healthy the sens were also bad. They've been bad with any lineup they have iced.

 

[Legend123]

Ok with the potential to be good. Don't think it'll ever be great if those are the best pieces.

I dont see that one elite superstar, playoff performer to put it over the edge into great tier. Slaf maybe, but that's quite a while away and a lot needs to go right for him.


Now if they were able to land themselves Bedard, then you're taling about a truly elite forward group, Bedard/Suzuki down the middle would be top tier with a 40 goal scoring winger and a potential PWF monster in Slaf.... Need that one extra piece though, for Habs fans hopefully they get Bedard.


Then the focus needs to immediately shift to the Defense because that looks like a mess with really nobody who projects anywhere close to a #1D yet(Guhle probably the closest as a mid tier #2).

You seem very clueless or badly informed about the Habs core. Suzuki is a proven playoff performer who has carried his team on two attempts, once to the finals.
Then Guhle is already playing #1D minutes and certainly has the potential to be a long time #1D. Not only the top 5 picks end up as #1Ds. We have 3 well performing rookies on the defense. Which other teams can say this? In addition to Guhle, Xhekaj and Harris, we have Hutson (our best prospect), Barron, Mailloux + any 1rst round talent we may pick with the Panthers pick. Allen is a possibility for instance. The D is def no issue.

Whats the issue is our lack of true top end star on forward and defense. For defense I have hope Hutson and Guhle can be that but offensively it would be sick to have Bedard, Mychkov, Fantilli, Carlssen or Smith

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

You seem very clueless or badly informed about the Habs core. Suzuki is a proven playoff performer who has carried his team on two attempts, once to the finals.
Then Guhle is already playing #1D minutes and certainly has the potential to be a long time #1D. Not only the top 5 picks end up as #1Ds. We have 3 well performing rookies on the defense. Which other teams can say this? In addition to Guhle, Xhekaj and Harris, we have Hutson (our best prospect), Barron, Mailloux + any 1rst round talent we may pick with the Panthers pick. Allen is a possibility for instance.

Congrats, you just named a bunch of dime a dozen prospects.

Guile playing #1D on that Havs defense means absolutely nothing. That's exactly why they're going to finish bottom 5 in the league this year. It's an awful Defense.

But anyways I'm well aware of your posts. They hold no value at all. So carry on with your delusions.

 

[Legend123]

Congrats, you just named a bunch of dime a dozen prospects.

Guile playing #1D on that Havs defense means absolutely nothing. That's exactly why they're going to finish bottom 5 in the league this year. It's an awful Defense.

But anyways I'm well aware of your posts. They hold no value at all. So carry on.

its 6 quality to great rookies and prospects. The point is that we dont need to worry about it as we have alot of depth there.

Guhle has been playing sick #1D minutes shutting down elite players like crosby. What are you on about? Its not looking so good for a bottom 5 finish tho i do wish it.

P.S i love the Fallacious ad hominem reasoning. You seem quite skilled at it.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

its 6 quality to great rookies and prospects. The point is that we dont need to worry about it as we have alot of depth there.

Guhle has been playing sick #1D minutes shutting down elite players like crosby. What are you on about? Its not looking so good for a bottom 5 finish tho i do wish it.

Yes, he's doing great!

The classic 20 game sample overreaction.

 

[Legend123]

View attachment 610597

Yes, he's doing great!

The classic 20 game sample overreaction.

I wonder how many games youve watched of the Habs?? Zero?

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I wonder how many games youve watched of the Habs?? Zero?

Oh look, the classic argument. "Shit, he's right but I bet he hasn't watched as many games as me. That'll show him"

I've watched a handful. The beautiful thing about analytics is they dont lie and they have no viewer bias, unlike the biased viewings of fans of a team

 

[Mrb1p]

Ok with the potential to be good. Don't think it'll ever be great if those are the best pieces.

I dont see that one elite superstar, playoff performer to put it over the edge into great tier. Slaf maybe, but that's quite a while away and a lot needs to go right for him.


Now if they were able to land themselves Bedard, then you're taling about a truly elite forward group, Bedard/Suzuki down the middle would be top tier with a 40 goal scoring winger and a potential PWF monster in Slaf.... Need that one extra piece though, for Habs fans hopefully they get Bedard.


Then the focus needs to immediately shift to the Defense because that looks like a mess with really nobody who projects anywhere close to a #1D yet(Guhle probably the closest as a mid tier #2).


Edit: On the Suzuki/Norris debate... Suzuki looks better right now but we're not even 20 games into the season yet, still way to small a sample size. Obviously Norris isn't playing at all right now so we have nothing to go on with him.


I'd say Norris pretty clearly had the much better year between the two last year so he was well ahead to start the year, but Suzuki is closing thay gap while Norris is hurt and he's playing quite well.

Going back to January, Suzuki is PPG.

Norris is 0.87.

Its not close ever since Ducharme left.

Suzuki would be your best forward.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Going back to January, Suzuki is PPG.

Norris is 0.87.

Its not close ever since Ducharme left.

Suzuki would be your best forward.

.... PPG vs 0.87 is not even close? When one scores goals at a significantly higher rate?


Also, I am not a Sens fan. Suzuki would certainly not be the best forward in Colorado. He wouldn't even crack our Top 3.

 

[Mrb1p]

.... PPG vs 0.87 is not even close? When one scores goals at a significantly higher rate?


Also, I am not a Sens fan. Suzuki would certainly not be the best forward in Colorado. He wouldn't even crack our Top 3.

I didnt mean to quote you.

ok but Norris out goal and outproduced Suzuki last season, this is not advanced stats

Advanced stats tell Norris was better in 2020-21 when the Habs made their miracle run and the Sens were again stuck at the bottom

You don't seem to understand, Sens have been "terrible" for years thus "advanced stats on any player would have looked awful"

Your argument works more for Ottawa who have been in a FULL scorched earth rebuild then have been terribly coached for years.

Going back to January, Suzuki is PPG.

Norris is 0.87.

Its not close ever since Ducharme left.

Suzuki would be your best forward.

 

[Legend123]

Oh look, the classic argument. "Shit, he's right but I bet he hasn't watched as many games as me. That'll show him"

I've watched a handful. The beautiful thing about analytics is they dont lie and they have no viewer bias, unlike the biased viewings of fans of a team

Well you seem like the genius here so ill take your word for granted. Ill be sure to talk Guhle down when he plays great and HFHabs are raving about him.
Ill tell them "Guys, Mr. Pierce Hawthorne has said Guhle is bad and is playing terribly cuz he saw the advanced stats where boxes are drawn."

 

[Hockeym]

Oh look, the classic argument. "Shit, he's right but I bet he hasn't watched as many games as me. That'll show him"

I've watched a handful. The beautiful thing about analytics is they dont lie and they have no viewer bias, unlike the biased viewings of fans of a team

Actually analytics without context is bullshit , hockey is a sport with a lot of actions and events during a game . You can't just put random charts and declare thoses are facts without having the background to support your numbers . You can say whatever you want with numbers because you're using them and reading it with your biased opinion. It's a mix of both actually , understanding the stats but also having the knowledge about the stats aka watching the player during games because you're able to see what is happening with your stats. You sounds like you don't read a book but watch a review on youtube and then declare your opinion on it .

 

[Xspyrit]

well anyways even if Norris was better before this year, Suzuki is certainly better now and by a quite good amount. I dont see why we're arguing. Norris is a sick player but during his first 5 games when he wsa healthy the sens were also bad. They've been bad with any lineup they have iced.

The only reason we're still arguing is because of "fan resistance", you are not letting objectivity weigh more than your fanatism in the balance... Also, "by a quite good amount" seems to be very "what have you done for me lately" flavored... I mean, Norris was OBJECTIVELY better for 2 seasons and while Suzuki has had a great start of the season, Norris has been injured pretty much right away, he has not been there to "defend himself"

Suzuki under Ducharme : 20 goals, 55 Pts, -28 in 83 games
Norris before this season : 47 goals, 75 Pts, -11 in last 91 games (12th highest GPG in the NHL during that 91 games sample size)

Suzuki now plays on a healthy team coached by Martin St. Louis while Norris is still stuck playing for a Ducharme level coach, maybe even worse, even though DJ Smith looks like the most friendly guy in the world

Finally, "the sens were also bad" during that 5 games stretch is total misinformation and proves that you have watched 0 minutes of play.

1st game : 4-1 loss to Buffalo but 2 empty net goals. Craig Anderson stole that game for them, very close game.
2nd game : another 1 goal game loss, again very close game in terms of high danger chances
3rd game : Sens scored 7 goals, dominated scoring chances 42-29
4th game : Sens scored 5 goals, dominated scoring chances 35-21 and 14-7 high danger chances
5th game : Sens scored 5 goals, dominated scoring chances 29-15 and 15-5 high danger chances

Norris got injured in that game when he finally scored his first goal. He was very snake bitten in the first 4 games, hitting multiple crossbars and posts and him and his teammates were getting robbed by goalies on plays he created or tried to finish. He was as usual playing against top competition and had a 54.84 CF%, 58.24 SF%, 55.58 xGF%, 61.43 SCF% and 67.57 HDCF%. He literally has the highest HDCF/60 among centers who played at least 30 minutes... What does it mean? He was creating A LOT of offense

And wow by digging I just found out that Suzuki has a xGF/60 of 2.2 (comfortably below average among Centers) and a xGA/60 of 4.31 (6th worse in the league), that is absolutely horrible. The fact that he is over PPG and still in the + is a miracle. He has a GF/60 of 5.15 wow, VASTLY outscoring his xGF

You should stop because you're demonstrating once again that you're out of your element. Making statements is the easiest thing to do in the world. Backing them up objectively is not as easy and some people just can't do it.