Confirmed with Link: Sens sign Francis Perron to ELC

bert

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Prince is gonna be 24 y/o at the beginning of next season. He's older than Zibanejad, Ceci, Lazar, Puempel, etc. He's the same age as Pageau. That's why "even come close" sounds very exaggerated. could believe that Prince hasn't breakout yet. I don't share that sentiment.

How many games has he played in the NHL where he has had a chance to be successful? Pretty hard to reach your development peak with what 10 games maybe where he played in a top 6 role didnt have a coach breathing down his neck? He broke out last year in the AHL... Why not if he is given an opportunity in the NHL? He has scored at every level.

Lazar looks lost right now just to touch on your post, he was rushed maybe they should have taken their time with him like Prince?

Well wasnt it rumored that Spezza had asked for a trade a few years before actually being dealt but BMurr and Co talked him out of it and settled him down? Maybe that's what backdoorpass had info on?

Anyways, Im real interested in Perron. The Q does have a history of kids producing like crazy but never really becoming anything at the next level.

Not lately, the scoring in the Q is on par with the OHL and the WHL. Recently it has been the WHL that has been the highest scoring league.

I think Perron has the potential to be a player though, they will have to be patient with him.
 

Xspyrit

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Jun 29, 2008
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How many games has he played in the NHL where he has had a chance to be successful? Pretty hard to reach your development peak with what 10 games maybe where he played in a top 6 role didnt have a coach breathing down his neck? He broke out last year in the AHL... Why not if he is given an opportunity in the NHL? He has scored at every level.

Lazar looks lost right now just to touch on your post, he was rushed maybe they should have taken their time with him like Prince?

Lazar is more than 2 years younger

Prince : 18 pts in 64 games = 23 pts per 82 games
Lazar : 35 pts in 143 games = 20 pts per 82 games

Prince is supposed to be an offensive player, Lazar is a defensive player. Maybe the fanbase expected too much out of Lazar offensively but he is still developing. Of course, he is not excelling yet but he has a lot of room to grow. I don't feel the same with Prince, but I think he could carve out a 3rd line role somewhere. Lazar has intangibles that might make him a lot more useful down the road. But I don't see why we have to compare the 2

At the end of the day, Prince was not irreplaceable... Hoffman, MacArthur, Smith, Dzingel, McCormick, Puempel... Where does Prince fit? Useless on the 4th line, and I'd much rather have Smith or Dzingel on the 3rd LW.

My question back is :

Why is it so HARD for a portion of this board to let a marginal talent like Shane Prince go?
 

2CHAINZ

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Feb 27, 2008
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Lazar is more than 2 years younger

Prince : 18 pts in 64 games = 23 pts per 82 games
Lazar : 35 pts in 143 games = 20 pts per 82 games

Prince is supposed to be an offensive player, Lazar is a defensive player. Maybe the fanbase expected too much out of Lazar offensively but he is still developing. Of course, he is not excelling yet but he has a lot of room to grow. I don't feel the same with Prince, but I think he could carve out a 3rd line role somewhere. Lazar has intangibles that might make him a lot more useful down the road. But I don't see why we have to compare the 2

At the end of the day, Prince was not irreplaceable... Hoffman, MacArthur, Smith, Dzingel, McCormick, Puempel... Where does Prince fit? Useless on the 4th line, and I'd much rather have Smith or Dzingel on the 3rd LW.

My question back is :

Why is it so HARD for a portion of this board to let a marginal talent like Shane Prince go?

Because Melnyk is cheap, Phillips points, GSN, Spezza no look drop passes, Murray sucks, and because we didn't get our number one guy in Boudreau.
 

Boud

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Dec 27, 2011
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Because Melnyk is cheap, Phillips points, GSN, Spezza no look drop passes, Murray sucks, and because we didn't get our number one guy in Boudreau.

And we let go our #1C in Da Costa too.
 

BonkTastic

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That's much less to do with Condra and more to do with our coach having no semblance of a system.

Case in point, Condra being practically useless in Tampa Bay.

To the point where it was reported at multiple times in the season that Condra could be on the trade block.

For literally the exact same reason we moved on from Condra - the idea that while he's not a bad player, 3 years might be too long a term when you have so many young players chomping at the bit to earn NHL ice time - the Bolts were (and maybe still are) shopping the guy.
 

2CHAINZ

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Feb 27, 2008
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To the point where it was reported at multiple times in the season that Condra could be on the trade block.

For literally the exact same reason we moved on from Condra - the idea that while he's not a bad player, 3 years might be too long a term when you have so many young players chomping at the bit to earn NHL ice time - the Bolts were (and maybe still are) shopping the guy.

Ya but bro why did we give Chiasson a 1 year contract ? I knew when we traded Spezza and he came back he was never going to be as good as Spezza so why didn't we just let him go last off season ? Murray screwed us. I mean eventhough Spezza nixed a deal for Hornqvist and their first rounder I still blame Murray and Chiasson for Spezza leaving.
 

DrEasy

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Condra, Prince or Da Costa may not have been game-changers on their own, but not valuing them properly is a good symptom of the problems with our team philosophy.

But mocking fellow HFers will fix this, I'm sure.
 

BonkTastic

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Condra, Prince or Da Costa may not have been game-changers on their own, but not valuing them properly is a good symptom of the problems with our team philosophy.

Who is to say that we didn't value them properly?

Personally, we're at least 2-for-3 on that trio. Depending on how Prince fares in the next couple of years, we might be hitting 1.000 on these guys.
 

PoutineSp00nZ

Electricity is really just organized lightning.
Jul 21, 2009
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Condra, Prince or Da Costa may not have been game-changers on their own, but not valuing them properly is a good symptom of the problems with our team philosophy.

But mocking fellow HFers will fix this, I'm sure.

A symptom of what? THe Sens allegedly offered Condra a 2 year contract, he opted to take the 3 year contract offered in Tampa Bay. He had value to the team, but it was limited. The third year was where they drew the line. So be it. I'm a fan of COndra, i loved what he brought as a checker, and imo his absence was felt on the penalty kill last season, but it is what it is.

Dacosta and Prince were both given chances and never did much with them. So the team moved on with young players that showed more with the same opportunity.

That's it, that's all.
 

DrEasy

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Who is to say that we didn't value them properly?

Personally, we're at least 2-for-3 on that trio. Depending on how Prince fares in the next couple of years, we might be hitting 1.000 on these guys.
Da Costa: we still don't know how he would have fared in the NHL. Never got a chance to prove himself here. The last time he played here he was pretty good, then he was sent down never to be seen again. Doing well in the KHL is no guarantee, but what else he can do to prove his worth, play badly there?

Condra: major PK contributor (along with Gryba, probably). Compare our PK before and after Condra. In his case though, I realize the contract he got was probably too much for what he did for us, and given our budget constraints I can understand letting him go. Cameron was a fan anyway, so he can't be blamed for anything concerning him.

Prince: maybe he didn't have the impact we hoped he would on our team, but dude had a great pedigree, and he provided skills we are dearly lacking. Never really put in a position to succeed. We'll see how he turns out in the long term, and maybe he won't be much, but it's legitimate for some fans to be upset, and more importantly treating them sarcasm and mockery is what gets me.

Prince and Da Costa both had play-making and puck-handling skills, and I think these skills were undervalued by our previous regime (compared to, say, "grit"). That's the symptom part I was referring to.
 

Sensinitis

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Aug 5, 2012
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Da Costa: we still don't know how he would have fared in the NHL. Never got a chance to prove himself here. The last time he played here he was pretty good, then he was sent down never to be seen again. Doing well in the KHL is no guarantee, but what else he can do to prove his worth, play badly there?

I guess it's a question mark, but the fact that no other team offered him a one-way contract should be telling.

Condra: major PK contributor (along with Gryba, probably). Compare our PK before and after Condra. In his case though, I realize the contract he got was probably too much for what he did for us, and given our budget constraints I can understand letting him go. Cameron was a fan anyway, so he can't be blamed for anything concerning him.

No one man is responsible for a good PK. He was a good PKer but our team sucked at PKing last season. The result would have been the same if Condra was here.

Prince: maybe he didn't have the impact we hoped he would on our team, but dude had a great pedigree, and he provided skills we are dearly lacking. Never really put in a position to succeed. We'll see how he turns out in the long term, and maybe he won't be much, but it's legitimate for some fans to be upset, and more importantly treating them sarcasm and mockery is what gets me.

We'll see what happens with Prince. I can't speak for him yet.

But, I can say that we have Hoffman, MacArthur, Smith ahead of Prince. So, where would he have played?

With the Isles he's listed as a 3rd line LW for next year. He wouldn't even have that role with us.

Also, do you prefer Dzingel or Prince?
 

Micklebot

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Apr 27, 2010
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Da Costa: we still don't know how he would have fared in the NHL. Never got a chance to prove himself here. The last time he played here he was pretty good, then he was sent down never to be seen again. Doing well in the KHL is no guarantee, but what else he can do to prove his worth, play badly there?

Condra: major PK contributor (along with Gryba, probably). Compare our PK before and after Condra. In his case though, I realize the contract he got was probably too much for what he did for us, and given our budget constraints I can understand letting him go. Cameron was a fan anyway, so he can't be blamed for anything concerning him.

Prince: maybe he didn't have the impact we hoped he would on our team, but dude had a great pedigree, and he provided skills we are dearly lacking. Never really put in a position to succeed. We'll see how he turns out in the long term, and maybe he won't be much, but it's legitimate for some fans to be upset, and more importantly treating them sarcasm and mockery is what gets me.

Prince and Da Costa both had play-making and puck-handling skills, and I think these skills were undervalued by our previous regime (compared to, say, "grit"). That's the symptom part I was referring to.

DaCosta: The best you can say for DaCosta is that maybe if he got more opportunity, he might be an NHL player. Other teams haven't seen enough from him to try and entice him out of the KHL, so I'm inclined to side with the Sens evaluation until proven otherwise.

Condra: Yes, he was a big contributor on our PK, and this year's PK sucked. The problem is Condra doesn't do enough to make his new team want to keep him in the lineup either, so did we really do a poor job in evaluating him? This years PK failed because of the guys we had replace Condra on the PK (Chiasson, Pageau, Lazar, and Zibanejad) lacked experience big time, not because Condra was some supremely good penalty killer. Pageau, Lazar and Zibanejad are all young and will improve. Chiasson likely leaves the team. I also believe coaching was an issue in this regard. If this coming season, the PK rebounds to close to league average, you can safely assume that Condra wasn't the be all an end all of our PK. Suffice it to say, there is way too little evidence to say we incorrectly evaluated Condra. You can certainly suggest that we didn't properly assess the guys replacing him, but to be fair, they expected a healthy MacArthur, Turris and Michalek to be available, the last one in particular was expected to be a regular on the PK but was injured to frequently to make any significant impact.

Prince: Time will tell. I don't see him ever becoming a top 6 guy, but I'd love him to prove me wrong, I was really high on the pick. I think it's unfair to say he never got a chance though. He played about 180 mins combined with one of Turris or Zibanejad, which is a decent trial run for a rookie in the top 6. By comparison, Dzingel got 100 mins combined with Turris, Zibanejad and Pageau(who I've included because he took over top 6 duties when Turris came out of the lineup). Now, Dzingel only played 30 games, but even prorating that to the 42 Prince played, you end up with less top 6 mins, but Dzingel looked more comfortable in that role than Prince ever did imo.
 

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