Confirmed with Link: Sabres re-sign Zemgus Girgensons, 1 year, 2.5 mil aav

Doug Prishpreed

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So, according to this, maybe a slight overpay but for someone who is looked up to as a locker room, and has been a loyal warrior for 10 years of this craziness, worth every penny.
I’m not sure there’s a standardized way to interpret the results, I just posted it because I had it on my phone and thought it might add some context. Personally, I usually kind of roll my eyes at how these used and don’t take them very seriously.
 
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MOGlLNY

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I’m not sure there’s a standardized way to interpret the results, I just posted it because I had it on my phone and thought it might add some context. Personally, I usually kind of roll my eyes at how these used and don’t take them very seriously.
They’re a tool to help work together with the eye test.

Drives me nuts when people just post a card and declare if a player is good or bad.
 

Doug Prishpreed

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This isn't from last season..?
Yes, but this was him at basically his peak, or maybe a bit after. Not that these numbers shouldn’t 100% be taken with a grain of salt, but I’m not sure you’d see better numbers for 22/23. If I had a subscription I’d post the newer ones.
 
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MOGlLNY

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They’re a tool to help work together with the eye test.

Drives me nuts when people just post a card and declare if a player is good or bad.
Mittelstadt is a prime candidate of why cards aren’t the end all be all.

Without looking, I think besides a rough patch to start the season, more than a few of us thought Mitts looked better than his metrics showed. Eventually he started to turn on his card too in spite of the anchor he was attached to.
 

BFLO

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Tampa had Tyler Johnson the the 4th line making 5M. Vegas had Roy on the 4th line making 3M.
That has nothing to do with your original post about contenders not paying 4th liners money. The fact they have a good contract on their second line irrelevant.
By pay, I meant that they don’t sign players with the intent of them being 4th liners for $2.5m.

That doesn’t stop players making $2.5m or more from getting pushed down to the 4th line over time, such as Nic Roy or Tyler Johnson.

Roy was one of the higher scoring 3c’s in the league when he got extended to $3m, Tyler Johnson was a 2nd liner coming off a season with 45p in 66games played and had 42p in 47 career playoff games at that point.
 

Jim Bob

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Overpaying ZG and OK on 1 year deals doesn't really matter as long as they also choose to spend to upgrade the parts of the roster that need it.

Even if Kevyn makes all the moves I'm hoping for this summer I still don't see us as contenders, but I do see us as comfortably making the playoffs.
I do not see money being the barrier to making moves this off season in any way shape or form.

What I expect to happen is that Adams is more patient and has more faith in the roster as is than most fans and media do.

The comments about the goalies are an example of that. I believe that Adams has way more faith in the three guys they have than I do and most fans do.
 

Fjordy

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I do not see money being the barrier to making moves this off season in any way shape or form.

What I expect to happen is that Adams is more patient and has more faith in the roster as is than most fans and media do.

The comments about the goalies are an example of that. I believe that Adams has way more faith in the three guys they have than I do and most fans do.
This faith must be supported by something, blind faith is not very good. You can believe in anything, but when it doesn't happen or it doesn't work, sometimes you have to open your eyes and do it differently.
 
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Jim Bob

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This faith must be supported by something, blind faith is not very good. You can believe in anything, but when it doesn't happen or it doesn't work, sometimes you have to open your eyes and do it differently.
Adams made minor tweaks to the roster between 2021-22 and 2022-23 and the team made a major jump up in the standings. I do not believe that expecting a lot of guys on the youngest roster in the NHL last season to show marked improvement in 2023-24 is blind faith.

And just because I do not have a lot of faith in a Levi-[UPL or Comrie] duo in goal, I would not say it is completely blind faith. It is similar to the faith that Adams showed in Thompson when he signed him to the big extension after one year of notable production.

Adams bet on the player that they saw every day and developed. They bet on the character and work ethic that they saw behind the scenes. And Adams seems to be betting on Levi in a similar manner.

I may disagree with the bet. But, I will not say it is blind faith at all.
 
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Fjordy

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Adams made minor tweaks to the roster between 2021-22 and 2022-23 and the team made a major jump up in the standings. I do not believe that expecting a lot of guys on the youngest roster in the NHL last season to show marked improvement in 2023-24 is blind faith.

And just because I do not have a lot of faith in a Levi-[UPL or Comrie] duo in goal, I would not say it is completely blind faith. It is similar to the faith that Adams showed in Thompson when he signed him to the big extension after one year of notable production.

Adams bet on the player that they saw every day and developed. They bet on the character and work ethic that they saw behind the scenes. And Adams seems to be betting on Levi in a similar manner.

I may disagree with the bet. But, I will not say it is blind faith at all.
You did not understand at all what I wanted to say, unfortunately the mentality and the difficulties of translation distort it.
 

Jim Bob

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You did not understand at all what I wanted to say, unfortunately the mentality and the difficulties of translation distort it.
But, having faith in the ability to develop their guys has worked since the coaching change from Kreuger to Granato.

Players have improved and the Sabres have gotten better in the standings.
 

Fjordy

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But, having faith in the ability to develop their guys has worked since the coaching change from Kreuger to Granato.

Players have improved and the Sabres have gotten better in the standings.
That's not the point, I didn't mean it at all. In addition to faith, there must be logic and realism. Not everyone will be like Thompson, that's obvious. Jokiharju didn't work, UPL and Comrie didn't work. Can we give them another chance? Of course, but only in a certain role. Going into the season with Levi, UPL and Comrie is not logical and not right. Adams believes in his players, and rightly so, and commendable, but he is not an idiot and understands that not all of them will work. Goaltender is not a position where you are going to experiment unless you are tanking.
 

Jim Bob

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That's not the point, I didn't mean it at all. In addition to faith, there must be logic and realism. Not everyone will be like Thompson, that's obvious. Jokiharju didn't work, UPL and Comrie didn't work. Can we give them another chance? Of course, but only in a certain role. Going into the season with Levi, UPL and Comrie is not logical and not right. Adams believes in his players, and rightly so, and commendable, but he is not an idiot and understands that not all of them will work. Goaltender is not a position where you are going to experiment unless you are tanking.
I can see them looking at what Levi did down the stretch and have a lot of confidence in him.

I see things differently. But, there is more than blind faith to thinking that Levi could make a big difference over the course of the whole season.

And Adams talking about checking in with other goalies make me have some level of belief that he knows that it would be a good idea to upgrade over UPL & Comrie. The question will be about who is available to them and what the cost will be.
 

Fjordy

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I can see them looking at what Levi did down the stretch and have a lot of confidence in him.

I see things differently. But, there is more than blind faith to thinking that Levi could make a big difference over the course of the whole season.

And Adams talking about checking in with other goalies make me have some level of belief that he knows that it would be a good idea to upgrade over UPL & Comrie. The question will be about who is available to them and what the cost will be.
Well, what I meant is that Adams probably understands that going into the season with Levi, UPL and Comrie is very dangerous. Levi hasn't proven anything yet, although he looks promising, while UPL and Comrie have had a bad season and don't have much experience in the NHL, especially since they are not starters and have never even played 40 games in a season.

I hope Adams will act wisely and add goalie in trade or in UFA.
 

Dirty Dog

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Adams made minor tweaks to the roster between 2021-22 and 2022-23 and the team made a major jump up in the standings. I do not believe that expecting a lot of guys on the youngest roster in the NHL last season to show marked improvement in 2023-24 is blind faith.

And just because I do not have a lot of faith in a Levi-[UPL or Comrie] duo in goal, I would not say it is completely blind faith. It is similar to the faith that Adams showed in Thompson when he signed him to the big extension after one year of notable production.

Adams bet on the player that they saw every day and developed. They bet on the character and work ethic that they saw behind the scenes. And Adams seems to be betting on Levi in a similar manner.

I may disagree with the bet. But, I will not say it is blind faith at all.

Hell, the faith in Thompson even being rostered for his one year of notable production was a bit wild. He keeps hitting gold with his faith in development, and I’m sure there are some failures incoming.

I’d probably have a different approach too, but we’ll see how it turns out! And I absolutely do think we see the same goalies this year
 
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BFLO

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I do not see money being the barrier to making moves this off season in any way shape or form.

What I expect to happen is that Adams is more patient and has more faith in the roster as is than most fans and media do.

The comments about the goalies are an example of that. I believe that Adams has way more faith in the three guys they have than I do and most fans do.
Most GMs have more faith in themselves than their predecessors and the players those predecessors acquired. We’re heading into year 4 with Adams and he’s added remarkably little to the current roster given the length of time he’s been in charge and complete lack of success.

That could all change this summer, but as you say, he’s likely to continue making almost no additions.
 

Jim Bob

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Most GMs have more faith in themselves than their predecessors and the players those predecessors acquired. We’re heading into year 4 with Adams and he’s added remarkably little to the current roster given the length of time he’s been in charge and complete lack of success.

That could all change this summer, but as you say, he’s likely to continue making almost no additions.

Of the 53 players that were under contract in Botts last year as GM, only 12 are left.

Tuch, Greenway, Krebs, Quinn, Peterka, Jost (RFA), Lyubushkin, Stillman, Power, Clague (RFA), Comrie, and Levi are all "Adams guys."

And I would give him credit for not moving out guys he inherited that have developed into big core pieces like Thompson, Skinner, Cozens, and Dahlin.
 

Husko

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Very happy with this. Hoping they target a checking/PK specialist center to plop between him and Girgensons. Would serve a lot of needs, and most importantly let the young offensive talent play with other offenisve talent.
 

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