Prospect Info: Prospect Thread (Overseas, College, Junior, etc)

[herzausstein]

Gunnarwolfe should be higher on name alone.

Joking aside, this took had to take alot of work to do so thanks for your thoughts. Would you be able to break it down into groups? Like: top 6 potential, bottom 6 potential, tweener, ahl bound, echl bound or something similar?

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I think Livingstone should count, and that makes a nice round 40.

 

[maplepred]

I think Livingstone should count, and that makes a nice round 40.

I kept it under age of 24, otherwise he would be on there. But good catch my friend!

Gunnarwolfe should be higher on name alone.

Joking aside, this took had to take alot of work to do so thanks for your thoughts. Would you be able to break it down into groups? Like: top 6 potential, bottom 6 potential, tweener, ahl bound, echl bound or something similar?

That’s a great idea!!
Let me get to that and post it.
And thank you

 

[maplepred]

@herzausstein
How’s this?

Preds Top Prospects
1. Askarov franchise goalie
2. Wood top 3 forward
3. Kemmel top 3 forward
4. Evangelista top 3 forward
5. Tomasino top 3/6 forward
6. Parssinen top 6 forward
7. Svechkov top 6 forward
8. Schaefer middle 6 forward
9. L’Heureux top 9 forward
10. Molendyk top 4 D
11. Matier top 4 D
12. Chistyakov top 4 D
13. Ufko 4/5 D
14. Lind middle 6 forward
15. Kiiskinen top 9 forward
16. Mackinnon 4/5 D
17. Kulonummi top 6 D
18. Stastney 4/5 D
19. Afanasyev bottom 6 forward
20. Burke middle 6 forward
21. Nilsson third line forward
22. Wilsby top 6/tweener D
23. Jatkola nhl backup goalie
24. Sward top 6 D
25. Ingram third line centre
26. Del Gaizo tweener D
27. Olsson tweener D/top 6 potential
28. Prokop top 6/7 D
29. Willis tweener/rotational forward
30. Fink tweener/rotational forward
31. Roest tweener/rotational forward
32. O’Hara top line ahl forward
33. Knak top 6 ahl forward
34. Walther bottom 6 forward/tweener
35. Strinden middle 6 ahl forward
36. Haider AHL head goalie/tweener
37. Campbell top 9 ahl forward
38. Muzzatti top 9 ahl forward
39. Fontaine ahl forward with cool name

 

[herzausstein]

@herzausstein
How’s this?

Preds Top Prospects
1. Askarov franchise goalie
2. Wood top 3 forward
3. Kemmel top 3 forward
4. Evangelista top 3 forward
5. Tomasino top 3/6 forward
6. Parssinen top 6 forward
7. Svechkov top 6 forward
8. Schaefer middle 6 forward
9. L’Heureux top 9 forward
10. Molendyk top 4 D
11. Matier top 4 D
12. Chistyakov top 4 D
13. Ufko 4/5 D
14. Lind middle 6 forward
15. Kiiskinen top 9 forward
16. Mackinnon 4/5 D
17. Kulonummi top 6 D
18. Stastney 4/5 D
19. Afanasyev bottom 6 forward
20. Burke middle 6 forward
21. Nilsson third line forward
22. Wilsby top 6/tweener D
23. Jatkola nhl backup goalie
24. Sward top 6 D
25. Ingram third line centre
26. Del Gaizo tweener D
27. Olsson tweener D/top 6 potential
28. Prokop top 6/7 D
29. Willis tweener/rotational forward
30. Fink tweener/rotational forward
31. Roest tweener/rotational forward
32. O’Hara top line ahl forward
33. Knak top 6 ahl forward
34. Walther bottom 6 forward/tweener
35. Strinden middle 6 ahl forward
36. Haider AHL head goalie/tweener
37. Campbell top 9 ahl forward
38. Muzzatti top 9 ahl forward
39. Fontaine ahl forward with cool name

I appreciate it. It helps me alot with perceived upside of the players. I dont get to pay attention to alot of the bottom half of that group so it is interesting to see thoughts on them as well as compare thoughts on the upside of the top half of the group.

 

[maplepred]

Y

I appreciate it. It helps me alot with perceived upside of the players. I dont get to pay attention to alot of the bottom half of that group so it is interesting to see thoughts on them as well as compare thoughts on the upside of the top half of the group.

I’m glad you find it useful. I put quite a bit of time into it and a lot of adjusting but this is the final list I am happy with.

If I were an author I would publish this copy lol

 

[AintLifeGrand]

I know we are currently doing the rankings with the poll thread but I have been working on this list since the last draft in June, been tweaking it for a bit and am pretty happy with my rankings on it now so decided I wanted to share my list and get some feedback. Should some guys be higher? Lower? If you think someone is too high/low I’m happy to give my explanation for their ranking. This is for overall potential though, not NHL ready at all. Obviously things will change in time but right at this moment this is how I feel they should be ranked.

So I took the most relevant prospects we have and it turned out the list ended up being 39 long.

Would love for any feedback

Preds Top Prospects
1. Askarov
2. Wood
3. Kemmel
4. Evangelista
5. Tomasino
6. Parssinen
7. Svechkov
8. Schaefer
9. L’Heureux
10. Molendyk
11. Matier
12. Chistyakov
13. Ufko
14. Lind
15. Kiiskinen
16. Mackinnon
17. Kulonummi
18. Stastney
19. Afanasyev
20. Burke
21. Nilsson
22. Wilsby
23. Jatkola
24. Sward
25. Ingram
26. Del Gaizo
27. Olsson
28. Prokop
29. Willis
30. Fink
31. Roest
32. O’Hara
33. Knak
34. Walther
35. Strinden
36. Haider
37. Campbell
38. Muzzatti
39. Fontaine

Fontaine and Knak way too low… i’d put them both top 20

 

[maplepred]

Fontaine and Knak way too low… i’d put them both top 20

Top 20? I don’t know. I mean I feel like this top 20 is very solid and tough to bump anyone.
Fontaine doesn’t do really much that impresses me at all, knak is decent but I mean he may cap out at fourth liner in NHL max and I mean that just doesn’t get me too excited lol. I hope I’m wrong though.
Fontaine I don’t think ever sees the NHL

 

[AintLifeGrand]

Top 20? I don’t know. I mean I feel like this top 20 is very solid and tough to bump anyone.
Fontaine doesn’t do really much that impresses me at all, knak is decent but I mean he may cap out at fourth liner in NHL max and I mean that just doesn’t get me too excited lol. I hope I’m wrong though.
Fontaine I don’t think ever sees the NHL

you need to check Dobber Prospects for their upside projections

Knak is producing at a NHL'er 2nd liner based on his development curve/PNHLe

 

[maplepred]

you need to check Dobber Prospects for their upside projections

Knak is producing at a NHL'er 2nd liner based on his development curve/PNHLe
View attachment 730990

To each their own opinion. That’s just my list i put together and my projections.
I hope dobber is right though, that would be amazing is knak ended up being a top six forward too!

 

[wmupreds]

That Knak projection hasn't been updated since 2020-21. He hasn't taken huge steps forward since then.

 

[AintLifeGrand]

I actually follow the Swiss league and for him to be at almost .5 ppg playing sheltered minutes for Davos is really impressive.

Keep in mind the National League has become arguably the 2nd best league in the world now since the Russian/Ukraine war

 

[maplepred]

I actually follow the Swiss league and for him to be at almost .5 ppg playing sheltered minutes for Davos is really impressive.

Keep in mind the National League has become arguably the 2nd best league in the world now since the Russian/Ukraine war

KHL is still second best league in the world. The war is not stopping them from playing hockey is it?
I also am not sure about this so I’m just asking but wouldn’t the Finnish and Swedish leagues be tougher competition than the Swiss league?

I mean I hope Knak does well absolutely but is he realistically?

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

It was nice the Preds brought Knak over at the end of the season for a look. He is still a prospect. He will certainly have to go ahead and take those steps to securing a larger scoring role in Switzerland in the coming season, however. If he does that, he could climb back into our top-20 next year. But you can't really put him there atm, not with the prospect depth and the draft we just had. And since he signed the 3-year extension that will keep him in Switzerland until 2026, we're probably not going to see much more of him anytime soon. His rights expire on June 1, 2025, so it's also not entirely clear how that will mesh with his Swiss contract going to 2026. Presumably he has an out clause for signing in the NHL, but he'll have to really take some huge leaps in the next 2 years before the AHL would seem more attractive than just staying in Davos permanently.

One thing about having this big influx of draft picks is we'll probably end up being a little bit harsh on signing guys. The guys whose rights are expiring in 2024 and 2025 are going to have to really show something. Our reserve list is pretty big right now, and we are already at 46/50 contracts. Some guys will be let go who in past years we might have handed contracts to.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

KHL is still second best league in the world. The war is not stopping them from playing hockey is it?
I also am not sure about this so I’m just asking but wouldn’t the Finnish and Swedish leagues be tougher competition than the Swiss league?

I don't think anybody can say too conclusively these days. KHL lost some of the imports from other countries due to the war, so the theory is that makes the KHL weaker than it was. But I don't think they lost ALL their imports, so they are usually still considered the 2nd best league. But I think with all of the top European leagues - and the AHL could be added to this - they are clustered closely enough that a good team in any of the leagues could win a game against teams from the other leagues. It's a tighter grouping perhaps than ever before? On a slight average, the KHL is probably still on top, but who knows, it's close enough I wouldn't get too invested in the argument. I'd rather live in Davos than Milwaukee though. And both of them way before Moscow atm.

 

[AintLifeGrand]

KHL is still second best league in the world. The war is not stopping them from playing hockey is it?
I also am not sure about this so I’m just asking but wouldn’t the Finnish and Swedish leagues be tougher competition than the Swiss league?

I mean I hope Knak does well absolutely but is he realistically?

nah dog , thats kind of like an old trope . All of the KHL’s high end import talent (outside of a few us/ canadian guys) went to the swiss league.

The National League pays more than any other league (outside of the nhl) and has the 2nd largest crowds of any league in the world.

it smokes Liiga and is better than the SEL as well

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

I would probably do a prospects ranking in a series of "tiers" first. One could debate within those tiers based on various factors (upside, risk vs. proximity to NHL, etc). I will quasi-list them in my order even within the tiers, but could easily order them differently on a different day.

Tier 1: Guys who we hope have some potential upside to be "NHL Star Players". These are our 3 most recent highest picks. But if we are going to get a "breakthrough" star player, even though the odds still aren't that great, these might be our best hopes for that?
Wood - best total package... except there is that skating issue
Askarov - franchise goalie? but still so much to work on
Kemell - 40-goal driver and volume shooter... or Arvidsson?

Tier 2: Could still be "NHL Star Players"... we saw some great things from these guys in the NHL already, but is there sort of a "cap" on their upside? Like, are they more Forsberg/Duchene/Johansen types if things keep going well? 60-80 pts is still great, they can still be key players. Sometimes I'm tempted to push a couple of them into Tier 1 (Parssinen and Evangelista) but then I try to check my enthusiasm... it would be a lot to ask. Not impossible though that these guys will end up better than the Tier 1 guys, these two tiers are VERY close!
Evangelista - so surprising in Year 1
Parssinen - he's going to be good regardless of the offense
Tomasino - bit of a fall based on last season (hopefully that was just Hynes)

Tier 3: I think the main thing that separates them so far is just exposure... I may end up putting them at #7/8 in these rankings today, but as soon as we see them next season they could easily jump a tier quickly (especially Svechov I'm thinking).
Svechkov
Molendyk

Tier 4: Two late first rounders but who project more likely as grinders/middle-6 players as opposed to top players? But one never knows... if they can bring 20-30 goals to go with grit that's hugely valuable also.
L'Heureux
Schaeffer

(marks the end of the "Top 10")

Tier 5: Sort of a grab-bag of our most-ready D plus almost-ready Afanaseyev. But I rate this tier above the ones below it because while it may be fair to question the maximum upside of some of these players, I think they are all coming from backgrounds with just as much accomplishment at younger ages as some of the less experienced prospects, but have built on that with successful professional seasons as well, and could fill in at the NHL level today and not be embarrassed which I think is a big accomplishment on its own. I probably diverge from many posters' opinions here because I value this "demonstrated progression" more highly while consciously trying to "restrain my enthusiasm" on the younger and less experienced prospects.
Chistyakov
Livingstone
Stastney
Afanaseyev
Del Gaizo
Wilsby

Tier 6: Here are some younger prospects and recent draft picks who have done good things at their various junior/lesser levels, but are going to need to carry that forward in their journey - really hardly any ordering at all here. Some of course may have higher "upside" than the tier above them, but I need to see them progress further towards reaching that upside before I bump them up.
Lind
Nilsson
Ufko
Kulonummi
Jatkola
Kiiskanen
MacKinnon
Olsson
Ingram
Burke
Matier
Prokop

(now we're a few players past the "Top 20"... 28 down to be exact!)

Tier 7: These guys are "interesting" in some fashion, maybe they are newer late picks, or guys who are we're just not that familiar with and might jump a couple tiers with great seasons, who knows... I could probably have divided Tier 6 and 7 a little better to level out the numbers in each... hmmm.... ok, true!
Fink
Willis
Roest
Knak
Haider

(that's 33 done)

Tier 8: I'm guessing "probably not gonna happen" for these guys? But maybe they have some hidden super power, who knows.
Fontaine
Campbell
Kondelik
Sward
Muzzatti
Walther
Mutter
O'Hara
Strinden
Reid
McLane

(the end of the "Top 44" )

(I didn't even put Volkov or Yeryomenko even though they are technically on our Reserve List still).

I think with a few exceptions it's pretty close to maplepreds list.

 

[Flgatorguy87]

Knak

I would probably do a prospects ranking in a series of "tiers" first. One could debate within those tiers based on various factors (upside, risk vs. proximity to NHL, etc). I will quasi-list them in my order even within the tiers, but could easily order them differently on a different day.

Tier 1: Guys who we hope have some potential upside to be "NHL Star Players". These are our 3 most recent highest picks. But if we are going to get a "breakthrough" star player, even though the odds still aren't that great, these might be our best hopes for that?
Wood - best total package... except there is that skating issue
Askarov - franchise goalie? but still so much to work on
Kemell - 40-goal driver and volume shooter... or Arvidsson?

Tier 2: Could still be "NHL Star Players"... we saw some great things from these guys in the NHL already, but is there sort of a "cap" on their upside? Like, are they more Forsberg/Duchene/Johansen types if things keep going well? 60-80 pts is still great, they can still be key players. Sometimes I'm tempted to push a couple of them into Tier 1 (Parssinen and Evangelista) but then I try to check my enthusiasm... it would be a lot to ask. Not impossible though that these guys will end up better than the Tier 1 guys, these two tiers are VERY close!
Evangelista - so surprising in Year 1
Parssinen - he's going to be good regardless of the offense
Tomasino - bit of a fall based on last season (hopefully that was just Hynes)

Tier 3: I think the main thing that separates them so far is just exposure... I may end up putting them at #7/8 in these rankings today, but as soon as we see them next season they could easily jump a tier quickly (especially Svechov I'm thinking).
Svechkov
Molendyk

Tier 4: Two late first rounders but who project more likely as grinders/middle-6 players as opposed to top players? But one never knows... if they can bring 20-30 goals to go with grit that's hugely valuable also.
L'Heureux
Schaeffer

(marks the end of the "Top 10")

Tier 5: Sort of a grab-bag of our most-ready D plus almost-ready Afanaseyev. But I rate this tier above the ones below it because while it may be fair to question the maximum upside of some of these players, I think they are all coming from backgrounds with just as much accomplishment at younger ages as some of the less experienced prospects, but have built on that with successful professional seasons as well, and could fill in at the NHL level today and not be embarrassed which I think is a big accomplishment on its own. I probably diverge from many posters' opinions here because I value this "demonstrated progression" more highly while consciously trying to "restrain my enthusiasm" on the younger and less experienced prospects.
Chistyakov
Livingstone
Stastney
Afanaseyev
Del Gaizo
Wilsby

Tier 6: Here are some younger prospects and recent draft picks who have done good things at their various junior/lesser levels, but are going to need to carry that forward in their journey - really hardly any ordering at all here. Some of course may have higher "upside" than the tier above them, but I need to see them progress further towards reaching that upside before I bump them up.
Lind
Nilsson
Ufko
Kulonummi
Jatkola
Kiiskanen
MacKinnon
Olsson
Ingram
Burke
Matier
Prokop

(now we're a few players past the "Top 20"... 28 down to be exact!)

Tier 7: These guys are "interesting" in some fashion, maybe they are newer late picks, or guys who are we're just not that familiar with and might jump a couple tiers with great seasons, who knows... I could probably have divided Tier 6 and 7 a little better to level out the numbers in each... hmmm.... ok, true!
Fink
Willis
Roest
Knak
Haider

(that's 33 done)

Tier 8: I'm guessing "probably not gonna happen" for these guys? But maybe they have some hidden super power, who knows.
Fontaine
Campbell
Kondelik
Sward
Muzzatti
Walther
Mutter
O'Hara
Strinden
Reid
McLane

(the end of the "Top 44" )

(I didn't even put Volkov or Yeryomenko even though they are technically on our Reserve List still).

I think with a few exceptions it's pretty close to maplepreds list.

The thing that is interesting for that bottom tier, is a few of those guys have very clear traits or abilities that are NHL'esque, but there's so many other things they still have to piece together to ever have a chance. As you move up through these lists the things the players do well get's larger or more extreme. It's a solid ranking when you view it that way.

 

[Edgework]

The thing I’ve liked about parssinen is that he plays with so much detail in his game. Watching him in the nhl, you constantly think things like “oh wow, nice angle there” or “smart body placement to shield that defender” or “sweet puck placement” or “nice footwork there.”

To me, that level of detail isn’t really an up-and-down thing. Those are habits, so they should be there pretty much all the time. When you combine that with his big frame and great ice vision, I think it bodes really well for his nhl career.

Evangelista is interesting because he is seemingly always in the right place at the right time. If you’re in the right place at the right time once, you maybe got lucky. If you do it constantly, you’re seeing the pattens unfold at a high level.

We need more games from evangelista, but there is some tentative evidence he is a very smart offensive hockey player.

As you move up through these lists the things the players do well get's larger or more extreme.

or possibly their weaknesses get fewer as you move up. Like “Buford in tier 6 has a great shot but can’t skate,” whereas “John in tier 2 has a great shot and no glaring weakness.”

 

[herzausstein]

WRT Tier 4
Am i off base of thinking of Jordin Tootoo and Josh Anderson as comparables for L'Heureux and Schaefer?

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

It seems crazy to me that we have 39 or 44 or 46 "prospects" we could even list. I can remember some years when we did the voting, people would sort of just throw up their arms after 10 or 20, and that's kind of reflected in the tiering too where it's just impossible for us in our armchairs to really differentiate or have any real opinion about some of the guys past 20. But in this year's group, if I just number my list then Kulonummi would mark the #20 guy, and there are easily 10 guys after him that it would "seem like a shame" not to have in your top-20, relative to most years' lists?

This is really the value in "making lots of picks" to me. If you can list 30 even semi-legit prospects in your system, that's a big difference from having things kind of dwindle out after listing 15 or 16 guys. If even 2 or 3 out of that extra "insane depth" climb up the ranks (and I suspect some will), then it was well worth it to keep and make all those picks IMO.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

WRT Tier 4
Am i off base of thinking of Jordin Tootoo and Josh Anderson as comparables for L'Heureux and Schaefer?

I was going to get as optimistic as Scott Walker on L'Heureux! But it's kind of hard to tell with the older players (Nichol and Tootoo included in the options), because fighting is just not ever going to be the same as it used to be. I guess if Walker is the optimistic version of L'Heureux, then Anderson can be for Schaefer? But let's face it, we're more likely to get Austin Watson, right? Not really so bad, end of the day.

 

[herzausstein]

I was going to get as optimistic as Scott Walker on L'Heureux! But it's kind of hard to tell with the older players (Nichol and Tootoo included in the options), because fighting is just not ever going to be the same as it used to be. I guess if Walker is the optimistic version of L'Heureux, then Anderson can be for Schaefer? But let's face it, we're more likely to get Austin Watson, right? Not really so bad, end of the day.

If he could become the 30 point version of tootoo, it wouldnt be too bad. Energetic pest that gets under everyone's skin. A scott walker version would be nice though.

I wasnt trying to be optimistic for an Anderson comparison. 30ish point big bodied forward. Both watson and Schaefer have similar production rates in the minors though (different leagues though OHL vs WHL) so it could turn out in a similar fashion.

 

[AintLifeGrand]

Smh at ranking Afanasyev above Knak when they are roughly the same age and Knak producing at a higher rate than Egor in a harder league

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

Smh at ranking Afanasyev above Knak when they are roughly the same age and Knak producing at a higher rate than Egor in a harder league

You should create a poll and see if there is even 1 other person in the world besides you who has Knak ahead of Afanaseyev.