PC Building Guide and Discussion #11 (everything is expensive...)

[Knave]

There's this too - these guys are closer to you.

GIGABYTE GeForce GTX 1080 WINDFORCE OC 8GB(GV-N1080WF3OC-8GD)

Yeah that works out. I ordered it, they'll deliver it to the Canada Computers, phone me and I'll pick it up and pay for it after work.

 

[Kestrel]

Yeah that works out. I ordered it, they'll deliver it to the Canada Computers, phone me and I'll pick it up and pay for it after work.

Awesome - I'm jealous

 

[Knave]

Awesome - I'm jealous

Thanks for all the help

 

[Kestrel]

Thanks for all the help

No problem at all - I know you're waiting for other parts to be released, but I hope you end up really enjoying the system.

 

[SniperHF]

@SniperHF I'm assuming you're just saying that it would be really easy to set up the water cooling on that card? I know nothing about water cooling.

Yes. It's a self contained unit or "all in one" All you have to do is mount the radiator on your exhaust and it will run just like any other card.

The ones that are complicated are the cards that are a water block only. In that case you need to buy a pump, tubing, a radiator, and a fan. The "hybrid" model includes all that stuff.

 

[Knave]

No problem at all - I know you're waiting for other parts to be released, but I hope you end up really enjoying the system.

Picked it up after work, there is no going back now:

 

[SniperHF]

Picked it up after work, there is no going back now:

See, if I had a $800 video card laying around I wouldn't be waiting for other parts to become available if you catch my drift.

 

[Starry Knight]

So, I ended up buying a new desktop. It was a pretty great deal with upgrades across the board.

What I'm wondering is how to manage two hard drives. My SSD is only 128GB, so most things I'll probably want on the hard drive. What should I keep on the SSD? What should I be saving/moving from the original startup to the hard drive?

 

[Knave]

See, if I had a $800 video card laying around I wouldn't be waiting for other parts to become available if you catch my drift.

You're tempting me. I have the case, I have a bluray drive, I have the graphics card now. I want to try to wait it out but who knows maybe I'll cave by the end of the week and order the stuff available now, lol.

I mean they just announced the new Vive headset. They just announced it today. aaaah

 

[SniperHF]

So, I ended up buying a new desktop. It was a pretty great deal with upgrades across the board.

What I'm wondering is how to manage two hard drives. My SSD is only 128GB, so most things I'll probably want on the hard drive. What should I keep on the SSD? What should I be saving/moving from the original startup to the hard drive?

Are you installing the OS on the SSD and using it as a boot drive? If you aren't planning on it you probably should. You get the most benefit out of an SSD if it's used as the boot drive.


The short answer is you want frequently used stuff on the SSD.


Longer
Windows install (about 30 GB thereabouts)

Web browser (minimally 30MB to 100MB, the temporary files are what take up the space)

If you install your OS cleanly on the SSD, your temp files will be located there by default. This is good as temp files are frequently accessed so the speed from the SSD is helpful. I find these tend to take between 1 and 5 GB depending on how big you let it get.

Page file (will be on the SSD by default if Windows was installed on the SSD)

Your most played games for the rest. On a 128GB Drive this is usually only 1 or 2 games.


I usually try to leave about 20 GB free on a 128GB SSD for the OS, windows updates and other stuff sometimes needs free space on the C drive. You might be able to get away with less.

If you aren't using your SSD for the OS you could get closer to filling it up, just leave a little extra space. Between 5 and 10GB. Games get patched and need to store files temporarily for example.

 

[Starry Knight]

Are you installing the OS on the SSD and using it as a boot drive? If you aren't planning on it you probably should. You get the most benefit out of an SSD if it's used as the boot drive.


The short answer is you want frequently used stuff on the SSD.


Longer
Windows install (about 30 GB thereabouts)

Web browser (minimally 30MB to 100MB, the temporary files are what take up the space)

If you install your OS cleanly on the SSD, your temp files will be located there by default. This is good as temp files are frequently accessed so the speed from the SSD is helpful. I find these tend to take between 1 and 5 GB depending on how big you let it get.

Page file (will be on the SSD by default if Windows was installed on the SSD)

Your most played games for the rest. On a 128GB Drive this is usually only 1 or 2 games.


I usually try to leave about 20 GB free on a 128GB SSD for the OS, windows updates and other stuff sometimes needs free space on the C drive. You might be able to get away with less.

If you aren't using your SSD for the OS you could get closer to filling it up, just leave a little extra space. Between 5 and 10GB. Games get patched and need to store files temporarily for example.

It's a prebuilt, so everything at this point is loaded onto the SSD and takes up roughly 70GB. I will probably keep using it as a boot drive.

 

[SniperHF]

It's a prebuilt, so everything at this point is loaded onto the SSD and takes up roughly 70GB. I will probably keep using it as a boot drive.

Oh I thought you meant that you added the SSD as an upgrade.

Then you're basically set. 70GB seems like a lot though, either bloatware or windows updates sucking up space. You might run disk cleanup just as a starting point and see if there's some files it might remove.

Any of the "creators" big Windows updates tend to create a Windows old which keeps a backup copy of the whole install prior to the update.
Delete Windows.old after the Windows 10 Fall Creators Update | PCsteps.com

Even if your PC was "new" it might not have had a current Windows image on it so you might have that Windows.old skulking around.

 

[Starry Knight]

View media item 1651View media item 1649View media item 1647
I'm not too sure with what constitutes bloatware and what I should be moving over to the hard disk. Should I be taking any other the directories in their entirety over?

 

[SniperHF]

and what I should be moving over to the hard disk

Most likely nothing.
What you want to do going forward is install less frequently used programs on the HDD as well as store your documents/music/movies over there. As well as games you don't have room for on the SSD.

 

[Starry Knight]

Thanks a lot for your help! I'll be sure to ask you any more questions when they pop up.

 

[SniperHF]

Thanks a lot for your help! I'll be sure to ask you any more questions when they pop up.

One other thing, if you're using Steam you can create multiple libraries so you can install steam games on both the SSD and HDD


You want one library on the SSD and one on the HDD.

 

[Knave]

So the main things for compatibility when I buy the other parts are that the RAM, Motherboard and CPU are all compatible with each other? And everything else should be fine?

And how would I know what RAM is compatible with the new Ryzen CPUs if I managed to hold out until late April? Would the CPU give me an indication of that?

 

[Kestrel]

So the main things for compatibility when I buy the other parts are that the RAM, Motherboard and CPU are all compatible with each other? And everything else should be fine?

And how would I know what RAM is compatible with the new Ryzen CPUs if I managed to hold out until late April? Would the CPU give me an indication of that?

You're on the right track - the motherboard has to be the right socket/chipset for the CPU, and the RAM needs to be compatible. If you buy an Intel CPU, it's almost not worth worrying about RAM compatibility at this point - it just should work. I suspect the new Ryzen CPU's will be much MORE that way than the current ones, but each RAM manufacturer will likely have a few RAM packs they specifically designate as being Ryzen compatible - each motherboard may have a list of RAM that is identified as being compatible too - we can help you with that when it's time if you would like.

 

[Knave]

You're on the right track - the motherboard has to be the right socket/chipset for the CPU, and the RAM needs to be compatible. If you buy an Intel CPU, it's almost not worth worrying about RAM compatibility at this point - it just should work. I suspect the new Ryzen CPU's will be much MORE that way than the current ones, but each RAM manufacturer will likely have a few RAM packs they specifically designate as being Ryzen compatible - each motherboard may have a list of RAM that is identified as being compatible too - we can help you with that when it's time if you would like.

Alright. I guess for now I should pick up other stuff like power supply, SSD and Windows?

 

[Kestrel]

Alright. I guess for now I should pick up other stuff like power supply, SSD and Windows?

Might as well... although, Windows depends on the approach you would like to take. If you're just going to get a retail pack, go ahead whenever you feel like. If you don't mind doing the Reddit Microsoft Software Swap, you can get Windows at a reduced price - I have gone that route a few times, and never had a problem. My current system is running off a Windows 10 key I got off Ebay - and it activated without a problem. There's no guarantee that Microsoft won't deactivate it at a later date, but in my mind, for the under $10 I spent, it's a worthwhile risk. This is the listing I bought from: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro license key - INSTANT DELIVERY! | eBay

If you're going that route, I'd wait until you're ready to install Windows, and buy it then.

 

[Knave]

Might as well... although, Windows depends on the approach you would like to take. If you're just going to get a retail pack, go ahead whenever you feel like. If you don't mind doing the Reddit Microsoft Software Swap, you can get Windows at a reduced price - I have gone that route a few times, and never had a problem. My current system is running off a Windows 10 key I got off Ebay - and it activated without a problem. There's no guarantee that Microsoft won't deactivate it at a later date, but in my mind, for the under $10 I spent, it's a worthwhile risk. This is the listing I bought from: Microsoft Windows 10 Pro license key - INSTANT DELIVERY! | eBay

If you're going that route, I'd wait until you're ready to install Windows, and buy it then.

Yeah $10 sounds absurdly cheap.

I ordered a 1TB version of the SSD in the build you posted from Newegg. So now just need to grab a power supply.

As a bit of an aside, Ryzen processors had some modest price decreases in anticipation of the new launches.

What kind of stuff would you need to be doing for the Thread ripper variant?

 

[Kestrel]

What kind of stuff would you need to be doing for the Thread ripper variant?

If you are thinking Threadripper, be sure that it's actually what you want. If this is basically just a VR gaming machine, Threadripper isn't for you unless you want the bragging rights of having Threadripper. If you want to do a bunch of video encodes, and stream, and maybe do other stuff while you're doing your VR - or have other tasks that take a lot of cores - that's the kind of thing Threadripper will shine in. Otherwise you're blowing a lot of money, and not getting any extra benefit out of it. That said - I LOVE my Threadripper.

Number one thing for Threadripper - get a power supply with TWO EPS cables (that's the CPU power cable) - to be clear, not just a power supply with ports for two cables, but one that actually HAS two cables. The reason for that distinction - my 650W Seasonic power supply is fully capable of running two cables, it has the ports to take them - but they only ship it with ONE cable. And you can't buy another cable from Seasonic, if you contact them, they will recommend a third party site where you're going to pay $20 or $30 just for the stupid cable.

Number two - Threadripper has a quad-channel RAM setup. That means you would want to try and track down a decent quad channel (4 sticks) RAM kit that is compatible. I got lucky, and found a 32 GB quad channel kit for, I think it was $280. Failing that, you can get two dual channel kits, which should be fine - it's just that a quad channel kit is in theory meant to have 4 sticks that have been tested together.

Number three - Threadripper CPU's do NOT come with a cooler, so you have to buy a third party cooler. There are very few options out there. I got a Noctua heat sink with 140mm fan, but I had to make sure I got a case that could even fit the cooler (the case you got does). If your RAM is too high, you're going to have to move the fan higher up on the heat sink. On some motherboards, it MIGHT also cut off access to your first PCIe slot, but you're supposed to be able to offset the cooler to fix that - I didn't have to do that, but the cooler is sitting very very close to my video card.

 

[Knave]

If you are thinking Threadripper, be sure that it's actually what you want. If this is basically just a VR gaming machine, Threadripper isn't for you unless you want the bragging rights of having Threadripper. If you want to do a bunch of video encodes, and stream, and maybe do other stuff while you're doing your VR - or have other tasks that take a lot of cores - that's the kind of thing Threadripper will shine in. Otherwise you're blowing a lot of money, and not getting any extra benefit out of it. That said - I LOVE my Threadripper.

I'll look into it more when I get home I guess. I do have my current PC which in theory I could transfer Blu-ray disc rips to and encode on it and use it as a mule.

I do tend to run alot of tabs and Handbrake while doing stuff like games or watching a movie/Netflix.

It would be nice to have it all on one computer with two screens but it is a significant jump in price and I'd imagine the power supply.would be significantly.more expensive on top of purchasing a cooler like you mentioned.

 

[Kestrel]

I'll look into it more when I get home I guess. I do have my current PC which in theory I could transfer Blu-ray disc rips to and encode on it and use it as a mule.

I do tend to run alot of tabs and Handbrake while doing stuff like games or watching a movie/Netflix.

It would be nice to have it all on one computer with two screens but it is a significant jump in price and I'd imagine the power supply.would be significantly.more expensive on top of purchasing a cooler like you mentioned.

To put it in perspective, my motherboard was somewhere around $400 and $500 (and was one of the "cheap" ones), and the processor costed me around $1200. I think the cooler was about $100. The power supply I ended up getting was about $200, but you can probably get cheaper - I got a platinum rated power supply, and you don't necessarily need that.

I would suggest that even an 8 core Ryzen 7 would be worth looking at - you still get 16 threads, and you pay a lot less. But, if you think Threadripper might be for you, it takes away the need to wait. Threadripper 2 won't be out until the second half of the year.

Also, Threadripper can mine. That is NOT a reason to buy it - mine is currently mining what would be roughly $1.60 to $1.75 per day - I plan to hang onto what I'm earning though (I'm paid in Bitcoin), as if Bitcoin rebounds, what I'm getting paid could potentially even double in value. If Monero (what it mines) goes up in value, that will help too - at my peak, it was mining about $4 per day. BUT - you can't count on any of that.

 

[Kestrel]

I'm hoping my mining will eventually pay off at least the processor, but like I said... you can't count on that. I HAD about $100 in Bitcoin that I chose not to cash out right away... it's probably sitting at around $60 right now I think it will go back up though, and I've got more that I can transfer to my wallet to be ready to cash out - but I'm in no hurry while Bitcoin is low.