Player Discussion: Patrik Laine Part VII: Eliitti! - Mod Warning Post #79

[QuietContrarian]

Goddamn if he really does that he definitely is as stupid as a coach as I really believe he is. I mean Laine-Little-Ehlers was just such garbage during last season that I absolutely don’t want to see that line again. Absolutely not a smallest bit of chemistry. Horrible troubles defensively because of losing most of the battles all around the ice, and just as horrible offensively, as it was about mindless skating and passing and practically no sense at all. Just an absolutely horrible line really.

Of course I’m that guy who doesn’t really see a good chemistry between Laine and Ehlers (at least on the ice), so I seriously don’t like them on the same line. I also do think that Ehlers is kind of overrated, although his skating is definitely absolutely magnificent. Last season his play was just too often resembling a headless chicken with the puck, and he way too often just skated too long around in the corner and lost the puck there or with a too late and bad pass.

Sure Ehlers has been good in the beginning of the season, but so far really in only two games. And at least so far I’m not really convinced yet that he has really changed that much from last season. If he has after all developed and started to really think with his play, instead of just skating mindlessly like a madman, then he could of course even be a very good and valuable player. But I will really believe it only when he has played the majority of his games like that during the full season.

In my opinion Scheifele is the best player in the Jets and the chemistry is obvious between him and Laine. It is plain stupid to waste so much offensive potential with those two not playing together. It would really create so much more scoring for the Jets, that no other combination would really match it during a full season. The ideal third player with them would be Perreault, whom I think has been bashed a bit too much here by Kelsier. Perreault is really a great player to drive a line and it is especially because of his relentless forechecking. He is also a lot better at creating shooting chances to his linemates than he is usually given credit for, especially if he can have linemates like Scheifele and Laine.

It was proven statistically that this combination worked the best for the Jets last season, both by scored goals and also driving possession. Just great chemistry between these three. Now that Perreault is injured though, I would like to see Connor get his chance with Scheifele and Laine.

Also Ehlers-Little-Wheeler line seemed to work pretty well last season, and it is well known that Little and Wheeler have pretty good chemistry playing together, so why not make sure that the Jets would have really two pretty good scoring lines?

Ehlers, overrated?

Thats a new one...

Is Laine overrated because he only seems to have a great shot at times? NO!
He is still very young, as Ehlers is, and Ehlers has to combat being a rather small player.

The only thing Ehlers did wrong was misuse his speed and dash straight for the Ozone, he hadnt really adapted fully to his linemates not thinking at the same pace, and not fully used to not being able to dance around all opponnents like in jr.

At the end of the season and this seasons he seems to master this in a better way.

If this is not some kind of bash on Ehlers because he is on the first line, then what is it?
64pts for an overrated headless chicken, - then ill take the overrated headless chicken anyday.
Ehlers made some of the sexiest high iq plays and passes I saw last season, so this does really seem like a nonsensical comment.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

I dont agree with Ehlers being overrated but he does NOT have to struggle.because he is rather "small". First of all he is not, second of all the league is trending towards players his size. One look at Patrik out there and u can see which one struggles with his size

 

[QuietContrarian]

I dont agree with Ehlers being overrated but he does NOT have to struggle.because he is rather "small". First of all he is not, second of all the league is trending towards players his size. One look at Patrik out there and u can see which one struggles with his size

Didnt say he struggled, I said he has to work with being a rather smallish player and use his speed.

Just because more smaller players are finding a place in the league does not mean the league is abandoning its size fetish, u still need big strong players, and smallish players need to have something extraordinary to survive, like Kane, Ehlers, Johnny hockey, Marner and so forth.

And yes imo Ehlers is rather slight.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

Didnt say he struggled, I said he has to work with being a rather smallish player and use his speed.

Just because more smaller players are finding a place in the league does not mean the league is abandoning its size fetish, u still need big strong players, and smallish players need to have something extraordinary to survive, like Kane, Ehlers, Johnny hockey, Marner and so forth.

And yes imo Ehlers is rather slight.

I dont agree. There are players, big and small, playing every role in the league. You dont become an NHL regular just because you are big enough. Every player needs some sort of a skill to succeed.

 

[QuietContrarian]

I dont agree. There are players, big and small, playing every role in the league. You dont become an NHL regular just because you are big enough. Every player needs some sort of a skill to succeed.

Again, thats not what I wrote, im too tired to have this dance.

Sizeable skilled players usually have less obstacles to overcome than smallish skilled players, in my honest opinion.

Thankfully you dont have to agree

 

[Howard Chuck]

This has been concerning me somewhat to begin the season, as that's not really how he played before NHL. He was legitimately physical and driving the net aggressively was a definite trademark of his. Last season, I figured it's just because of him having to get used to NHL pace and all, but even after a season he still hasn't been able to regain these aspects to his game properly. I'll try to look more closely and see what the issue would be. One thing that comes to mind is that Laine's really at his best when he gets to do a zone entry / rush in speed but with the Jets' system, the zone entries usually happen with the wingers at a standstill(Something I consider very outdated for zone entry systems, by the way), which might not allow him to play to his strengths. This was an issue for his national team in the WHCs as well, by the way.

My favorite team to watch right now is Leafs and it's like night and day how they fly into the zone.

I've mentioned before that he seems to be hanging back more and never really committing completely to the offence. I really believe that he is trying to play a more defensive game, which is great I suppose, but I would rather have someone else on his line looking after that, as he is more of a threat to score than pretty much anyone else. But if this is what he is being told to do and it's what he is doing, then good for him for being coachable.

 

[kelsier]

I've mentioned before that he seems to be hanging back more and never really committing completely to the offence. I really believe that he is trying to play a more defensive game, which is great I suppose, but I would rather have someone else on his line looking after that, as he is more of a threat to score than pretty much anyone else. But if this is what he is being told to do and it's what he is doing, then good for him for being coachable.

I agree with ijuka that Laine isn't playing with his strengths and he seems overly committed to the defense. This might be caused by a fear of losing ice time or something. I'd rather have him steaming towards the net and taking a bit more chances. If he's the first one to cross the offensive blue line, he nowadays rather just shoots than tries to get around the defender. That's not the Laine I know, so seems like he's doing what his told.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

I've mentioned before that he seems to be hanging back more and never really committing completely to the offence. I really believe that he is trying to play a more defensive game, which is great I suppose, but I would rather have someone else on his line looking after that, as he is more of a threat to score than pretty much anyone else. But if this is what he is being told to do and it's what he is doing, then good for him for being coachable.

Really sad to see a guy with his offensive tools worry about defense so much. He does not need to be a two way shut down player ffs. He did mention in a preseason interview that he wants to focus on defending and be useful even when he is not producing, but if that turns out to significantly hinder his offense... then that just absolutely sucks.

 

[nobody important]

Really sad to see a guy with his offensive tools worry about defense so much. He does not need to be a two way shut down player ffs. He did mention in a preseason interview that he wants to focus on defending and be useful even when he is not producing, but if that turns out to significantly hinder his offense... then that just absolutely sucks.

I figure Maurice wants a team of little Mo-bots. So much easier to deploy updates if they're all running the same software.

 

[Aavco Cup]

I think he realizes he needs to increase his garbage goal totals

 

[Kaako Kappo]

I think he realizes he needs to increase his garbage goal totals

Can't score those goals when he's 30 feet away from the net though.

 

[Narow]

C'mon Laine today you shall have a great game and show that you can score hattricks away from scheifele

 

[nobody important]

I think he realizes he needs to increase his garbage goal totals

I'm sorry but watching that, this is all I could think of.

 

[Halberdier]

Really sad to see a guy with his offensive tools worry about defense so much. He does not need to be a two way shut down player ffs. He did mention in a preseason interview that he wants to focus on defending and be useful even when he is not producing, but if that turns out to significantly hinder his offense... then that just absolutely sucks.

It's kind of sad, yes, but that's the other reason why he is so good at winning his own game compared to most other Jets.

I have been amazed how many posters in this thread have been lately talking about that "Laine is not that big liability on d-zone", while his positioning, calm play and excellent reading has made him one of the best Jets in this regard and statistically the best Jet so far in this 5-game season (which is way too small sample size to do ANY real conclusions yet).

You (I mean You that think that "Laine is not anymore THAT bad defensively, though still bad") should sometimes really watch his play and positioning. It often looks like Laine is doing nothing, but in the end the loose puck just happen to be on his stick eventually, or he saves the sure goal on the last possible moment.


What is missing from Laine's play right now is the explosiveness and that killing mentality. He needs to get into that play. It's maybe not that easy when he is RW and he needs to make the first pass out of the d-zone, as it is in the Jets system as he should sometimes get the puck when he is skating fast. All of us that did watch very closely his play on FEL know that he has all the tools, as he was THE go to guy for bringing the puck into o-zone for example. Often it did took one successful great play before it clicked, and then he was unbeatable. That has happened only periodically in NHL, and we are waiting for it to happen first time for this season.

 

[Cleatus]

Was expecting Laine to have his share of challenges this year because he still has a lot to learn about the North American game. None the less, much like Marner, if you can get 4 points in 5 games when you're playing "bad," that's a hell of a good sign of things to come.

 

[Lowered Expectations]

After six games Laine is only Jets F with positive +/- with +3 and he has 0 PIM. So his two-way play seems to be ok. If fact to me it seems he play too much D first, being often 1st to return to D zone.
Maybe finally we get ESL and Laine will get unleashed - making hits in O zone and get that magic touch with Scheif going again.
Call me crazy but I would even try Laine- Scheif - Armia, Connor - Little - Wheeler, Ehlers - Copp - Tanev in some point. Well just get the pairings right: Laine and Scheif, Little and Wheeler. Use Connor, Ehlers and Armia to get modifications. Do NOT separate Laine and Scheif!
.

 

[Asiantuntija]

Laine isn't getting quality chances with Little and that could hurt his confidence. Little doesn't have enough vision to set him up and he starts to take stupid shots from bad spots as he did today.

 

[grieves]

If, and I'm saying IF they are so stupid that they are trying to somehow limit Laine's scoring to get a better deal, that is going to backfire in probably more ways than one. For the love of god, don't do that. You'll have better luck just asking him nicely for a discount.

And if that is not the case, then jesus christ, wake me up when the new coach is here.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

Nah, Laine not producing is a side product of the team being ass.

 

[Ippenator]

Whatever it is really, one thing is absolutely sure. The Jets play like crap, and Maurice should be fired as soon as possible to still try to save this season.

Honestly I don’t feel right now like I want to wake up anymore in the middle of the night to start torchuring myself by watching this hideous crap which is about a moronic coach using the talented roster in ways that are going to destroy the player’s confidence and misuses the talent in so frustrsting ways.

This is really feeling like a bad dream. I just wish I would already wake up...

 

[Narow]

Laine isn't getting quality chances with Little and that could hurt his confidence. Little doesn't have enough vision to set him up and he starts to take stupid shots from bad spots as he did today.

So basically what you are saying is that Laine needs to be set up and he is very reliant on linemates.

 

[Laineux]

So basically what you are saying is that Laine needs to be set up and he is very reliant on linemates.

At this point he is. He's simply not fast enough to make prime scoring opportuinites happen by himself. He doesn't look any faster and might be even slower than last year which is very dissapointing.

 

[Ippenator]

At this point he is. He's simply not fast enough to make prime scoring opportuinites happen by himself. He doesn't look any faster and might be even slower than last year which is very dissapointing.

I’m starting to also believe that this might be the case. At least in last night’s game his skating looked pretty bad really. Although it is good to remember that training hard with Hannu Rautala’s group for getting more explosiveness might not really show really good results so soon as we might have been expecting. Anyway Otto Koivula, whom plays for Ilves in FEL, has been having similar kind of problems with his skating after training hard for the summer in Rautala’s group. But lately I have been seeing signs already of his skating starting to gradually improve, so I’m quite confident that it will gradually happen with Laine too.

Anyway Mikko Rantanen and Rasmus Ristolainen have clearly improved their explosiveness in the few summers that they have been training in Rautala’s group, so I’m not really worried at least on the long term basis. But right now I’m not feeling too good about this season for the Jets and Laine altogether. And unfortunately I think this season is really doomed if Maurice is not sacked ASAP.

 

[Asiantuntija]

So basically what you are saying is that Laine needs to be set up and he is very reliant on linemates.

Sniper needs playmaker to success. His deking & skating ain't good enough to make chances happen himself. Also he could be little bit scared to go full speed because last time he did it was game against Buffalo before he got injured. His movement looks awful with Little because chemistry is so low like it has always been. Hard to skate if you don't have any idea where you should skate. That has always been the case with Laine & Little.

All i'm saying that he needs center who is on the same page with him.

 

[Finnished]

Laine should definitely fire his off season trainer lol.