Player Discussion: Patrik Laine IVever: a new hope?

[LemonSauceD]

Would you guys do Mikheyev + a prospect (not including Lekkerimaki/Raty) for Laine straight up?

 

[Crede777]

Would you guys do Mikheyev + a prospect (not including Lekkerimaki/Raty) for Laine straight up?

Lol no. Mikheyev only has like 30 points this season and is 29.

 

[VT]

Would you guys do Mikheyev + a prospect (not including Lekkerimaki/Raty) for Laine straight up?

Mikheyev is always injured also he has not played like in Toronto. Prospects? Why. We have enough prospects. So this is terrible offer.

 

[majormajor]

i mean, this is just an egregiously bullshit narrative that entirely falls apart when you compare the power plays he was featured on in winnipeg versus the ones in columbus

winnipeg's power play rankings each of laine's four full seasons there:

1. 16-17: 18th
2. 17-18: 5th (64 PPG, laine had 20 + 11 assists)
3. 18-19: 4th (62 PPG, laine had 15)
4. 19-20: 15th

versus in columbus:

1. 20-21: 27th
2. 21-22: 24th
3. 22-23: 26th
4. 23-24: 31st

winnipeg's power play was well-coached (top-5 twice, top half of the league 3/4 of his seasons there) and built around using his one-timer. columbus's has been poorly coached the whole time (bottom-10 in all 4 years) and not build around his one-timer.

this year he's only played 18 games (extremely small sample!) – mostly while recovering from a serious concussion – on a team that 1) stinks and 2) really stinks at setting up its stars to succeed. case in point:

1. laine had a 6-3-9 statline in 18 games this season
2. gaudreau had 3-7-10 in those same 18 games
3. laine and gaudreau barely played together (72% of laine's 5v5 time was away from JG)
4. gaudreau is on pace for a career-worst season despite good underlying numbers

this is, inarguably, a lost year for patrik laine. but the two years prior to this are a better indication of the player he actually is. so what exactly is that?

answer: a highly-productive complimentary piece on a good team, as evidenced by his 5v5 scoring rates during those seasons:

Laine Team/Season	5v5 G/60	5v5 primary A/60	5v5 primary points/60
CBJ 22-23	0.97	0.75	1.72
CBJ 21-22	1.04	0.74	1.78
WPG 19-20	0.87	0.58	1.45
WPG 18-19	0.73	0.56	1.29
WPG 17-18	1.26	0.40	1.66
WPG 16-17	1.22	0.52	1.74

the g/60 numbers are down but the playmaking (primary A/60) went way up. that's not because he 'doesn't want to score' – it's because he went from playing with playmakers (ehlers + scheifele) to being asked to be the primary playmaker on his line (often with jenner, nyquist, etc).

columbus has largely asked laine to do different things (carrying/passing the puck) as a result of him having relatively weaker linemates, tougher assignments, and a worse power play. and he's done well enough at them to be a more productive 5v5 player than he was in winnipeg.

The kernel of truth, which you've carefully avoided, is that there's a reason Laine hasn't been kept with Gaudreau. Laine wants to be the primary puck carrier on his line. Gaudreau can't set him up if Laine is the one with the puck.

The reason Laine clicked with Nyquist and Jenner is because those guys don't need a lot of time with the puck, that wasn't a drag on Laine, it was the best possible situation for him given his preferred playstyle.

You really think the Jackets wouldn't love it if Gaudreau + Laine worked? That would solve a lot of problems!

Would you guys do Mikheyev + a prospect (not including Lekkerimaki/Raty) for Laine straight up?

If Laine wants to go to Vancouver then I'd be open to making that happen. And a short term cap dump plus picks would be fine. I think the fit in Columbus isn't there. But in this particular proposal Mikheyev has two years left after this at a hefty cap hit, a lot for a player nobody wants. That would be a pricy capdump.

 

[LemonSauceD]

The kernel of truth, which you've carefully avoided, is that there's a reason Laine hasn't been kept with Gaudreau. Laine wants to be the primary puck carrier on his line. Gaudreau can't set him up if Laine is the one with the puck.

The reason Laine clicked with Nyquist and Jenner is because those guys don't need a lot of time with the puck, that wasn't a drag on Laine, it was the best possible situation for him given his preferred playstyle.

You really think the Jackets wouldn't love it if Gaudreau + Laine worked? That would solve a lot of problems!



If Laine wants to go to Vancouver then I'd be open to making that happen. And a short term cap dump plus picks would be fine. I think the fit in Columbus isn't there. But in this particular proposal Mikheyev has two years left after this at a hefty cap hit, a lot for a player nobody wants. That would be a pricy capdump.

Some of us would be open to trading for him. What you would want?

 

[majormajor]

Some of us would be open to trading for him. What you would want?

If we're taking on the Mikheyev deal then something like Pettersson (the D-man) plus a 2nd, or your next 1st rounder.

I presume Willander is off the table along with the two you mentioned, it looks to me like EP the D is the only interesting prospect left.

 

[LemonSauceD]

If we're taking on the Mikheyev deal then something like Pettersson (the D-man) plus a 2nd, or your next 1st rounder.

I presume Willander is off the table along with the two you mentioned, it looks to me like EP the D is the only interesting prospect left.

Yeah that’s the thing. We really don’t have expendable assets so a trade might be hard to accomplish.

I’d probably do that deal though but man tough pill to swallow. we need a top 6 winger like badly for next season during this competitive window that’s kinda opened up for us.

 

[Indy18]

Yeah that’s the thing. We really don’t have expendable assets so a trade might be hard to accomplish.

I’d probably do that deal though but man tough pill to swallow. we need a top 6 winger like badly for next season during this competitive window that’s kinda opened up for us.

That's the thing about trades...everything has a price and when demand goes up it starts to get more costly.

 

[VT]

The kernel of truth, which you've carefully avoided, is that there's a reason Laine hasn't been kept with Gaudreau. Laine wants to be the primary puck carrier on his line. Gaudreau can't set him up if Laine is the one with the puck.

The reason Laine clicked with Nyquist and Jenner is because those guys don't need a lot of time with the puck, that wasn't a drag on Laine, it was the best possible situation for him given his preferred playstyle.

You really think the Jackets wouldn't love it if Gaudreau + Laine worked? That would solve a lot of problems!

I write about this all the time, both Laine and Gaudreau need players who don't need to hold the puck

 

[cbjthrowaway]

The kernel of truth, which you've carefully avoided, is that there's a reason Laine hasn't been kept with Gaudreau. Laine wants to be the primary puck carrier on his line. Gaudreau can't set him up if Laine is the one with the puck.

this year's ice time is less an indication that they don't work together and (much) more about vincent's obsession with putting gaudreau/jenner together + wanting to try laine at center.

playing with playmakers wasn't an issue for laine at all in winnipeg. he can be the triggerman on a line with a playmaking center. problem is, the jackets don't have any of those, so he's been pushed into a puck-dominant role (and shown that he can play that way!)

The reason Laine clicked with Nyquist and Jenner is because those guys don't need a lot of time with the puck, that wasn't a drag on Laine, it was the best possible situation for him given his preferred playstyle.

i think there's a clear path forward for laine in columbus in either capacity. i could see a new coach trying to use him the way winnipeg did (shoot-first winger with two playmakers) or the way larsen did (primary puck-carrier/distributor) but on a second line.

he's also shown good chemistry with kent johnson in limited time together. i think a johnson-jenner-laine second line would work really well. probably the best of both worlds for laine, and would ensure that gaudreau and fantilli stick together (likely with marchenko on the right wing).

You really think the Jackets wouldn't love it if Gaudreau + Laine worked? That would solve a lot of problems!

and yet, last year, the jackets were at their best when gaudreau and laine were both out there. in fact, gaudreau's underlying numbers were significantly worse without laine.

 

[Xoggz22]

Would you guys do Mikheyev + a prospect (not including Lekkerimaki/Raty) for Laine straight up?

I don't think that's a fit for CBJ. Prospect pool is already strong so unless CBJ is making a deal for a blue chip prospect (not suggesting that here), I don't see a need to fill a prospect list through trade. Future (2025, 2026) draft picks could be considered, however, I think CBJ is looking to upgrade the roster significantly and this wouldn't do that. Unfortunately, not a good option in my opinion.

 

[cbjthrowaway]

Would you guys do Mikheyev + a prospect (not including Lekkerimaki/Raty) for Laine straight up?

there's nothing in vancouver's system that would interest me in a laine trade outside of willander, but he wouldn't be enough on his own, and the jackets very well may draft a RHD in the early first round this summer anyway.

raty and lekkerimaki do nothing for me, and mikheyev is a cap dump.

 

[majormajor]

this year's ice time is less an indication that they don't work together and (much) more about vincent's obsession with putting gaudreau/jenner together + wanting to try laine at center.

Given Gaudreau and Jenner's stats together you could re-write "obsession with putting gaudreau/jenner together" as "desire to put Gaudreau with the center he has by far the best results with". I think that would be a bit more fair to Vincent.

Laine was concussed early on and was not back to himself at any point before leaving, so we can excuse Vincent for not putting Laine on Johnny's line.

playing with playmakers wasn't an issue for laine at all in winnipeg. he can be the triggerman on a line with a playmaking center. problem is, the jackets don't have any of those, so he's been pushed into a puck-dominant role (and shown that he can play that way!)

Johnny and Patty played half of last year together. Half. And Laine did not revert to being a triggerman, he just kept carrying the puck all the time.

and yet, last year, the jackets were at their best when gaudreau and laine were both out there. in fact, gaudreau's underlying numbers were significantly worse without laine.

What I see when I look at last year's numbers together (aside from Laine having a better year overall than Johnny), was that Laine had better results without Johnny. Better results with Jenner, Roslovic, and Marchenko. There's only one puck and Laine wants to carry it.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

It came to our attention this week that Patrik Laine, who has been out of the lineup since Dec. 14 and in the NHL/NHLPA players’ assistance program since late January, has listed his downtown Columbus condo for sale. Laine is away from the club until he’s cleared by the program to return to hockey, so we asked his agent, Andy Scott, what, if anything, was behind Laine’s plans to move. Scott did not respond. Davidson told The Athletic last weekend that Laine will not return to play this season.

 

[CBJWerenski8]