Rumor: Ottawa Senators in for potential Ownership Change

[Icelevel]

Good news. Melnyk's been a decent enough owner but it's time to move on and get some new ownership to this team.

As long as it's an improvement

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Pros: Nelson Peltz comes back to buy the team
Cons: Peltz's son Brad gets to play with Duchene

 

[LuckyPierre]

Eugene Melnyk is going down the Rod Bryden path. He was a savior when he stepped up to buy, absolutely. But at this point, he's only trying to keep the lights on.

I expect the NHL to intervene and facilitate a sale, because Bettman is committed to Ottawa, but not to an owner who can't maintain an organization. As he stated last month, "something has to give".

 

[Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk]

Under Eugene Melnyk, Senators have lost $94 million

Bagnall: How Melnyk carries on despite setbacks in business and health

Two articles on Melnyk's debts and investments. Things haven't been rosy for him sadly.

I agree with Hoffmanijad that new ownership (or even shared ownership) would be insane for this team.
First and foremost, we wouldn't hear Melnyk howling nonstop about attendance, budgets and so on. Even if there were a budget, which there will be either way, the team will be able to keep its best players and add players as needed.
This is super, super key and it would be a huge boon to the franchise.

If Alfie were to be the public face of this sale, then it gives us a Teflon Dan aura, nothing will touch him, he is immune to criticism, period. Let this be true, please please please...

 

[DrEasy]

Yep, majority of people who claim to have heard something say it's the Cirque group with Alfie as face of the ownership bid. Hopefully where there's smoke there's fire...

So they're going to move the team to Detroit?

 

[ToastrStutzle]

I have a hard time believing these rumors. Melnyk is on the record saying he never wants to sell the Sens and he wants to pass the business to his kid when he gets older.

As others have said, this is probably part of the NCC Lebreton deal where maybe some of his business partners are going to get a small stake in the sens as part of the deal.

 

[GrantLemons]

I have a hard time believing these rumors. Melnyk is on the record saying he never wants to sell the Sens and he wants to pass the business to his kid when he gets older.

He's also not nearly as wealthy as he once was. Money talks.

Having Eugene as the owner is like a dark cloud hanging over the franchise. It's hard having respect for a guy that penny pinches left, right, and centre (marketing, branding, the 25th season logo LoL, in-game experience etc ), and expects fans to come and spend their hard earned money on the product. I understand things aren't rosy financially for him right now, but you can't have someone that toxic at the top of a business. It doesn't work.

A change of ownership would be a breath of fresh air for the city and fans. Who doesn't cringe when Melnyk talks to the media these days? Even fairweather fans hate Melnyk. I yearn for someone more dignified to own and represent the franchise.

 

[Micklebot]

I have a hard time believing these rumors. Melnyk is on the record saying he never wants to sell the Sens and he wants to pass the business to his kid when he gets older.

As others have said, this is probably part of the NCC Lebreton deal where maybe some of his business partners are going to get a small stake in the sens as part of the deal.

Just to play devils advocate;

How many owners go on record saying they want to sell? If he was struggling, and looking to maximize profits when forced to sell, would it not encourage a higher price if he looked like he was against selling instead of openly searching for a buyer, particularly when there are potential investors actively pursuing purchasing the team, unlike when Bryden was searching for anyone with interest?

 

[Knave]

I'm sure he loves the team but I'm sure he loves horses and all sorts of other stuff too.

Not that many owners want to sell their pro sports team. Some are forced to because of circumstances, others get offers that blow them away. They may be fans of the team but everyone has limits.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Pros: Nelson Peltz comes back to buy the team
Cons: Peltz's son Brad gets to play with Duchene

Pro: Nelson Peltz daughter shows up to some games and I try to win a date. And get rejected. Wait is that a con?

 

[ottawah]

Serious question, i am not living near Ottawa, so i don't know how it is in Ottawa.

If a new owner were to buy the Sens.. will the arena be full or near full because of it, if it stays in Kanata?

Or do they need the team to be move downtown for them to have success?

There is a lot of you guys saying with new owner we will spend to the caps, bigger front office, etc. On paper it seems fair to think that. But if the arena isn't near full.. At some point they are going to lose money with the Sens.

I'm just curious has if a new owner will trigger something in some people that will make them want to go to game more.

The larger issue is cost. The team already has shown Kanata is a location that can support Toronto level attendance, but only at the right price. The last ~10 years have seen the pay raises in the federal government average 1/3 of the pay raises across Canada, and its starting to hit the attendance as discretionary income in Ottawa has been dropping rapidly in relation to the rest of the country. There have been rumors/thoughts that a new downtown arena would include a large hike of ticket prices, and I believe that if that is the case a downtown arena will not be that beneficial. Keep the prices where they currently are, and it should alleviate the issue. Up them another 25%, and attendance will IMHO suffer even more.

 

[The Senators Guy]

ne as the owner is like a dark cloud hanging over the franchise. It's hard having respect for a guy that penny pinches left, right, and centre (marketing, branding, the 25th season logo LoL, in-game experience etc ), and expects fans to come and spend their hard earned money on the product. I understand things aren't rosy financially for him right now, but you can't have someone that toxic at the top of a business. It doesn't work.

As a Sens fan. I respectfully agree.

 

[Samboni]

Eugene would never publicly state that his team is for sale or that he is seeking investors as that would reduce its value i.e. turn things into a buyers market. Until someone comes forward with credible facts, this is just another rumour and nothing to get worked up about.

 

[R2010]

Ridin' Pine Show (podcast) had Don Brennan on a couple days ago (for whatever that's worth) and he brought up the ownership situation. Implied Melnyk was looking to sell and said Karlsson wasn't resigning if Melnyk was still there...

 

[Upgrayedd]

Ridin' Pine Show (podcast) had Don Brennan on a couple days ago (for whatever that's worth) and he brought up the ownership situation. Implied Melnyk was looking to sell and said Karlsson wasn't resigning if Melnyk was still there...

Would have to figure if Alfie rolls in with the prayed upon new ownership group an EK extension would be the biggest tap in of all time!

 

[otown]

This is certainly starting to snowball but I'm not buying it until Bobby Mack says that it might have legs!

 

[Micklebot]

The larger issue is cost. The team already has shown Kanata is a location that can support Toronto level attendance, but only at the right price. The last ~10 years have seen the pay raises in the federal government average 1/3 of the pay raises across Canada, and its starting to hit the attendance as discretionary income in Ottawa has been dropping rapidly in relation to the rest of the country. There have been rumors/thoughts that a new downtown arena would include a large hike of ticket prices, and I believe that if that is the case a downtown arena will not be that beneficial. Keep the prices where they currently are, and it should alleviate the issue. Up them another 25%, and attendance will IMHO suffer even more.

Do you have a link for this data? I'd love to see it. Also, why would pay raises relative to private be an important consideration rather than something like pay increases relative to the consumer price index data? My discretionary spending isn't impacted by my neighbour's raise in salary relative to mine, it's impacted by the rise in the cost of goods relative to my increases in salary.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

"The average public sector employee makes 18 to 37 per cent more than a comparable employee working in the private sector."

Private sector workers earn less, work more: report

The Federal Government is the largest Employer in the National Capital region.

The issue, for the past two years now, is the failed Phoenix Pay system

 

[ToastrStutzle]

Just to play devils advocate;

How many owners go on record saying they want to sell? If he was struggling, and looking to maximize profits when forced to sell, would it not encourage a higher price if he looked like he was against selling instead of openly searching for a buyer, particularly when there are potential investors actively pursuing purchasing the team, unlike when Bryden was searching for anyone with interest?

Normally I agree. I'm going back to when the whole Lebreton discussion was heating up prior to the NCC announcement. I remember Melnyk going off on the Devcore bid hinting that they'd be willing to buy the team. Eugene was very mad and reactionary. He called Betman asking if there had been any back door dealings with him and he said no. Eugene went on a bit of a rant for the press where he said he would never sell the team while he was still alive (or something to that effect).

To me this is someone who was speaking from emotion and wasn't just trying to drive the price up.

Could things have changed since then? Sure.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

"The average public sector employee makes 18 to 37 per cent more than a comparable employee working in the private sector."

Private sector workers earn less, work more: report

The Federal Government is the largest Employer in the National Capital region.

The issue, for the past two years now, is the failed Phoenix Pay system

It is a gigantic mess.

I am 100% certain it plays a role in the reduced attendance. A lot of terms/casuals get majorly screwed by it.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

We spent too much money on veteran depth pieces and now only have 2 mill in cap space left anyways, so new ownership would be very handcuffed.

This isn't really an accurate representation of our cap situation.

Not counting Clarke MacArthur who would be LITR eligible, we will have roughly 34M committed to 8 players in 2019-20 (AKA the season Duchene+Karlsson's raises kick in). That's a ton of cap flexibility.

The season before that (next season) we have up to about 16M (11M cap+4.65M Mac LTIR) to spend on 6 skaters with the only two big names being Stone+Ceci. That's before we account for any added cap space from the cap rising. The cap has risen an average of 2M per season, but is rumoured to go as high as 80M-82M next season.

There's no way new ownership would be handicapped cap wise.

 

[ottawah]

Do you have a link for this data? I'd love to see it. Also, why would pay raises relative to private be an important consideration rather than something like pay increases relative to the consumer price index data? My discretionary spending isn't impacted by my neighbour's raise in salary relative to mine, it's impacted by the rise in the cost of goods relative to my increases in salary.

I posted it a while back you have to dig through the agreements, and the pages for average raises which you can find.

and its been well below the consumer price index to boot, which is likely well below the cost of tickets.

Just cannot find the agreements much online anymore, but I have been at the same level since 2009. Just check my income tax returns, 8 years 6% total raises (CS category), Roughly eyeballing it, Canadian average wages went up about 21% in that time period.

Caveat of course is that last month many of us got our first pay raise in 4 years including back raises, which is ~5%, getting us up to half of what everyone else got. But we also expect no raises for another 4 years, so I'm not spending mine on tickets.

But part of my point is if price is starting to affect attendance in larger markets (NY, Montreal for example), then the effect in Ottawa where 1 out of every 6 workers work in the PS, then you can guess what it is doing here.

 

[ottawah]

"The average public sector employee makes 18 to 37 per cent more than a comparable employee working in the private sector."

Private sector workers earn less, work more: report

The Federal Government is the largest Employer in the National Capital region.

The issue, for the past two years now, is the failed Phoenix Pay system

I do not know anyone who has lost any pay over it. I'm sure it has affected some people, but not that many as many PS employees really do not go that often anyways.

As for making more, you are looking at a report that is about total compensation across all salary bands. The problem with applying a report like that to this situation is that the very low end employees is where the biggest difference upwards is, with those at the top earning less than private secotor counterparts. And who is buying tickets ....

As well, total compensation is not cash in hand.When you look at how much a PS employee makes relative to total compensation, its less than in the private sector as benefits eat up a huge chunk of the paycheck. I love having them, but I cannot buy tickets with pension contributions or vacation days ......

 

[Boud]

I do not know anyone who has lost any pay over it. I'm sure it has affected some people, but not that many as many PS employees really do not go that often anyways.

As for making more, you are looking at a report that is about total compensation across all salary bands. The problem with applying a report like that to this situation is that the very low end employees is where the biggest difference upwards is, with those at the top earning less than private secotor counterparts. And who is buying tickets ....

As well, total compensation is not cash in hand.When you look at how much a PS employee makes relative to total compensation, its less than in the private sector as benefits eat up a huge chunk of the paycheck. I love having them, but I cannot buy tickets with pension contributions or vacation days ......

Almost everyone in my directorate has some kind of problem with their pay. I am owed over 3K from December 2016 and have sent a couple of PAR/ the new forms created for Phoenix problems and have called Miramichi several times with no luck. I'm pretty lucky I'm not in immediate need of money but it is pretty annoying nonetheless. Most people haven't been getting their acting pays and reimbursements for travelling and etc so that does make a decent difference.

The average salary in my department is 89K so that's pretty damn good but of course a lot of these employees are not in the NCR especially engineers and scientifics who like you say drive up the average quite a bit. Most people in the NCR are doing Admin work so they make anywhere from 40K-70K.

Your last paragraph is 100% accurate, public sector employees do make more money but at the end of the day they have less cash in hand than private sector employees because a big chunk of that money goes for the benefit unless you're a casual or determinate employee. An indeterminate employee will pay anywhere from 200$ to 500$ PER PAY for benefits (400 to 1000 a month). That's a whole lotta dough.

 

[Micklebot]

I do not know anyone who has lost any pay over it. I'm sure it has affected some people, but not that many as many PS employees really do not go that often anyways.

As for making more, you are looking at a report that is about total compensation across all salary bands. The problem with applying a report like that to this situation is that the very low end employees is where the biggest difference upwards is, with those at the top earning less than private secotor counterparts. And who is buying tickets ....

As well, total compensation is not cash in hand.When you look at how much a PS employee makes relative to total compensation, its less than in the private sector as benefits eat up a huge chunk of the paycheck. I love having them, but I cannot buy tickets with pension contributions or vacation days ......

Not having to pay for dentists, prescriptions, or contribute as much towards retirement planing means that you have more of your take home pay available for discressionary spending. It's not as easy as saying you can't spend benefits, therefore you have less money to put towards discretionary spending.

Wrt how many people have lost pay via Phoenix, I'm not sure, but when my directorate canvased staff for a list of pay issues, over 50% were affected in some way or another, but that includes overpayment (I'm not having union dues deducted, and my wife is getting two bilingual bonuses, though she's being paid at 3 classifications lower than she should be). It's not so much the direct affect it's having on peoples' pay though, even if that certainly has a dramitic effect for some, but rather it's the complete lack of trust in the system that's seeing many people delay making financial decisions; we've put off the purchase of a new car because we don't trust that our pay won't turn upside down when they finally try to fix our issues.