Reddwit
Registered User
- Feb 4, 2016
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How does AA not have a guaranteed spot on this team? That's absurd.
I'm doing trying to figure out the ****ed up "logic" this management is employing.
He easily could have. But why would a GM say that? You shouldn't even say that if it's McDavid. Kid has to come into camp and play like he belongs. Even if we signed no one, AA shouldn't have had a guaranteed roster spot. If Jurco/Pulkkinen/Frk/Mantha outplayed him, AA should be in GR. These guys need to battle it out, we don't need kids that are unable to impress enough to make the roster. We need another Larkin, not another Pulkkinen who only gets into the NHL because he runs out of options.How does AA not have a guaranteed spot on this team? That's absurd.
I'm doing trying to figure out the ****ed up "logic" this management is employing.
Tell that to Jurco and Pulkkinen..AA could put up a dozen goals in the preseason and still have to hope for injuries at this point
the roster is completely set in stone
He pretty much has to. However like in every walk of life, it's usually harder to get 'in' than it is to get kicked out. The substitute teacher can absolutely rock the english grammar class but it's not going to necessarily cause the school to fire the ordinary teacher.I get your point but to follow that logic we should tell Zetterberg he has to earn his spot, too.
He easily could have. But why would a GM say that? You shouldn't even say that if it's McDavid. Kid has to come into camp and play like he belongs. Even if we signed no one, AA shouldn't have had a guaranteed roster spot. If Jurco/Pulkkinen/Frk/Mantha outplayed him, AA should be in GR. These guys need to battle it out, we don't need kids that are unable to impress enough to make the roster. We need another Larkin, not another Pulkkinen who only gets into the NHL because he runs out of options.
How does AA not have a guaranteed spot on this team? That's absurd.
I'm doing trying to figure out the ****ed up "logic" this management is employing.
Tells me players aren't stupid. They can see which teams are mired in the muck and which teams are on the cusp of contending. They see teams with a plan and young talent just waiting to take over vs teams that are perennial bubble teams.(Stamkos didn't even bothered to meet them, but he did bothered to meet Toronto and Buffalo - two latest tank teams in the league. It should tell enough).
For one, some decisions are on the coach. If you want a coach that always goes for the young player instead of the proven veteran, you may be looking a long time. Go to other team's boards, most teams complain that their coach chooses to play veteran guys over the up and coming prospect.really, does that go for darren helm?
if you think for one second performance will dictate roster spots over contract term and money you're out of touch with reality man
Tell that to Jurco and Pulkkinen..
He pretty much has to. However like in every walk of life, it's usually harder to get 'in' than it is to get kicked out. The substitute teacher can absolutely rock the english grammar class but it's not going to necessarily cause the school to fire the ordinary teacher.
For AA it should be enough to outplay Jurco/Pulkkinen to be on the team from day 1. I think Blashill will want him on the team too.
Well, we'll se in 3 months. That would be a solid top 9, I'd be fine with it. Call up AA and Mantha at first opportunity if that's how we start. But I'm sure we will stay 100% healthy all season or something.Jurco and Pulkkinen aren't on the team right now either
the top 9 WILL be Zetterberg,Helm,Abdelkader,Nielsen,Vanek,Nyquist, Tatar,Sheahan,Larkin and there's absolutely nothing the likes of AA(or Mantha,or Jurco/Pulkkinen for that matter) can do about it no matter how well they play other than hope for injuries or a tradelaugh
Wings are or are fast going exactly where Sabres were couple of years back then. We also had similar kind of discussion about rebuild/going with the current core back then. There was a lot of opposition for the rebuild back then, but I doubt that atm anyone thinks that it was the wrong course of action...
Devils are also a prime example - before Lou got canned. And to be honest, I expect the same to happen for Holland after a couple of years (officially he will retire with some kind of title). This team in the future likely will be a bubble team which in the season's end will clearly stay out of the playoffs (like Devils).
Holland added second tier piece and once again a pretty washed veteran. Top FAs seem to avoid Wings pretty effectively (Stamkos didn't even bothered to meet them, but he did bothered to meet Toronto and Buffalo - two latest tank teams in the league. It should tell enough). And it's not that Wings have been some power house drafting wise the last roughly +10 seasons (not actually bad either). Those additions will keep you from falling to the bottom, but those are nearly not enough to make you actually competitive. And 6 years contracts to 32 years old don't usually end up looking good. Though, I think Nielsen (atm) is a better player than many seems to know here.
Sabres tanked for two seasons. So we saw two seasons pretty bad hockey... But the organisation sold the plan to the fans well. Fans knew exactly what is happening, so stomaching putrid hockey was a lot more tolerable. Our GM also told us that he is going to improve the team during the last tank season - and he did (Kane, ROR, Lehner, Franson etc.). We pulled ourselves out of the bottom of the league (I don't think Sabres have been or are going to be another Edmonton. They have done the things Edmonton didn't (traded their picks and prospects for immediate, yet young pieces to get the team out of the bottom before they get used to it). This off-season he has told playoffs being the goal. He made two strong pick ups (Kulikov and Okposo) to strengthen the team, and might have more in his sleeves. I think that during the upcoming season Detroit and Buffalo are a lot closer in the standings than many think they will. But it remains to be seen.
This post wasn't posted to mock or insult. It was to offer meaningless 2 cents, because I think I know the situation Wings and Wings' fans as a community are right now. And that situation might be one of the most frustrated ones in the current NHL.
I just hope that not that many here are buying Holland's "it takes 10 years to rebuild" - because it really doesn't. Tim Murray said that anyone telling that it takes +5 years to make a rebuild is just buying himself some undeserved time (it was pretty much after he was appointed as the GM). It was a pretty bold statement, IMO, but also indicated that many GMs are just trying to cover their bases. This upcoming season is a season number 3 for Sabres on their rebuild, and I doubt they are 7 years away from icing a contender - if they ever will.
For one, some decisions are on the coach. If you want a coach that always goes for the young player instead of the proven veteran, you may be looking a long time. Go to other team's boards, most teams complain that their coach chooses to play veteran guys over the up and coming prospect.
But for sure I believe that if AA performs well, he will be given room on the roster. They managed to find room for him last year for 30+ games, it's pretty rare for the Wings to give a kid that many games and then give them less games the next season. At minimum AA is probably looking at 40-50 games, if he is playing well.
Vanek, Ott, Miller, Jurco and Pulkkinen won't be given anything for free this year. Certainly I think AA has a bigger chance than most of them to be in the top 9 on opening night.
Wings are or are fast going exactly where Sabres were couple of years back then. We also had similar kind of discussion about rebuild/going with the current core back then. There was a lot of opposition for the rebuild back then, but I doubt that atm anyone thinks that it was the wrong course of action...
Devils are also a prime example - before Lou got canned. And to be honest, I expect the same to happen for Holland after a couple of years (officially he will retire with some kind of title). This team in the future likely will be a bubble team which in the season's end will clearly stay out of the playoffs (like Devils).
Holland added second tier piece and once again a pretty washed veteran. Top FAs seem to avoid Wings pretty effectively (Stamkos didn't even bothered to meet them, but he did bothered to meet Toronto and Buffalo - two latest tank teams in the league. It should tell enough). And it's not that Wings have been some power house drafting wise the last roughly +10 seasons (not actually bad either). Those additions will keep you from falling to the bottom, but those are nearly not enough to make you actually competitive. And 6 years contracts to 32 years old don't usually end up looking good. Though, I think Nielsen (atm) is a better player than many seems to know here.
Sabres tanked for two seasons. So we saw two seasons pretty bad hockey... But the organisation sold the plan to the fans well. Fans knew exactly what is happening, so stomaching putrid hockey was a lot more tolerable. Our GM also told us that he is going to improve the team during the last tank season - and he did (Kane, ROR, Lehner, Franson etc.). We pulled ourselves out of the bottom of the league (I don't think Sabres have been or are going to be another Edmonton. They have done the things Edmonton didn't (traded their picks and prospects for immediate, yet young pieces to get the team out of the bottom before they get used to it). This off-season he has told playoffs being the goal. He made two strong pick ups (Kulikov and Okposo) to strengthen the team, and might have more in his sleeves. I think that during the upcoming season Detroit and Buffalo are a lot closer in the standings than many think they will. But it remains to be seen.
This post wasn't posted to mock or insult. It was to offer meaningless 2 cents, because I think I know the situation Wings and Wings' fans as a community are right now. And that situation might be one of the most frustrated ones in the current NHL.
I just hope that not that many here are buying Holland's "it takes 10 years to rebuild" - because it really doesn't. Tim Murray said that anyone telling that it takes +5 years to make a rebuild is just buying himself some undeserved time (it was pretty much after he was appointed as the GM). It was a pretty bold statement, IMO, but also indicated that many GMs are just trying to cover their bases. This upcoming season is a season number 3 for Sabres on their rebuild, and I doubt they are 7 years away from icing a contender - if they ever will.
I just hope that not that many here are buying Holland's "it takes 10 years to rebuild" - because it really doesn't.
People understand the difference in context though, right? If you want to burn it down the rebuild happens almost immediately... it's just that it's not complete any time soon.
That's the difference.
When people around here agitate for a rebuild what they're actually asking for is a total fire sale of pretty much any decent player on the roster with trade value, 2-4 years of absolute suckage, and then maybe if everything works out the team is back where they are now 5 years later, except with a younger core. Maybe. If the early 1's don't pan out you have to add years onto that time frame.
What the Wings appear to prefer is that oft-maligned 'rebuild on the fly' phrase, where they try and stay fairly competitive and then tinker with the team here and there. If they catch a break and land a big player via UFA or the draft, the team gets dangerous quick... if not, then they just sort of hover around the top of the league's middle third.
As far as comparison's to Buffalo's recent history goes, I could not disagree more. I like the futures of the 'young' (sub 26ish) players on Detroit's roster considerably more than those that were on the Buffalo roster. It's incredibly easy to do that, because we know how all those young players in Buffalo turned out. Vanek, Myers, Stafford and Gerbe all either flatlined or declined. They never found a replacement for Miller.
Now, sure, after really really stinking for a couple years following just kind of stinking for 2 they got consecutive top 3 picks and seem to have done well with them.
The problem with trying to replicate that kind of awfulness in Detroit is that the team drafts way too consistently and is way too successful finding competent NHL-quality players to get bad enough where they're like the 2nd or 3rd worst team in the NHL. They lost something like 500 man games from all their starters in 2014, and most of those from key players, and still made the playoffs. That's how deep Detroit is talentwise.
Not much on the top end obviously, but man do they have a bunch of solid players rattling around the system.
People understand the difference in context though, right? If you want to burn it down the rebuild happens almost immediately... it's just that it's not complete any time soon.
That's the difference.
When people around here agitate for a rebuild what they're actually asking for is a total fire sale of pretty much any decent player on the roster with trade value, 2-4 years of absolute suckage, and then maybe if everything works out the team is back where they are now 5 years later, except with a younger core. Maybe. If the early 1's don't pan out you have to add years onto that time frame.
What the Wings appear to prefer is that oft-maligned 'rebuild on the fly' phrase, where they try and stay fairly competitive and then tinker with the team here and there. If they catch a break and land a big player via UFA or the draft, the team gets dangerous quick... if not, then they just sort of hover around the top of the league's middle third.
As far as comparison's to Buffalo's recent history goes, I could not disagree more. I like the futures of the 'young' (sub 26ish) players on Detroit's roster considerably more than those that were on the Buffalo roster. It's incredibly easy to do that, because we know how all those young players in Buffalo turned out. Vanek, Myers, Stafford and Gerbe all either flatlined or declined. They never found a replacement for Miller.
Now, sure, after really really stinking for a couple years following just kind of stinking for 2 they got consecutive top 3 picks and seem to have done well with them.
The problem with trying to replicate that kind of awfulness in Detroit is that the team drafts way too consistently and is way too successful finding competent NHL-quality players to get bad enough where they're like the 2nd or 3rd worst team in the NHL. They lost something like 500 man games from all their starters in 2014, and most of those from key players, and still made the playoffs. That's how deep Detroit is talentwise.
Not much on the top end obviously, but man do they have a bunch of solid players rattling around the system.
Wings are or are fast going exactly where Sabres were couple of years back then. We also had similar kind of discussion about rebuild/going with the current core back then. There was a lot of opposition for the rebuild back then, but I doubt that atm anyone thinks that it was the wrong course of action...
Devils are also a prime example - before Lou got canned. And to be honest, I expect the same to happen for Holland after a couple of years (officially he will retire with some kind of title). This team in the future likely will be a bubble team which in the season's end will clearly stay out of the playoffs (like Devils).
Holland added second tier piece and once again a pretty washed veteran. Top FAs seem to avoid Wings pretty effectively (Stamkos didn't even bothered to meet them, but he did bothered to meet Toronto and Buffalo - two latest tank teams in the league. It should tell enough). And it's not that Wings have been some power house drafting wise the last roughly +10 seasons (not actually bad either). Those additions will keep you from falling to the bottom, but those are nearly not enough to make you actually competitive. And 6 years contracts to 32 years old don't usually end up looking good. Though, I think Nielsen (atm) is a better player than many seems to know here.
Sabres tanked for two seasons. So we saw two seasons pretty bad hockey... But the organisation sold the plan to the fans well. Fans knew exactly what is happening, so stomaching putrid hockey was a lot more tolerable. Our GM also told us that he is going to improve the team during the last tank season - and he did (Kane, ROR, Lehner, Franson etc.). We pulled ourselves out of the bottom of the league (I don't think Sabres have been or are going to be another Edmonton. They have done the things Edmonton didn't (traded their picks and prospects for immediate, yet young pieces to get the team out of the bottom before they get used to it). This off-season he has told playoffs being the goal. He made two strong pick ups (Kulikov and Okposo) to strengthen the team, and might have more in his sleeves. I think that during the upcoming season Detroit and Buffalo are a lot closer in the standings than many think they will. But it remains to be seen.
This post wasn't posted to mock or insult. It was to offer meaningless 2 cents, because I think I know the situation Wings and Wings' fans as a community are right now. And that situation might be one of the most frustrated ones in the current NHL.
I just hope that not that many here are buying Holland's "it takes 10 years to rebuild" - because it really doesn't. Tim Murray said that anyone telling that it takes +5 years to make a rebuild is just buying himself some undeserved time (it was pretty much after he was appointed as the GM). It was a pretty bold statement, IMO, but also indicated that many GMs are just trying to cover their bases. This upcoming season is a season number 3 for Sabres on their rebuild, and I doubt they are 7 years away from icing a contender - if they ever will.
Com on HD, were nothing like the Sabres from 2013! They were crammed with aging, under performing veterans like Steve Ott, and Thomas Vanek, and...wait...
I think that's exactly what their game plan is. I have to imagine the motivation to think that way is either delusion or that the playoff streak is more important than we think.
The delusion would be that they think any of their picks and prospects are just a year or two from becoming the next Datsyuk or Lidstrom and will lead us into the promised land.