Observations XIX

[Armourboy]

dude is averaging 7:45 of TOI and has 3 points in his 44 career playoff games. 3 goals no assists. he has scored 2 big goals lately, yes but one was on a blatant penalty and reaves is just trash honestly. smh.

before scoring 2 goals in the past 3 games, reaves playoff stats were 41 games played. 1 goal , 0 assists. i seriously wonder if people think before they message board sometimes.

Yeah and it makes you wonder what these teams are doing the other 50 minutes of the game when these guys arent playing. Big Buff is a bit different time wise, but he's also pretty unique in the land of Dmen.

 

[101st_fan]

dude is averaging 7:45 of TOI and has 3 points in his 44 career playoff games. 3 goals no assists. he has scored 2 big goals lately, yes but one was on a blatant penalty and reaves is just trash honestly. smh.

before scoring 2 goals in the past 3 games, reaves playoff stats were 41 games played. 1 goal , 0 assists. i seriously wonder if people think before they message board sometimes.

People think enough to recognize a nugget that fits a narrative and then latch on to that nugget for dear life. All contrary evidence must be ignored or their narrative fails.

 

[desmondtootoo]

It's funny, because I marvel at the "don't believe your lying eyes" syndrome, where people watch us lose to the Jets and see very clearly the effect of Byfuglien, Myers, and their other big guys............. but then announce "nuh-uh, that didn't happen.... it was something else".

We've had this argument for about 16 years now, every year our exit from the post season has had a similar tinge, and every year comes the "nuh uh that didn't really happen, it was because Pekka was tired........... or something something something".

Meanwhile, Reave's presence carried his team farther than we got, the last 2 years. He's not a goal scorer, lol, nice strawman to focus the "nuh-uh" on. He's not superman either, he just neutralized (along with a couple other guys) the Byfuglien effect that beat us. Great hockey players like Josi, Arvidsson, Fiala, Smith, Ellis, Forsberg, Johansen, simply got bullied back out of their game. Hartnell was our last ditch effort to counter Byfuglien.......... we all watched this as it unfolded, and it was 100 days late and 1000 dollars short.

 

[desmondtootoo]

Blah blah blah. Any time the Preds are eliminated you show up with this bullcrap.

Over an 82 game season we were the best team in the entire NHL without any of these goons.


We didnt lose in the playoffs because we didnt have skilled big guys. We lost because the goalie that gave us Vezina caliber goaltending all year for some reason morphed into Mike Dunham in the playoffs. But the fact that we lost allows you to pick whatever excuse suits your narrative and run with it.

If you dig the Prez's trophy and don't really care about the cup ........ you're right on the mark.

Preds were a great team all year, yes they were the best. Then along comes the second season, some say the real season.

We struggled against the Avs, and we lost to the Jets. Because all we had was small talent, that doesn't translate to the playoffs without somebody to keep you from getting beat up when the refs put the whistles away.

Look at Trotzy with Wilson lol. I know you guys hate proof and evidence. We got as far as we did last year because we were very lucky that the Hawks, Blues, and Ducks don't have the monsters. Pens had just enough, along with the cheap play. Ducks have the cheap but no monsters, and the Preds could skate around that.

In the playoffs, you can't avoid the tougher, bigger, badder hockey, though we almost did that last year. One series short.

 

[ILikeItILoveIt]

Wait, let me pull the stakes out of my eyes ......... there, now where was I ....... oh yes, we lost because we're small. Can only win the playoffs if you are big. But yet you can be small and still manage to earn more points than any other team over an 82 game season.

Its really simple. We won in the regular season and lost in the playoffs because most of our best guys played their best for the 82-game season, and played badly during 12 games in the playoffs. They didn't shrink in size or get slower. They simply didn't play well. When most of your best guys don't play well, you lose. That's it.

If you think putting Reaves on our team, or Myers, or Tom Wilson would have caused us to beat the Jets, then you don't understand the vital roles Rinne, Josi, Ellis, Turris, Fiala and Smith play on our team. We had some great players (Josi, Ellis, Rinne) play reeeeaaaallllyy bad in Round 2. We had a 2nd line that became our 1st line for 30 games in the regular season, disappear. Not because they were small (again, they didn't shrink in April/May nor did the Jets we beat in the regular season become larger in April/May). They all slumped at the same time. Didn't think it was possible, but they did. And even with that massive slump, we still took it to 6 games.

Our 2018 Playoff Team was much better than our 2017 Playoff Team. The 2017 Team over-performed (i.e. played better) and the 2018 Team under-performed (i.e. played worse). The Preds front office has done a great job of putting a talented team together who can win it all. They just have to do it at the right time (like in 2017) with the right players (like the 2018 team).

We will be better next year. so will other teams. We will make the playoffs next year. And then if we play like we're capable, we'll win the Cup (like the Caps will do shortly even though I'm sure they have numerous posters on their board who were saying the same things about them last year and the other years they lost in the playoffs).

 

[101st_fan]

If you dig the Prez's trophy and don't really care about the cup ........ you're right on the mark.

Preds were a great team all year, yes they were the best. Then along comes the second season, some say the real season.

We struggled against the Avs, and we lost to the Jets. Because all we had was small talent, that doesn't translate to the playoffs without somebody to keep you from getting beat up when the refs put the whistles away.

Look at Trotzy with Wilson lol. I know you guys hate proof and evidence. We got as far as we did last year because we were very lucky that the Hawks, Blues, and Ducks don't have the monsters. Pens had just enough, along with the cheap play. Ducks have the cheap but no monsters, and the Preds could skate around that.

In the playoffs, you can't avoid the tougher, bigger, badder hockey, though we almost did that last year. One series short.

What you're offering is neither proof nor evidence. IF your position held true then the Jets would have advanced past the Knights based only on size. They didn't.

 

[Armourboy]

It's funny, because I marvel at the "don't believe your lying eyes" syndrome, where people watch us lose to the Jets and see very clearly the effect of Byfuglien, Myers, and their other big guys............. but then announce "nuh-uh, that didn't happen.... it was something else".

We've had this argument for about 16 years now, every year our exit from the post season has had a similar tinge, and every year comes the "nuh uh that didn't really happen, it was because Pekka was tired........... or something something something".

Meanwhile, Reave's presence carried his team farther than we got, the last 2 years. He's not a goal scorer, lol, nice strawman to focus the "nuh-uh" on. He's not superman either, he just neutralized (along with a couple other guys) the Byfuglien effect that beat us. Great hockey players like Josi, Arvidsson, Fiala, Smith, Ellis, Forsberg, Johansen, simply got bullied back out of their game. Hartnell was our last ditch effort to counter Byfuglien.......... we all watched this as it unfolded, and it was 100 days late and 1000 dollars short.

So Vegas is winning on 8 minutes of play every game. Boy isnt the rest of the league going to be pissed when they find out the key to getting to the Stanley Cup Finals has nothing to do with having great players like Sidney Crosby or Evgani Malkin. Damn I guess Guentzel was worthless too.

Glad we got that figured out.

 

[LCPreds]

This guys whole argument is moot if the Preds win a 50/50 game 7. Try harder with your analysis man.

Also, please explain why Winnipeg only now made it to the wcf. They’ve had buff for more than a year.

 

[PredsV82]

This guys whols argument is moot if the Preds win a 50/50 game 7. Try harder with your analysis man.

Also, please explain why Winnipeg only now made it to the wcf. They’ve had buff for more than a year.

He cant explain anything that blows his bloviating BS out of the water, which is why he only shows up after the Preds have lost.

Literally no one else in the hockey world blamed the Preds loss to Winnipeg on lack of size. Hes is a broken record.

 

[101st_fan]

Reaves sure led the Knights to a trium ... uh ... oh .... nevermind.

 

[NoNecksCurse]

tom wilson scored so like shut up. he's right for the 1st time in 2.5 years.

 

[desmondtootoo]

Wow, what a well attended party ! You guys really turn out for a get together.

Have you not been watching hockey (or at least reading about the history) for the last 50 years, as I have ? Wherein the story of the post season has ALWAYS been about hitting harder, scrumming it up, and the resultant fights (at least up to a few years ago anyway) ? Which can be described as "Bullying it up with your biggest, baddest, and toughest". That's ALWAYS been playoffs 101, for anybody claiming to follow hockey.

Man, I am glad you guys have re-written the history of hockey. What color is the sky on you'se guys' planet ? Probably chartreuse and mauve, lol.

 

[desmondtootoo]

So Vegas is winning on 8 minutes of play every game. Boy isnt the rest of the league going to be pissed when they find out the key to getting to the Stanley Cup Finals has nothing to do with having great players like Sidney Crosby or Evgani Malkin. Damn I guess Guentzel was worthless too.

Glad we got that figured out.

It's interesting that I never said any of this. But don't let that slow you down. Any opinions on what I actually said ? Ah, I thought not. Carry on.

 

[desmondtootoo]

Reaves sure led the Knights to a trium ... uh ... oh .... nevermind.

"A part of" leading them (2 teams) to one trium ..... uh .....oh ..... more than us 2 years running. One being the cup.

 

[desmondtootoo]

He cant explain anything that blows his bloviating BS out of the water, which is why he only shows up after the Preds have lost.

Literally no one else in the hockey world blamed the Preds loss to Winnipeg on lack of size. Hes is a broken record.

I really wouldn't be claiming that we won because we were too small .......... now would I ?

"Literally" and "no one else in the hockey world" ...... kind of BIG concepts, don't you think ? Maybe revisit the meanings of those words, lol.

 

[Pred303]

there is something to be said about the lack of grit on this team on some of the lines against 'hard' teams. our second line is too much finesse, not enough grit. the forsberg-johansen line is certainly strong enough to cover for the lack of size/strength of arvidsson, but the second line doesn't have that. wish we had kept neal instead of jarnkrok to give that second line more toughness against strong teams. think it would have made a ton of difference honestly (and then one has to think of giving hornqvist up for neal, exactly the type of RW'er we most need). jarnkrok is an excellent 'utility' player able to fill multiple roles in the regular season, but it's no accident he becomes ineffective against hard teams in playoff intensity type games. my wish, is that we would add back a second line right winger with size/strength, and push smith down to 3rd line RW with Bonino and Tolvanen. Bonino plays a hard enough game to help Tolvanen. and then a 4th line of Sissons/Jarnkrok/Watson.

Personally i am ready to upgrade the forward corps at the expense of the defensive corps. Relying on your defense to produce offense causes a weakened defensive structure which we saw demonstrated all year, but especially in the playoffs. We were saved by the vezina caliber goaltending we saw in the regular season, but when the goaltending wasn't there in the playoffs it was exposed. Offensively our defense corps is the best in the league. but defensively we are middle of the pack honestly. offense slumps, but defense doesn't. and when your main contribution from your defense is offense, well sometimes that 'slump' just occurs at exactly the wrong time. add in that our goaltending isn't going to be as good as it was this past year (almost surely) and we need to tighten up defensive structure.

I see people saying we should pair subban/josi and then ekholm/ellis. but while that would work outstanding for the first pair i think, i don't think an ellis/ekholm pair has enough puck carrying ability to avoid disaster. all of them were basically bad even strength these playoffs (except ekholm), but at least subban was hot on the PP. so i could accept changes without panic.

i just would like to see more defense from defensemen and more offense from forwards.

 

[desmondtootoo]

Wait, let me pull the stakes out of my eyes ......... there, now where was I ....... oh yes, we lost because we're small. Can only win the playoffs if you are big. But yet you can be small and still manage to earn more points than any other team over an 82 game season.

Its really simple. We won in the regular season and lost in the playoffs because most of our best guys played their best for the 82-game season, and played badly during 12 games in the playoffs. They didn't shrink in size or get slower. They simply didn't play well. When most of your best guys don't play well, you lose. That's it.

If you think putting Reaves on our team, or Myers, or Tom Wilson would have caused us to beat the Jets, then you don't understand the vital roles Rinne, Josi, Ellis, Turris, Fiala and Smith play on our team. We had some great players (Josi, Ellis, Rinne) play reeeeaaaallllyy bad in Round 2. We had a 2nd line that became our 1st line for 30 games in the regular season, disappear. Not because they were small (again, they didn't shrink in April/May nor did the Jets we beat in the regular season become larger in April/May). They all slumped at the same time. Didn't think it was possible, but they did. And even with that massive slump, we still took it to 6 games.

Our 2018 Playoff Team was much better than our 2017 Playoff Team. The 2017 Team over-performed (i.e. played better) and the 2018 Team under-performed (i.e. played worse). The Preds front office has done a great job of putting a talented team together who can win it all. They just have to do it at the right time (like in 2017) with the right players (like the 2018 team).

We will be better next year. so will other teams. We will make the playoffs next year. And then if we play like we're capable, we'll win the Cup (like the Caps will do shortly even though I'm sure they have numerous posters on their board who were saying the same things about them last year and the other years they lost in the playoffs).

We proved that we can 'almost' win without size last year, when we got incredibly lucky with the draw 3 series in a row. Typically you don't get 3 series into the playoffs without meeting a traditionally built playoff team.

No, simply "plugging" some big guy into our team probably wouldn't make all the difference. You actually have to do it with some amount of strategy and overall team chemistry in mind. Just dumping Wilson onto the 4th line maybe doesn't do anything. The way Trotz plugged him into the first line is the stroke of genius that made his presence something different (after avoiding it for 2 decades in Nashville lol). And he has played up to the challenge, as a hockey player. Reaves and Engelland effectively negated the bruising strategy of Buff and Myers. Watson and Fisher didn't quite do that for us.

Everybody at this point in the playoffs is stacked with talent. That's also 90% of the story. The other 10% is what changes the outcomes. The big guys aren't brawling bums either, especially these days. They clean out both creases, the corners, the transition. That's where we lost, we gave up all 3 of those to the big guys. We really gave up a lot of this to Mackinnon, Landeskog, Rantanen, Johnson .... bigger guys who can fly and control the game against a bunch of guys who weigh 30-40-50 pounds less.

It's funny that you cite how "everybody slumped at the same time", which you admittedly "didn't think was possible".

The likelihood of that being the case is much less than them all being 160-180 pounds, playing against guys that have talent AND weigh 230-250-270. THAT's how "everybody gets into a slump" .......... getting knocked on your can 20 times per game.

 

[NoNecksCurse]

i am accepting of all opinions and i know mine suck but there is just something to be said of someone that goes dormant for 2 (?) years and pops up like Buddha.

great post 303. i think we should move subban this off season personally and re sign ellis at 5 million.

 

[LCPreds]

I see people saying we should pair subban/josi and then ekholm/ellis. but while that would work outstanding for the first pair i think, i don't think an ellis/ekholm pair has enough puck carrying ability to avoid disaster. all of them were basically bad even strength these playoffs (except ekholm), but at least subban was hot on the PP. so i could accept changes without panic.

What about Subban/Ellis and Josi/Ekholm? Subban and Josi can carry for both pairs and you have now aligned offense+defense with your pairings. Though I do believe Subban to be great at both.

i think we should move subban this off season personally and re sign ellis at 5 million.

Why move Subban? What would you hope to get for him?

Also just noticed in another thread you recommended shipping Ellis out. How many people post on your account?

 

[NoNecksCurse]

What about Subban/Ellis and Josi/Ekholm? Subban and Josi can carry for both pairs and you have now aligned offense+defense with your pairings. Though I do believe Subban to be great at both.



Why move Subban? What would you hope to get for him?

Also just noticed in another thread you recommended shipping Ellis out. How many people post on your account?

multiple with everyone drinking a lot of alcohol.

if ellis will not sign for 3-4 years at 5 million then ship him out.

if he will sign for that then ship subban out and free up 9 million.

our top 4 was utterly worthless. no point to tie up (long term when the sweetheart deals run out) 25-28 million when those guys were literally duds this post season. i look at washington and vegas' top 4 to compare.

and that comment was more of long term. ellis at 32+ years old.. no thanks. our window is the next 3-4 years depending on if saros is a viable solution which i believe he will be better than rinne come april.

 

[LCPreds]

But what do you hope to get by shipping Subban out? Freeing up cap space... for what? I just don't see what's out there that makes this a better team with Subban not on it.

 

[Armourboy]

Well I had a nice big post about what we need and why, but this dumb ass board decided that was the perfect time to make me agree to some new damn change and ate it.

I'll just summarize.

A 2nd line forward on the level of a Simmonds, Hornqvist, Wilson, maybe even Neal or a JVR I'll buy. A bigger more physical Dman that is more defensive minded I'll buy. Needing f***ing Ryan Reeves? Straight up BS every day of the week.

Ryan Reeves is not the reason Vegas is in the SCF, Fleury standing on his damn head and luck are the reason they are where they are. Once he came back down to earth, the overall weakness of that Dcorp has finally shown itself.

 

[NoNecksCurse]

But what do you hope to get by shipping Subban out? Freeing up cap space... for what? I just don't see what's out there that makes this a better team with Subban not on it.

if he was shipped out, then yes the cap space would be awesome. but i would also to expect to get back a top 7 pick along with a right handed PMD replacement and a top 9 forward.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

if he was shipped out, then yes the cap space would be awesome. but i would also to expect to get back a top 7 pick along with a right handed PMD replacement and a top 9 forward.

I dunno, Subban and his cap hit are not for everybody. I suspect you'd have a hard time getting a really primo return for him. Just like the nonsense on the main trade board, there'll be some kind of cap dumping or balancing attempted, and the end result will be something that doesn't look very good to us at all.

A top pick is really just not the team's direction right now either. Let them have their run, in 5 or 6 years or whenever the fun ends, there will be plenty of time to move out the fading veterans for bunches of draft picks further on down the road.

 

[LCPreds]

if he was shipped out, then yes the cap space would be awesome. but i would also to expect to get back a top 7 pick along with a right handed PMD replacement and a top 9 forward.

So you would essentially trade a Norris finalist for a prospect, a d-man of some variety (that obviously wouldn't be as good as PK), and a 3rd line forward?

I don't even know where to begin. We're in prime "win now" mode. Do you just not like PK?