Speculation: NJD Offseason Part IV

[dzubrus8]

I think any team paying Stamkos more than $8-9 million is a sucker.

Since his broken tibia, Stamkos has .85 ppg. That's not even 70 points a season. He doesn't offer anything in terms of defense. That ppg rate puts him at 16th among NHL centers this season.

I have a bad feeling that if Tampa Bay signs him they'll lose a lot of their true pertinent talent and they will hamstring themselves for several years. That'd be a shame.

In my opinion, only teams with tons of cap space should be looking at Stamkos because that contract can singlehandedly destroy franchises.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I think any team paying Stamkos more than $8-9 million is a sucker.

Since his broken tibia, Stamkos has .85 ppg. That's not even 70 points a season. He doesn't offer anything in terms of defense. That ppg rate puts him at 16th among NHL centers this season.

I have a bad feeling that if Tampa Bay signs him they'll lose a lot of their true pertinent talent and they will hamstring themselves for several years. That'd be a shame.

In my opinion, only teams with tons of cap space should be looking at Stamkos because that contract can singlehandedly destroy franchises.

You realize we are one of those teams. We have the 2nd most cap space available in the league right now with only a few guys getting raises.

 

[SpeakingOfTheDevils]

I'd give Stamkos $8M. I'd give him $9M. Once you start to enter double digits, though, that's when it gets a bit nutty for me.

He's a dynamic talent, but, yes, he has that injury history and his numbers have tailed off a bit since the big one. Only way I go $10M is if the term is more like 5 years, which won't happen.

 

[dzubrus8]

You realize we are one of those teams. We have the 2nd most cap space available in the league right now with only a few guys getting raises.

Sadly, I know. I don't think I would even consider bringing him at a double-digit salary. I want a durable gamebreaker but not at that price unless I know exactly what I'm getting. Kovalchuk had one sub PPG season from age 20-27. That's the type of guy you can pay $10-12 million a year and know what you're getting. I don't fault Lou/Vanderbeek for wanting Kovy but I would be fuming if Shero decides that Stammers is worth $10 million or a dollar more.

 

[Balance]

So were signing a much worse version of Kovalchuk for more money

Count me out

 

[dzubrus8]

Just posted a trade on nhl-trade-rumors.com which is like the trade board here (I don't know how to find that on HFBoards else I would've posted it there).

NJ: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
EDM: Damon Severson, Scott Wedgewood, 2017 1st round pick

I got some responses that Edmonton would say no and others that Edmonton should take it and run.

I think New Jersey would be winners in this deal: draft Chychrun in round 1 if he falls or Jake Bean. Bring up Santini. Pick up Goligoski/Yandle/Demers/whomever. Profit.

 

[Emperoreddy]

Just posted a trade on nhl-trade-rumors.com which is like the trade board here (I don't know how to find that on HFBoards else I would've posted it there).

NJ: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
EDM: Damon Severson, Scott Wedgewood, 2017 1st round pick

I got some responses that Edmonton would say no and others that Edmonton should take it and run.

I think New Jersey would be winners in this deal: draft Chychrun in round 1 if he falls or Jake Bean. Bring up Santini. Pick up Goligoski/Yandle/Demers/whomever. Profit.

We absolutely lose, and how do we draft Chychrun without a 1st round pick? Edmonton fans that say no to that are drunk.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

So were signing a much worse version of Kovalchuk for more money

Count me out

I am not saying that Stamkos is Kovalchuk because he is not

but if we had to sign Kovy to a 7 year deal (the max we can give to Stamkos), his cap hit would have been astronomical....

plus that was 6 years ago. completely different situations.

 

[Ripshot 43]

Just posted a trade on nhl-trade-rumors.com which is like the trade board here (I don't know how to find that on HFBoards else I would've posted it there).

NJ: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
EDM: Damon Severson, Scott Wedgewood, 2017 1st round pick

I got some responses that Edmonton would say no and others that Edmonton should take it and run.

I think New Jersey would be winners in this deal: draft Chychrun in round 1 if he falls or Jake Bean. Bring up Santini. Pick up Goligoski/Yandle/Demers/whomever. Profit.

The value may not be far off but I personally would have a hard time trading all 3 of those pieces for small center like RNH. I like him as a player, but I bet he won't ever be a playoff performer. Especially out west, if the Oilers ever make the playoffs I wouldn't be surprised if he disappears due to the physical nature of the playoffs and how big centers are out there on the top teams. Breaking down our side of things. Despite a rocky season, I'm still on team Severson and I think we see more of rookie year Severson than last season with this upcoming season. Our 1st could very well likely be a top 10 lottery pick and either way should be a top 6 forward if you draft correctly. Wedge is just coming into his own and we don't know what we have in him. So, I pass on the trade.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I am more down on Severson than most, but no way do I trade those 3 assets for RNH. that would not be smart.

 

[dzubrus8]

We absolutely lose, and how do we draft Chychrun without a 1st round pick? Edmonton fans that say no to that are drunk.

We draft Chychrun in 2016 since we didn't give up our 2016 1st. Since the team clearly becomes a lot better with RNH and Zacha next year, I don't think it's such a be-all end-all. Sign Demers and I don't think that the defense gets any worse at all.

You wouldn't trade next year's 20th pick, a potential top-2-but-right-now-an-underwhelming-top-4 defenseman, and a goalie who will never be able to start for New Jersey for a 1st line center? Really?

 

[Emperoreddy]

We draft Chychrun in 2016 since we didn't give up our 2016 1st. Since the team clearly becomes a lot better with RNH and Zacha next year, I don't think it's such a be-all end-all. Sign Demers and I don't think that the defense gets any worse at all.

You wouldn't trade next year's 20th pick, a potential top-2-but-right-now-an-underwhelming-top-4 defenseman, and a goalie who will never be able to start for New Jersey for a 1st line center? Really?

Better draft class next year, and no way in hell is it guaranteed to be 20th.

That trade is poor asset management.

 

[dzubrus8]

The value may not be far off but I personally would have a hard time trading all 3 of those pieces for small center like RNH. I like him as a player, but I bet he won't ever be a playoff performer. Especially out west, if the Oilers ever make the playoffs I wouldn't be surprised if he disappears due to the physical nature of the playoffs and how big centers are out there on the top teams. Breaking down our side of things. Despite a rocky season, I'm still on team Severson and I think we see more of rookie year Severson than last season with this upcoming season. Our 1st could very well likely be a top 10 lottery pick and either way should be a top 6 forward if you draft correctly. Wedge is just coming into his own and we don't know what we have in him. So, I pass on the trade.

But with Schneider a surefire elite goalie and Blackwood one of the best goalie prospects in the league, where does Wedge fit in?

Even if Severson becomes as talented as a top-2, he'll still be 2nd fiddle to Lars. I don't know how likely it is that he becomes a top-2 and I never thought it was super likely, but I know that a lot of people here are fans. With a legit top-line center and maybe one or two medium-sized UFA signings and I think this team is a playoff team and maybe even a contender at that. They're not that far off and I don't think losing Severson will slow them down.

 

[Emperoreddy]

But with Schneider a surefire elite goalie and Blackwood one of the best goalie prospects in the league, where does Wedge fit in?

Even if Severson becomes as talented as a top-2, he'll still be 2nd fiddle to Lars. I don't know how likely it is that he becomes a top-2 and I never thought it was super likely, but I know that a lot of people here are fans. With a legit top-line center and maybe one or two medium-sized UFA signings and I think this team is a playoff team and maybe even a contender at that. They're not that far off and I don't think losing Severson will slow them down.

RNH is not a legit top line center. He had a nearly identical PPG as Rico this season. He has topped out at 55 points max so far. With scoring going down I don't see his point totals going any higher than that. He also isn't very big, which raises what will happen to his game in the post season.

He is a good player, but he isn't worth all of those assets.

 

[Ripshot 43]

But with Schneider a surefire elite goalie and Blackwood one of the best goalie prospects in the league, where does Wedge fit in?

Even if Severson becomes as talented as a top-2, he'll still be 2nd fiddle to Lars. I don't know how likely it is that he becomes a top-2 and I never thought it was super likely, but I know that a lot of people here are fans. With a legit top-line center and maybe one or two medium-sized UFA signings and I think this team is a playoff team and maybe even a contender at that. They're not that far off and I don't think losing Severson will slow them down.

I think we've seen RNH near his best and that's a good second line center. Not meaning I'm against having a team with 2 second line centers because I understand finding a 1st line center in their prime pretty much means you have to draft them. I like who your targeting, I just really don't like packaging Severson while his value is down and our 1st which could just as easily be a top 10 pick or early 20s as you said.

 

[NJDevs26]

I wouldn't trade Severson alone for RNH let alone Severson and a 1st. Wedge is incidental, if anything he has more value to us as next year's backup than he would in a trade.

Tell me who the second defensive pairing is next year if you trade Severson. Schlemko (maybe) and Moore again? Yech. Or overpay a FA along with taking on RNH's contract? All that cap space we had just got cut in half pretty quickly, and not for a true difference maker. And keeping Severson isn't just about the next year it's about the next ten and what he can be, some at a very low cost while Nugent-Hopkins is already getting paid market value more or less. His celing as a defenseman is higher than RNH's as a forward imo.

 

[Ripshot 43]

I wouldn't trade Severson alone for RNH let alone Severson and a 1st. Wedge is incidental, if anything he has more value to us as next year's backup than he would in a trade.

Tell me who the second defensive pairing is next year if you trade Severson. Schlemko (maybe) and Moore again? Yech. Or overpay a FA along with taking on RNH's contract? All that cap space we had just got cut in half pretty quickly, and not for a true difference maker. And keeping Severson isn't just about the next year it's about the next ten and what he can be, some at a very low cost while Nugent-Hopkins is already getting paid market value more or less. His celing as a defenseman is higher than RNH's as a forward imo.

You said it better than me.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I wouldn't trade Severson alone for RNH let alone Severson and a 1st. Wedge is incidental, if anything he has more value to us as next year's backup than he would in a trade.

Tell me who the second defensive pairing is next year if you trade Severson. Schlemko (maybe) and Moore again? Yech. Or overpay a FA along with taking on RNH's contract? All that cap space we had just got cut in half pretty quickly, and not for a true difference maker. And keeping Severson isn't just about the next year it's about the next ten and what he can be, some at a very low cost while Nugent-Hopkins is already getting paid market value more or less. His celing as a defenseman is higher than RNH's as a forward imo.

I agree that Severson has the higher ceiling at his position compared to RNH's ceiling as a forward.

He is a good 2C, and ya I would love to add another 40-50 points into our forward pool. Especially when our bottom 2 centers couldn't get to 20 points combined.

Just no where near the cost that RNH would call for.

 

[NJDevs26]

I agree that Severson has the higher ceiling at his position compared to RNH's ceiling as a forward.

He is a good 2C, and ya I would love to add another 40-50 points into our forward pool. Especially when our bottom 2 centers couldn't get to 20 points combined.

Just no where near the cost that RNH would call for.

I also want to see where Zacha slots in next year before I'm spending assets to add a center in a trade...unless it's a REAL big-time center and not just another 2. And that's where the Stamkos tease comes in. On paper he is seemingly everything we need - in the past a true top-liner who'll bump Henrique/Zajac down to where they belong and one that only costs money/cap space, of which we have a lot of. But I do agree I'm very, very leery about paying for past production and not getting the same player considering his production has declined over the last couple years. Of course I'm not expecting him to go anywhere but Tampa/Toronto anyway.

 

[Emperoreddy]

I also want to see where Zacha slots in next year before I'm spending assets to add a center in a trade...unless it's a REAL big-time center and not just another 2. And that's where the Stamkos tease comes in. On paper he is seemingly everything we need - a true top-liner and one that only costs money/cap space, of which we have a lot of. But I do agree I'm very, very leery about paying for past production and not getting the same player considering his production has declined over the last couple years.

The term alone is scary, never mind the hit that will be $8 million minimum. You definitely have to look twice as he would add a key missing cog to the machine.

Thing is that also puts a timeframe on this whole process. We have a window to create a contender and it is before Stammer falls apart because we will be in cap hell most likely as his contract nears its conclusion.

I'm not totally against it, but I'm leery too. I mean we will have something like $25 million in space after we give our RFAs their raises?

 

[billingtons ghost]

Just posted a trade on nhl-trade-rumors.com which is like the trade board here (I don't know how to find that on HFBoards else I would've posted it there).

NJ: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins
EDM: Damon Severson, Scott Wedgewood, 2017 1st round pick

I got some responses that Edmonton would say no and others that Edmonton should take it and run.

I think New Jersey would be winners in this deal: draft Chychrun in round 1 if he falls or Jake Bean. Bring up Santini. Pick up Goligoski/Yandle/Demers/whomever. Profit.

Do you really see RNH turning into anything? I've been terribly underwhelmed every time I've seen him. I think the deal above is fair, but personally I'd rather have what we are giving up.

Pointswise, like someone said - He is Henrique, but with none of Rico's character.

 

[Scorcho]

Well here would be one option for the Devils. And I think it would be the type of culture change that would make sense for Edm.

Zajac and Santini for Eberle.

Not saying that's a deal I'd want to make for the dev's, but imo that is the type of deal Edm should be looking for.

Where is Eberle in regards to UFA?

Please do me a favor and look up Zajac's contract status.

He has a No Trade Clause, I highly doubt he waives it to go to edmonton of all places.
also it's an overpayment anyway.

 

[tailfins]

So I've been trying to find players using that site that had similar stats to Palmieri in the 2014-2015 season, so far I found one potential "under-the-radar" guy. I have no idea how well he plays but he's buried under forward depth and is around Palmieri's age.

Kyle Palmieri
2014-2015:
24 years old
Pending RFA (contract expires in 15/16)
677:15 5V5 TOI
9.41 Sh%
1.51 Points/60
7.53 Shots/60

Melker Karlsson (3rd line RW for San Jose)
2015-2016:
25 years old
Pending RFA (contract expires in 16/17)
756:49 5V5 TOI
10.47 Sh%
1.51 Points/60
6.82 Shots/60

No idea if this is in any way a sustainable way of looking for trade targets, but I like the aspect it brings

I know nothing about Karlsson, but generally this seems like a good idea. Particularly with Bleed's comment that he's in Pete's doghouse. I like Pete, but knowing how stubborn Pete was about players, Wilson probably is better off moving Karlsson if Pete really doesn't like him.

 

[Bleedred]

I know nothing about Karlsson, but generally this seems like a good idea. Particularly with Bleed's comment that he's in Pete's doghouse. I like Pete, but knowing how stubborn Pete was about players, Wilson probably is better off moving Karlsson if Pete really doesn't like him.

I do wanna stress though, that Pete usually plays him almost every night. He hasn't been a healthy scratch too often.

And even in this year, it's not like his point totals are as bad as Tedenby's or Josefson's last few seasons or anything like that. He's just been a 3rd and 4th liner this year. And since Pete has more depth there, a player like him can afford to be slotted down. He's had a meh playoff so far though. Many on the Sharks forum seem to think he's been the worst forward on the team this playoffs. I can't say I disagree.

Not that this means anything, since it's just 8 games.

 

[devilsblood]

Please do me a favor and look up Zajac's contract status.

He has a No Trade Clause, I highly doubt he waives it to go to edmonton of all places.
also it's an overpayment anyway.

As I said, it's not a deal I'd be looking to make but it's the type of deal edm should be looking to make.

I find it interesting that people see it as an overpayment.