Player Discussion: Niku

[Teppo Numenor]

Lol, had we traded him after the 2015 year or even the 2016 season we likely get atleast a 2nd round pick for him.

After the 2015 and 2016 drafts we had skilled forwards galore and it should have been obvious to the org that Petan would have had a tough time beating out Laine, Conner, and Ehelers for a spot in the top 6.

We also had Perrault and Copp emerging for the bottom 6. A smart org should have realized there wasn't a spot for him and sold him while he still had a lot of value.

A smart org. Like the one you used to manage

 

[Teppo Numenor]

Free at last

 

[sashalaine]

Niku's agent speaking:

https://www.is.fi/nhl/art-2000008278678.html

- Sami told us this weekend that he wants out.

- I don't know if any Finnish player ever has wanted to terminate a 1-way contract. This was completely Sami's initiative.

- We expected him to get a chance to show his capabilities (when the contract was signed).

- The coach denied him of joining offensive rushes aggressively. Maurice is a good coach, but he's very defensive-minded. Sami just didn't fit into his plans.

- In the beginning of February we requested a trade. And asked after it every couple of weeks.

- He wants to play more than he wants money. He sees that there was no use for his kind of a player in Winnipeg.

 

[Garbox]

Here's his agent talking (in Finnish).

Main points are that more than the big money, Niku want's to play and that Maurice told Niku not to join the attack so much. So basically he was told not to use his biggest strengths.

But, agents... a grain of salt may be needed. Or two.

https://www.is.fi/nhl/art-2000008278678.html

Edit: Slow

 

[surixon]

Here's his agent talking (in Finnish).

Main points are that more than the big money, Niku want's to play and that Maurice told Niku not to join the attack so much. So basically he was told not to use his biggest strengths.

But, agents... a grain of salt may be needed. Or two.

https://www.is.fi/nhl/art-2000008278678.html

Edit: Slow

Given the state of our dcore the last few years that is very believable.

 

[TS Quint]

Nic Petan, Marko Dano and Sami Niku.

"If Mo just gave them a chance, they'd be full time Jets players"

Sometimes, players just don't have the mix of traits needed to play in the NHL.

Bu bu bu but the “advanced” stats!

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Please trade Heinola so I can stop following Jets.

Okay.

 

[DRW204]

Here's his agent talking (in Finnish).

Main points are that more than the big money, Niku want's to play and that Maurice told Niku not to join the attack so much. So basically he was told not to use his biggest strengths.

But, agents... a grain of salt may be needed. Or two.

https://www.is.fi/nhl/art-2000008278678.html

Edit: Slow

agent protecting his player....in other news, the sky is blue and water is wet lol.

Bu bu bu but the “advanced” stats!

niku has terrible advance stats though.

what funny is, the #FreeNiku crowd, and folks who claim him to be an nhl dman seem to often be a proponent of advanced stats or on-ice measures. but they avoid that discussion like the plague when it comes to niku.

 

[Jets 31]

Niku was a 7th round pick and he was absolutely lost in his own end and got muscled in the corners alot . He showed some offensive ability but he isn't getting a sniff at playing with the defense we have now. Petan went to Toronto and didn't win a regular spot there either, some times draft picks don't pan out, shit happens.

 

[llwyd]

Well, it's pretty wide spread thought among Finnish fans that Niku got bit of a raw deal in Winnipeg and was never given a chance to play on his strengths. This might be pure homerism of course but I hope he will prove himself in some other team.

 

[lanky]

agent protecting his player....in other news, the sky is blue and water is wet lol.

niku has terrible advance stats though.

what funny is, the #FreeNiku crowd, and folks who claim him to be an nhl dman seem to often be a proponent of advanced stats or on-ice measures. but they avoid that discussion like the plague when it comes to niku.

Niku fans see his skill and can project him succeeding in the right context. Maurice and Niku are objectively a bad fit. They make each other worse. Niku's results were bad but maybe they wouldn't be in a different scenario. This isn't a great analogy but I'll use it anyways - Pionk had terrible results with the Rangers, but in a different scenario here in Winnipeg he's awesome.

 

[Jimmyjets]

Well, it's pretty wide spread thought among Finnish fans that Niku got bit of a raw deal in Winnipeg and was never given a chance to play on his strengths. This might be pure homerism of course but I hope he will prove himself in some other team.

Finnipeg, where Fins go to get screwed by the org.

- Selanne - traded!
- Laine - greatest player in the world, totally screwed over by the Jets by not being gifted the captain's position on the top line even though the captain was a top 10 scorer in the league. Then traded!
- Niku - Elite offensive Defenseman that wouldn't cut his hair so Mr. Burns wouldn't let him play. Contract terminated!
- Luoto - signed as an undrafted UFA... Immediately regretted that decision. Contract terminated!
- Heinola - "Insert Bernie Sanders meme here" (You're on thin ice bucko!!! keep your bag packed)
- Team Finland Jets 3rd Jersey - no longer being used.

 

[tbcwpg]

Well, it's pretty wide spread thought among Finnish fans that Niku got bit of a raw deal in Winnipeg and was never given a chance to play on his strengths. This might be pure homerism of course but I hope he will prove himself in some other team.

Unfortunately he couldn't play defence and when defenseman is your position, that's a pretty core component of what you need to do.

I don't think he's a full time NHL player but I do feel he could fit in as a fill in guy on another team.

 

[jungles]

Niku fans see his skill and can project him succeeding in the right context. Maurice and Niku are objectively a bad fit. They make each other worse. Niku's results were bad but maybe they wouldn't be in a different scenario. This isn't a great analogy but I'll use it anyways - Pionk had terrible results with the Rangers, but in a different scenario here in Winnipeg he's awesome.

And Pionk had his best offensive numbers under Maurice, which throws cold water on the "let me be me" narrative.

 

[surixon]

Maurice generally doesn't have any issue with his top 4 guys jumping into the play and producing. He seems to want more low risk types on his bottom pairings though much like he prefers those types on his 4th line.

Niku wasn't good enough defensively to play top 4 so as a result the fit wasn't good for the bottom pairing.

Hopefully he gets a chance somewhere else. Niku needs to go to an org where they need a PP specialist and are ok with sheltering that type of player on the third pairing.

 

[DRW204]

Niku fans see his skill and can project him succeeding in the right context. Maurice and Niku are objectively a bad fit. They make each other worse. Niku's results were bad but maybe they wouldn't be in a different scenario. This isn't a great analogy but I'll use it anyways - Pionk had terrible results with the Rangers, but in a different scenario here in Winnipeg he's awesome.

i mean this can be said for any player? like, if you put any player in the perfect ideal situation they'll succeed. however, in pro-sports shit happens. you have an opponent to go against, you have linemates to consider... if niku can only be good when everything is ideal, then he is not going to make it far.

what was the right context for Niku.... he was poor defensively, didn't generate offense. idk how long the Jets could have gone with another poor dman on their roster. he was not better than Trouba-Buff-Myers on the right in 18-19, but he did get 30 games due to injuries...he had flashes of good talent/skill, but overall was not good. people bring up him being on the PP, the Jets had a top 5PP that year with Buff/Morrissey/Trouba on the point, he wasn't usurping them. he got hurt in 19-20, but when he did play, it didn't improve from the year previous. and by the on-ice measures/stats pretty sure he ranked below Bitetto even!

id say Pionk was successful in less than ideal situations.... he played with Sbisa+Kulikov+Forbot, and performed admirably. Niku most common line mates this past year were Demelo+Morrissey (not high minutes of course), and the 3 years prior was Charot+Kulikov.

we'll see if he becomes a top defender elsewhere like all the niku fans/Finnish crew regurgitate he would be, and i'll admit im wrong.

And Pionk had his best offensive numbers under Maurice, which throws cold water on the "let me be me" narrative.

Trouba too. Myers produced above his career PPG pace with the Jets (vs BUF+VAN), & of course Buff was a great point producer.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Good vision offensively, but defensively at the NHL level he, well, he just cant even spell D.

Wishing him all the best and success. His game may be better suited to the larger ice and softer play in europe.

Kinda sounds like what people were saying about Neal Pionk as a Ranger.

 

[llwyd]

Finnipeg, where Fins go to get screwed by the org.

Well, Laine business was quite ridiculous, but that never was so wide spread in Finland, actually many mocked Tappara and Laine fans for finding those endless excuses. Niku is not even that well known back here and people who talk about him are pretty well informed and judicious - and still there is a bit of consensus about his being passed over pretty easily. I certainly think that he might make a decent career in some other franchise.

 

[larmex99]

Well, it's pretty wide spread thought among Finnish fans that Niku got bit of a raw deal in Winnipeg and was never given a chance to play on his strengths. This might be pure homerism of course but I hope he will prove himself in some other team.

Unfortunately for some non-fans you play the game to win. The NHL is not a league to go to if you want to work on your game.

 

[Whileee]

As I recall, most of the enthusiasm for Niku based on his statistics were really just based on his raw point production at lower levels (e.g. AHL).

But as I've noted in the past, a lot of D point production really depends on power play production, and even-strength point production at lower levels tends to be a better predictor of production at the NHL level than all production.

So, looking back at rookie seasons at the AHL level...

Even-strength points per game...

Niku (age 21): 0.33
Stanley (age 20): 0.25
Chisholm (age 20): 0.29
Heinola (age 19): 0.37

Niku feasted on PP points, but wasn't a huge stand-out in terms of production at even strength at the AHL level.

 

[llwyd]

Unfortunately for some non-fans you play the game to win. The NHL is not a league to go to if you want to work on your game.

Well, sometimes patience is good for winning too. But anyway, too bad it didn't work out in Winnipeg, hopefully he will get a new chance somewhere else.

 

[JetsUK]

Niku fans see his skill and can project him succeeding in the right context. Maurice and Niku are objectively a bad fit. They make each other worse. Niku's results were bad but maybe they wouldn't be in a different scenario. This isn't a great analogy but I'll use it anyways - Pionk had terrible results with the Rangers, but in a different scenario here in Winnipeg he's awesome.

I enjoyed watching Niku play, and think he might have become a different player with some changes in timing and luck, and maybe also different levels of buy-in form player and team. It's worth noting that he was considered a strong defensive player early in his career and played that role internationally. He didn't magically forget how to defend.

I also think it's a mistake to take a player who (arguably) hasn't been developed optimally and argue that his lack of success elsewhere is exclusively down to him and not a myriad of other factors, including an unsuccessful or outright botched development program -- especially when we criticize this exact pattern in other orgs.

Good luck to Sami -- hopefully he's able to find his feet in another org and fulfills that early promise. And hopefully the Jets do not drop the ball with superior prospects in blue-chipper Heinola and high-potential Samberg.

 

[rehf]

I can't blame this entirely on Maurice, it's really issues with both sides. Sami looked pretty awful defensively and couldn't adapt, but Maurice didn't put him in a position to succeed at all.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I remember Niku lighting it up in the A and thinking, probably rightfully, that he deserved a chance in the N. after that he half-assed it and never gave it his full effort in the A and that does not endear you to an organization. The org thought he had more to learn in A and there wasn’t a spot.
He probably deserved more of a chance when we had sbisa and players who were known to be bad. When Niku got a chance there wasn’t much love on either side and everyone saw Stanley a less skilled player giving it his all and with something the team lacked in size. The team prefers safer players on 3rd pair. Niku wasn’t better than poolman.

 

[Al Camino]

So was listening to Skates and Plates pod this morning. Brandon made some good points about Niku. One thing stuck out was that he basically stated that Niku's work ethic and attitude wasn't great. Which begs why would you keep a guy that long if you clearly can't work with?