Matthews v. Laine who finishes this season with more goals

[vivalavili]

Seeing how Laine has the edge on PP and his even strength play has suffered from playing with Little and Ehlers, I'd give it to Laine. Little just isn't a good enough #2C for a contending team and Ehlers-Laine partnership hasn't been working this season since they are too similar players, who like to hold the puck a lot. IF Laine can land a the first-line right winger role when Scheif comes back, he'll most likely hit 35+ again, most likely +40 knowing what he's able to do.


AM34-Nylander partnerships seems to be working right now and there's no reason for me to think AM wouldn't be keeping this pace up. Still, Jets are the better team right now and Laine in a real first line producer role he should make it.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

You said that he can score with elite linemates which he doesn't have right now (Ok, lately he's been playing with Wheeler but you know). So how the **** is he leading his team in goals?

Why do you even discuss players you don't actually follow?

cause of PP goals. he's scoring on the PP where he plays with Scheifele (until he got hurt), Wheeler, and Buff. He's not scoring at ES so much when he's centered by Little. he's definitely the best goal scorer on the team, but he still doesn't create his own offense the same way

 

[LeafsNation75]

cause of PP goals. he's scoring on the PP where he plays with Scheifele (until he got hurt), Wheeler, and Buff. He's not scoring at ES so much when he's centered by Little. he's definitely the best goal scorer on the team, but he still doesn't create his own offense the same way

How many times have we seen Matthews create a chance out of nothing. That's the difference when you have elite #1 Centre compared to a Winger like Laine.

 

[jbobell98]

For all the talk of Matthews being hands down the better player its weird seeing Laine have more points while be a year younger...

 

[biotk]

Seeing how Laine has the edge on PP and his even strength play has suffered from playing with Little and Ehlers

Laine, Little and Ehlers have a higher 5v5 goals/60 (2.43) than Scheifele, Connor and Wheeler (2.20) .......

 

[LeafsNation75]

For all the talk of Matthews being hands down the better player its weird seeing Laine have more points while be a year younger...

Wow he has a whopping 2 more points despite being tied with Matthews in total goals.

 

[olli]

For all the talk of Matthews being hands down the better player its weird seeing Laine have more points while be a year younger...

Laine has played 9 more games than Matthews. I'm a Jets fan and I'd say Matthews is quite bit better right now (and so far in their careers). For this poll I'll say Laine though due to his slightly lower shooting % (especially relative to career shooting %).

 

[biotk]

For all the talk of Matthews being hands down the better player its weird seeing Laine have more points while be a year younger...

Laine is 7 months younger. If you want you can compare Laine's 50 games this year with Matthews' first 50 games last year:

Laine: 50 GP 22 G, 17A, 39Pts
Matthews: 50 GP 23 G, 19A 42 Pts (with Matthews being 5 months younger)

Also, Matthews led his team in points both seasons. Laine was 18 and 15 points back.

 

[biotk]

The PP itself has gone stagnant anyways.

The PP that Matthews is on has certainly gone stagnant, but to be honest it was never great to begin with. The team has never changed things up over the last year and half despite it becoming less and less effective each month.

Since entering the league Matthews has 47 5v5 goals. Next is Lee (42) and then Kucherov, Tarasenko, Skinner and Rakell (all at 38). Yet, Matthews only has 10 PP goals in 123 Games which places him around a billionth in the NHL. Boeser has 10 in 55 games. Sure Matthews doesn't get a lot of PP minutes compared to anyone else who is a top line player (his unit got 13% of the PP time their last game), but it is more than just ice time - it is the way the team is utilizing him.

Matthews has the highest iHDCF/60 in the league 5v5 by a decent margin since entering the league. On the PP he just isn't getting those iHDCF chances - other players who also have high iHDCF/60 at 5v5 such as Lee, Crosby, Benn, Tavares, Skinner, JVR are putting up iHDCF/60s on the PP that are 2, 3, 4 times higher than Matthews (over the last year and a half - this year 5 - 10 times higher).

He wasn't getting a ton of PP iHDCFs last year, but at least he was getting assists. This year he isn't getting those PP assists, and his already low for him PP iHDCF numbers have fallen off a cliff. The top 5v5 iHDCF player since he entered the league is 10th (in other words - dead last) among Leafs' forwards in PP iHDCFs this year. He has fewer iHDCFs than Leivo who has played 12 games. It is a completely dysfunctional PP unit - a PP unit with a shooting percentage of 3% over the past 6 weeks or so, and yet the team has changed nothing.

 

[olli]

Laine is 7 months younger. If you want you can compare Laine's 50 games this year with Matthews' first 50 games last year:

Laine: 50 GP 22 G, 17A, 39Pts
Matthews: 50 GP 23 G, 19A 42 Pts (with Matthews being 5 months younger)

Also, Matthews led his team in points both seasons. Laine was 18 and 15 points back.

That speaks more to how Wheeler and Scheifele put up more points than Matthews (so far) than to how Matthews is a better player than Laine.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

For all the talk of Matthews being hands down the better player its weird seeing Laine have more points while be a year younger...

Tell me more about Laine being a year younger!

 

[biotk]

That speaks more to how Wheeler and Scheifele put up more points than Matthews (so far) than to how Matthews is a better player than Laine.

Actually it speaks to who opposing teams focus on shutting down: top player on top line - that is Matthews and Scheifele.

However, between Matthews, Scheifele and Wheeler, Matthews is a class of his own 27 5v5 points in 41 games (24 primary points) compared to 20 5v5 points in 38 for Scheifele (15 primary) and 24 5v5 points in 50 games for Wheeler (17 primary).

 

[LeafsNation75]

Tell me more about Laine being a year younger!

It's not like we didn't hear it enough last season about Laine being 7 months younger in the Calder debate and how the voters would realize that. Oh yeah these were the Calder votes last year that shows it was never a factor.

1) Auston Matthews: 1st place votes 164, 2nd place votes 3 votes, 3rd place 0 votes, 4th place 0 votes, 5th place 0 votes

2) Patrik Laine: 1st place votes 3, 2nd place votes 134, 3rd place votes 24, 4th place votes 6, 5th place 0 votes.

 

[Isaac Nootin]

It's not like we didn't hear it enough last season about Laine being 7 months younger in the Calder debate and how the voters would realize that. Oh yeah these were the Calder votes last year that shows it was never a factor.

1) Auston Matthews: 1st place votes 164, 2nd place votes 3 votes, 3rd place 0 votes, 4th place 0 votes, 5th place 0 votes

2) Patrik Laine: 1st place votes 3, 2nd place votes 134, 3rd place votes 24, 4th place votes 6, 5th place 0 votes.

I know.

7 months does not equal 1 year. I wonder when this will stop being a thing? Or is it still relevant when they are 27? 37?

 

[IPS]

It's not like we didn't hear it enough last season about Laine being 7 months younger in the Calder debate and how the voters would realize that. Oh yeah these were the Calder votes last year that shows it was never a factor.

1) Auston Matthews: 1st place votes 164, 2nd place votes 3 votes, 3rd place 0 votes, 4th place 0 votes, 5th place 0 votes

2) Patrik Laine: 1st place votes 3, 2nd place votes 134, 3rd place votes 24, 4th place votes 6, 5th place 0 votes.

It's no secret at this point that all of the experts know that Matthews is on another level. Amuses me that a one dimensional PP specialist is still being compared with one of the very best players in the game.

 

[LeafsNation75]

I know.

7 months does not equal 1 year. I wonder when this will stop being a thing? Or is it still relevant when they are 27? 37?

When Ovechkin won the Calder over Crosby in 2006 he was around 24 months older and no Penguins fans complained about that. Although if it wasn't for the lockout chances are Ovechkin would have won it in 2005 and Crosby would have won it in 2006. However the age difference is a lot greater than Matthews and Laine.

 

[LeafsNation75]

It's no secret at this point that all of the experts know that Matthews is on another level. Amuses me that a one dimensional PP specialist is still being compared with one of the very best players in the game.

I say that's because other fans can't stand that the Leafs finally got one of the best up and coming players. Although secretly maybe some Jets fans wish they won the 1st pick in 2016 to get Matthews and are jealous about that.

 

[tgo0]

Jets fan - Matthews

 

[Garthinater]

Laine is 7 months younger. If you want you can compare Laine's 50 games this year with Matthews' first 50 games last year:

Laine: 50 GP 22 G, 17A, 39Pts
Matthews: 50 GP 23 G, 19A 42 Pts (with Matthews being 5 months younger)

Also, Matthews led his team in points both seasons. Laine was 18 and 15 points back.

Well said.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

I know.

7 months does not equal 1 year. I wonder when this will stop being a thing? Or is it still relevant when they are 27? 37?

If Matthews were 7 months younger they'd be saying he has the advantage because he has more youthful energy

 

[Apotheosis]

The PP that Matthews is on has certainly gone stagnant, but to be honest it was never great to begin with. The team has never changed things up over the last year and half despite it becoming less and less effective each month.

Since entering the league Matthews has 47 5v5 goals. Next is Lee (42) and then Kucherov, Tarasenko, Skinner and Rakell (all at 38). Yet, Matthews only has 10 PP goals in 123 Games which places him around a billionth in the NHL. Boeser has 10 in 55 games. Sure Matthews doesn't get a lot of PP minutes compared to anyone else who is a top line player (his unit got 13% of the PP time their last game), but it is more than just ice time - it is the way the team is utilizing him.

Matthews has the highest iHDCF/60 in the league 5v5 by a decent margin since entering the league. On the PP he just isn't getting those iHDCF chances - other players who also have high iHDCF/60 at 5v5 such as Lee, Crosby, Benn, Tavares, Skinner, JVR are putting up iHDCF/60s on the PP that are 2, 3, 4 times higher than Matthews (over the last year and a half - this year 5 - 10 times higher).

He wasn't getting a ton of PP iHDCFs last year, but at least he was getting assists. This year he isn't getting those PP assists, and his already low for him PP iHDCF numbers have fallen off a cliff. The top 5v5 iHDCF player since he entered the league is 10th (in other words - dead last) among Leafs' forwards in PP iHDCFs this year. He has fewer iHDCFs than Leivo who has played 12 games. It is a completely dysfunctional PP unit - a PP unit with a shooting percentage of 3% over the past 6 weeks or so, and yet the team has changed nothing.

I am completely on board with this. I would prefer they simply stack the unit with Matthews, Marner and Nylander and have Rielly and JVR be with them. Put Matthews either down low or on the right side for tap-in's or puck handling and it would drastically improve PP numbers for everyone overall.

 

[SotasicA]

The second option should include Jets fans AND Finns, to cover all the homer votes.

 

[LeafsNation75]

If Matthews were 7 months younger they'd be saying he has the advantage because he has more youthful energy

If Matthews was 7 months younger I think they'd be saying how more mature Laine is for his age.

 

[wabagee]

The second option should include Jets fans AND Finns, to cover all the homer votes.

The votes are close all around, With the millions more Leaf fans you would think this would be lopsided. It's still awesome for Laine to have a small vocal minority from a small country defending him. Keep on keepin on, To all the Finns I salute you!

 

[LeafsNation75]

The votes are close all around, With the millions more Leaf fans you would think this would be lopsided. It's still awesome for Laine to have a small vocal minority from a small country defending him. Keep on keepin on, To all the Finns I salute you!

There is nothing wrong with Laine having a lot of fans from Finland. However some of them went way overboard last year in the Calder threads defending him, when Leafs fans would post some stats where Matthews was better and they didn't care. I mean for example how often was it beaten to death that Matthews was just 7 months older. We were told the voters would remember that fact and in the end they did not care.