LD Jake Sanderson - USNTDP, USHL (2020, 5th, OTT)

[robert ethan]

You didn’t think the defenseman who led the winning team in ice time, neutralizing a lot of the opposition while facing the toughest matchups (including one of the most productive lines of the tournament), all while being on the ice for both the winning team’s goals and making a key contribution to the second goal stood out? He’s the guy who used his tremendous skating to pinch on Cozens, a guy who can fly, and keep the puck in the zone before the second goal. His skating jumped off the screen.

You don’t think he deserves some credit for the stifling style?

I believe that Guhle stood out more to you, but I’d argue that’s probably because you were watching the game to see him play rather than watching all players objectively. I mean suggesting that Guhle’s skating stood out more than Sanderson’s is a pretty big statement.

I like Guhle, he’s one of the guys I was hoping the Sens would pick with their third 1st if the Islanders lost the play in. But there’s a reason he wasn’t touted up there with Drysdale and Sanderson and likely wasn’t considered with the 5th or 6th picks.

Eye test aside, for all the extra playing time and PP time Sanderson saw compared to Guhle, KG still emerged with more goals, points and a better +-. Most of the D men ahead of Guhle on that team are in the NHL currently. Obviously Sanderson was going to get a.lot more responsibility in his situation and handled it well, but in terms of projectible NHL tools I like Guhle more than the two dmen taken ahead of him.

 

[TeddyBare]

Is Guhle's thread not getting enough bumps?

 

[Dr Quincy]

Little difference in the respective depth of the two teams. Team Canada went to camp with more first round draft picks to choose from than they had roster spots. Guhle's forte is defense, and his team trailed from the start, so the offensive blueliners got more looks as the game went on. But watching the game, his raw tool set stood out much more. The size, strength, physicality, skating, shot. Canada ran into a good goalkeeper playing in a tight system on a team of players with long familiarity with each other. Otherwise they dominated the tournament and would win 8 of 10 from the US in a series.

So cute....

 

[Dr Quincy]

Eye test aside, for all the extra playing time and PP time Sanderson saw compared to Guhle, KG still emerged with more goals, points and a better +-. Most of the D men ahead of Guhle on that team are in the NHL currently. Obviously Sanderson was going to get a.lot more responsibility in his situation and handled it well, but in terms of projectible NHL tools I like Guhle more than the two dmen taken ahead of him.

The amount of stock you are putting in 2 goals scored in a 16-2 game against Germany and a 10-0 game against Switzerland is exactly why amateurs should let others do the scouting for them.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

He's following Suter's career path pretty closely. If he gives you 80% of that I think you have to be pumped. I haven't been paying too much attention to the thread, but it's pretty obvious he's ahead of Guhle currently.

 

[robert ethan]

The amount of stock you are putting in 2 goals scored in a 16-2 game against Germany and a 10-0 game against Switzerland is exactly why amateurs should let others do the scouting for them.

They were both good goals, and two more than Sanderson and Drysdale combined, managed against similar opposition. Rap on Guhle is limited offence, but if a defenseman has the shot, they don't need to be great puck handlers. E.g. Shea Weber or Zdeno Chara, or going back further, Dion Phaneuf and Sheldon Souray. Those guys handled the puck like it was a porcupine.

 

[Dr Quincy]

They were both good goals, and two more than Sanderson and Drysdale combined, managed against similar opposition.

That should help him in his future career in Europe.

 

[robert ethan]

That should help him in his future career in Europe.

Yeah, it's always the big, physical North American players who end up in Europe, right? I guess that's because they play a tougher game on smaller ice over there.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Eye test aside, for all the extra playing time and PP time Sanderson saw compared to Guhle, KG still emerged with more goals, points and a better +-. Most of the D men ahead of Guhle on that team are in the NHL currently. Obviously Sanderson was going to get a.lot more responsibility in his situation and handled it well, but in terms of projectible NHL tools I like Guhle more than the two dmen taken ahead of him.

So, your nose has to go in the poop. You can put your own nose in it, or I can force it in, but remember, it's for your own good.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Little difference in the respective depth of the two teams. Team Canada went to camp with more first round draft picks to choose from than they had roster spots. Guhle's forte is defense, and his team trailed from the start, so the offensive blueliners got more looks as the game went on. But watching the game, his raw tool set stood out much more. The size, strength, physicality, skating, shot. Canada ran into a good goalkeeper playing in a tight system on a team of players with long familiarity with each other. Otherwise they dominated the tournament and would win 8 of 10 from the US in a series.

Guhle played like 3 mins in the third period, which basically is three shifts. Clearly his own staff felt like he was a liability and opted to relegate him to the bench.

So Canada lost the WJC with Sanderson playing a huge role in that, yet they didn’t consider Guhle a difference maker so they stapled him to the bench. They also lost to Russia at the Hlinka with Guhle wearing a letter and failed to win a medal at the WU17HC with Guhle again wearing a letter.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

I think Robert Ethan is trolling but knows Sanderson is better. Pavel seems to genuinely think Sanderson isn't very good, which is kind of concerning.

 

[TopC0rner]

I think Robert Ethan is trolling but knows Sanderson is better. Pavel seems to genuinely think Sanderson isn't very good, which is kind of concerning.

Concerning for whom?

 

[robert ethan]

Guhle played like 3 mins in the third period, which basically is three shifts. Clearly his own staff felt like he was a liability and opted to relegate him to the bench.

So Canada lost the WJC with Sanderson playing a huge role in that, yet they didn’t consider Guhle a difference maker so they stapled him to the bench. They also lost to Russia at the Hlinka with Guhle wearing a letter and failed to win a medal at the WU17HC with Guhle again wearing a letter.

So, trailing in the third period, you expect them to use 18 year old defense first player Guhle, or 19 year old offensive whizzes Byram and Harley (both of whom are in the NHL) ? Sanderson wouldn't have fared differently on that depth chart. KG was out at the end of close games Canada led, or were protecting a shutout. At the U17, Canada had their talent spread between 3 teams. US puts it's best 16 year olds on one team and leaves them there for 2 years, which accounts for whatever success they have at those levels. Then the same players essentially get together for the WJC once they age out of the NDTP. It works from a medal perspective, but it doesn't mean the individual players are better than top players from other countries. If you want to talk team success, Guhle won 90 games and lost 28 in 2 seasons in the WHL. +42. Sanderson has a net losing record and was-16 over his 2 NDTP seasons.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

Concerning for whom?

Um, not Jake Sanderson.

 

[BondraTime]

Why are people still debating with this pigeon?

 

[Agent Zub]

Concerning for whom?

humanity

 

[Boud]

Why are people still debating with this pigeon?

I almost bothered to post a long reply but it's such a waste of time, this kid is straight up trolling.

This is a Sanderson thread related to his development, if you wanna talk about Guhle go in the Guhle thread.

 

[KnuckChuckinTkachuk]

I almost bothered to post a long reply but it's such a waste of time, this kid is straight up trolling.

This is a Sanderson thread related to his development, if you wanna talk about Guhle go in the Guhle thread.

That ignore feature is such a blessing

 

[foggyvisor]

Just accept that the poster thinks Guhle is better and move on plz. No need to "debate".

 

[Steve Kournianos]

So, trailing in the third period, you expect them to use 18 year old defense first player Guhle, or 19 year old offensive whizzes Byram and Harley (both of whom are in the NHL) ? Sanderson wouldn't have fared differently on that depth chart. KG was out at the end of close games Canada led, or were protecting a shutout. At the U17, Canada had their talent spread between 3 teams. US puts it's best 16 year olds on one team and leaves them there for 2 years, which accounts for whatever success they have at those levels. Then the same players essentially get together for the WJC once they age out of the NDTP. It works from a medal perspective, but it doesn't mean the individual players are better than top players from other countries. If you want to talk team success, Guhle won 90 games and lost 28 in 2 seasons in the WHL. +42. Sanderson has a net losing record and was-16 over his 2 NDTP seasons.

Well I guess that does it, since you answered your own question. The fact that Guhle is “defense first” is exactly why it was Sanderson who went higher in the draft, played a bigger role at the WJC, and is the better prospect.

Also, Prince Albert was a powerhouse and a Memorial Cup entry in 2019. Guhle was their No. 4 on that team. When he took over as the No. 1 last season they regressed from an .824 pts pct to .641.

Also, Guhle was not used exclusively for shutdown duties when Canada had the lead late. In the medal round, his ice time in the 3rd pd of the Czech game was 5th among Canadian dmen. In the game against Russia he was 6th. Against the Americans he was 5th.

Three medal-round games — all with Guhle’s ice time reduced in the 3rd period, regardless of whether Canada was winning or losing.

 

[ChurchOfAlfie]

Heads up, any Canadians wanting to check out Sanderson can catch UND's game on TSN2 tonight.

 

[robert ethan]

Well I guess that does it, since you answered your own question. The fact that Guhle is “defense first” is exactly why it was Sanderson who went higher in the draft, played a bigger role at the WJC, and is the better prospect.

Also, Prince Albert was a powerhouse and a Memorial Cup entry in 2019. Guhle was their No. 4 on that team. When he took over as the No. 1 last season they regressed from an .824 pts pct to .641.

Also, Guhle was not used exclusively for shutdown duties when Canada had the lead late. In the medal round, his ice time in the 3rd pd of the Czech game was 5th among Canadian dmen. In the game against Russia he was 6th. Against the Americans he was 5th.

Three medal-round games — all with Guhle’s ice time reduced in the 3rd period, regardless of whether Canada was winning or losing.

My original question was, if the "defense first" guy is outscoring the "offense first" guys, while being larger and more physical, why is he regarded as the lesser prospect?

The only answer I've gotten is "just because he is, and some 'scouts' say he is". Guess I'll have to leave it at that.

 

[Breakers]

Heads up, any Canadians wanting to check out Sanderson can catch UND's game on TSN2 tonight.

assuming it happens

(fingers crossed)

 

[Dr Quincy]

My original question was, if the "defense first" guy is outscoring the "offense first" guys, while being larger and more physical, why is he regarded as the lesser prospect?

The only answer I've gotten is "just because he is, and some 'scouts' say he is". Guess I'll have to leave it at that.

Those aren't the only answers you've gotten.

Perhaps you should read the answers more closely.

 

[Burke6687]

My original question was, if the "defense first" guy is outscoring the "offense first" guys, while being larger and more physical, why is he regarded as the lesser prospect?

The only answer I've gotten is "just because he is, and some 'scouts' say he is". Guess I'll have to leave it at that.

The professional scouts, i.e. not stat watchers nor combine results guys are PROJECTING. Scouting is about projecting who you believe the player will grow into, not what they are today or in the past. Using a few games or tournaments as your sample to draw a definitive conclusion as to who will be better is asinine and incomplete.
Those who are much smarter than you or I, believe Sanderson will become a better pro and I for one realize I am not any smarter to think I know better.
Obviously they are not always right, more often than not they are wrong. To answer your question, Sanderson projects as a better and more complete pro hockey player by people who are paid to make such projections, simple as that.