Keep Stepan or Brassard?

[darko]

Both. If I had to choose, Brassard easily.

Easily? Yeah sure thing pal.

 

[Boom Boom Geoffrion*]

Brassard is our most exciting playoff performer (Outside of Hank). And despite not producing as consistently as Stepan, he is the more talented player. I was skeptical when we acquired him, but he's been a terrific fit here and has become someone I identify as a core player.

But I'd still take Stepan. I think he's the type of player that will maintain his peak for longer than Brassard. He's a freaking monster defensively. Always creating turnovers and opportunities.

We would all love that elite 1C. But, I think having a 1-2-3 punch of Stepan/Brassard/Hayes is tremendous in its own way. Three different types of centers. All possessing unique skills.

The position many of us thought would be a burden, has actually been a position of strength. Close this poll! keep both.

 

[Machinehead]

Easily? Yeah sure thing pal.

With the year he just had and the contract he's probably about to get...I just don't know.

I know what we're getting out of Brassard and he's worth it.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

I clearly don't know much about skaters because I said Derick Brassard is a better player than Derek Stepan.

Got it.

Your thought process is absurd. It's all of the other ridiculous stuff you've said. Stick to goaltending. At least you can give passable analysis there.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Brassard is more naturally talented and has the ability to really dominate a game when he's on. But for all the strides he's made, he just doesn't bring that consistently enough.

Stepan, for all his accomplishments, has yet to put together an 82 game season that fully represents what he is capable of. However, if healthy I think he outproduces Brassard and brings a bit more consistency.

Without factoring in contracts, I'd take Stepan without too much gnashing of teeth.

Agreed. Consistency is huge.

 

[JC704]

Gun to my head: Stepan. Better defensively, and has a track record of erasing better offensive centers in the postseason.

 

[Kokoschka]

In a vacuum, Stepan. Better defensively, puts up more points, is younger. Brassard being "more talented" is nice and all, but Stepan consistently puts up a better PPG. And even considering how flat out awesome Brassard was this season, I want him to show me he can be this Player consistently.

The question gets interesting when we learn the conditions of Stepan's new contract. Anything under 6m$ and it's a steal of a contract for us and you Keep him over Brassard, and easily imo. Anything above 7 and I'll cringe.

 

[Edge]

Frankly, both players have something to prove in 2015-2016.

Brassard needs to show that he can repeat what he did last season.

Stepan needs to show he's closer to his 2013 form rather than his 2014 form.

 

[darko]

Frankly, both players have something to prove in 2015-2016.

Brassard needs to show that he can repeat what he did last season.

Stepan needs to show he's closer to his 2013 form rather than his 2014 form.

This season was Stepan's best season to date.

 

[Machinehead]

This season was Stepan's best season to date.

Only in production, which is thanks mostly to an absurd on-ice team shooting %. He was an awful possession player and hurt just about every teammate he played with in that regard.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Only in production, which is thanks mostly to an absurd on-ice team shooting %. He was an awful possession player and hurt just about every teammate he played with in that regard.

I'm surprised that Step is such a poor possession player, but I think it's because Kreider isn't the proper winger for him. Their numbers together are still pretty good, but overall, since 2012:

Stepan&Nash: 1088 minutes together 53.3 CF% with a CF60 of 64.91 and CA of 56.81
Stepan&Kreider: 1477 minutes together 51.6 CF% with a CF of 58.91 and CA of 55.29

Both have a PDO near 104 (Thanks Henke-poo)

I honestly think our top-6 should be

Hagelin-Stepan-Nash --> 58.0 CF% in around 200 minutes together since 2012
Kreider-Brassard-Zucc --> 62.8 CF% in just around 100 minutes together since 2012

Hagelin is the relentless forechecker that can dish it to Stepan and Nash from behind the net, and Kreider is basically Pouliot on steroids for the Brassard line.

 

[nevesis]

Your thought process is absurd. It's all of the other ridiculous stuff you've said. Stick to goaltending. At least you can give passable analysis there.

Absurd because you disagree with my opinion? Poor you.

How about ignoring my posts if you don't like what I say. I detailed my opinion fairly clearly, and if you can't respect it, move on and stop whining like you're known to do here.

 

[theFiGS]

Nash and brassard for Schwartz oshie lehtera

 

[NYROrtsFan]

Bottom line is that Brassard is a better playoff player than Stepan and that's all that really matters.

 

[Loff]

Brass has really grown on me for the past two seasons. He's such an intense and proud player. I'm slightly leaning towards Brass.

But it's tough. I hope they both end up staying here.

 

[Doctyl]

Absurd because you disagree with my opinion? Poor you.

How about ignoring my posts if you don't like what I say. I detailed my opinion fairly clearly, and if you can't respect it, move on and stop whining like you're known to do here.

The thing is your opinion might have been stronger if you didn't provide those details

 

[Matz03]

Hagelin-Stepan-Nash --> 58.0 CF% in around 200 minutes together since 2012
Kreider-Brassard-Zucc --> 62.8 CF% in just around 100 minutes together since 2012

Hagelin is the relentless forechecker that can dish it to Stepan and Nash from behind the net, and Kreider is basically Pouliot on steroids for the Brassard line.

If we resign Hags to anything over $3.5m then he should get his shot there. I always liked Nash at RW over left wing too.

Getting back to the centers conversation, if we see growth from all 3 guys we could see Brassard reach 65 pts, Stepan hit 70, and Hayes crack the 50 pts mark. You can't complain with that. Stepan and Hayes better be working on their faceoffs and shots this offseason though.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Absurd because you disagree with my opinion? Poor you.

How about ignoring my posts if you don't like what I say. I detailed my opinion fairly clearly, and if you can't respect it, move on and stop whining like you're known to do here.

No. Absurd because the analysis is poor. I thought I made that pretty clear.

You can post your opinion. I can also say it's incorrect. Funny how that works.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

The thing is your opinion might have been stronger if you didn't provide those details

If he has just said keep Brass and not provided any substance it still would have been better.

 

[JohnC]

Your thought process is absurd. It's all of the other ridiculous stuff you've said. Stick to goaltending. At least you can give passable analysis there.

"Passable"

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Some numbers going back to when Brassard had become a NYR till now...5v5 Regular Season Data from 12/13 - 14/15

Stepan
126GF
66GA
2.80 GF/60
1.47 GA/60
13.81 GFRel%
2.13 P/60
60.0 CF/60
51.44 CF%
0.38 CFRel%

Brassard
105GF
88GA
2.81 GF/60
2.35 GA/60
-1.66 GFRel%
1.84 P/60
57.14 CF/60
52.63 CF%
2.14 CFRel%

I think some people are underrating/undervaluing Stepan's importance to this team. Brassard is the more naturally skilled player, evidenced by draft position too, but that doesn't mean he will ever outproduce Stepan. Stepan has Brassard beat in everything from individual point production to team performance while they're on the ice, with the exception of puck possession. IT's amazing how Stepan and the team faired with him on the ice despite him being at best, an average puck possession player.

The only thing concerning for Stepan over this time period is that his 5v5 SV% is 95+. I am not convinced if this is an example of a player who is great defensively impacting his teams SV% (in contradiction conventional wisdom) over a smaller sample size, about 2 1/2 seasons. It's hard to imagine anything close to 95% SV% being sustainable. His GF/GA ratio is unbelievable due to this.

So, as others have said, you keep both players. Neither players are true #1C's in the NHL IMO. But, it's a great problem to have however with 2 great young borderline 1C's. And now the emergence of Kevin Hayes has made it an even more awesome problem.

The only thing that causes pause with me is playoff performance. You know you'll get defensive effort and some steady modest production from Stepan. It's clear to me that Brassard can transcend his game to a level that Stepan and most other players (Rick Nash) can't, come playoff time and score huge goals and go on a point production frenzy.

But, again, keep both.

 

[Placid]

Which one we should trade ? Thats an...ugly question to be honest

Both players have their positives and negatives (which has been laid out pretty thoroughly in this thread).

Ultimately, since this is a cap league... i am pretty sure that Steps demands on a new contract is going to scare the bejezus out of me. He has leverage, and he knows it (rather, his agent knows it). Brass is solidly locked up for another 4 (?) years.. so if we *had* to get rid of one, i'd probably go with Step, much as it pains me to say so...

Ideally.. we trade none of them

 

[chosen]

Absurd because you disagree with my opinion? Poor you.

How about ignoring my posts if you don't like what I say. I detailed my opinion fairly clearly, and if you can't respect it, move on and stop whining like you're known to do here.

What do you base your opinion on in regards to Brassard will continue to improve and Stepan won't?

 

[Vitto79]

Both

Definitely but if I had to choose its stepan

 

[Doctyl]

Definitely but if I had to choose its stepan

Agreed. I'd gut the defense and wings before trading one of these two.