Value of: JT Miller vaule and price set now that Nazem Kadri has signed with Flames.

[Jerzey Devil]

Vancouver:
1.) Is not currently good enough (they have enough talent that they could make playoffs, and potentially even win a round, but they're far from being a real threat to go far in the postseason). That means retaining the same core with no changes is clearly not a solution.
2.) The team lacks cap space.
3.) Has some good young pieces.
4.) The team lacks quality prospects.

Realistically, the team will need to move a good player or two to get itself out of a jam. I'd love to keep Miller, in a vacuum, but if the team chooses to do that, they should move Horvat.

How does Vancouver turn this team into a contender within 3-5 years to convince Petterson and Hughes to stay? They’d need roster players in return for whoever they trade not picks. Picks won’t get them any immediate help unless they flip them. They don’t have a very good prospect pool so it’s not like they’ll be getting much more help from youth over the next few years either. Seems like they’re more in a win now mode.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

How does Vancouver turn this team into a contender within 3-5 years to convince Petterson and Hughes to stay? They’d need roster players in return for whoever they trade not picks. Picks won’t get them any immediate help unless they flip them. They don’t have a very good prospect pool so it’s not like they’ll be getting much more help from youth over the next few years either. Seems like they’re more in a win now mode.

Win what exactly, now?

 

[racerjoe]

How does Vancouver turn this team into a contender within 3-5 years to convince Petterson and Hughes to stay? They’d need roster players in return for whoever they trade not picks. Picks won’t get them any immediate help unless they flip them. They don’t have a very good prospect pool so it’s not like they’ll be getting much more help from youth over the next few years either. Seems like they’re more in a win now mode.

Well... you would be wrong.

The team now has no place to improve from, as in no assets to do so, and no room to make now improvements.


However if they make a few key changes, and this includes a Miller trade where we get back a good young piece and shed some salary, in other places to make other moves its doable... still very hard and I think the deck is stacked against us, but much better odds than trying to win with what we have now.

 

[NYVanfan]

Well... you would be wrong.

The team now has no place to improve from, as in no assets to do so, and no room to make now improvements.


However if they make a few key changes, and this includes a Miller trade where we get back a good young piece and shed some salary, in other places to make other moves its doable... still very hard and I think the deck is stacked against us, but much better odds than trying to win with what we have now.

a competent top 4 right D would go miles to proberly balancing this team
ideally one in the mid 20s, so the window to win is a bit longer.
thats why the Miller trade talk -- he should be somewhere where they can win in the next 3 years.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

Well... you would be wrong.

The team now has no place to improve from, as in no assets to do so, and no room to make now improvements.


However if they make a few key changes, and this includes a Miller trade where we get back a good young piece and shed some salary, in other places to make other moves its doable... still very hard and I think the deck is stacked against us, but much better odds than trying to win with what we have now.

Boeser raise.
Miller raise.
Horvat raise.

Production? No raises.

Cap space? No gains. More bleeding, in fact.

What could go wrong?

 

[Jerzey Devil]

Win what exactly, now?

Try to turn the team into a contender asap.

Well... you would be wrong.

The team now has no place to improve from, as in no assets to do so, and no room to make now improvements.


However if they make a few key changes, and this includes a Miller trade where we get back a good young piece and shed some salary, in other places to make other moves its doable... still very hard and I think the deck is stacked against us, but much better odds than trying to win with what we have now.

I think if they trade Miller they should go for a good prospect, roster player, and 2nd or something. They need two impact players back.

But so far it really seems like they’ve fumbled the Miller trade. If it’s true they weren’t letting GM’s talk extension with him that was a big fail. Not sure I buy the Lou canceling a trade because the media found out crap though.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Sharks have 3 goalies.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

Sharks have 3 goalies.

Sir, this is an Arby’s

 

[racerjoe]

Boeser raise.
Miller raise.
Horvat raise.

Production? No raises.

Cap space? No gains. More bleeding, in fact.

What could go wrong?

They get in anything can happen right?

Try to turn the team into a contender asap.

I think if they trade Miller they should go for a good prospect, roster player, and 2nd or something. They need two impact players back.

But so far it really seems like they’ve fumbled the Miller trade. If it’s true they weren’t letting GM’s talk extension with him that was a big fail. Not sure I buy the Lou canceling a trade because the media found out crap though.

I mean my ideal return and I kind of mentioned it earlier would be something like Necas, Morrow and a 1st. Now I don't see the canes doing this, as it doesn't fit what their team has done, but something like that.

I think it is super hard to say too much right now on what is happening, the landscape seems to be super fluid, like I didn't guess anything like the Flames Panthers deal happening.

I also don't believe most of the rumours we have heard around Miller as since JR has taken over the media has got nothing right about this team beside Allvin being GM. Like hours before the Boeser deal we heard he was just going to accept his QO, or the NYI fiasco at the draft... I just don't think anything is being leaked from us right now.

 

[gritdash60]

Well someone is going to make him rich.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Hopefully atleast three more JT threads before pre season starts

 

[danteipp]

If Vancouver isn't allowing potential acquiring teams to talk extension with Miller, then they must know something.

Like that he wants to test free agency and/or has a limited amount of teams that he will extend with right now.

And odds are most of those teams that he would sign with are capped out.

If that is the case, it is very tough to trade Miller outside of a typical deadline deal where maybe you win him over, but more than likely he is a rental.

 

[andora]

I don't think 2/3 are really a thing.

For example and Canes fans don't @ me I as I have said in other threads I don't think you will trade for JT it doesn't fit your teams M/O.

Canes get JT Miller and a depth RD maybe Bouroughs?

Canucks get Bear, Necas, and a 1st or Morrow or something

That deal is a near wash in salary, as I think many deals will end up being that happen now.

So then miller as a rental?

What does carolina do 1,2,3 years from now to work 8+ million in

 

[Oblivion Beckons]

Miller is getting a contract closer to Zibanejad than to Kadri.

 

[DearDiary]

The interesting thing is the Flames being willing to move a 1st just to clear room to give 7 years to a 31 year-old.

The trade doesn't set the market but it flies in the face of the Miller commentary saying teams won't want to give value and pay a big contract for a 29 year old.

I don't understand your post, unless you're thinking the Canucks take a cap dump back?

 

[racerjoe]

So then miller as a rental?

What does carolina do 1,2,3 years from now to work 8+ million in

I believe The Canes should be at the all in point now. They have a bunch of good players who will all need raises soon, and a few guys a bit older. Their window should be the next few years. They should be going for it... but again if you read my post I specifically said the Canes WON'T do this, as it is NOT the M/O.

 

[andora]

I believe The Canes should be at the all in point now. They have a bunch of good players who will all need raises soon, and a few guys a bit older. Their window should be the next few years. They should be going for it... but again if you read my post I specifically said the Canes WON'T do this, as it is NOT the M/O.

Gotcha.. misread it

 

[Filthy Dangles]

IMO, Miller gives who ever trades for him, 4 or 5 years of solid 1st line center (80 to 100 points)

Now, who fits that need?

That is a pretty huge assumption...

Miller is younger and better than Kadri. He’s not signing the same deal as Naz.

Kadri is more of your traditional center, Miller is more of a winger/center hybrid. For a team that has a bonafide 1st line center but big hole at 2nd or even 3rd line center, I could see Kadri being valued more

 

[McSuper]

Isles maybe turning back to canucks?

View attachment 577895

Extended Miller same as Nazem Kadri 7 x 7... what you giving us !

Going by the title of the thread 1 has nothing to do with the other. An UFA signing doesn't set a value in a trade. It may set the value next year but I doubt it. This year is weird. Lots of decent players still unsigned. Cap is a premium so it hard for teams to clear cap to make a trade unless cap is being sent back

 

[zcaptain]

That is a pretty huge assumption...



Kadri is more of your traditional center, Miller is more of a winger/center hybrid. For a team that has a bonafide 1st line center but big hole at 2nd or even 3rd line center, I could see Kadri being valued more

Come on, you have to be kidding! Miller has way more value. Why? He is younger (3 years) and has scored more points than Kadri, by a substantial amount. Not to mention, far more versatile.

If you honestly think what you are saying is true.....lol..........you may be the only one on the planet.

as for you questioning his longevity...................... Miller has to play 4 seasons, which will be the same age as Kadri next year...............so what you are saying is Kadri's remaining 6 years will be crappy............Calgary hopes not!

 

[Paul4587]

That is a pretty huge assumption...



Kadri is more of your traditional center, Miller is more of a winger/center hybrid. For a team that has a bonafide 1st line center but big hole at 2nd or even 3rd line center, I could see Kadri being valued more

I may be off but I don’t think there’s a single GM that would value a 2C over a first liner winger. Unless that 2C is only playing on the second line because he’s behind another high end centre.

I take the winger who has scored at an 88 point pace the last three seasons combined and is 29 over the centre who has scored at at 70 point pace (which is largely inflated from one big year) the last three seasons combined and is 31.

 

[RandV]

I don't know if it would actually work out but considering the circumstances and what happened I wonder if the Isles don't circle back to Vancouver for Miller. Basically they were trying to sign Kadri, but had to move a contract then tried but failed to move Bailey. So... why can't Vancouver take Bailey to accommodate a Miller trade? Vancouver probably wouldn't want Bailey past this season and Isles probably will have a tough time with the increase cap Miller would need over Kadri, but it accomplishes what both teams now and the obstacles for next season aren't that great.

That still leaves the question of what gets a deal done for both sides. Isles obviously aren't going to trade Dobson here, but from what I know they don't have that much after him.

 

[Aqualung]

Again.... If Miller is willing to sign 7x7M, why would Vancouver move him? That's a great contract for him(Mind you I dont think he signs for 7M, closer to 8M).

The argument about "He doesn't fit our core" doesn't work when he's a player as good as he is(At least according to Canucks fans), if he's that good you do what you have to do to keep him and build around him. It's not like he's super old, still only 29. You trade Horvat and re-sign Miller, go with JT and Petey as the Top 6 Centers, with a combination of Boeser, Garland, Hoglander, Podkolzin, Mikheyev, and Kuzmenko as the Wingers in the Top 9.

I think GM/Prez rather have Horvat and EP as the top two centers and signing Miller likely means Canucks can’t keep Horvat. That said, if he was available at 7x7 I would sign him and figure out the Horvat thing later.

 

[CanucksSayEh]

I think GM/Prez rather have Horvat and EP as the top two centers and signing Miller likely means Canucks can’t keep Horvat. That said, if he was available at 7x7 I would sign him and figure out the Horvat thing later.

I hope we keep all 3 and deal a winger if needed. Only having 2 of them is sketchy, we get gutted if one is injured. With 2 of them being able to play wing, we can load up a line/top 6 when needed, and have the depth down the middle the rest of the time.

This season could be a good chance to see who is really expendable between Garland, BB, Kuz etc.

 

[lanceuppercut75]

I think Vancouver would like to ideally bring in a top pairing RHD with term in a deal where they send JT Miller extended out, but there might not be a fit. It would also require dumping Myers in a separate trade (for an overpaid forward with approx 2 years of term), which is hard with Myers' NTC. Going for a good player plus a first plus a prospect is probably more likely to happen and also more likely to create a bidding war.