Jonathan Woes

[BobbyJet]

Toews is awesome, never have to worry about a player that has the heart , character , compete level , that he does. He's played a hell of alot hockey in the time he's been in Chicago ( not including all the international play)

Well we're talking what, more than a year and a half of subpar play from Toews? Has he had a back issue that long? If so, gasp...I'd have a hard time thinking it won't be back. I'm not a doctor, but it seems like most people that get back problems don't ever fully get rid of them.

After the first occurrence, unless the injury is strictly muscle related, back issues generally don't just go away. They can come and go at random and can be aggravated if not given enough recuperative time. I wonder if that is what Jonny has gone through - I know Hossa has in the past. He also had some wrist issues last season as I recall, from all the hacking he takes playing in the trenches as he does. I wouldn't be surprised if he had both issues at the same time for a stint. That'll affect any player's performance.

 

[x Tame Impala]

He came back on Dec 13th.

30 games 11 goals 19 assists

He's been getting better over that span though.

Dec 9 GP 2 G 4 A
Jan 13 GP 3 G 7 A
Feb 8 GP 6 G 8 A

 

[Hawkaholic]

Well we're talking what, more than a year and a half of subpar play from Toews? Has he had a back issue that long? If so, gasp...I'd have a hard time thinking it won't be back. I'm not a doctor, but it seems like most people that get back problems don't ever fully get rid of them.

Most people aren't pro athletes.

Hossa had a back issue some years ago, haven't heard a word about them since, really.

 

[Hawkaholic]

FWIW, John Jaeckel wrote this in his blog this morning:

"I've heard since that at least since the World Cup, and up until a few weeks ago, there was an injury, to Toews back, that he had been playing through all season. But a few weeks ago, once the back healed up, Toews' game began to emerge,"

An injury was the only reasonable excuse. He didn't look the same no matter what it was.

Even if he had lost his offensive touch, he would still be a beast along the boards, and not hand over the puck as much as he was. If it were him losing a step, he would still be able to board battle and not lose pucks that are on his stick so easily.

I never bought the notion that he was done, or had lost a step. An injury was really the only reason for the drop off.

I thought he was fine last year, not the best Toews we have seen, but not the beginning of this year bad. Last year was more his line mates not finishing and having a revolving door on his wings. This year something looked completely off.

 

[piteus]

I don't think Toews was nearly as bad last year as he was at the start of this year.

Last year, Toews got his 28 goals as usual but his assist total feel with Hossa's down year and rotating LWs. He wasn't playing amazing, but I don't think he was playing poorly. He was still doing the other things that make him great when he wasn't scoring.

This year, he was losing puck battles and seemed to have lost a step at the beginning of the year. His play was much worse than last season, IMO.

I thought Toews struggled on and off last year. I know he was scoring goals, but he lacked jump. Something was off in his game.

This year, I thought he started off well without the results. It frustrated him ... further magnified by the constant change of both linemates. Then Toews fell off the cliff. In hindsight, his back must have certainly hurt in Nov and Dec. Hopefully, he stays healthy.

 

[Killer Boots Man]

This got me pretty amped up:

https://twitter.com/NHL/status/834255410794098690

Big man doing big things.

 

[Killer Boots Man]

Can we please change the name of this thread to something other than "Jonathan Woes"?

 

[bobbydigital]

I understand the criticism Toews received this season, he was playing poorly. But I don't understand the logic behind saying he's past his prime at 27.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I understand the criticism Toews received this season, he was playing poorly. But I don't understand the logic behind saying he's past his prime at 27.

Because there is no logic to saying that.

Just a lack of intelligence.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

I understand the criticism Toews received this season, he was playing poorly. But I don't understand the logic behind saying he's past his prime at 27.

I don't even understand the criticism...

Oh and the notion Toews is regressing at 27 is just asinine... That BS comes from anti-Toews "Hawks fans"...

You would think they would have learned by now?

 

[RememberTheRoar]

I don't even understand the criticism...

Oh and the notion Toews is regressing at 27 is just asinine... That BS comes from anti-Toews "Hawks fans"...

You would think they would have learned by now?

And that's why so many people pushed back against those "Hawks fans", their arguments were illogical given Toews' track record.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

When Toews plays like this he's head and shoulders the best player in the world.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

And that's why so many people pushed back against those "Hawks fans", their arguments were illogical given Toews' track record.

Well, they're still going to hate Toews no matter what....

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

When Toews plays like this he's head and shoulders the best player in the world.

Easy killer

 

[x Tame Impala]

Can we please change the name of this thread to something other than "Jonathan Woes"?

No never.

 

[Salvaged Ship]

So even with the horrible start on the season he now has 42 points in 50 GP. That's about a 66 pt season if he played 82 games. Is that around career average? I am not sure.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

Easy killer

It's true....

See, that is the true problem with Toews, he doesn't play like this all the time. People say he's overrated but he isn't when he plays this way.

Toews problem isn't his skill or what he's capable of, his problem is that he is inconsistent... He can go from being the best player in the world to being "average"... I will say this much tho - he is the best player in the world when it matters and that's what people take note of.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

So even with the horrible start on the season he now has 42 points in 50 GP. That's about a 66 pt season if he played 82 games. Is that around career average? I am not sure.

Yes, it is his career average.

Or close to it.... He's at .82 ppg this season (after being at .40 a few weeks ago), his career average is .87...

 

[topnotch]

So even with the horrible start on the season he now has 42 points in 50 GP. That's about a 66 pt season if he played 82 games. Is that around career average? I am not sure.

It's a little lower than his career average which is 71.4 points per 82. Given his horrible start to the season 66 per 82 is pretty good.

 

[Hawksfan2828]

It's a little lower than his career average which is 71.4 points per 82. Given his horrible start to the season 66 per 82 is pretty good.

His points per 82 doesn't do him any justice.....

How can you penalize a player for not producing in games he didn't play?

 

[x Tame Impala]

It's true....

See, that is the true problem with Toews, he doesn't play like this all the time. People say he's overrated but he isn't when he plays this way.

Toews problem isn't his skill or what he's capable of, his problem is that he is inconsistent... He can go from being the best player in the world to being "average"... I will say this much tho - he is the best player in the world when it matters and that's what people take note of.

He's never been the best in the world. His best season IMO was 2013 where he was a PPG shutdown, possession monster. Crosby is still better

 

[Hawksfan2828]

He's never been the best in the world. His best season IMO was 2013 where he was a PPG shutdown, possession monster. Crosby is still better

Not when Toews is scoring at the same rate or better he's not.... Isn't that always the "bench mark" isn't that the knock Toews gets? "he doesn't score enough"?..

I mean Toews does just about everything better than Crosby but score..

 

[topnotch]

His points per 82 doesn't do him any justice.....

How can you penalize a player for not producing in games he didn't play?

He's not being penalized. It's an extrapolation.

You mentioned 0.82 ppg. That is the same as 67.5 points per 82 games - what I provided; my previous post said 66 points per 82 which was a lazy mistake because I didn't check Toews current numbers closely enough.

Either way 0.823 points per game or 67.5 points per 82 is slightly lower than his current career averages of 0.871 ppg and 71.4 points per 82.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Not when Toews is scoring at the same rate or better he's not.... Isn't that always the "bench mark" isn't that the knock Toews gets? "he doesn't score enough"?..

I mean Toews does just about everything better than Crosby but score..

Toews is and never has been better than Crosby.

 

[x Tame Impala]

Not when Toews is scoring at the same rate or better he's not.... Isn't that always the "bench mark" isn't that the knock Toews gets? "he doesn't score enough"?..

I mean Toews does just about everything better than Crosby but score..

He does, except the "but score" aspect is pretty important and Crosby has always been much, much better at it.