Jets - General Rumour, Trade, Free Agent and Waiver Speculation - Part XXII

[Mortimer Snerd]

RoR is painting himself as a contentious customer, and I'm sure that Chevy won't touch someone like that, not after Alain Walsh and Pavelec, and especially one not under contract.

What he said + ROR wants a lot of money, is more attitude problem than Kane, is not the player Kane is and Kane is under a favourable contract for 4 more years.

 

[Guerzy]

I personally would try to get Strome over Brock. Higher upside imo. Produced very well while spliting time between the NHL this season and over a PPG in the AHL. Roll him and Scheif on a line. young enough at 20 to learn to play the wing and center, plus was trending around the same mark for point production with Mark.
JMO
if they are throwing him and their 5th out there as Jetabre was saying.

Strome + 5th would be a dream return for Byfuglien. That's not going to happen, though, in my opinion.

Now, you do a package deal of Kane + Byfuglien, gets the Islanders a top winger (for Tavares) and top offensive defenseman (as they missed the boat on Boyle) and have Strome + 5th coming back in some form of deal, and that may be something.

 

[ps241]

5th overall + Brock Nelson is something I would entertain if a Kane move was being discussed. Then trade Byfuglien in a deal for either a top 6 forward (Brayden Schenn has long been a top choice of mine) or in a deal like Ottawa did for Ryan last summer, a young/promising roster player (Silverberg) + top prospect (Noesen) + 1st round pick. Bobby Ryan, like Byfuglien, also had 2 years remaining on his deal. So I think we should ideally be able to get something similar if we don't go straight up young top 6 player like a Brayden Schenn (for example). Then sign a UFA or two and we may be alright. Though, much of these pieces are futures so... not sure which direction we would go, honestly..

It has me thinking. I do like Nelson and I am a big fan of the top 5 or 6 players in this draft. I know 4 years of contract for Kane feels like a long time but it will go by fast. If we don't let Evander get to his last year that means we have a 2 to 3 year window with him assuming he will want to go into free agency. It may seem like I am getting ahead of myself but our team is years away from contending and Evander has a contractual shelf life. Not panicking at all and he is a great asset but we have to keep the big picture in mind.

Although Strome and a 5th looks better (I would do that in a heartbeat) if the Isles did that it might set them back too much. They would be giving up their high 2011 1st round pick (with lots of restricted years left), plus their 5th overall this year (who looks like a great piece) and they don't have a 1st round in 2015? Not saying their 2015 pick is part of this deal but it is in the equation as far as the future of the Isles. You pick up 4 years of Evander Kane which is great but at what cost?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Brock Nelson.

For me, none of those little add ons (Mayfield, Pelech, Baily, etc) are enough with the pick to move Kane. We would be "hoping" the pick turns into a Kane, and it would likely take 3 years for that to happen.

The Islanders would have to add a guy like Nelson to the package. A young guy that can step in and contribute a portion of Kane's lost offense.

There was a report that the Islanders were interested in Clitsome. I'd package up Kane and Clitsome for the 5th and Nelson myself (or something else in that range of value). But I may like Nelson more than some on this board. I don't want to even trade Kane at all, but that just shows how I view Nelson.

The pick + Nelson + ?? for Kane alone. If Clitsome were added that ?? would have to go up to something quite significant.

 

[Aavco Cup]

If the Isles don't make the playoffs, Snow won't be the one worrying about the 2015 draft. He has to win now.

 

[garret9]

I'm sure part of the ROR fiasco is not liking the team not being able to agree to terms prior to lockout, and thus leaving him financially stranded.

 

[tacogeoff]

Strome + 5th would be a dream return for Byfuglien. That's not going to happen, though, in my opinion.

Now, you do a package deal of Kane + Byfuglien, gets the Islanders a top winger (for Tavares) and top offensive defenseman (as they missed the boat on Boyle) and have Strome + 5th coming back in some form of deal, and that may be something.

My bad I missunderstood Jetabre. I thought they were saying Strome + 5th for Kane on the trade boards. I would take that over Brock + 5th for Kane in a heart beat.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

5th overall + Brock Nelson is something I would entertain if a Kane move was being discussed. Then trade Byfuglien in a deal for either a top 6 forward (Brayden Schenn has long been a top choice of mine) or in a deal like Ottawa did for Ryan last summer, a young/promising roster player (Silverberg) + top prospect (Noesen) + 1st round pick. Bobby Ryan, like Byfuglien, also had 2 years remaining on his deal. So I think we should ideally be able to get something similar if we don't go straight up young top 6 player like a Brayden Schenn (for example). Then sign a UFA or two and we may be alright. Though, much of these pieces are futures so... not sure which direction we would go, honestly..

It is really intriguing how the possibilities start to multiply as soon as one significant player gets traded. I wonder if GMs get any sleep at all this time of year.

 

[Guerzy]

It is really intriguing how the possibilities start to multiply as soon as one significant player gets traded. I wonder if GMs get any sleep at all this time of year.

I wondered this earlier this morning. .. It's gotta just be a nutty time of year to be a GM. They probably spend 95% of their day on the phone/email.

 

[Jetabre]

My bad I missunderstood Jetabre. I thought they were saying Strome + 5th for Kane on the trade boards. I would take that over Brock + 5th for Kane in a heart beat.

I saw one Islanders fan suggest Kane for 5th + Strome, most of the fans threw the idea under the bus, but the fact one fan suggested it is a positive to me.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Strome + 5th would be a dream return for Byfuglien. That's not going to happen, though, in my opinion.

Now, you do a package deal of Kane + Byfuglien, gets the Islanders a top winger (for Tavares) and top offensive defenseman (as they missed the boat on Boyle) and have Strome + 5th coming back in some form of deal, and that may be something.

If we included Buff we would definitely need more than the 5th + Strome. Even 5th + Strome + Nelson would be a little light. Might be getting interestingly close though.

 

[ps241]

Strome + 5th would be a dream return for Byfuglien. That's not going to happen, though, in my opinion.

Now, you do a package deal of Kane + Byfuglien, gets the Islanders a top winger (for Tavares) and top offensive defenseman (as they missed the boat on Boyle) and have Strome + 5th coming back in some form of deal, and that may be something.

Strome + Nelson + 5th (goodbye future ) for Kane and Buff?


Our future 2015-2016 line up:

Ladd-Scheifele-Little
Dal Colle-Strome-Wheeler
Larkin-Nelson-Frolik
O'Dell-Lowry-Lipon

Of course that is not how it would look exactly and you might need to mix in a FA or two. You would still have Kosmo and Petan in the oven cooking. Scheif and Strome could compete for the #1 spot. Larkin actually plays centre so you have Scheif, Strome, Nelson, Larkin, Lowry, Little, and O'Dell as centers.

This mix has lots of talent in the restricted years so I think it could be pretty cap friendly and allow some investment in our D core.

 

[Guerzy]

Strome + Nelson + 5th (goodbye future ) for Kane and Buff?


Our future 2015-2016 line up:

Ladd-Scheifele-Little
Dal Colle-Strome-Wheeler
Larkin-Nelson-Frolik
O'Dell-Lowry-Lipon

Of course that is not how it would look exactly and you might need to mix in a FA or two. You would still have Kosmo and Petan in the oven cooking. Scheif and Strome could compete for the #1 spot. Larkin actually plays centre so you have Scheif, Strome, Nelson, Larkin, Lowry, Little, and O'Dell as centers.

This mix has lots of talent in the restricted years so I think it could be pretty cap friendly and allow some investment in our D core.

It certainly has part of the makings of an intriguing deal, I think. Especially when you consider the Islanders wants/needs and where they are as an organization (looking to "win" now). I'm no Islanders fan so I could be wrong, but from the outside looking in I would think Kane (top winger for Tavares) and Byfuglien (top defenseman, offensively one of the best in the NHL) would peak their interests. And both are signed for the next 2-4 seasons so they're guaranteed some time here. Enough so to do a deal like this? honestly who knows. Food for thought, though, and fun to talk about this time of year.

 

[Jetabre]

From what I've seen, Islander fans don't want Byfuglien at all, but really want Kane.

 

[VictoriaJetsFan]

This is an excellent plan Mr. Guerzy...pretty much exactly what you want going into 15-16..one big group of amazing young talent coming together with few holes left on the roster and no young prospects rushed..I would happily sacrifice 14-15 for the bigger picture...great plan.

 

[Guerzy]

From what I've seen, Islander fans don't want Byfuglien at all, but really want Kane.

Ya? ok, interesting.

But... would Garth Snow want Byfuglien? .. I kind of think so with Garth being Garth. They need a top offensive defenseman, Byfuglien ranks atop the entire league there. Hamonic is their #1 guy on the right side, Byfuglien could slot in as the #2 on the second pairing, right side. He's got a Stanley Cup on his resume. And, he's locked up for the next 2 seasons, so he's a guaranteed player there.

This is all if Byfuglien would waive his NTC to go to the Isles. He can select 5 teams in which he cannot be traded to.

 

[Jetabre]

Ya? ok, interesting.

But... would Garth Snow want Byfuglien? .. I kind of think so with Garth being Garth. They need a top offensive defenseman, Byfuglien ranks atop the entire league there. Hamonic is their #1 guy on the right side, Byfuglien could slot in as the #2 on the second pairing, right side. He's got a Stanley Cup on his resume. And, he's locked up for the next 2 seasons, so he's a guaranteed player there.

This is all if Byfuglien would waive his NTC to go to the Isles. He can select 5 teams in which he cannot be traded to.

I actually thought Byfuglien was someone they could really want as well, but their fans seem to hold alot of faith in their defensive prospects, and personally I know not how their defence prospects look as far as making the jump into the NHL so I can't really comment on that part.

But it seems the fans are willing to be more patient, where Garth I can definitely see being in a more win now mode.

 

[ps241]

It certainly has part of the makings of an intriguing deal, I think. Especially when you consider the Islanders wants/needs and where they are as an organization (looking to "win" now). I'm no Islanders fan so I could be wrong, but from the outside looking in I would think Kane (top winger for Tavares) and Byfuglien (top defenseman, offensively one of the best in the NHL) would peak their interests. Enough so to do a deal like this? honestly who knows. Food for though, though and fun to talk about this time of year.

Yea we have a bit too much time on our hands before the draft so why not have fun. Isles would have to feel the need to win now to pull off that trade and I just don't see it. We certainly take the unproven talent risk but it’s a 3 for 2 deal and we get younger and add good pedigree. At least we would be asset stacking around a core while keeping some veterans in the mix.

Our young core would be:

Scheifele 21, Strome 21, Dalle Colle 18, Larkin 18, Trouba 20, Morrissey 19, Nelson 22 Bogosian 23. Plus you have the prospect group to support.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Our young core would be:

Scheifele 21, Strome 21, Dalle Colle 18, Larkin 18, Trouba 20, Morrissey 19, Nelson 22 Bogosian 23. Plus you have the prospect group to support.

Chevy at the season end presser did mention the phrase "expand the core" several times.

 

[Jetabre]

Yea we have a bit too much time on our hands before the draft so why not have fun. Isles would have to feel the need to win now to pull off that trade and I just don't see it. We certainly take the unproven talent risk but it’s a 3 for 2 deal and we get younger and add good pedigree. At least we would be asset stacking around a core while keeping some veterans in the mix.

Our young core would be:

Scheifele 21, Strome 21, Dalle Colle 18, Larkin 18, Trouba 20, Morrissey 19, Nelson 22 Bogosian 23. Plus you have the prospect group to support.

Not to mention whoever we get from the 2015 draft after sucking even more for a year from losing Buff and Kane. Our core would be looking mighty fine like this.

 

[Huffer]

You're reading my mind.

If it's a deal built around Kane for the Isles 5th, Nelson is the guy that has to be coming back. Cizikas doesn't interest me in the slightest, he's a meh 4th liner with perhaps a bit of upside.

I would definitely do that deal you mentioned involving Clitsome. Interesting to hear about the Isles interest in him, do you know if that was prior to his back surgery? Postma is another guy we could send their way in that trade. Honestly though, I think Kane for Nelson + 5th is pretty close to even.

It's really only Eklund, so take that for what it's worth:

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Eklund/Two-Metro-Teams-Interested-in-Clitsome/1/60228

Strome + 5th would be a dream return for Byfuglien. That's not going to happen, though, in my opinion.

Now, you do a package deal of Kane + Byfuglien, gets the Islanders a top winger (for Tavares) and top offensive defenseman (as they missed the boat on Boyle) and have Strome + 5th coming back in some form of deal, and that may be something.

I think we are talking about Kane for 5th plus Nelson here Guerzy, not Buff. I think with Kane it's a pretty good deal for us, Buff seems unrealistic IMO.

It has me thinking. I do like Nelson and I am a big fan of the top 5 or 6 players in this draft. I know 4 years of contract for Kane feels like a long time but it will go by fast. If we don't let Evander get to his last year that means we have a 2 to 3 year window with him assuming he will want to go into free agency. It may seem like I am getting ahead of myself but our team is years away from contending and Evander has a contractual shelf life. Not panicking at all and he is a great asset but we have to keep the big picture in mind.

Although Strome and a 5th looks better (I would do that in a heartbeat) if the Isles did that it might set them back too much. They would be giving up their high 2011 1st round pick (with lots of restricted years left), plus their 5th overall this year (who looks like a great piece) and they don't have a 1st round in 2015? Not saying their 2015 pick is part of this deal but it is in the equation as far as the future of the Isles. You pick up 4 years of Evander Kane which is great but at what cost?

I don't really know if the Isles would be good with Nelson let alone Strome TBH. (They wouldn't be good with either according to their fans on HF ). Strome may have some higher upside, but Nelson is looking pretty good too. He's bigger, a little further along at the moment, and many Islander fans have him as possibly JT's winger on the 1st line next season. He was pretty good in the WC's as well.

I might take flak for this, but if it came down to it, and someone unforeseen was at 5 (say some combination of the Panthers moving and taking Nylander, the Flames taking Ritchie, etc), and you have a guy like Sam Bennett sitting there, I would probably move Kane and our 9th for the 5th and Nelson. I think Nelson could give you 70% or more of Kane's production next year, and the difference between a Bennett and a guy we're likely to get at 9 could be significant.

Now I don't know why the Isles would be willing to move their 1st to try to get better immediately, but would want a pick back as part of the deal. They'd probably want a roster player instead of the 9th. But that's something I would probably do from a "value" perspective. As Guerzy posted, maybe replace the 9th with Buff, but get something back like a Cizikas.

Kane + Buff

For

Nelson + 5th (only if it's a faller like a Bennett) + Cizikas

That's a pretty aggressive trade for the Jets IMO. We'd be worse next year swapping Kane and Buff for Nelson and Cizikas. But we'd be younger and cheaper, and if the Jets used some of the massive cap and salary savings (10.42 - 2(guess) = 8.42 extra to spend) on another player the team could be the same or even better. Plus, they would be adding Bennett (which is why I would even be thinking about it) and heaven help us if someone else "drops" to 9 like an Ehlers?

The Islanders would be a better team next year for sure (if that's their motivation). Even if Nelson could put up 70% of Kane, the pick isn't going to be in the NHL, and Buff is going to be a massive improvement to their record over Cizikas. Their only downside is if Nelson develops closer to Kane, and the loss of the pick (which is compensated by Buff, who they could re-sign, of flip in two deadlines).

Try not to rip me apart too much, considering the trades we see in then NHL these days, this is pretty pie in the sky stuff. Just throwing it out there for fun discussion purposes.

Strome + Nelson + 5th (goodbye future ) for Kane and Buff?


Our future 2015-2016 line up:

Ladd-Scheifele-Little
Dal Colle-Strome-Wheeler
Larkin-Nelson-Frolik
O'Dell-Lowry-Lipon

Of course that is not how it would look exactly and you might need to mix in a FA or two. You would still have Kosmo and Petan in the oven cooking. Scheif and Strome could compete for the #1 spot. Larkin actually plays centre so you have Scheif, Strome, Nelson, Larkin, Lowry, Little, and O'Dell as centers.

This mix has lots of talent in the restricted years so I think it could be pretty cap friendly and allow some investment in our D core.

Of course you posted this after my long winded one.

If we could get your deal, I would take it in a second. I think it's asking a lot though IMO.

 

[Huffer]

The pick + Nelson + ?? for Kane alone. If Clitsome were added that ?? would have to go up to something quite significant.

Personally I think you're underrating Nelson and overrating Clitsome, but that's just me.

 

[Flair Hay]

The only reason the Isles are considering moving the 5th is because of the NHL ready prospects they have.

I doubt they would trade the 5th AND any of Nelson/Strome/whoever.

We'd be looking more at 5th + Grabner IMO

 

[Huffer]

The only reason the Isles are considering moving the 5th is because of the NHL ready prospects they have.

I doubt they would trade the 5th AND any of Nelson/Strome/whoever.

We'd be looking more at 5th + Grabner IMO

I'd agree that that would be what the Islanders would want. Don't see how it works for the Jets though. We have to hope that the 5th turns out to be as good as Kane in two years, and Grabner isn't much of an enticing placeholder in those two years (and then is UFA) to make the risk worthwhile IMO.

 

[VictoriaJetsFan]

While packaging Buff and Kane would be really tough..a Kane to NYI deal for Strome and a fifth would be superb.

Either that or the Kane to Pittsburgh trade for Maata and a first.

Or the Buff to Detroit for Tatar/Jurco and a 1st.

Either scenario gives us 2 2014 1st's, two 2015 1st's and two strong young players.

This is a prospect pool that could win the Stanley Cup...sit all the 19 year olds in junior, play Pavelec next year and we can draft Hanifan to be Jacob Trouba's partner for the next 100 years.