Jake Gardiner 2.0 - More beast than man now, I am afraid...

[Joey Hoser]

Many top pairing defenseman make the same mistakes Gards does. They just aren't focused on so heavily.

Not to equate the two, but I'm sure if we watched Doughty play 400 games, we'd pick up on some habitual shortcomings in his game that **** us off once in awhile.

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Because he is part of our team and people seem to be putting him down for some reason[ (mainly because Jake has looked better than his usual boneheaded self)

Uh, huh. Serious question: Are you aware of what irony is?

 

[pheasant]

Someone should make a bad cut-and-paste photoshop of Rielly and Gardiner over a 'Beauty and the Beast' picture. Call it Rielly and the Beast!

 

[theIceWookie]

Not to equate the two, but I'm sure if we watched Doughty play 400 games, we'd pick up on some habitual shortcomings in his game that **** us off once in awhile.

That's my point, and we had similar issues with Phaneuf. He became a whipping boy and people micro-analyzed every move. It's the same thing that happens often with highly regarded prospects going into their draft year. They get so focused on, that people start to just expect their strengths and start micro-analyzing their weaknesses.

It doesn't mean they are perfect, or don't have issues, but they are often overblown in that regard.

Gardiner is by no means on the same level as Doughty, but he absolutely gets unfairly analyzed often.

 

[theIceWookie]

People on this forum have a weird idea of what makes a top pairing or #1 defenseman. It would seem we need a player who:

-never makes positional errors
-never gets beaten 1-on-1
-never loses a board battle
-throws bone crunching hits
-is never the victim of an unlucky bounce

Look around the league at guys who are not only top pairing d-men, not only #1s, but considered franchise defensemen. Let's say Karlsson, Doughty, Subban, Weber, Chara 3+ years ago, Suter. They get beaten sometimes. They screw up routine plays once in a while. They gamble for offense, sometimes when they shouldn't. They play the most minutes against the best players, of course they get bested sometimes.

These guys would be shredded on this forum if they played for the Leafs. Chara's performane the year Boston won the Cup would have made him trade-bait.

There are no flawless defensemen. So how much more do you need Gardiner to do before you think he's worth his mistakes? The guy has shown he's capable of 26+ minutes/game against top competition. He's shown he can drive offense, from his own zone or the opponents' blueline.

He reminds me more and more of Kaberle, if Kaberle had been more willing to use his wicked slapper. Not overly physical, but solid positionally and with great stick-work. Takes few penalties. Is such a smooth skater that some people think he's not putting in enough effort. High-end breakout playmaker, excels under pressure and in big games. He even has Kaberle's great ability to look off his pass targets, though Gardiner could learn a thing or two from Kaberle about head/body fakes.

It's classic grass is greener logic. People spend so much time focusing on Gardiner, that they think that other dmen who are "good" don't make the msitakes that he makes. They essentially hold the position that a number one dmen must be perfect and never make mistakes, and a number two rarely makes them.

 

[bunjay]

That's my point, and we had similar issues with Phaneuf. He became a whipping boy and people micro-analyzed every move.

If we're talking about this board specifically, I think it was more the opposite. People were looking for reasons to praise Phaneuf. Lots of excuses were made for him.

There was no micro-analysis necessary. He's very slow, and with his bad foot speed he can't make the big hits he was famous for. He peaked offensively in his early 20s and has declined ever since.

 

[thewave]

If we're talking about this board specifically, I think it was more the opposite. People were looking for reasons to praise Phaneuf. Lots of excuses were made for him.

There was no micro-analysis necessary. He's very slow, and with his bad foot speed he can't make the big hits he was famous for. He peaked offensively in his early 20s and has declined ever since.

Dion is still a good defender and has been great for Ottawa. The guy was not a 7m defender though. 5m and I take the guy back for a few years.

Jake, when going is an amazing D. Rielly is the same and I hope they continue this current level of play. If Z comes back and is just good and whoever the other 3 are play their best we have a chance this series. We have a shot.

 

[Macallan18]

If we're talking about this board specifically, I think it was more the opposite. People were looking for reasons to praise Phaneuf. Lots of excuses were made for him.

There was no micro-analysis necessary. He's very slow, and with his bad foot speed he can't make the big hits he was famous for. He peaked offensively in his early 20s and has declined ever since.

I have to say I was never a Phaneuf fan here in Toronto. He seems to have picked it up a bit in Ottawa. Saw too many games where he put in a very half-hearted effort after he was beaten on a play. Just the wrong attitude here.

 

[Myopic]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

 

[LeafingTheWay]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

Andersen on for both goals. Same old Leafs goalies.

 

[Gallagbi]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

Not really the right year to harp on +/, pal

 

[Slyfox]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

It was Zaitsevs fault on both goals

 

[TheMadHatTrick]

Not really the right year to harp on +/, pal

All of a sudden +/- is meaningful again when it suits the narrative.

Jake is even now for what it's worth.

GO LEAFS! (i.e. the whole team in case it even needs to be said. lol)

 

[kihei]

I thought as the game went on, he got better and better.

 

[ironrhcp]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

Zaitsev is a minus machine. Too bad they had to put Jake with this dud. Guy is not NHL caliber.Firs ****ing game in after 2 shifts the kid is -2. And -23 on the year. They have to put him with Jake so that hes not a liability. To bad Polak is out. Much rather have Polak > Zaitsev

 

[A1LeafNation]

It was Zaitsevs fault on both goals

Agreed. But I can give him a pass because it was his first couple shifts of playoff hockey.

 

[Commander Clueless]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

Hard not to be, considering he plays most of the game.

 

[1specter]

Zaitsev is a minus machine. Too bad they had to put Jake with this dud. Guy is not NHL caliber.Firs ****ing game in after 2 shifts the kid is -2. And -23 on the year. They have to put him with Jake so that hes not a liability. To bad Polak is out. Much rather have Polak > Zaitsev

someone's been watching too much don cherry

 

[LondonKendrick]

Nice to see Jake winning over the haters.

JVR, Bozak and Gardiner have been great down the stetch, if these are the whipping boys of this market we're pretty spoiled.

 

[MorrisSmit89]

Zaitsev is a minus machine. Too bad they had to put Jake with this dud. Guy is not NHL caliber.Firs ****ing game in after 2 shifts the kid is -2. And -23 on the year. They have to put him with Jake so that hes not a liability. To bad Polak is out. Much rather have Polak > Zaitsev

lmaoo.. plus/minus

 

[WillNyeTheHockeyGuy]

Zaitsev is a minus machine. Too bad they had to put Jake with this dud. Guy is not NHL caliber.Firs ****ing game in after 2 shifts the kid is -2. And -23 on the year. They have to put him with Jake so that hes not a liability. To bad Polak is out. Much rather have Polak > Zaitsev

Plus/minus are not the stats they refer to when they need analytics... Zaitsev's been one of our top 2 defensemen this season. He gave up 2 goals on his first shift in his first playoff game at home after a concussion. Relax and learn to watch hockey. Holy Dart Guy.

 

[Jyrki Lumme]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

The irony of this post and your username is too much,

 

[Bluelines]

Gardiner on for both goals. Same old Gardiner.

-2

Despite Jakes best effort to give away the game, Kadri had a monster of a game and stole victory away from Jake and Washington.

Hopefully Jake will show up at least one game this series and help out his brothers. Man he was horrid last night. #jakemistakes #flakeyjakey

 

[The Magic Man]

Jake and Rielly have taken a huge step forward this series. It's amazing to see this transition. I can't wait to see how they play next year. This whole team has grown and we'll be better for it next year no matter what happens now.

 

[Nithoniniel]

Despite Jakes best effort to give away the game, Kadri had a monster of a game and stole victory away from Jake and Washington.

Hopefully Jake will show up at least one game this series and help out his brothers. Man he was horrid last night. #jakemistakes #flakeyjakey

Are you serious?

I mean, I get that you don't like the guy. But you have to be kidding with this post?