Whoever voted Laine, I ask you this.
Hypothetical Question here:
If this season they switched place.
If the lines are On Buffalo and WInnipeg this year....
Connor Scheifele Wheeler
Ehlers Eichel Perrault
And now Eichel gets everything Laine got so less ice time but Eichel now goes on the PP's that Jets give him and now plays with high end offensive talent, who are a fast and high offensive team with meaningful games to play motivating him more.
Meanwhile Laine takes Eichel;s place on Buffalo, last place team in standings and goals for.
Laine is now centered by Zemges Girgensons and Jason Pominville on the other wing. Laine gets Eichel;s ice-time and plays for the Sabres who don't score and a bad PP< with awful goaltending, defense, new coach, team that has hard time winning or anything to play for.
Laine ALSO only gets to play the amount of games Eichel played last year and this year.
Okay so now.
WIth those two situations.
What happens? Are you suggesting Eichel doesen't so as good? He by all means should do better in that environment.
But what about Laine? Does he producde the same, as a sniper you need good playmakers creating room, especially on the PP where a large number of his pts come from.
Does Laine do as good? I don't know.
Then there's the whole Center vs WING thing.
So taking this situation into context, can you see who would likely be more valuable ?
I can.
But even as it stands now in real life, in these opposite situations, EICHEL STILL averages a higher PPG in the past two seasons Laine has played do on a role reversal which would steer both mens directions further I do believe, should more-so show the better player.
I mean it's hypothetical so.... not concrete, just mere speculation so I can't conclusively say who'd be better but again I have a pretty strong idea backed by the logistics of the situation presented.
That's great to hear that you are happy with the pick and you should be. I've seen some games yes as I follow up on Ristolainen time to time so it's pretty difficult not paying attention to Eichel on the process.
I absolutely take in count everything when evaluation or comparing players. Starting from ice time to line mates and then of course age. I've read a few of your posts where you ignore the age difference entirely and that's not the proper way of comparing two young kids. Just like it would be unfair to compare Laine's 17-18 season to lets say Rantanen's 17-18 season, because they are year apart from one another. You can just look what they accomplished at what age. So if one thinks the two are close to one another right now, it's the next year of Laine that should be compared to Eichel's 17-18 as opposed to looking at Eichel and Laine today. If you take Eichel's two first seasons, then look at Laine's two first seasons, I just don't see it particularly close.
Also it's quite correct that one plays in a powerhouse and the other in a bottom feeder. However it's incorrect to claim that Laine would somehow have an insane benefit from the deep Jets roster. He's not playing in the first line that gets the minutes and the only times he's getting any advantage from Scheifele or Wheelers is on the powerplay. Where as the Sabres are build around Eichel. I cannot but imagine if the Jets already built around Laine instead of Scheifele/Wheeler. There's little to no doubt in my mind he would be a PPG+ player and possibly even already competing with the very best players in the league in total production (imagine a line of Laine - Scheifele - Wheelers for instance). But no, he was kept at the bay with minimal/average ice time and had a center he had absolutely zero chemistry with and one that isn't exactly known for his excellent playmaking abilities (just look at Little's assist totals from the past seasons even when he played in the first line). I think the fact of one playing 20+ minutes compared to other's 16+ minutes on average, more than compensates any difference created by the team disadvantage.
Laine isn't just a sniper. He has terrific hockey IQ and vision and I've said it many times over that it's his hockey IQ that has enabled him to have the early success in his career, despite of lots of fans who only see him as the shooter. No player could achieve anything of this magnitude (at every level he has ever played at) if he was only equipped with similar scoring arsenal. This kid hasn't even fully grown into his 6"5 frame just yet, but once he does, he will set the league on fire. His resume speaks on his own behalf, all the way from FEL to international ice and finally the NHL. No one has anything similar in their pockets. Laine's success at all of the three mentioned (FEL, international and NHL) has been historical, and he has yet but to scratch the surface. So no, I would not look back on that decision.
Eichel is a different type of player relying on different strengths and great by his own right, but so far looking at age to age achievements in hockey I don't see him being on the same level. Will it remain that way? I don't have the crystal ball to make bold statement there. Anyway, both of them are future faces of the NHL and I'm sure any team would give king's ransoms just to get even one of them.
It is close.
Fair post, I can see your points.
They are totally different players on totally different teams.
I think with Laine's production and the lack of coverage majority get to Eichel (not helped by last placed team or injuries) but we'd be talking about a 75 pt season last year and possibly 85-90 this year if he didn't miss.
had he reached those the results would be different in how see both guys.
So far Matthews this season is having the exact season Eichel had last year in his 2nd season. Same PPG, almost identical.
Matthews may be better defensively and play a few minutes less a game, but has more offensive talent on his team also (and a team that has more to play for and scores more) while Eichel team has next to no motivation and while he averages a few more minutes then Matthews, Eichel has to go up against ALL the best forward checkers (shutdown lines) and best defenders.
This is where LAINE and Matthews have an easier advantage in this regard. Both these teams can roll different Leafs and Jets lines against top defenders, where-as On Buffalo it's THE ROR against maybe the top scorers, but the best two way guys, shutdown players (two way centres) and best defenders play against Eichel.
Meanwhile Laine gets tons of PP points with some amazing gifted offensive players. I'm not trying to say it's just his SHOT, I just mean that's the most noticeable differenceand asset he has..., he's also got a great skillset, his EIchel also has (obviously) an amazing Hockey IQ, he's a better skater, and overall the atrributes favour Eichel if we're going to comopare the 20-25 most important traits a forward should have.
Eichel has 46 EVEN Strength points this year in just 63 games! Not only that but 44 of the 62 pts he's scored this year in just 63 games have been PRIMARY points.
It's just a lot of things back and forth for both guys you can say.
There's arguments to be made for both, they;re in the same tier.
I just think if Buffalo got better and EIchel played at least the amount Laine plays which is around 75ish games on average, we'd see way more from EIchel, but the point is what we're seeing already especially given the circumstances is mega impressive.
That being said I enjoy both guys a great deal and think they will be two of the most important forwards each and every year for the next 15 seasons.
