Prospect Info: Isles Prospect Talk PART XI

[xECK29x]

Haha, I was just going to inquire about the Prospect camp. I'd love to go this year.

I will be definitely going to the prospect game this year. Would love to do a board meetup

 

[PWJunior]

I will be definitely going to the prospect game this year. Would love to do a board meetup

We can fight over who's the better prospect, Wahlstrom vs. Dobson. I love @SI90 and all, but his ass is going down.

 

[doublechili]

That was quite a haul for the Isles. Dobson, in particular, was a surprise to me he fell that far.

On a random note, that reaction from that Montreal fan in the stands when they called Kotkaniemi's name was hilarious.

Ironically, that was Bergevin's mother.

 

[seafoam]

What do you think about trading for Sam Bennett? He could use a change of scenery.

I do agree that Bennett could benefit from a change of scenery.

However, he’s primarily a LW at this point in his career, which isn’t a huge need for this club, so unless it was a 1 for 1 swap (say Nelson), my focus would be elsewhere.

Also, I don’t think Nelson would really entice them to move the former 4th overall pick, who has one year left on a cheap bridge deal, and is looking to come into next season and prove to Calgary’s new coach that he’s got a spot on the team.

For me, Nelson has kind of settled into what he is, while the jury is still out on Bennett (plus Bennett plays with more jam than Nelson).

 

[Konk]

The strengths of our system mirror this draft, wingers and defensemen.

Taking a peek to next year's draft, it's chock full of high end center prospects.

That is one thing I love about the fact that we landed Dobson, not just because he's the 2nd best D behind Dahlin, but we were able to tap into the strength of the class. If JT walks, next year provides us with an opportunity to give Barzal a #1B centerman moving forward with that ridiculous class of pivots.

 

[periferal]

I went and looked it up right after. Her reactions are so over the top and dramatic that if she was an actress I wouldn't be surprised. If we can get a billboard, maybe Habs fans hired her to react to Bergevin's ineptitude.

 

[Bronson]

FALSE FLAG OPERATION!

 

[periferal]

I know we are going to be doing the top prospect poll soon. But here is my post draft top 10

1. Wahlstrom
2. Sorokin
3. Dobson
4. Bellows
5. Wilde
6. Toews
7. Vande Sompel
8. Aho
9. Soderstrom
10. Dal Colle

I have MDC in my top 10 because he's got one year left to prove himself . Maybe he improves his game and produces well in the AHL.

We have a nice crop after my top 10.
Iskhakov, Golyshev, Wotherspoon, Quenneville, Skarek, Mireageas, Cockerill, Salo. Can't forget Yannick Rathgreb who produced well in the Swiss league and is only 23.

Ranking prospects is cool, but we should add another layer and that is saying which prospects have a realistic shot of becoming regular NHLers. Usually outside the top 5-7 guys I see so much debate if this guy is better than that guy...When neither of them are going to make it so in that case it really doesn't matter.

 

[periferal]

Now that the draft is over, I hope LL sends everyone in scouting and player development packing.

Under the Snow era, the Sound Tigers have been a joke. Our player development has been mediocre at best.

The entire system needs to be flushed out.

I completely agree that the scouting department/development system needs to be totally overhauled. After signing JT it's literally the most important thing.

What's amazing is how, under snow, the drafts have been better AFTER the top-10. When you think about the blown picks in the top-10 (Reinhart, Dal Colle, Strome, and trading Nino for a 4th liner), it's embarrassing to have that much draft capital, and John Tavares, and still be missing the playoffs years later.

If we hot on those picks the Isles might even be a Cup contender now, and Tavares would probably be resigned already.

So once again...The scouting department/development system need to be completely gutted and rebuild ASAP.

 

[Jester9881]

1. Wahlstrom
2. Dobson/Bellows tied
4. Sorokin
5. Wilde
6. Toews
7. Soderstrom
8. Iskhakov
9. Aho
10. Wotherspoon

 

[Islesfan22]

That is one thing I love about the fact that we landed Dobson, not just because he's the 2nd best D behind Dahlin, but we were able to tap into the strength of the class. If JT walks, next year provides us with an opportunity to give Barzal a #1B centerman moving forward with that ridiculous class of pivots.

I know you weren't really high on Wilde but was the based mostly on his poor under 18's for team USA?

 

[seafoam]

I don’t see Wilde becoming anything more than a Cody Franson type to be honest.

 

[saintunspecified]

I do agree that Bennett could benefit from a change of scenery.

However, he’s primarily a LW at this point in his career, which isn’t a huge need for this club, so unless it was a 1 for 1 swap (say Nelson), my focus would be elsewhere.

Ah, didn't realize he was shifted to the wing full time.

 

[periferal]

I don’t see Wilde becoming anything more than a Cody Franson type to be honest.

Because...?

And if Wilde, or any 2-7 round pick, becomes a regular NHLer that is a success.

 

[seafoam]

Because...?

And if Wilde, or any 2-7 round pick, becomes a regular NHLer that is a success.

Because of his lack of hockey IQ.

Wilde to me is the classic case of “tools, but no toolbox”. Luckily, these guys tend to have big trade value while they are still prospects, so I’m confident Wilde will help this organization in some fashion down the road.

 

[periferal]

Because of his lack of hockey IQ.

Wilde to me is the classic case of “tools, but no toolbox”. Luckily, these guys tend to have big trade value while they are still prospects, so I’m confident Wilde will help this organization in some fashion down the road.

And that's all I ask for...Be an asset either on the ice or in a trade. If the #41 pick becomes something more valuable down the line then that is a success.

 

[PWJunior]

That is one thing I love about the fact that we landed Dobson, not just because he's the 2nd best D behind Dahlin, but we were able to tap into the strength of the class. If JT walks, next year provides us with an opportunity to give Barzal a #1B centerman moving forward with that ridiculous class of pivots.

As we saw with Montreal and Arizona, the need for a center was just too much despite it being a very weak crop. Kotkaniemi and Hayton should be very good players, but they both reached and we reaped the benefits. We dipped into the strength of the class and getting the BPA+value on our picks. This was just not the year to go after a center and our scouting staff seemed to know that. It was the smart and right play.

Dobson was a coup, his positional value makes him my #1 Isles prospect. Big and swift skating RD's with smarts, that is the most valued commodity in the NHL behind the #1 elite center. #1C's are the QB's of the NHL according to pay scale. #1D's are the edge rushers of the NHL. Those are the two positions that is almost impossible to find unless you draft one. I know you don't like Wilde (I'm not a huge fan either), but he has immense tools and while he may not have #1D upside... potential top-4 RD's who are big and swift carry a pretty big premium. I think best case scenario is that Wilde can develop into a Nurse/Dumba type, similar high tools/low IQ that have developed into quality players despite taking much longer to come around. That's a pretty valuable trade chip if it comes to that.

I'm also thrilled with Wahlstrom because he's a RH shot RW. I think LW is the most plentiful and thus least valued commodity in the NHL. RW's are a different story and we got the best one in a strong winger class.

I also liked that we got the goalie who many had at the top of their rankings, big kid with some pro experience already. Not a bad idea to take a flyer on a goalie, the RB's of the NHL. This Iskhakov (I'm just going to call him Ishtar) intrigues the hell out of me. I rolled my eyes at first when we took him and immediately thought of Cammaratta, but this kid has something. Likely the only real blemish in reaching for him, but I can understand the play.

 

[BrockLobster]

I will be definitely going to the prospect game this year. Would love to do a board meetup

When is that?

 

[Konk]

I know you weren't really high on Wilde but was the based mostly on his poor under 18's for team USA?

Not just his poor U18, but overall he's always demonstrated a low IQ -- I don't think it's correctable. He doesn't demonstrate smarts in any zone, whereas a guy like Bouchard who is a train wreck defensively still at least showcases smarts offensively.

As we saw with Montreal and Arizona, the need for a center was just too much despite it being a very weak crop. Kotkaniemi and Hayton should be very good players, but they both reached and we reaped the benefits. We dipped into the strength of the class and getting the BPA+value on our picks. This was just not the year to go after a center and our scouting staff seemed to know that. It was the smart and right play.

They just took BPAs with those two picks and it was the smart move.

Dobson was a coup, his positional value makes him my #1 Isles prospect. Big and swift skating RD's with smarts, that is the most valued commodity in the NHL behind the #1 elite center. #1C's are the QB's of the NHL according to pay scale. #1D's are the edge rushers of the NHL. Those are the two positions that is almost impossible to find unless you draft one. I know you don't like Wilde (I'm not a huge fan either), but he has immense tools and while he may not have #1D upside... potential top-4 RD's who are big and swift carry a pretty big premium. I think best case scenario is that Wilde can develop into a Nurse/Dumba type, similar high tools/low IQ that have developed into quality players despite taking much longer to come around. That's a pretty valuable trade chip if it comes to that.

You know how I feel about Dobson -- Smith was my favorite player going into this draft and after I saw Dobson play, I had no problem putting him above Smith in just about every category. Dobson is a play stopper, puck retriever, and play starter -- he starts the rush up ice either with a smart, short pass and follows it or he leads it himself. But he's not the type to get stuck in his own end and that's a big part of his game. Super sharp player, always mentally one step ahead. I have zero doubts he will be a #1 in the NHL and to me, even if Wahlstrom projects as a #1 RW, Dobson as a potential #1 is much more rare and a more valuable commodity. He's their #1 prospect and if you can go back and watch his Memorial Cup games, you should do that. I think chl.neulion.com has them for $4 a game. He was the anchor of that team all year and he really stepped up and lead that team from the backend. He was their best player and 2nd leading scorer on Acadie-Bathurst and fourth overall for all Memorial Cup players.

In terms of Wilde -- Nurse/Dumba are bad comparisons, IMO. Both Nurse and Dumba always had smarts in their own end. Nurse was always more of a physically raw kid who some had hoped his offense would come around, but he was always competent in his own end in juniors. Same with Dumba -- rover and risky in his pinches, but was always solid defensively in the WHL. Wilde is unnecessarily risky offensively and he's clueless in his own end. He just shows a lack of intelligence everywhere on the ice. I don't think he has top four upside, tools be damned, if you can't keep up mentally the tools won't ever be useful. I would love to say I was wrong five years from now since he's an Islander, but I don't think so.

I'm also thrilled with Wahlstrom because he's a RH shot RW. I think LW is the most plentiful and thus least valued commodity in the NHL. RW's are a different story and we got the best one in a strong winger class.

I'm not as high on Wahlstrom as some, but he is certainly a dangerous goal scorer. Really comparable to Bellows and now we have elite shots from both wings.

I also liked that we got the goalie who many had at the top of their rankings, big kid with some pro experience already. Not a bad idea to take a flyer on a goalie, the RB's of the NHL. This Iskhakov (I'm just going to call him Ishtar) intrigues the hell out of me. I rolled my eyes at first when we took him and immediately thought of Cammaratta, but this kid has something. Likely the only real blemish in reaching for him, but I can understand the play.

I agree, those are intriguing picks, and I'm excited to see them play.

 

[Islesfan22]

Not just his poor U18, but overall he's always demonstrated a low IQ -- I don't think it's correctable. He doesn't demonstrate smarts in any zone, whereas a guy like Bouchard who is a train wreck defensively still at least showcases smarts offensively.


They just took BPAs with those two picks and it was the smart move.


You know how I feel about Dobson -- Smith was my favorite player going into this draft and after I saw Dobson play, I had no problem putting him above Smith in just about every category. Dobson is a play stopper, puck retriever, and play starter -- he starts the rush up ice either with a smart, short pass and follows it or he leads it himself. But he's not the type to get stuck in his own end and that's a big part of his game. Super sharp player, always mentally one step ahead. I have zero doubts he will be a #1 in the NHL and to me, even if Wahlstrom projects as a #1 RW, Dobson as a potential #1 is much more rare and a more valuable commodity. He's their #1 prospect and if you can go back and watch his Memorial Cup games, you should do that. I think chl.neulion.com has them for $4 a game. He was the anchor of that team all year and he really stepped up and lead that team from the backend. He was their best player and 2nd leading scorer on Acadie-Bathurst and fourth overall for all Memorial Cup players.

In terms of Wilde -- Nurse/Dumba are bad comparisons, IMO. Both Nurse and Dumba always had smarts in their own end. Nurse was always more of a physically raw kid who some had hoped his offense would come around, but he was always competent in his own end in juniors. Same with Dumba -- rover and risky in his pinches, but was always solid defensively in the WHL. Wilde is unnecessarily risky offensively and he's clueless in his own end. He just shows a lack of intelligence everywhere on the ice. I don't think he has top four upside, tools be damned, if you can't keep up mentally the tools won't ever be useful. I would love to say I was wrong five years from now since he's an Islander, but I don't think so.


I'm not as high on Wahlstrom as some, but he is certainly a dangerous goal scorer. Really comparable to Bellows and now we have elite shots from both wings.



I agree, those are intriguing picks, and I'm excited to see them play.

Ye i read the same thing about Wilde in some scouting reports also that he is a long strider and his skating is not as good as advertised. Hockey IQ is something either you have or you don't can't be developed.

 

[Islesfan22]

As i have said and ill say it again Iskhakov is someone i was like Wow this kid is really good when i saw him play. I was hoping Islanders drafted him in the third round but i don't think Islanders thought he was going to be there when they picked.

 

[PWJunior]

Ye i read the same thing about Wilde in some scouting reports also that he is a long strider and his skating is not as good as advertised. Hockey IQ is something either you have or you don't can't be developed.

At least I feel better about our player development program with Lou in charge now. Hopefully we see a housecleaning in that department throughout the summer.

I'm hoping for the best with Wilde. Maybe his tools will dazzle Chiarelli (if he's still employed) and we trade him for draft picks and we get Alexis LaFreniere out of it.

 

[PK Cronin]

Made a new prospect thread for the new season, let's take the discussion over there: https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/isles-prospect-talk-2018-19.2508075/