Intensity, possession and being hard to play

[themethod7]

The Penguins take more abuse then any team in the league.. easily. Wherever they find themselves on a game night, that opponent instantly turns the game into a campaign against Crosby. And if its a road game, the opposing crowd just feeds into it. There are very few easy nights if your a Penguin. Why does it feel like this team has it easier when Crosby is injured? Probably because its less of a motivator for the opponent.

Moreso then any other team, the Penguins need to be a tough team. They can't be small and soft. They'll get injured or worn out.. just like they have this year. Every opponent gets it up to beat the Penguins when Crosby is in the lineup. Shero needs to build a team that can not only take the abuse, but be the aggressor too. They need a 4th line that will fight. A few a-holes like Cooke and Ruutu too. Most of all they need someone on Crosby and Kunitz wing who will step up for those guys and plant a Dubinsky on his ass. I am really starting to think this is more important than a sniper.

Interesting timing, considering I just saw this on (a website that apparently shall not be named):

Average Weight: 201.3 (23rd)
Average Height: 6'1" (25th-T)
Average Age: 29.1 (4th)

Perfect combination of old, small, and soft!

 

[StutzlesTapeJob]

Interesting graphics. Indeed we are small. Also small where it counts (doubly). Our bigger players are our softer ones...Geno Neal etc. Our other bigger bodies don't dress.

For game 3 i would like to see:

Borts and Despres dressed. a 4th line of Glass Vitale Engo.

Borts in particular should be on the ice against Dubi as often as matchups allow. CBJ plays a good team game, but its not as though there raw talent means borts is a liability. He should be in Dubi's grill every time the play stops. He is good at bringing the sandpaper, being annoying, and getting people off their game.

We also need to dump, chase, and finish more checks. Every player in the NHL can dump and chase effectively if bought in. Its not about the 3 big hits that change a series. Its about the ice being contested every shift. Making those Dmen skate further, battle for pucks, play 16 of their 22 minutes fighting to get pucks out of the zone.

Feel bad for Gibbons btw. Not sure what happened, but i remember him throwing a hard shoulder into someones gut and it looking like he hit a brick wall. My uneducated was should separation. He was the only guy playing a playoff intensity game though. If he is out for a while he will be missed. Love that little imp.

 

[UnrealMachine]

I really thought that this low cap year would force Shero and DB's hand into playing their young, hungry D men. Despres is the one guy who brings snarl and the skating and outlet pass that this team needs, and he's #8 or #9 on our depth chart. Bort brings nastiness and more consistent physical play than Orpik. Yet both sit. And I love the pickup of Stemp and Goc. And whether you think Megna or Gibbons are a long term solution to anything, they play with speed and urgency.

But we'll never know if this roster can compete because DB is horribly misusing his resources, and Shero has once again given him a few toys he can't help but abuse (Scuds, Orpik, Engo, Adams, Glass, Kobe).

So in this critical offseason, Shero needs to get rid of DB and some of these useless players, close this chapter of mediocrity, and bring in a new regime. If he doesn't, then Shero needs to go too.

Asking Shero to even identify, let alone correct the multitude of problems that he alone created is probably asking too much. In other words: "If you give a gun to a chimp and the chimp shoots someone, you don't blame the chimp." -Marcy Rhoades (Married With Children, S4E8)

 

[wolffy66]

The notion that team lacks the players to dominate a team like the Jackets is absurd. Each of the top two lines has arguably the best player on the planet. Each of the top two lines has players capable of playing physical and scoring 30+ goals and another guy good for close to 20. It has a defenseman capable of being one of the most dynamic players at his position. And plenty of decent role players. Sure it has some weak players, Gladams to be sure.

But the problem is the way these guys are playing is complete ********. Its the mental make-up of this team that's the problem. They are playing down to Columbus because they think they can get away with sloppy lazy play. Its horrible pass after horrible pass. Its not hustling to get back on D cuz you're waiting for somebody else to get the puck back so you can transition quicker.

If this teams pulls its head out of its azz it will beat Columbus easily imo. I don't envision Disco being the guy to make that happen.

Bottom line I guess is this, stars need to play like stars thru hard work and not gambling that their talent will win out. The rest will fall into place.

 

[Tender Rip]

The notion that team lacks the players to dominate a team like the Jackets is absurd. Each of the top two lines has arguably the best player on the planet. Each of the top two lines has players capable of playing physical and scoring 30+ goals and another guy good for close to 20. It has a defenseman capable of being one of the most dynamic players at his position. And plenty of decent role players. Sure it has some weak players, Gladams to be sure.

But the problem is the way these guys are playing is complete ********. Its the mental make-up of this team that's the problem. They are playing down to Columbus because they think they can get away with sloppy lazy play. Its horrible pass after horrible pass. Its not hustling to get back on D cuz you're waiting for somebody else to get the puck back so you can transition quicker.

If this teams pulls its head out of its azz it will beat Columbus easily imo. I don't envision Disco being the guy to make that happen.

Bottom line I guess is this, stars need to play like stars thru hard work and not gambling that their talent will win out. The rest will fall into place.

Hi Rob.

 

[Farnham4top6]

One simple thing that could instantly make this team tougher to play against is the team, as a whole, stop giving a **** what the media, the fans, and likely even ownership thinks of them. All we heard for years is Sid and Geno get suckered into the rough stuff. yes, that's bad. But it's also the way they are. They've been getting into scrums since they came into the league. It gets them fired up. Now they look like two zombies. Neal gets called out by the media, and proceeds to disappear for 3 weeks. Orpik gets suckered by Thorton, the media calls out Orpik for not fighting, Orpik's thrown one big check since.

You can play tough, physical, and on the line without going over it. These guys go from one extreme to the other, and neither is beneficial. Get back to who you are and what you do, and hopefully that 'don't give a ****' attitude rubs off on everyone.

I'm not sure I"m explaining this right (it's early)

Orpik throws about 3 big hits a year so that isn't that much of difference. Shame that is fans only remembers those hits and not the rest who is worse then Swedish mainstream media.

 

[psu711]

The notion that team lacks the players to dominate a team like the Jackets is absurd. Each of the top two lines has arguably the best player on the planet. Each of the top two lines has players capable of playing physical and scoring 30+ goals and another guy good for close to 20. It has a defenseman capable of being one of the most dynamic players at his position. And plenty of decent role players. Sure it has some weak players, Gladams to be sure.

But the problem is the way these guys are playing is complete ********. Its the mental make-up of this team that's the problem. They are playing down to Columbus because they think they can get away with sloppy lazy play. Its horrible pass after horrible pass. Its not hustling to get back on D cuz you're waiting for somebody else to get the puck back so you can transition quicker.

If this teams pulls its head out of its azz it will beat Columbus easily imo. I don't envision Disco being the guy to make that happen.

Bottom line I guess is this, stars need to play like stars thru hard work and not gambling that their talent will win out. The rest will fall into place.

I think you sum up my thoughts nicely here.

We are better, on paper, than most teams in the playoffs. They just all seem to play better than we do... and have so for the last few months IMHO...

So really makes me wonder about just how much "better" we actually are.

TBH, if we were playing anyone other than CBJ or perhaps TB we may be down 2-0 at this point after these 2 performances.

 

[wolffy66]

I think you sum up my thoughts nicely here.

We are better, on paper, than most teams in the playoffs. They just all seem to play better than we do... and have so for the last few months IMHO...

So really makes me wonder about just how much "better" we actually are.

TBH, if we were playing anyone other than CBJ or perhaps TB we may be down 2-0 at this point after these 2 performances.

You would think that its the role of the coach to get the most out of his players but yeah, Dan Bylsma.

 

[The Old Master]

maybe it's because we have such a good coach that he can hide this teams flaws by having players play over their heads in the reg. season.....only for reality to set in once the playoffs start.......that will cost you two tickets behind the bench Danny boy

 

[themethod7]

I think you sum up my thoughts nicely here.

We are better, on paper, than most teams in the playoffs. They just all seem to play better than we do... and have so for the last few months IMHO...

So really makes me wonder about just how much "better" we actually are.

TBH, if we were playing anyone other than CBJ or perhaps TB we may be down 2-0 at this point after these 2 performances.

Don't let the 0-3 series fool you, we'd be in trouble if we faced TB playing the way we are now. They got jobbed last night on an atrocious goalie interference call and their first 2 games went into OT, all 3 games playing without their starting goalie. We got the weakest team in the playoffs and we're still looking average at best, any other team and we'd be down 0-2 I think.

 

[psu711]

You would think that its the role of the coach to get the most out of his players but yeah, Dan Bylsma.

I think Bylsma is terrible... but at some point Sid/Geno need to start taking the blame as well... Turn over machines who arnt producing and cant win a face off all of a sudden(not that test-tube isnt super human or anything)... I mean... how do you coach Sid anyway?

In no way is this a defense of Bylsma, but Stars need to play like Stars regardless of their coach...

If we were losing games 5-4 and getting production from our top players, then im talking system, pairings, matchups, goaltending... Not so much the case atm...

 

[Stainless]

It's a miracle - Danny boy and the cocky Pens getting called out by local media


Penguins' arrogance astounding

They never learn.

Every time the Penguins start to feel good about themselves, it seems they want to feel better. Good isn't good enough. They are hockey's great narcissists — hopelessly addicted to their own wondrous skill.

Their 4-3 double-overtime loss to the Columbus Blue Jackets on Saturday provided yet another stirring example, in addition to costing the Penguins home-ice advantage in this first-round series.

The Penguins dominated the first period and led 3-1 going to the intermission. That kind of lead should be good enough this time of year, or as defenseman Matt Niskanen put it, “There's no reason to give up scoring chances — unnecessary ones — when you have a two-goal lead in the playoffs.â€

The idea has to be to nurture the lead. To make it last. Defense should be the overriding mindset.

Only it wasn't.

That became clear when coach Dan Bylsma threw four forwards over the boards, including Evgeni Malkin at the point, for a power play six minutes into the period. The move shrieked offense. The situation called for a more conservative mindset — and it's not like the Penguins lack power play-capable defensemen.

The Blue Jackets had no business getting back in this game. Bylsma left the screen door open. Columbus had been dangerous on the penalty kill all season and had scored a short-handed goal in Game 1. There was no reason to take a chance.

Sure enough, Malkin fumbled a puck at the right point. He escaped unscathed. He then was victimized at the left point, which led to a 2-on-1 and Matt Calvert's short-handed goal.

This was sheer Penguins arrogance — and it changed the game for good. They never recaptured control. After outshooting the Blue Jackets, 15-4, in the first period, they were outshot 41-27 the rest of the way.

Afterward, Bylsma explained that he went with four forwards because it worked so well during the regular season. That is true. The Penguins had the league's top-ranked power play. But the playoffs are a different animal. Coaching staffs have way more time to break down opponent's special teams. They look for weaknesses.

Malkin on the point is a weakness.

It wasn't just the coach who fed the goal monster. The captain did, too. Sidney Crosby threw more interceptions than Neil O'Donnell in a Super Bowl. He was “credited†with a game-high four giveaways, more than the entire Columbus team, as he repeatedly attempted high-risk, cross-ice passes.

http://triblive.com/sports/joestarkey/5947875-74/penguins-power-columbus#axzz2zRI3KdjR

 

[wolffy66]

I think Bylsma is terrible... but at some point Sid/Geno need to start taking the blame as well... Turn over machines who arnt producing and cant win a face off all of a sudden(not that test-tube isnt super human or anything)... I mean... how do you coach Sid anyway?

In no way is this a defense of Bylsma, but Stars need to play like Stars regardless of their coach...

If we were losing games 5-4 and getting production from our top players, then im talking system, pairings, matchups, goaltending... Not so much the case atm...

I definitely agree, they should be leading and they are not. I'd just like a coach to fall back on or maybe help it that area. But ultimately its up to them.

 

[SidDidNothingWrong]

This has been something I have been saying for a long time. We play better when Martin, Letang, Sid, and Geno, etc. are injured. For whatever reason, I can't say I know for sure. Maybe it is because the other players know that there isn't anyone to rely on to score so they can't just sit back and they actually have to try their hardest. I subscribe more to the belief that a team does not need superstars to win. Our young rookies are so good and so energetic that it makes up for a lack of experience.
If we iced this line-up, I can almost guarantee that they would make it as far as a team with Sid,Geno,Letang,etc.
Bennett-Megna-Gibbons
Zolniercyk-Ebbett-Connor
Farnham-Payerl-Kostpoluous
Sill-Dea-Archibald
Marcantuoni-Leblond as backups

Despres-Puliot
Samuelsson-Harrington
Ruopp-Dumolin

I obviously just threw this together without caring much about specific position. The point being, our farm team is much harder to play against than our professional team. Sure this may elicit some chuckles and whatnot, but you answer me this question, who has more goals in the past two playoff games? Gibbons or Crosby? If we iced our Wilkes-Barre Scranton Pens would they have had that terrible effort in overtime? I would have argued that we would have won.
Some of our best moments, some of our most difficult-to-play-against days were with WBS Pens this season. Everyone has to put on their big boy pants and give an honest 100 percent effort. A 100 percent effort GIbbons is surely worth more than a 50 percent effort Sid or Geno. I am so sick of hearing that we need to line match to get Crosby away from guys like Niklas Grossman, Brandon Dubinsky, and Sean Courterier. He is the best player in the world, he should be scoring more than a rookie. Sure, the organizational culture and lack of structure makes it more difficult for this team to achieve their best, but at some point the best player in the world and the second best player in the world, have to come in the clutch for the first time in 4 years.

 

[WVP]

I am so sick of hearing that we need to line match to get Crosby away from guys like Niklas Grossman, Brandon Dubinsky, and Sean Courterier. He is the best player in the world, he should be scoring more than a rookie. Sure, the organizational culture and lack of structure makes it more difficult for this team to achieve their best, but at some point the best player in the world and the second best player in the world, have to come in the clutch for the first time in 4 years.

I feel that way as well. Bergeron/Chara or Datsyuk/Lidstrom is a different story but who's supposed to be the "best" player? Earn that title. And if you don't have any space at ES how about banging one home on the PP?

 

[Shady Machine]

I feel that way as well. Bergeron/Chara or Datsyuk/Lidstrom is a different story but who's supposed to be the "best" player? Earn that title. And if you don't have any space at ES how about banging one home on the PP?

I agree but that doesn't mean the coach shouldn't try to give Sid a favorable match up, especially if he's struggling.

 

[Shockmaster]

I agree but that doesn't mean the coach shouldn't try to give Sid a favorable match up, especially if he's struggling.

I'm pretty sure the coaches tried to give Mario favorable match-ups even though he's one of the greatest players of all time. No reason Crosby has to drag around the other team's shutdown center/top D pairing the entire game like he is now.

 

[billybudd]

Unfair IMO. Gibbons has played 41 games this season, and this was pretty much his only injury sustained after a hit. At least that I can remember. Bad break, could happen to anyone.

Force he takes on hits from other players due to his tiny frame, frequency he gets freight trained, it was really only a matter of time. There's a hit I'm surprised he gets back up from every two or three games.

That said, if Gibbons is on one of the top two lines and producing (which he was in these playoffs), that's less of a problem to me than that he's in the bottom six at all. A scorer, if he creates enough, can be 5'5. Bottom six players, at least theoretically, need to be doing other things he's incapable of doing.

Guy like him, to me, it's top six or get him the Hell off the ice.

 

[Penguinzilla*]

The only player on the team that is hard to play against is Bortuzzo. Assuming "hard to play against" means someone that can make life physically miserable for opposing players.

 

[NeedleInTheHay]

If we iced this line-up, I can almost guarantee that they would make it as far as a team with Sid,Geno,Letang,etc.
Bennett-Megna-Gibbons
Zolniercyk-Ebbett-Connor
Farnham-Payerl-Kostpoluous
Sill-Dea-Archibald
Marcantuoni-Leblond as backups

Despres-Puliot
Samuelsson-Harrington
Ruopp-Dumolin

Please tell me you're joking and you don't honestly believe that team would make the ECF like Crosby/Malkin did last year.

 

[sf expat71]

I don't think being hard to play against is necessarily about beating down the other team physically. Although I don't think we've had a true pest on our team that drives the opposition crazy since Jarko Ruutu, which is pretty sad. Even a guy like Bolland was aces in Chicago at getting under the opponent's skin. Cookie maybe...? But a team like Detroit, though they rarely throw down and fight, is very hard to play against. The subtle and uncalled interference plays and mostly sound defensive structure, as well as the ability to skate like crazy, that is hard to play against because they frustrate the opposition. Personnel-wise, there is no reason we can't be like them.

 

[billybudd]

Detroit's not as honest as they're reputed to be. Zetterberg has long been skating around non-stop slashing people in the wrists and ankles away from the play and calling it "defense." He seems to have taught that to the rest of the players on the Red Wings during his recovery from back surgery because they're all doing it now.

Filthy and unpenalized stickwork is definitely one way to be "hard to play against." I suspect we would not be able to pull this off without being sent to the box, for whatever reason.

 

[NastyNick]

What astounds me about the powerplay is that they got away from the setup that was working for them most of the year. Neal in the high slot keeps the pressure off of the outside. It gives Crosby and Malkin time and space to make plays. If you want a shooting poweplay, which these guys do, thats the way you do it.

What they are doing now is sticking Kunitz in front of the net. Columbus is basically ignoring him and keep guys in the lanes to the net. There is no space. The Pens have to make 2 great passes to get a good chance. Factor in the fear of the Penguins and the confidence on Columbus.. and this is just a bad situation for Pittsburgh.

 

[Freeptop]

Lack of size, grit, and determination won't get you far. Ray Shero didn't address this issue during the off-season or trade deadline. He is going to suffer the consequences once this team gets eliminated again in the postseason. Even softer teams in the playoffs (i.e. Detroit, Chicago, Dallas, Minnesota, Montreal, New York, San Jose) have players that provide size and grit.

It is very frustrating to see how clueless this organization is. How is this team going to be expected to keep possession of the puck when they're soft and undersized? They are getting outplayed by freakin' Columbus. Imagine if they advance to the next round and they have to play against the Flyers! Pittsburgh has no players besides Sidney Crosby, Chris Kunitz, Taylor Pyatt and Deryk Engelland that are willing to battle in-front of the net. This organization desperately needs a power-forward that is in their prime.

The lack of passion is noticeable as well. The vast majority of the players that are currently on this team aren't willing to stick up for each other. It is pathetic, screw this p***yfed mentality that this team has. I am sure that Sidney Crosby is well aware of the issues regarding this soft organization.


It blows my mind why this team doesn't have an enforcer. Yet, they have a useless piece of **** like Craig Adams on the team.

San Jose is a soft team? Since when? They've got one of the largest set of players in the League, and they're not afraid to make use of their large frames.

As for an enforcer - I really don't see how having someone who can't skate and can't make a pass would help one bit.

The toughness that the Pens are lacking is a willingness to take a hit to make the proper play in their own end. Instead of making sure they get it to a teammate, they just lob it to a random area of the ice, where it either gets scooped up by an opponent, or it ends up being icing. The lack of holding on to the puck in their own end leads to long periods of time getting worn out in their own zone.

On the other end of the ice, the lack of toughness is (still) a lack of anyone being willing to go to the net for rebounds. They try for pretty passing plays instead of keeping it simple and being willing to take a cross-check in order to maintain a screen in the crease, or be ready for a rebound. They all end up on the perimeter looking for cross-ice passes that either miss or get intercepted.

An enforcer helps with neither of those situations.

I agree with the rest of your points, but calling the Sharks soft and saying the Pens need an enforcer in the playoffs just had to be commented on.

 

[Your Boy Troy]

San Jose is a soft team? Since when? They've got one of the largest set of players in the League, and they're not afraid to make use of their large frames.

As for an enforcer - I really don't see how having someone who can't skate and can't make a pass would help one bit.

The toughness that the Pens are lacking is a willingness to take a hit to make the proper play in their own end. Instead of making sure they get it to a teammate, they just lob it to a random area of the ice, where it either gets scooped up by an opponent, or it ends up being icing. The lack of holding on to the puck in their own end leads to long periods of time getting worn out in their own zone.

On the other end of the ice, the lack of toughness is (still) a lack of anyone being willing to go to the net for rebounds. They try for pretty passing plays instead of keeping it simple and being willing to take a cross-check in order to maintain a screen in the crease, or be ready for a rebound. They all end up on the perimeter looking for cross-ice passes that either miss or get intercepted.

An enforcer helps with neither of those situations.

I agree with the rest of your points, but calling the Sharks soft and saying the Pens need an enforcer in the playoffs just had to be commented on.

It's a myth that all enforcers can't skate or play a regular shift in the NHL. Look at hybrid-enforcers like Patrick Bordeleau, Anthony Peluso, and Luke Gazdic. I think that it is important to have an intimidating player on the team that is willing to stick up for their teammates in certain situations. It lifts the weight off the players' shoulders knowing that they have an enforcer that will protect them. Pittsburgh doesn't have a player that is willing to step-up. And, certainly no player that is intimidating. How many times have we seen Crosby, Malkin, Neal, and Kunitz get their focus off their game whenever they are victims to agitating? There have been too many times when they react to these agitators, and winded up paying for it on the scoreboard. This team needs someone to care of the dirty business. Even it means that the enforcer takes a penalty. As long as the star players remain on their game.

I shouldn't have stated that San Jose is a soft team. However, the talent that they currently have is built around speed. Not necessarily size and grit. Why do you think that they have players like Havlat, Kennedy, Wingles, and Brown on the team?