Proposal: I was convinced that a Nylander for Tkachuk trade would have been a great opportunity for Dubas.

[Gabriel426]

There is no way Flames would take Willie for Tkachuk in a one for one deal.

 

[Man Bear Pig]

It was a horrendous trade for Florida and if you thought we had no cap space before, it would be even worse now. Not that he would have signed here anyways. Not to mention that Tkachuk isn't exactly much of a playoff performer.

 

[ER89]

Say it with me... William makes 6.9m for being a top line winger.

Say it with me again.... William shows up in the playoffs unlike Chucky.

 

[BertCorbeau]

I was in favour of a deal around Nylander + for Tkachuk .. but my idea of a "+" wasn't close to what Florida paid. And Florida gave up a player better than Nylander.

Also Tkachuk only wanted to go to a few teams, where he'd willingly sign long term

So getting mad that the Leafs didn't t get him doesn't make sense on a few fronts:

- the crazy assets required
- the fact that Tkachuk likely wouldn't sign long term here
- finally a straight up Nylander for Tkachuk trade clearly wasn't going to be accepted by Calgary

 

[Buds17]

The entire point of the trade was for Calgary to maximize the return by working in collaboration with Tkachuk for a team with which he'd be willing to sign for the long term. It sure appeared as though that destination was going to be restricted to a handful of American teams only (it's quite amazing how all three Tkachuks found themselves starting their NHL careers with Canadian teams).

 

[ULF_55]

It would have been a great opportunity if we traded Nylander for Tkachuk and he signed 8x years at $6.9 million.

But that's not the structure of what Florida gave up.. They basically ripped their core apart and are a fundamentally different team today.

Calgary did very well on this.

Can they re-sign Huberdeau? That's a question mark, but they only had Tkackuk for a year anyway, so that's a wash.

Adding Weeger to their defense isn't bad.
1st. round pick wipes out Panthers until 2026 now.

Panthers just have to move out 3.3mm now.

 

[BayStBullies]

Trading Nylander for a more expensive forward does not address the needs of this team. Nylander is on a very good contract.

This fanbase is insufferable. You spend the entire off season mock trading beans for the best players in the league, then get upset when the Leafs GM doesn't beat out the other 31 GMs. "How could he not trade the beans for McDavid, it was so obvious?!?!?!"

 

[BertCorbeau]

The best comparable package I could come up with would be:

Nylander + Brodie + Liljegren + 1st Rd pick

.. maybe swap Sandin for Lily, but Weegar > Brodie and is younger so the Leafs would have to compensate with a better prospect .. plus Hubes > Nylander, but Nylander is younger.

And I still don't think that's enough.

 

[hamzarocks]

The Matthew Tkachuk trade is so bad it might result in the panthers relocating due to fans losing interest in a non-playoff team...

Ok that is an exaggeration, but the panthers f***ed up so bad paying that much to get an inferior player than Huberdeau, killing an average d-core, gutting their prospect pool even further, and losing another 1st rounder

The panthers went from having elite offensive depth to being super top heavy

Lost Marchment, Giroux, Acciari and now Huberdeau

Tkachuk is a 75-85 point winger, not a 105-point winger. He's been worse than JT in the playoffs with 15 pts in 27 games.

Originally i thought the Panthers went all in for next year and dealt Hornqvist + Reinhart + 1st for Tkachuk and then signed him to that deal. That would have been a great move as they got their core deeper and still had Weegar whose a great 2/3D

Dealing their best player in Huberdeau was tough, but then they added Weegar who should be valued at a 1st+prospect, another 1st (albeit far from now), and a B/B+ prospect

If the leafs had even offered Marner for Tkachuk, Dubas would have cost us Matthews and set us to another rebuild.

Smart move to stay away from this terrible overpay

The best comparable package I could come up with would be:

Nylander + Brodie + Liljegren + 1st Rd pick

.. maybe swap Sandin for Lily, but Weegar > Brodie and is younger so the Leafs would have to compensate with a better prospect .. plus Hubes > Nylander, but Nylander is younger.

And I still don't think that's enough.

It would be

Marner + Lilijgren + 2024/2025 1st + Hirvonen

Huberdeau is a UFA sure, but he's been very similar to Marner since 2019.

Tkachuk is worth Nylander + Cap Dump (if we had one say Marleau on a 1 year 6M deal he'd be the fit) + 2023 1st

Nothing more

 

[BertCorbeau]

I actually think as Tkachuk mature's he'll be a stellar playoff player, which is why I wanted him.

But that price is bonkers.

 

[RebuildYear5]

Wouldn't this deal make more sense, especially since we're strapped on cap.

1st round 2023 + Kerfoot + Holl + Prospect or 2nd round pick

For

Jonathan Huberdeau(50% retained)

We would then have the option to trade Tavares after this season and regain our assets we lost trading for Huberdeau plus sign Jonathan to a lower cap hit...win/win

Also that gives Kyle an extra 2.750M to sign Sandin & any free agent

 

[Stephen]

Calgary did very well on this.

Can they re-sign Huberdeau? That's a question mark, but they only had Tkackuk for a year anyway, so that's a wash.

Adding Weeger to their defense isn't bad.
1st. round pick wipes out Panthers until 2026 now.

Panthers just have to move out 3.3mm now.

Panthers are finally feeling the cap crunch. They basically accelerated into cap hell, fast forwarding past the last affordable year of Huberdeau and Weegar, have no first rounders till 2025, are $3.3 million over the cap, and are threadbare on defense. And next year Spencer Knight is going to probably get a healthy raise.

 

[ITM]

Another good read by Zito:

Apparently Weegar was a disappointment and Huberdeau had the kind of playoffs he'd be tarred and feathered for in Toronto.

Tkachuk's contract sets our negotiations up in an interesting way.

I think my favorite take away from examining the Flames/Panthers situation is Carter Verhaeghe*, who was the second best playoffs performer behind Johnny Gaudreau between the two teams.

*Think Verhaeghe was moved by LL was he not?

Wouldn't this deal make more sense, especially since we're strapped on cap.

1st round 2023 + Kerfoot + Holl + Prospect or 2nd round pick

For

Jonathan Huberdeau(50% retained)

We would then have the option to trade Tavares after this season and regain our assets we lost trading for Huberdeau plus sign Jonathan to a lower cap hit...win/win

Also that gives Kyle an extra 2.750M to sign Sandin & any free agent

Absolutely implausible.

 

[New User Name]

Wouldn't this deal make more sense, especially since we're strapped on cap.

1st round 2023 + Kerfoot + Holl + Prospect or 2nd round pick

For

Jonathan Huberdeau(50% retained)

We would then have the option to trade Tavares after this season and regain our assets we lost trading for Huberdeau plus sign Jonathan to a lower cap hit...win/win

Also that gives Kyle an extra 2.750M to sign Sandin & any free agent

Trade Tavares? He has a NMC.

 

[RebuildYear5]

Another good read by Zito:

Apparently Weegar was a disappointment and Huberdeau had the kind of playoffs he'd be tarred and feathered for in Toronto.

Tkachuk's contract sets our negotiations up in an interesting way.

I think my favorite take away from examining the Flames/Panthers situation is Carter Verhaeghe*, who was the second best playoffs performer behind Johnny Gaudreau between the two teams.

*Think Verhaeghe was moved by LL was he not?


Absolutely implausible.

Oouf dont even get me started about Carter Verhaeghe yet another player we traded away for nothing....only to be extremely valuable come playoffs

If management kept everything intact we would have

Kadri + Brown + Verhaeghe + FA

For

Tavares and his 11M caphit

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Say it with me... William makes 6.9m for being a top line winger.

Say it with me again.... William shows up in the playoffs unlike Chucky.

I don't think you can say that about Nylander. He's never played the 2nd round of a playoff series in his life. One can cherry pick his first round stats, but they only help the 1st round hockey pool. I would take the winning goal in an elimination game over 8 points in 7 playoff games. Nylander is a pretty good player (to be fair), but he's not bulletproof by any means.

 

[Seath The Scaleless]

You're loading the question with too many scenarios that favour your fantasy.

Ask a normal question.

His recent playoff stats are fine. And him and his team have won a playoff round.

Ok here's a normal question. How would this trade have put TOR over the top and addressed many areas of need?

 

[RebuildYear5]

Trade Tavares? He has a NMC.

Ooouf forgot, if he cares about the team like he says he does....give us the list Johnny boy, cant believe Kyle slapped a NMC ontop of giving the guy 11M

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Ok here's a normal question. How would this trade have put TOR over the top and addressed many areas of need?

Tkachuk is a power forward who can show grit as well as a scoring touch. He does not play on the perimeter like many leaf forwards do. He has net presence, does puck retrieval, and has body checking in his game. He also has a decent defensive game too.

 

[ULF_55]

Panthers are finally feeling the cap crunch. They basically accelerated into cap hell, fast forwarding past the last affordable year of Huberdeau and Weegar, have no first rounders till 2025, are $3.3 million over the cap, and are threadbare on defense. And next year Spencer Knight is going to probably get a healthy raise.

Just one correction, the Panthers next 1st. round pick before any moves to recoup, is 2026.

I guess we know who's going to be setting Mangiapane this upcoming season.
Huberdeau had 30 goals, and 85 assists.

I guess we know who's going to be setting Laine this upcoming season.
Gaudreau had 40 goals, and 75 assists.

 

[Seath The Scaleless]

Tkachuk is a power forward who can show grit as well as a scoring touch. He does not play on the perimeter like many leaf forwards do. He has net presence, does puck retrieval, and has body checking in his game. He also has a decent defensive game too.

He also tends to disappear in the playoffs. He was very ineffective for most of the Dallas series because he was too busy trying to bully Klingberg and showed nothing after game 1 vs their provincial rivals.

The Leafs don't need inconsistent playoff performers at that price.

 

[ER89]

I don't think you can say that about Nylander. He's never played the 2nd round of a playoff series in his life. One can cherry pick his first round stats, but they only help the 1st round hockey pool. I would take the winning goal in an elimination game over 8 points in 7 playoff games. Nylander is a pretty good player (to be fair), but he's not bulletproof by any means.

This is not a good argument. It's not his fault we aren't in the second round. Then what's next he's never played in the conference finals so we only Cherry pick the first two rounds? In fact you are cherry picking. Playoffs is the playoffs, period. And regarding one winning goal in an elimination game, so if a random fourth liner scored that goal you'd rather him than Matthews or Mitch or William? Absurd reasoning tbh.

You're right though, he isn't bullet proof. But in these parts he's being traded for shit like Rasmus Andersson or for a winger who to be fair may even be better in the regular season, but costs 2.6m more and is noticeably worse in the playoffs.

Also chucky has only been to the second round once and he did dick all there.

 

[New User Name]

Ooouf forgot, if he cares about the team like he says he does....give us the list Johnny boy, cant believe Kyle slapped a NMC ontop of giving the guy 11M

He does care about the team and wants to be here to help bring a Cup home. It would be an insult to ask him to go somewhere else. There's such a thing called integrity and even in a cut throat business like the NHL, it's still a virtue to have.

That said I think signing John at that amount was a huge blunder on the part of Dubas.

 

[al secord]

Being in our division, we have more chances to flip the puck at him and watch the hilarity ensue

 

[BertCorbeau]

Another good read by Zito:

Apparently Weegar was a disappointment and Huberdeau had the kind of playoffs he'd be tarred and feathered for in Toronto.

Tkachuk's contract sets our negotiations up in an interesting way.

I think my favorite take away from examining the Flames/Panthers situation is Carter Verhaeghe*, who was the second best playoffs performer behind Johnny Gaudreau between the two teams.

*Think Verhaeghe was moved by LL was he not?


Absolutely implausible.

Yes Lou gave Verhaeghe away with a few other prospects in a cap dump deal that got the Leafs Grabner

Verhaeghe was 5 minunies into his post junior career before the Leafs even gave him a shot to develop within the org.

And then Lou let him go again on the Island where Carter ended up signing with Tampa and winning a cup (IIRC). Then he signs with Florida and breaks out as a top 6 player.

Great story!