How Long Will We Keep Pretending That a D Is More Needed Than A #1 C

[LeftCoast]

So the plan should be to draft forwards and just cross our fingers that a late round defenseman turns out?

That's pretty much what we've done for 11 years.

 

[Roy Baby*]

I'd be surprised if there was a centre in the 2016 draft other than Matthews that would be more valuable to us than Horvat.

Expected. He's a top 10 pick center. Much like I'm pushing for in this thread. Another Horvat basically. Tanev And Edler have had better careers than a few of those guys. Not in first round. If Hutton was a top 15 pick, you'd be ecstatic with how he's playing. Sbisa is a first round pick by the way. Not a spring chicken either. You don't think it's possible to pull more out of the hat? Those kind of "steals" are popping up and have popped all over the league. Faulk, Ghost, Klingberg, Muzzin, Giordano, T.J. Brodie, Byfuglien, Chara , etc.. It goes on and on.

It's time to get a center with a "whatever it takes attitude" and that could even be done through smart trading. Draft isn't everything.

 

[WTG]

Juicy list. A lot of guys in that $8 million paid or expected paid range. The quality of those centers >> the quality of those D.

I like it.

A lot of that quality is also the 1st overalls.

Looking at the list I made I consider the best centers to be 1st overalls.

Wereas the best defensemen in my other list are picked from all over. Which I guess kind of confirms your original point that #1 defensemen pop up more often later in the draft (2-15). However, contradicts your point that we'd be "wasting" our pick by picking a defensemen.

The conclusion I draw is that we should be picking the best available player with our 1st round pick. We shouldn't reach for a defensemen but we also shouldn't completely avoid them with our pick as there is still a good chance we get a #1 defensemen.

 

[Horrorshow]

Expected. He's a top 10 pick center. Much like I'm pushing for in this thread. Another Horvat basically. Tanev And Edler have had better careers than a few of those guys. Not in first round. If Hutton was a top 15 pick, you'd be ecstatic with how he's playing. Shisa is a first round pick by the way. Not a spring chicken either.

But it doesn't appear that there is another Horvat in our draft range. If there are no prospects who currently project to be better than Horvat or Sedin (not to mention McCann and Sutter), then why not pick one of the handful of prospects who look like they could very likely be important pieces of our future defence?

Edit: This isn't to say we should pick one position or another. Always pick BPA. What that best player is is subjective though.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

Exactly.

Across the league...PK will always be better than Tinordi will be...Keith is better than Seabrook...Klingberg>>>Honka , Faulk >>> Fleury , Weber + Josi >>>> Jones, etc.

Or remember that guy Nicklas Lidstrom ?

Draft on character + develop is key.

Get that #1 C and that solid D will fall outta the sky either through UFA or good later round drafting. That's just the way it is

You mean how it did for us throughout Henrik's entire career? We haven't had a top tier defenseman in over a decade. It's nice to say we'll develop one, but it's a hell of a gamble to assume that is in any way guaranteed. At the moment, we don't need to worry about Henrik's replacement because it looks like he won't be retiring for another five years.

 

[Serac]

Why waste early round picks on forwards ?

Pavel Datsyuk, Henrik Zetterberg, Luc Robitaille, Brett Hull, Daniel Alfredsson...

All of these quality players taken out of the first round...heck, mostly taken in the 6th and 7th rounds !
Who needs 1st round picks anyways ?
Let's just stock up on the later picks and roll with that because the 1st round just has garbage we shouldn't waste our picks on

 

[m9]

Draft BPA, that's it.

But for what is a bigger need on the ice? It's a good RHD. Has been for awhile.

 

[Tobi Wan Kenobi]

So the #1 centers that are in this group are also pretty low. This is what I'd consider the #1 centers in the group.

Sidney Crosby
Anze Kopitar
Jonathan Toews
Nicklas Backstrom
Steven Stamkos
John Tavares
Matt Duchene
Ryan Johansen
Alex Galchenyuk
Nathan MacKinnon
Aleksander Barkov
Sean Monahan
Sam Reinhart
Leon Draisaitl
Sam Bennett
Dylan Larkin

So 16/53 I would consider #1 center men/project to be #1 centermen.

Compare that to 13/52 #1 defensemen.

30% of top 15 drafted centermen become #1 (IMO)
25% of top 15 drafted defensemen become #1 (IMO)

It's a 5% difference. So it really comes down on which you value more, #1 center men or #1 defensemen.

You should change it to first line forwards instead of centers. We're probably more likely to take a winger this draft than anything else imo. Leaving off Forsberg, Couture, Scheifle, Horvat, Domi, Nylander, RNH and Lindholm? All of those guys look like they are or becoming first line forwards to me.

 

[kanucks25]

Hutton is potentially that puck moving #1 that we've all been craving.

Yikes. We'll be lucky if he's a consistent middle-pairing guy.

 

[Hit the post]

 

[racerjoe]

Too much talk of what's better to take, a center or a defensemen, yes defensemen are harder to project, but if a defensemen is the Best Player Available go for it.

Same if a forward is the best player available, I just don't want to reach because that is how you miss out. Look what Nashville did, they had a glut of great defensemen so they turned one into a number 1 center. There is definitely a group of players I have in the 4-10 spot right now and I wouldn't complain about any of them.

 

[JayBeautiful]

So the #1 centers that are in this group are also pretty low. This is what I'd consider the #1 centers in the group.

Sidney Crosby
Anze Kopitar
Jonathan Toews
Nicklas Backstrom
Steven Stamkos - Right Wing
John Tavares
Matt Duchene - Left Wing
Ryan Johansen
Alex Galchenyuk - Left Wing
Nathan MacKinnon
Aleksander Barkov
Sean Monahan
Sam Reinhart - Right Wing
Leon Draisaitl
Sam Bennett - Left Wing
Dylan Larkin - Left Wing

So 16/53 I would consider #1 center men/project to be #1 centermen.

Compare that to 13/52 #1 defensemen.

30% of top 15 drafted centermen become #1 (IMO)
25% of top 15 drafted defensemen become #1 (IMO)

It's a 5% difference. So it really comes down on which you value more, #1 center men or #1 defensemen.

yeah but 6 of the 16 you listed are actually wingers

 

[WTG]

yeah but 6 of the 16 you listed are actually wingers

They play some center.

 

[y2kcanucks]

Draft BPA. We need an elite 1C and we need an elite 1D.

 

[JuniorNelson]

Draft BPA. We need an elite 1C and we need an elite 1D.

I wouldn't object to a great goalie. Maybe they won't bungle that, this time.

The pressing need, is an elite center. The Sedins should be an elite second line set next season, at best.

 

[brokenhole]

Sign Stamkos draft Laine, use all the other picks on d-men.

 

[tiny103]

At least for this draft, unless we getting matthews, I'd rather take a dman if we stay around this draft spot

 

[Wang Gretzky]

We literally need everything, we don't have a number 1 anything lol

 

[604]

So the plan should be to draft forwards and just cross our fingers that a late round defenseman turns out?

...or sign one as a UFA.

UFA worked for BOS.

Late pick worked for CHI, PIT and DET.

The only recent Stanely Cup winner that drafted a franchise defenseman in the top 15 picks is LAK.

Every Stanley Cup winner in the last few years drafted a franchise centre in the top 15 (except Detroit who hadn't had a top 15 pick since 1991...but leading up to 1991, they had drafted a centre with each of their last three top 15 picks) ... note, I'm going to include Seguin on that list for BOS which is kinda cheap.

 

[Peen]

Galchenyuk on that list is horrifying

 

[JA]

I think that an elite pure goal scorer is what we need.

With the way that Bo Horvat has played, I wouldn't be afraid to make him the #1 centerman when the time comes, and then partner him with Sven Baertschi and somebody like Patrik Laine.

Sign Stamkos draft Laine, use all the other picks on d-men.

I would try for Laine with the first pick if he is available; if we're lucky, we can try to trade for a mid-to-late first round pick and use that to draft a defenseman.

I think that Stamkos will go to Montreal; if he's determined to stay in Canada, Ottawa is also a possibility. Vancouver seems less likely to me, though.

 

[Horse McHindu]

I'd still consider trading for Hamonic with our 2016 1st if we're not drafting Top 5

I'd still consider trading for Hamonic with our 2016 1st if we're not drafting Top 5:

If we fall within the 22-25 range at season's end (maybe 24/25), I'd strongly consider creating some kind of deal that involves our 2016 and the Islanders Travis Hamonic.

Hamonic is still young, and is a RHD. Furthermore, he has an excellent cap hit for the next 4 years. Given that he wants to play in a Western Canadian city (to the best of my knowledge, he didn't specifically say Winnipeg), it likely wouldn't be too difficult to extend him when his contract expires.

If Hamonic plays for us, he'll be 26 years old, and we would have a good chance of having him until the age of 33-34 (i.e. I'm taking into account a possible extension).

I don't think that's too bad a deal. A defense being lead by Edler, Tanev, Hutton, and Hamonic moving forward wouldn't be too shabby.

 

[JA]

I would look to trade Edler. He has under-performed relative to expectations and is at times a liability on the defensive side of the game. He doesn't offer much offensively either. I have been very dissatisfied with his game since the 2013 season.

 

[LeftCoast]

I'd still consider trading for Hamonic with our 2016 1st if we're not drafting Top 5:

If we fall within the 22-25 range at season's end (maybe 24/25), I'd strongly consider creating some kind of deal that involves our 2016 and the Islanders Travis Hamonic.

Hamonic is still young, and is a RHD. Furthermore, he has an excellent cap hit for the next 4 years. Given that he wants to play in a Western Canadian city (to the best of my knowledge, he didn't specifically say Winnipeg), it likely wouldn't be too difficult to extend him when his contract expires.

If Hamonic plays for us, he'll be 26 years old, and we would have a good chance of having him until the age of 33-34 (i.e. I'm taking into account a possible extension).

I don't think that's too bad a deal. A defense being lead by Edler, Tanev, Hutton, and Hamonic moving forward wouldn't be too shabby.

Islander are not looking for a draft pick - they are looking for another Travis Hamonic. They would want Ben Hutton or Chris Tanev.

I like Hamonic, but I think he's a right handed Ben Hutton. Not bad, but not the impact player we need (unless we lose Hamhuis).

 

[Jumptheshark]

I see it all the time that the Canucks are thin on D, which yeah, the Nucks don't have an elite D - but that's as it sits. Strong D come out of nowhere from any round and I've seen just about enough evidence to say that wasting a high draft pick on a D is counterproductive...

Would you rather have Ghost or Griffin Reinhart? Karlsson or Ryan Murphy ? Josi or Bogosian ? Weber or Coburn? Tanev or Luke Schenn? Erik Johnson was a 1st overall...PK Subban in the early 40s ---and younger

Doughty, OEL, Ekblad...ok, got that out of the way lmao rare.


So yes. Double shoulder surgery Chychrun and Bonehead Bean will not fix anything.

A center with tenacity is the #1 immediate need. Elite D will be found through any round and could already be in the system. A center? Not so much.

Now: what can the Canucks do (other than McLeod) to get a player like that ? Who do you think would fit perfectly as the Canucks #1 C ? I see Draisatl as the perfect Hank replacement and would give quite a bit to get him. What about you ?

as an oiler fan we sort a have three top C's (McJEsus, Nugie and Leon D) we will be trading either Nugie or Leon D in hope of getting a number 1 D-man

tell any oiler fan that having a number 1 C is more important then a number 1 D(legit number 1 D)