Helene St. James Holland: Mike Babcock extension unlikely before season

[Claypool]

I think he's saying: let me ice the best team I can or I'll find somewhere else to do it. I'm sure Holland telling him that he can't have Jurco this year has him irritated.

Wouldn't be surprised if Mrazek is part of it too. He's been excellent.

If signing Cleary is keeping Jurco off the roster that falls partially on Babcock. He really wanted Cleary back. They way I see it, any roster moves that have to be made due to the lack of cap space is partially the fault of Babcock.

 

[Hckytwn]

I have to wonder which side is preventing the extension from happening?

I can't imagine money being an issue.

I don't think it's money either. I think it's either Holland, location or prospects to win another cup.

On Holland, they might have a great working relationship, but Babcock's "wants" haven't been in sync with the team Kenny's delivered. On location, he might love Detroit, but there might be other places he likes better.

But I agree, if he's not signed by Oct 9th, he's gone, marking yet another "free agency" failure of this front office.

 

[Leafspoison*]

Leaf fan coming in peace with a Babcock question.

Hey everyone.

Just a few questions. Leaf nation is all over Babcock not signing yet. Does anyone know of a reason for this? Most just flat out don't like Carlyle.

In your opinion, are Shanny and Babcock friends or not?

Thanks for any answers and good luck with your season!

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

Hey everyone.

Just a few questions. Leaf nation is all over Babcock not signing yet. Does anyone know of a reason for this? Most just flat out don't like Carlyle.

In your opinion, are Shanny and Babcock friends or not?

Thanks for any answers and good luck with your season!

Just one man's take on the issue:

If both sides wanted a contract signed, it would have been done already. My hunch is that Babcock thinks that he has lost the locker room (or important parts of it) and that it is time to move on. I think this is a bigger issue than any personnel disputes he may have or have had with Holland in recent years.

Just my two cents. I have no clue what the relationship is like between Shanny and Babs. I am curious if he would have interest in the Leaf's job.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

I had the impression that Shanny didn't get along with Babs when they were here at the same time. But I doubt there's any actual evidence of that.

 

[Heaton]

I had the impression that Shanny didn't get along with Babs when they were here at the same time. But I don't there's any actual evidence of that.

And getting along with him as a player is completely different than him coaching other players. Selanne hates Bruce Boudreau, but the players who play well under him seem to like him. That's the issue.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

And getting along with him as a player is completely different than him coaching other players. Selanne hates Bruce Boudreau, but the players who play well under him seem to like him. That's the issue.

Shanny seems like a smart enough guy, I was just reflecting on Shanahan's last season here. I'm sure if he had the opportunity to hire Babcock, he would.

 

[HisNoodliness]

So I'll give my opinion on Babcock leaving and everything first. I honestly sort of want him gone. We could use a change of pace and the veteran-run team is getting old. If he begins to use our youth adequately, I'll probably feel differently as he is an incredible coach. I also think he's comfortable in Detroit and is going to be here for a long time. He likes Holland, and he likes his team. I'd be very surprised if he moves on.

As far as why he hasn't signed yet, I'm not sure. Most of the articles and his statements I've seen suggest two possibilities. The first is just that it isn't a big deal. He doesn't need a contract right now, and he has no reason to sign one immediately. He might as well wait and see if the team tanks or something. The other strong possibility is that he gets a little bit more power because of the contract. He has the "Give me this roster or I walk" card to play. Now the third possibility is he wants out, but I haven't seen anything to suggest that. So we'll just have to wait.
As far as Shanny goes, they obviously know and have worked with one another, and I'd assume they like each other. But I honestly don't know. If Babcock does leave, I have no idea where he'd go. I guess Shanahan in Toronto is appealing, but I'm sure he can find a connection to almost any team, so for you guys I wouldn't say he's a slam dunk to go there.
That's my two cents. I didn't feel like finding sources, but I'm sure a google News search of "babcock" will give you everything you need.

 

[Leafspoison*]

So I'll give my opinion on Babcock leaving and everything first. I honestly sort of want him gone. We could use a change of pace and the veteran-run team is getting old. If he begins to use our youth adequately, I'll probably feel differently as he is an incredible coach. I also think he's comfortable in Detroit and is going to be here for a long time. He likes Holland, and he likes his team. I'd be very surprised if he moves on.

As far as why he hasn't signed yet, I'm not sure. Most of the articles and his statements I've seen suggest two possibilities. The first is just that it isn't a big deal. He doesn't need a contract right now, and he has no reason to sign one immediately. He might as well wait and see if the team tanks or something. The other strong possibility is that he gets a little bit more power because of the contract. He has the "Give me this roster or I walk" card to play. Now the third possibility is he wants out, but I haven't seen anything to suggest that. So we'll just have to wait.
As far as Shanny goes, they obviously know and have worked with one another, and I'd assume they like each other. But I honestly don't know. If Babcock does leave, I have no idea where he'd go. I guess Shanahan in Toronto is appealing, but I'm sure he can find a connection to almost any team, so for you guys I wouldn't say he's a slam dunk to go there.
That's my two cents. I didn't feel like finding sources, but I'm sure a google News search of "babcock" will give you everything you need.

Thanks. That is a nice take on it.

 

[Dotter]

Just one man's take on the issue:

If both sides wanted a contract signed, it would have been done already. My hunch is that Babcock thinks that he has lost the locker room (or important parts of it) and that it is time to move on. I think this is a bigger issue than any personnel disputes he may have or have had with Holland in recent years.

Just my two cents. I have no clue what the relationship is like between Shanny and Babs. I am curious if he would have interest in the Leaf's job.

I don't get that hunch at all. Datsuyk, Kronwall and Zetterberg play well under him. They seem to even have a little 'pull' with him, he seems to respect their opinion. Aside from a few head bumps with Tatar, the kids seem to look up to him. They know his credentials and know he is the guy to make them (and their career) the best it can be. He simply demands the best.

So besides Dats, Zetter, Kronner, and the kids... who matters? Kyle ****ing Quincey?

He might have lost Hull, Shanny, Yzerman, Hasek back in the day because Babcock was a young punk in their eyes barking orders to world class vets, but that is not the case here.

My gut is telling me they are focusing on hockey right now. He might want something intangible in his contract not money related. Or maybe his wife is being a flake.

To the OP, I don't think Babcock and Shanahan can stand each other. I get the impression they pretty much flat out dislike each other. I can't see them ever working together.

 

[Leafspoison*]

Thanks for the insight guys. I appreciate it.

Hopefully we can get a few more opinions on this. It is a very curious debate we have in T.O right now.

If Carlyle gets canned, then one would have to think Shanny would make a move on Babcock, but Babcock is under contract.

 

[Super Cake]

Why are people suggesting that if he hasn't signed before the season starts, he is gone? You know he can sign a contract during the season right? It is not unheard of.

 

[Claypool]

You know he can sign a contract during the season right? It is not unheard of.

Except he's stated many, many times that's he's not negotiating during the season.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

Hey everyone.

Just a few questions. Leaf nation is all over Babcock not signing yet. Does anyone know of a reason for this? Most just flat out don't like Carlyle.

In your opinion, are Shanny and Babcock friends or not?

Thanks for any answers and good luck with your season!

Babcock is tired of not having a roster that is a genuine contender. He wants to win. He's enjoying coaching the flow of talented youngsters we've drafted the last 5 years, but so far none of them show signs of being the kind of elite players that you need to join the likes of LA, Chicago and Boston, and the window on Datsyuk and Zetterberg is closing. He has repeatedly stated publicly that we don't have a Doughty or a Weber etc

Not to mention, he's been here 10 years already. His son is at college, his daughter will go to college next year. Money isn't the issue, he's already one of the highest paid coaches in the league, and Mike Ilitch has deep pockets, so its going to take more than a wheelbarrow full of cash to tempt him to Toronto.

As I said in the thread on the main page, he has repeatedly stressed that he will only leave to go somewhere "where the grass is greener", and sorry, but that isn't Toronto. Your NHL team is worse than ours, and your farm team is worse than ours. He will only leave to join a team that gives him a genuine chance at competing for a cup.
Personally, I believe (and fear) he will go to Pittsburgh. He has a man crush on Crosby, and they just seem like the perfect match of talented but underperforming team and coach who knows how to win.

 

[Super Cake]

Except he's stated many, many times that's he's not negotiating during the season.

For all we know, that could just be a negotiation tactic that he is using to try to get more money out of Holland.

 

[Chance on Chance]

For all we know, that could just be a negotiation tactic that he is using to try to get more money out of Holland.

I highly doubt money is an issue

 

[SirloinUB]

Except he's stated many, many times that's he's not negotiating during the season.

I think the bigger issue is the media distraction rather than actually negotiating mid-season. Recent articles have suggested so at least

 

[Frk It]

I think the bigger issue is the media distraction than actually negotiating mid-season. Recent articles have suggest so

That's the impression I get as well.

 

[Super Cake]

I highly doubt money is an issue

Money night not be the issue or it in fact may be an issue.

Look, all i am just trying to say is that i really wouldn't worry about it yet.

I also really wouldn't pay that much attention to what these guys say to the media. These guys are good at providing misdirections in what they say

 

[Actual Thought*]

Maybe Babs is betting on himself. If he makes a deep playoff run he will get a better deal. If he wins the cup he will get an even better deal.

 

[detredWINgs]

Hey everyone.

Just a few questions. Leaf nation is all over Babcock not signing yet. Does anyone know of a reason for this? Most just flat out don't like Carlyle.

In your opinion, are Shanny and Babcock friends or not?

Thanks for any answers and good luck with your season!

Babcock won't go to the Leafs if Pittsburgh is an option. Which is almost a guarantee since Johnston is on for just a year. If he's leaving Detroit, it's because Holland repeatedly fails to get the guys that Babcock openly wants. For the past several years Babs has wanted a goal scorer, a big bodied top sixer, and right-handed defenseman. He's made these requests via the media, so it's undoubtedly been an ongoing dialogue between he and Holland. In response, Holland has turned around and handed him **** on a stick. With that in mind, the Pens or another organization that has a recent history of actually landing star free agents and being on the trade lists of guys with NM/TC's - unlike Toronto - will be where he lands.

 

[detredWINgs]

Money night not be the issue or it in fact may be an issue.

Look, all i am just trying to say is that i really wouldn't worry about it yet.

I also really wouldn't pay that much attention to what these guys say to the media. These guys are good at providing misdirections in what they say

Money is absolutely not an issue whatsoever. The Wings made Babcock the highest-paid coach in the NHL last time he was re-signed. They'll have no problem doing it again. This is a team that has spent $20-50M less on salary than it was in the years leading up to the cap when they had a $90M payroll. This is a team who potentially lit $2.5M on fire because of "an oath."

If Babcock asks for $5M with a sound argument as to why he thinks he deserves that money, it's his.

 

[Dotter]

Money is absolutely not an issue whatsoever. The Wings made Babcock the highest-paid coach in the NHL last time he was re-signed. They'll have no problem doing it again. This is a team that has spent $20-50M less on salary than it was in the years leading up to the cap when they had a $90M payroll. This is a team who potentially lit $2.5M on fire because of "an oath."

If Babcock asks for $5M with a sound argument as to why he thinks he deserves that money, it's his.

Could be over term or intangibles. Maybe Babcock wants 3 years and Holland wants 2 yrs to see where Blashill is at come 2016/17.

 

[Frk It]

Babcock won't go to the Leafs if Pittsburgh is an option. Which is almost a guarantee since Johnston is on for just a year. If he's leaving Detroit, it's because Holland repeatedly fails to get the guys that Babcock openly wants. For the past several years Babs has wanted a goal scorer, a big bodied top sixer, and right-handed defenseman. He's made these requests via the media, so it's undoubtedly been an ongoing dialogue between he and Holland. In response, Holland has turned around and handed him **** on a stick. With that in mind, the Pens or another organization that has a recent history of actually landing star free agents and being on the trade lists of guys with NM/TC's - unlike Toronto - will be where he lands.

Babcock has been coach of Team Canada for 5 years, and is a pro-Canadian guy. Toronto is the biggest hockey market in the league and Canada by a mile.

I see a lot of reasons tying him to the Leafs makes sense.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Babcock has been coach of Team Canada for 5 years, and is a pro-Canadian guy. Toronto is the biggest hockey market in the league and Canada by a mile.

I see a lot of reasons tying him to the Leafs makes sense.

When does Babs daughter graduate High School? Next year or the year after. Because I know that he said that he wont leave Detroit until She graduates just wondering.