Confirmed with Link: Hartley Fired Discuss (also Cloutier)

[1989]

Top candidates I'd like to see brought in are Boudreau and Boucher for their NHL experience. Green is definitely an intriguing name - perhaps if he was brought on as an assistant first, I'd be more amenable to that sort of arrangement.

I feel as if the contract the Flames will offer will be a relatively long one for a coach - 4 or 5 season term.

 

[SKRusty]

I feel like it is premature to count out Marc Crawford. I think that he could be a good fit with this group.

I also liked Playfair while he was here.

I disagree with your views on Crawford. Crawford has had his best successes with established players and leaders. When it comes to building teams he does not have that track record.

I am torn between going with Hunter or Leaman that understand the youth or going with Boudreau, Dineen, or Green.

Green and Dineen really intrigue me in that they worked for everything they got in the NHL. Both have great track records and are ready for the jump.

Boudreau is the safe bet but I don't know if he brings as much as Green or Dineen.

Leaman or Hunter would set the tone for a changing of the guard and philosophy in how the players are handled.

Leaman is the sleeper IMO. Treliving has seen him develop Jankowski, Gilles and Gilmour. The scouts have seen much of what Leaman has done including the championship drives.

 

[Volica]

I hate agreeing with Eric Francis but I think he has a point.

I don't know if a rookie NHL coach is the way to go here.

 

[bWo*]

Hunter as in Dale Hunter?

 

[Ace Rimmer]

I disagree with your views on Crawford. Crawford has had his best successes with established players and leaders. When it comes to building teams he does not have that track record.

He did quite well with the Canucks and even moreso, the Nordiques/Avalanche - both were in rebuilding mode when Crawford was hired.

 

[Calculon]

Excellent.

Would like Boudreau or Boucher possibly please and thanks.

 

[Volica]

Boudreau to me is the guy. Just the fact he knows how to adapt; it means a lot. When his team couldn't score; he bogged down the game and played to their strengths.

Just seems like a fit. Look how good the PP, PK and defence was in Anaheim under him. Not saying he has the same pieces; but I'd argue the D corps here is equal if not better than Anaheim's.

 

[Lunatik]

Why do people keep suggesting Boucher? He was a ****ing terrible coach

 

[SKRusty]

He did quite well with the Canucks and even moreso, the Nordiques/Avalanche - both were in rebuilding mode when Crawford was hired.

The Avs were a stacked line-up when Crawford took the helm. Sakic was in his prime, Adam Foote, Claude Lemieux, Kamensky, Ricci, Keane, Lefebrve, Lechyshyn Krupp and Roy in net.

Vancouver had Messier, Mogilny, Linden (after 2000), Jovanoski, Naslund, Zezel, Gagner, Brad May and Hedican.

In Dallas Marc didn't do well developing the young players he needed to plug into the line-up..

 

[Calculon]

It's been said all season what with all the 'that guy scored' moments. Hartley's defensive system was abysmal, especially in front of the net, where seemingly every opposing player was allowed to skate into the slot unhindered. Addressing that alone would make whatever goalie the Flames bring in look even better.

Unfortunately, it'll probably take the players some time to exorcise the bad defensive habits but with a proper coach that can actually instill a viable NHL calibre defensive system, this team can take the next step into becoming an actual contender.

 

[1989]

Why do people keep suggesting Boucher? He was a ****ing terrible coach

You're right. I (mistakenly) recalled for some reason that he was half-decent but upon a quick Wikipedia search, it turns out that he's not even good enough for the Swiss leagues.

Boudreau and Green for me.

 

[SKRusty]

Boudreau to me is the guy. Just the fact he knows how to adapt; it means a lot. When his team couldn't score; he bogged down the game and played to their strengths.

Just seems like a fit. Look how good the PP, PK and defence was in Anaheim under him. Not saying he has the same pieces; but I'd argue the D corps here is equal if not better than Anaheim's.

All great points but is Bruce able to be signed. Dineen or Green would both be good alternatives.

Dale Hunter and Leaman also have their strengths. IMO Boucher, Carlyle, Crawford, and Wilson are all "hockey past".

 

[Fig]

A strange funny connection... Crawford replaced Hartley for the ZSC Lions. Hartley replaced Crawford for the Avs.

Not saying we'll hire him, but those saying that Crawford won't make it as an NHL coach again... should consider the same comments made about Hartley.

 

[Isles5513]

The flames should hire someone off HF, since after all even the average HF posters have more hockey knowledge and know how to coach a team better than most, if not all NHL coaches.

 

[Isles5513]

Hunter as in Dale Hunter?

Don't want him because of certain events in the 90s.

 

[bWo*]

Don't want him because of certain events in the 90s.

Don't want him because of him employing that God forsaken 6 goalie system where the team turtles after going up 1-0 and a players like Bollig would have more ice time than Gaudreau. Been there, done that

 

[Dertell]

Don't want him because of certain events in the 90s.

Don't want him because he's a controlled zone entry sinkhole.

 

[Isles5513]

Don't want him because of him employing that God forsaken 6 goalie system where the team turtles after going up 1-0 and a players like Bollig would have more ice time than Gaudreau. Been there, done that

Wow has he really been doing that in the OHL? I don't really follow juniors too much, just the teams that have my teams prospects and this year has been an exception where I took a break and stopped watching in like January and finally started up in the last games of the regular season.

 

[TkachuckNotTkaczuk]

Overall Change in Style of Play Treliving Wants

I don't know if this maybe should be it's own thread but discussion on what style Treliving wants the team to play and the affect it has on the team makeup? (If a mod thinks this should just be in the Hartley fired thread please go ahead and move it)

It is not unknown that Treliving wants the team to play as a heavier puck possession team. As such, do we see a large change in the personnel we currently have? Can the players we have currently surrounding the core change enough and become players that dramatically increase the puck possession? Can the core, ie Johnny Gaudreau play a cycle game? (Not that he'll be the heavy part of a cycle but add in heavy body Monahan and ? to do the heavy work) or do we somewhat employ a different style when he's out there? Our systems employed by Hartley was very open and the new system will be much, much strict, tighter and ALL guys will have to buy in fully.

Will we see trades to address our size and weight this offseason? I think we have some big bodies on the farm that could help address that but are they skilled enough or ready to do it at the next level?

Besides new coach, a whole new system will be brought in and this deserves as much attention as a new coach's name.

 

[Anglesmith]

It's been said all season what with all the 'that guy scored' moments. Hartley's defensive system was abysmal, especially in front of the net, where seemingly every opposing player was allowed to skate into the slot unhindered. Addressing that alone would make whatever goalie the Flames bring in look even better.

Unfortunately, it'll probably take the players some time to exorcise the bad defensive habits but with a proper coach that can actually instill a viable NHL calibre defensive system, this team can take the next step into becoming an actual contender.

The only thing that keeps me from agreeing with that assessment is that the difference between last year and this year defensively was night and day. The "that guy scores" moments were minimal the season before. We really clamped down on odd-man rushes and stuck to the front of the net like glue. This season was completely different. The same coach oversaw both teams.

I really want to stress that I'm not going based on the goals against numbers, I'm just saying that last year, that was one thing that really stuck out to me. We'd get outshot-attempted, sure, but the biggest danger was volume of chances against, not the quality. We'd regularly win games where Corsi was against us, but it didn't really feel like our goaltender needed to play exceptionally well. And of course, this occurred over a period of time that would have evened out "luck."

I think what really is clear is that the players this season were not working for Bob the way they did the year before. Not that they weren't working hard, because I think we have hard-working guys. I just don't think they had anywhere near the level of discipline. If Bob lost the room a little bit, or if the players were starting to tune him out, then I guess at the end of the day he needed to go.

 

[TkachuckNotTkaczuk]

NVM discussion was about different system Treliving wants.

 

[bWo*]

Wow has he really been doing that in the OHL? I don't really follow juniors too much, just the teams that have my teams prospects and this year has been an exception where I took a break and stopped watching in like January and finally started up in the last games of the regular season.

From his time in the big leagues. He left a sour taste

 

[Calculon]

Dale Hunter would be a disaster. Crawford and Wilson are relics that don't have a place in the NHL going forward. Carlyle would be a poor fit for this roster; might also be a dinosaur.

Could see Treliving inquire about Stevens depending what the Kings do with Sutter. But it kind of seems like Sutter isn't re-signing there so, Steven probably isn't a viable option.

Wouldn't be completely surprised if they went with a rookie coach but for now, I'm still inclined to think Boudreau, whatever Treliving might say:

 

[1989]

Regarding discipline, 2015's success was also based heavily on the outstanding powerplays-for/against ratio, and the subsequent scoring successes the Flames enjoyed while being on the man advantage. Unfortunately, that kind of statistic is unsustainable, and the special teams didn't capitalize nearly as well this past season.

 

[L13]

I don't know if this maybe should be it's own thread but discussion on what style Treliving wants the team to play and the affect it has on the team makeup? (If a mod thinks this should just be in the Hartley fired thread please go ahead and move it)

It is not unknown that Treliving wants the team to play as a heavier puck possession team. As such, do we see a large change in the personnel we currently have? Can the players we have currently surrounding the core change enough and become players that dramatically increase the puck possession? Can the core, ie Johnny Gaudreau play a cycle game? (Not that he'll be the heavy part of a cycle but add in heavy body Monahan and ? to do the heavy work) or do we somewhat employ a different style when he's out there? Our systems employed by Hartley was very open and the new system will be much, much strict, tighter and ALL guys will have to buy in fully.

Will we see trades to address our size and weight this offseason? I think we have some big bodies on the farm that could help address that but are they skilled enough or ready to do it at the next level?

Besides new coach, a whole new system will be brought in and this deserves as much attention as a new coach's name.

Johnny Gaudreau can play whatever style of game you ask of him. Just. Don't worry about it.

I forget the specific games, unfortunately, but there were a couple of games toward the end of the season in which we cycled the puck and played a possession game and that was the best we'd looked all year. All I want is a coach who encourages the players to do that every night.