Euro: Group F: FRA vs. POR, GER vs. HUN, 6/23/2021

[Live in the Now]

Alright sooooooo as long as Portugal doesn't get absolutely smashed they're in good shape here. That being said if Hungary stole three points then it puts Portugal and Germany into tiebreakers for third place. The Hungary game is in Germany though, and I don't think anyone should be thinking that'll happen.

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[misterchainsaw]

Alright sooooooo as long as Portugal doesn't get absolutely smashed they're in good shape here. That being said if Hungary stole three points then it puts Portugal and Germany into tiebreakers for third place. The Hungary game is in Germany though, and I don't think anyone should be thinking that'll happen.

That would be wild (and Germany would be 3rd due to their H2H win with Portugal going home regardless of scorelines assuming France beats Portugal to create the tiebreaker). But yeah, considering the stage and where the game is being played that result would probably be even more shocking than Germany losing to North Macedonia in qualifying.

 

[Bures Elbow]

Santos special version 2.0 now that he knows what's required to reach the knockout stage.

I apologize to all fans watching the game (Evilo included ) in advance, as he'll play for the draw.

 

[cgf]

Santos special version 2.0 now that he knows what's required to reach the knockout stage.

I apologize to all fans watching the game (Evilo included ) in advance, as he'll play for the draw.

I'm kind of expecting you to draw this one before beating Belgium in the round of 16.

 

[Bures Elbow]

I'm kind of expecting you to draw this one before beating Belgium in the round of 16.

I think there's a larger percentage of us playing Holland in the Round of 16. Yet I think it's a big mistake to look too far ahead based on how we're playing, it doesn't matter if we're better on paper than Holland or even Belgium (though it's close in the latters case), and that their vulnerable defenses and lack of midfield balance with tons of available space suits us, we're playing poorly and look dreadful.

Need a huge match vs France where we show actual quality with a proper starting XI, then build on from that.

I mean, look at the positioning of both Danilo/William:

Shocking.

. Danilo should have dropped in between the Cb's, freeing one of them up to mark further outside which in turn pushes the fullback onto the opposing teams wingback, which is how you play vs a 3-5-2.

Santos came out yesterday and said that was his initial plan, and it got "lost in translation". Which screams to me he's attempting to cover his ass after the fact. Still no explanation in regards to how he set us up to not even pressure them and allow them to pick passes at leisure through our final third?

Semedo isn't great, he plays far too narrow defensively and should have adjusted his positioning after the first 15 minutes where any profesional should see whats happening when being over loaded, teammates should have spotted it as well. Yet a lot of this rests on Santos getting eviscerated tactically and the DM's not covering the spaces they should have been.

Danilo isn't the player he was after blowing his achilles, no where near as quick or mobile, which is a shame because he was a beast defensively who covered every blade of grass on the pitch. And William doesn't even dribble out of the press or circulate play the way he used to a few years back, he's done. Or at the very least needs a lot more consistent playing time at a high level to recapture his form and confidence.

Changes need to be made, energy and hunger need to be injected in the XI. Felix, Nuno Mendes ( if it), Sanches, and I'd risk throwing Palhinha in there. Unseasoned, no experience, but he's an absolute tank and dog who covers km's on the field and wins tons of 50/50 balls. Useless on the ball but with Felix/Bruno Fernandes/Bernardo Silva/Sanches he just needs to keep it moving while covering the backline. We might still lose because France is a fantastic team, but if we do we need to make it close and show a lot of what we can play as well.

 

[Bures Elbow]

For some reason the images didn't show in my initial post when inserting the links.

 

[cgf]

As long as you get your defense sorted out enough to draw with france, I think you'll be in good shape against one of those big teams who are vulnerable at the back.

 

[Savi]

 

[Moncherry]

Some good results for Portugal today with regards to the third-place table, so unless they get slaughtered by France, they should be through. I would normally be confident of that not happening, but after the Germany game, I'm not so sure. I thought losing to both Germany and France was always a distinct possibility, but even in my most cynical expectations I never thought they would get crushed like that.

Some line-up changes I think need to happen if Portugal is going to have any success against France:

-Danilo/William midfield needs to f*** off. This goes without saying. Even if you want to have a double DM pivot, you have better options on the bench. Palhinha had a way better season than Carvalho and Neves at least provides some semblance of an offensive threat.

-Rafa Silva needs to stop being the first-choice attacking substitute. The guy wasn't even a starter on an average Benfica team and had a bad season, by rights he shouldn't even be in the squad. Pote, Felix, and Guedes are all much better than him. Ridiculous how none of them have seen any playing time yet twice now Santos has thrown on Rafa.

-Nuno Mendes should maybe take Guerreiro's place. This may be a huge gamble but he might already be the best Portuguese LB and I haven't been impressed by Guerreiro at all. Perhaps even try one of them at RB instead of Semedo.

If Portugal manages to escape the group and play the Netherlands, they have a good chance of making a run to the semis like they usually do. A path through Netherlands/Wales/Denmark would be a reprieve after having to play France and Germany.

 

[koyvoo]

Man, that 3rd place spot actually looks as good a path as 1st or 2nd.

 

[Bures Elbow]

------------------------------------Patricio---------------------------------------
-----------------------Pepe-------------------------Dias--------------------------
Anyone----------------------------------------------------------Nuno Mendes
--------------------------Palhinha--------Sanches--------------------------------
Bernardo/Jota--------------Bruno Fernandes/Bernardo--------------Felix
------------------------------------Ronaldo-----------------------------------------

Bruno Fernandes looks so spent and legless, he might need to be benched based on these first few games. Bernardo to play the role he excelled at with Man City when he replaced De Bruyne in the middle...If both play Jota on the bench.

I expect Santos to play a midfield of Danilo-Neves-Sanches/Moutinho though and God knows who in attack with Ronaldo.

 

[cgf]

Looks like the group Winner will get Switzerland as long as group B's 3rd place team (Russia, 3pts, -5 GD) doesn't somehow make it. Ukraine is the other possibility....but I think that would require two of: Croatia/Scottland draw, Spain beats Slovakia by more than 5 goals, or France beats Portugal by more than 6 goals.

Runner up will play the winner of Group D (England or Czech Rep.)

3rd place (if advancing) will face the winner of group B (Belgium) or C (Netherlands), with the winner of group C being more likely.
- If 3rd place teams from groups A, C, D, & F advance, then group F's 3rd place team gets Belgium.
- If it's groups A, B, C, & F, or groups A, C/D, E, & F, then it'll be the Netherlands.

 

[Albatros]

Finland is 3rd in group B (1:3) rather than Russia, regardless Portugal would have to lose by four to be overtaken by them.

 

[cgf]

Finland is 3rd in group B (1:3) rather than Russia, regardless Portugal would have to lose by four to be overtaken by them.

Whoops, my bad. 3pts & -2 is still unlikely to cut it but much more plausible.

 

[Suiteness]

Santos special version 2.0 now that he knows what's required to reach the knockout stage.

I apologize to all fans watching the game (Evilo included ) in advance, as he'll play for the draw.

Trying to play football against that track team is how you get smashed. Both managers would rather not have the ball so ya, this game will probably be uber crap.

 

[Eisen]

Müller is out for the game. Knee injury.

 

[cgf]

Müller is out for the game. Knee injury.

Hummels & Ilkay are also questionable after missing training yesterday. Kroos had a light training, but Hofmann returned to practice.

If all of Müller, Hummels & Gundogan miss this match, I'm hoping for:

Gnabry
Sane/Musiala - Havertz
Gosens - Kimmich/Kroos - Goretzka - Kimmich/Hofmann
Rüdiger - Süle - Ginter
Neuer

Gnabry - Havertz
Gosens - Kroos - Goretzka - Hofmann
Kimmich
Rüdiger - Süle - Ginter
Neuer​

 

[luiginb]

With the additions of Depay and Aguero and Fati coming back there's no room for him either way.

 

[Eisen]

Hummels & Ilkay are also questionable after missing training yesterday. Kroos had a light training, but Hofmann returned to practice.

If all of Müller, Hummels & Gundogan miss this match, I'm hoping for:

Gnabry
Sane/Werner - Havertz
Gosens - Kimmich/Kroos - Goretzka - Kimmich/Hofmann
Rüdiger - Süle - Ginter
Neuer

Gnabry - Havertz
Gosens - Kroos - Goretzka - Hofmann
Kimmich
Rüdiger - Süle - Ginter
Neuer​

Kroos had a light training because of work load, apparently, he should be fine. I like that second line up of yours. Kimmich in the centre would close a whole.

 

[cgf]

Kroos had a light training because of work load, apparently, he should be fine. I like that second line up of yours. Kimmich in the centre would close a whole.

Yeah, that's why I still expect him to start...though I'd like for him to get some rest so we can see how Gosens - Kimmich - Goretzka - Hofmann would look in front of the back 3.

And I'm partial to a 3-1-4-2, it's the shape I'd like when Müller is done with the NT...at least unless our CBs get good enough for a back 4.

 

[Eisen]

Yeah, that's why I still expect him to start...though I'd like for him to get some rest so we can see how Gosens - Kimmich - Goretzka - Hofmann would look in front of the back 3.

And I'm partial to a 3-1-4-2, it's the shape I'd like when Müller is done with the NT...at least unless our CBs get good enough for a back 4.

I like the 3-5-2 generally when your outside defenders can't provide offense. I'm not sure if we have someone waiting in the pipeline who can play that.

 

[cgf]

I like the 3-5-2 generally when your outside defenders can't provide offense. I'm not sure if we have someone waiting in the pipeline who can play that.

Do you mean the outside CBs of the back 3 or the wingbacks? If you mean the wingbacks then we should be in great shape with Gosens & Baku leading the way, plus kids like Netz, John, Jakobs, Mbom, Massimo, etc. breaking in at the senior level.

If you're talking about the outside CBs, then...barring Kimmich playing in the back 3...that'll depend on how the next generation develops, but I think Ginter & Klostermann are both good with the ball and guys like Uduokhai & Schlotterbeck can reach a similar over the coming years.

Ultimately we need a new Hummels/Boateng, and until one of our young CBs can hit that top 10 level, the defense will remain a vulnerability that we have to make up for with exceptional keeping & midfielders...so here's to hoping that one of Bella-Kotchap / Arrey-Mbi / Dardai / Mai / Thiaw can take that leap that Tah, Süle & Torunarigha have been unable to.

 

[Eisen]

Do you mean the outside CBs of the back 3 or the wingbacks? If you mean the wingbacks then we should be in great shape with Gosens & Baku leading the way, plus kids like Netz, John, Jakobs, Mbom, Massimo, etc. breaking in at the senior level.

If you're talking about the outside CBs, then...barring Kimmich playing in the back 3...that'll depend on how the next generation develops, but I think Ginter & Klostermann are both good with the ball and guys like Uduokhai & Schlotterbeck can reach a similar over the coming years.

Ultimately we need a new Hummels/Boateng, and until one of our young CBs can hit that top 10 level, the defense will remain a vulnerability that we have to make up for with exceptional keeping & midfielders...so here's to hoping that one of Bella-Kotchap / Arrey-Mbi / Dardai / Mai / Thiaw can take that leap that Tah, Süle & Torunarigha have been unable to.

I mean the wingbacks. With four defenders you have two central defenders and two on the wings. The two one the wings is what I mean. Gosens plays more midfield, from what I have sewn which is admittedly not a lot given he's hiding in Serie A. A guy like Lahm or Lizarazu or that ilk would be nice. Yeah, we need CBs a lot as well. Defense was once the pride of our team. Not much left of it.

 

[cgf]

I mean the wingbacks. With four defenders you have two central defenders and two on the wings. The two one the wings is what I mean. Gosens plays more midfield, from what I have sewn which is admittedly not a lot given he's hiding in Serie A. A guy like Lahm or Lizarazu or that ilk would be nice. Yeah, we need CBs a lot as well. Defense was once the pride of our team. Not much left of it.

Ah gotcha. Netz is more of a traditional fullback like Lahm than an attacking wingback like Gosens, in a back 4 I like Klostermann as a defensive/inverted fullback...and maybe I'm just being a Union homer, but I think Schlotterbeck is a similar talent to Klostermann only left-footed...but you're right in general.

We don't really have any great options for the outside spots in a back 4. That's part of why I favor the back 3 right now...Gosens & Baku can be real difference-makers in the final third with that freedom to push forward; the other part being that having a third CB on the pitch should help with our problem at that spot...even if Flick won't try Kimmich in the back 3; which would be what I would do if I were taking over for Jogi after this tourney:

Gnabry
Müller - Havertz
Gosens - Gundogan - Goretzka - Baku
Kimmich - Ginter* - Klostermann
ter Stegen

Gnabry - Havertz
Gosens - Gundogan - Goretzka - Baku
Neuhaus
Kimmich - Ginter* - Klostermann
ter Stegen

*Rüdiger / Süle / Uduohkai / Schlotterbeck​

 

[TheGreenTBer]

So Portugal can advance with a draw? If so, not much of a point in trying to open up against France or they'll probably get butchered on the counter, and playing catchup against the French is the longest of longshots.