gretzky article on saturday meeting

[chiavsfan]

But they never got a chance because the real deal the Owners were offering on Saturdaye was not what the P.A. had been led to believe it would be.

How do you figure? The owners NEVER said anything about offering a 45-46 million dollar cap. That was all media. If anyone is to blame, it's the players themselves for reading too much into what the media was saying. And again, it was the players who were saying a deal was imminent...I never heard an owner, or a "league source" saying anything about a new proposal

 

[NHLFanSince2020]

However just like nearly everyone on this board who felt the deal was imminent, many players were optomistic because of Bettmans words that a deal "could" get done at $45-$46 million, which they were told the NHLPA was willing to offer.

I'd like to see or hear the quote where Bettman says "that a deal "could" get done at $45-$46 million".

Please provide the quote.

Thanks.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Wrong, the players union when asked to meet with the Owners group on Saturday, suggested that Mario and Wayne be invited to the negotions.

The people leaking the deals may have been players but not the players who were actually involved in the negotiations. However just like nearly everyone on this board who felt the deal was imminent, many players were optomistic because of Bettmans words that a deal "could" get done at $45-$46 million, which they were told the NHLPA was willing to offer. But that was just a tease on Bettmans part and the real basis for his bait and switch tactics that led to the collapse of negotiations.

How were Mario and Gretz used by the P.A.? The P.A. really thought they were being asked to negotiate a workable deal. They asked for Mario and Gretz to be included because as players and owners they had credibility to both camps and not the preconcieved agenda of some of the other Owners who have never played the game. But they never got a chance because the real deal the Owners were offering on Saturdaye was not what the P.A. had been led to believe it would be.

The truly sad part of all of this is not that the players tried any of the things that we all are pointing out to you. Though that is pretty sad. The truly sad part is that they have succeeded with some out in the public, you are a prime example, despite all evidence pointing to them lying and manipulating all of us not to mention the two figures that transcend the game. They get away with it to some degree. I would even bet many players will feel as you do. Now that is sad.

 

[NHLFanSince2020]

The truly sad part of all of this is not that the players tried any of the things that we all are pointing out to you. Though that is pretty sad. The truly sad part is that they have succeeded with some out in the public, you are a prime example, despite all evidence pointing to them lying and manipulating all of us not to mention the two figures that transcend the game. They get away with it to some degree. I would even bet many players will feel as you do. Now that is sad.

Agreed.

The players are trying to get the public hooked on the Kool-Aid.

 

[habfan4]

Wrong, the players union when asked to meet with the Owners group on Saturday, suggested that Mario and Wayne be invited to the negotions.

Take a look at the quotes and sources provided - the contention that the league called the meeting is a fallacy.

Your nic bling, is certainly apropos for someone who so blindly supports the NHLPA.

 

[SENSible1*]

Gretzky and Mario were actively negotiating with the splinter faction in the PA.

When Goodenow regained control, he used the opportunity presented to embarrass them for going behind his back.

Petty and stupid, but not really unexpected considering the source.

 

[Digger12]

Wrong, the players union when asked to meet with the Owners group on Saturday, suggested that Mario and Wayne be invited to the negotions.

The people leaking the deals may have been players but not the players who were actually involved in the negotiations. However just like nearly everyone on this board who felt the deal was imminent, many players were optomistic because of Bettmans words that a deal "could" get done at $45-$46 million, which they were told the NHLPA was willing to offer. But that was just a tease on Bettmans part and the real basis for his bait and switch tactics that led to the collapse of negotiations.

How were Mario and Gretz used by the P.A.? The P.A. really thought they were being asked to negotiate a workable deal. They asked for Mario and Gretz to be included because as players and owners they had credibility to both camps and not the preconcieved agenda of some of the other Owners who have never played the game. But they never got a chance because the real deal the Owners were offering on Saturdaye was not what the P.A. had been led to believe it would be.

What you're saying makes a lot of sense...but only if these events had transpired before Bettman CANCELLED THE SEASON.

Once he dropped that bomb, where is the incentive for the ownership side to call any sort of meeting a mere 3 days after the fact? They'd look like they were cracking if they did, and they've shown little signs of cracking throughout all of this.

Considering the time frame, it makes more logical sense to me that the players initiated the dialogue here.

 

[habfan4]

Gretzky and Mario were actively negotiating with the splinter faction in the PA.

When Goodenow regained control, he used the opportunity presented to embarrass them for going behind his back.

Petty and stupid, but not really unexpected considering the source.

Not trying to be a ***** here, but do you have a source on Wayne and Mario conducting clandestine negotiations with a group from the PA.

 

[bling]

Your nic bling, is certainly apropos for someone who so blindly supports the NHLPA.

Wow! I must be doing something right! My very first personal attack (albeit a weak one)

I have certainly read more quotes that say it was the NHL who asked for the meeting. The obvious confusion comes from the fact that Mario and Gretz were invited or requested to join by the P.A.

 

[Chileiceman]

Wow! I must be doing something right! My very first personal attack (albeit a weak one)

I have certainly read more quotes that say it was the NHL who asked for the meeting. The obvious confusion comes from the fact that Mario and Gretz were invited or requested to join by the P.A.

Other than what Bob Goodenow said whoelse has said that the meeting was called by the league? It would really make no sense for the league to call a meeting to discuss something other than a salary cap. Everything points to the meeting being called by the PA.

 

[habfan4]

Wow! I must be doing something right! My very first personal attack (albeit a weak one).

Well you called me a "Bettman lover" so I thought turn about was fair play.

I have certainly read more quotes that say it was the NHL who asked for the meeting. The obvious confusion comes from the fact that Mario and Gretz were invited or requested to join by the P.A.

I don't think the Gretzky quote I provided earlier was ambiguous about who called the meeting (according to the great one it was the PA) .

 

[SENSible1*]

Not trying to be a ***** here, but do you have a source on Wayne and Mario conducting clandestine negotiations with a group from the PA.

Friday's optimism was fueled first by news that the two sides were set to meet Saturday in New York, and then by the arrival of Hall of Famers Wayne Gretzky and Mario Lemieux to join the discussions.

Late Friday night, there were several reports that Gretzky and Lemieux had actually managed to broker a deal, but both reports were quickly denied by both the NHL and the Players Association.

tsn

similar themes
THN
tampa tribune

 

[bling]

What you're saying makes a lot of sense...but only if these events had transpired before Bettman CANCELLED THE SEASON.

Once he dropped that bomb, where is the incentive for the ownership side to call any sort of meeting a mere 3 days after the fact? They'd look like they were cracking if they did, and they've shown little signs of cracking throughout all of this.

Considering the time frame, it makes more logical sense to me that the players initiated the dialogue here.

Bettman stuck his d*ck in the meat grinder so to speak, when he made the ambiguous statement about the "possibility" of the NHL being willing to negotiate somewhat higher cap level in the $45 to $46 million range. This was in response to a question in the Q.and A. after the cancelation announcement. (try to deny that and demand a link all you want, but every one of you heard and read that question and Bettman's answer)

By leaving the Owners that tiny bit of leaway, even if he was not authorized to do so, provided proof of the sneaky underhanded weasle he is. Everybody in the free world snatched that bait and began questioning, if they were so close to a resolution than why did Gary have to jump the gun and cancel the season when the two sides were just a few millions apart?

A lot of people got involved at that time and private conversations and side deals and all kinds of crap was flying. The NHL Owners group knew that Bettman had caused this s**tstorm by tossing out the bait. So now it was time for them to do the switch. A conversation was held and a meeting was set up. Some believe it was players some believe it was owners who actually called the meeting and I am inclined to believe it was at the Owners behest. (They needed to offer the "switch".) Which was a rehash of their last restrictive proposal with even less favorable language. There was no basis for compromise and the discussion never got to the cap issue.

Bettman and his cronies only wanted to put on a show of willingness to deal to silence any who questioned his haste in cancelling the season.

 

[Sinurgy]

Bettman stuck his d*ck in the meat grinder so to speak, when he made the ambiguous statement about the "possibility" of the NHL being willing to negotiate somewhat higher cap level in the $45 to $46 million range. This was in response to a question in the Q.and A. after the cancelation announcement. (try to deny that and demand a link all you want, but every one of you heard and read that question and Bettman's answer)

By leaving the Owners that tiny bit of leaway, even if he was not authorized to do so, provided proof of the sneaky underhanded weasle he is. Everybody in the free world snatched that bait and began questioning, if they were so close to a resolution than why did Gary have to jump the gun and cancel the season when the two sides were just a few millions apart?

A lot of people got involved at that time and private conversations and side deals and all kinds of crap was flying. The NHL Owners group knew that Bettman had caused this s**tstorm by tossing out the bait. So now it was time for them to do the switch. A conversation was held and a meeting was set up. Some believe it was players some believe it was owners who actually called the meeting and I am inclined to believe it was at the Owners behest. (They needed to offer the "switch".) Which was a rehash of their last restrictive proposal with even less favorable language. There was no basis for compromise and the discussion never got to the cap issue.

Bettman and his cronies only wanted to put on a show of willingness to deal to silence any who questioned his haste in cancelling the season.

Is it just me or did your tone suddenly change? Weasel...cronies...****storm, dick in meat grinder...you seemed like such an innocent debater in the beginning.

 

[Hockeyfan02]

I'd like to see or hear the quote where Bettman says "that a deal "could" get done at $45-$46 million".

The only thing I've heard Bettman mention anything about something higher than 42.5 million was when a reporter asked him at the press conference Wednesday if the PA had offered 44 million, he said something along the lines of "Wed have to look very hard at that and give it some consideration" but didnt say the owners would accept it.

Good thing Gretzky cleared up the bickering of the two 5 year olds yesterday or this would have gone on for a while. Maybe those two should be focused on getting a deal instead of bickering about who wanted the meeting. I cant see a deal getting done anytime soon when theyre frickin arguing about who called the meeting. Players dropped the ball on this one though. I mean if you're flying to NYC to save the season then it better be to hammer out the big issue instead of focusing on the smaller issues that can be worked out once a cap number is set.

 

[bling]

Is it just me or did your tone suddenly change? Weasel...cronies...****storm, dick in meat grinder...you seemed like such an innocent debater in the beginning.

I was just getting warmed up....

 

[habfan4]

tsn

similar themes
THN
tampa tribune

Thanks for the links, I was out of town this past weekend (ironically in NYC) and didn't get to read/see or hear about any of these negotiation rumours/follies until Monday night.

 

[bling]

http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~84~2725004,00.html

Daly tells Terry Frei that the P.A. asked the league to invite them to a meeting but it was supposed to all hush hush. That kind of explains a couple things, like where Gretz got his idea that is was the NHLPA's show.

Some interesting stuff in this article, but of course all from the NHL perspective. It is Daly he was talking to..

 

[Jaded-Fan]

.......... anyone else notice this added insult, an attempt after this setup to use it to divide the owners?

"Why didn't the union put (a $45-million US salary cap) on the table and see what happened?" Philadelphia Flyers chairman Snider told the Philadelphia Inquirer. "I can't tell you for sure what would have happened, because I don't know. I don't think the union wanted to make a deal.

"But I understand the meeting was held because the players said unequivocally . . . they were coming in with a $45-million offer. To never put it on the table - for any reason - to me, that is flabbergasting."

NHLPA senior director Ted Saskin said Snider should be angry with Bettman, not the union.

"While I appreciate (Snider's) frustration, his anger should be directed toward those people who supposedly work for him (the league office) and should be representing his interests," Saskin told the Inquirer. "I am confident Philadelphia could have operated exceptionally well under our proposed framework, and I am sure that only compounds Ed Snider's concern over how events have unfolded."

http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news;_y...wN0bQ--?slug=cp-nhl_lockout&prov=cp&type=lgns



What a major tool . . .

 

[habfan4]

http://www.denverpost.com/Stories/0,1413,36~84~2725004,00.html

Daly tells Terry Frei that the P.A. asked the league to invite them to a meeting but it was supposed to all hush hush. That kind of explains a couple things, like where Gretz got his idea that is was the NHLPA's show.

Some interesting stuff in this article, but of course all from the NHL perspective. It is Daly he was talking to..

Pure semantics - So the PA asks the league to ask them to a meeting, and this supposed to be different from the PA asking the league to a meeting.

 

[Ar-too]

Daly tells Terry Frei that the P.A. asked the league to invite them to a meeting but it was supposed to all hush hush. That kind of explains a couple things, like where Gretz got his idea that is was the NHLPA's show.

That would seem to be a slight misrepresentation:

NHL executive vice president Bill Daly reflected on the bizarre events Monday, explaining that he called NHLPA president Trevor Linden, a veteran Vancouver Canucks forward, and requested Saturday's meeting. But he said that came only after "a premier player" contacted commissioner Gary Bettman, implying the union's position was softening.

 

[RLC]

Bettman stuck his d*ck in the meat grinder so to speak, when he made the ambiguous statement about the "possibility" of the NHL being willing to negotiate somewhat higher cap level in the $45 to $46 million range. This was in response to a question in the Q.and A. after the cancelation announcement. (try to deny that and demand a link all you want, but every one of you heard and read that question and Bettman's answer)

By leaving the Owners that tiny bit of leaway, even if he was not authorized to do so, provided proof of the sneaky underhanded weasle he is. Everybody in the free world snatched that bait and began questioning, if they were so close to a resolution than why did Gary have to jump the gun and cancel the season when the two sides were just a few millions apart?

A lot of people got involved at that time and private conversations and side deals and all kinds of crap was flying. The NHL Owners group knew that Bettman had caused this s**tstorm by tossing out the bait. So now it was time for them to do the switch. A conversation was held and a meeting was set up. Some believe it was players some believe it was owners who actually called the meeting and I am inclined to believe it was at the Owners behest. (They needed to offer the "switch".) Which was a rehash of their last restrictive proposal with even less favorable language. There was no basis for compromise and the discussion never got to the cap issue.

Bettman and his cronies only wanted to put on a show of willingness to deal to silence any who questioned his haste in cancelling the season.

OH YEA here we go, It's Bettmans fault it always has and always will be. I suppose he is guilty of tearing newborns from their incubators and pitchforking them into german made ovens.

It's just as likely the Goodenow was behind the whole thing, orchestrating the event like a puppeteer pulling strings. Goodenow has mislead the players with a very bad tactic during this CBA negotiation and now with Gretzky saying it was the players that wanted the meeting not the NHL it clear that Boob Goodenow either has no controle over large portions of the NHLPA OR he was behind this whole meeting thing trying to bushwack the NHL into something it is not willing to do.

This will make quite a vocal player meeting next week
Funny thing about hockey players, they respect Wayne Gretzky as a leader and Wayne as a truthfull person at all times. If Goodenow tries to say Wayne is lieing over this meeting thing, he might as well start calculating he severance pay.

Goodenow is like the captain of a sinking ship, he is expected to go down with his ship and he will ask the players to stay the course as the ship sinks to the bottom of the sea. We 700 + 1 should sacrifice ourselves so we all get medels (postumusly)

 

[NHLFanSince2020]

The only thing I've heard Bettman mention anything about something higher than 42.5 million was when a reporter asked him at the press conference Wednesday if the PA had offered 44 million, he said something along the lines of "Wed have to look very hard at that and give it some consideration" but didnt say the owners would accept it.

Thank you.

Anyone else?

Wanna recant your assertion bling?

 

[Greschner4]

Gretzky and Mario were actively negotiating with the splinter faction in the PA.

When Goodenow regained control, he used the opportunity presented to embarrass them for going behind his back.

Petty and stupid, but not really unexpected considering the source.

Yep.

The whole thing was set up by Goodenow and the KoolAid drinkers to gain back control of the union and the negotiations. That's as obvious as can be.

 

[dakota]

Bettman stuck his d*ck in the meat grinder so to speak, when he made the ambiguous statement about the "possibility" of the NHL being willing to negotiate somewhat higher cap level in the $45 to $46 million range. This was in response to a question in the Q.and A. after the cancelation announcement. (try to deny that and demand a link all you want, but every one of you heard and read that question and Bettman's answer)

By leaving the Owners that tiny bit of leaway, even if he was not authorized to do so, provided proof of the sneaky underhanded weasle he is. Everybody in the free world snatched that bait and began questioning, if they were so close to a resolution than why did Gary have to jump the gun and cancel the season when the two sides were just a few millions apart?

A lot of people got involved at that time and private conversations and side deals and all kinds of crap was flying. The NHL Owners group knew that Bettman had caused this s**tstorm by tossing out the bait. So now it was time for them to do the switch. A conversation was held and a meeting was set up. Some believe it was players some believe it was owners who actually called the meeting and I am inclined to believe it was at the Owners behest. (They needed to offer the "switch".) Which was a rehash of their last restrictive proposal with even less favorable language. There was no basis for compromise and the discussion never got to the cap issue.

Bettman and his cronies only wanted to put on a show of willingness to deal to silence any who questioned his haste in cancelling the season.

with the NHLPA worried so much about the "switch" it is not wonder we are not playing hockey... my GOD... Bettman left that out there to get a deal done... players began asking questions... players say well take it... players ask Gretzky and Lemiueum to come... players then say whooooo... we were just kidding... then make it look like the NHL is to blame...

if the NHLPA would stop stooping so low and just be professional about the process and not playing games there would be a deal... why did Goodenow say no cap for all these years and then offer a cap at the last minute? Because his negotiating strategy is wait till last minute... it backfired... and his group is paying the price... now dont make the same mistake twice.