Post-Game Talk: Game 5 - BRUINS crap out in Vegas - VGK 3 BRUINS 1 FINAL

[NDiesel]

He also traded the 2nd pick in the draft and budding superstar Tyler Seguin for what turned out to be nothing (literally), and botched the deal for Iginla that likely gives the B’s a second Cup. FYI, a President’s Trophy and $2.65 will get you an x-large coffee at Dunkin Donuts.

He did an excellent job acquiring Chara, Horton, Campbell, Sides and Recchi among others. However, when Chia got here, he also inherited a young Bergeron and Krejci, Marchand, Lucic, Thomas, Rask and the 5th pick in the draft, so a large chunk of the Cup team was in place already. He was set up in a far better situation than what he’s left Sweeney.

Your post is bang on, except for you would have a President's Trophy AND an x-large coffee at Dunkin Donuts.

 

[bob27]

outside of no-brainer picks like Dougie and Seguin and the very good Pastrnak pick which Chia picks were good?

IIRC he didn't draft a single full-time NHL defenseman the whole time he was here.

Cehlarik, Grzelcyk, O'Gara, Donato, Heinen, Bjork, McIntyre and Johansson are current Bruins top-20 prospects picked by Chiarelli. Spooner and Matt Benning will probably have decent NHL careers. That's not mentioning Krug and Kevan Miller, who were college FA signings. Overall his poor drafting cost him the job, but it was certainly trending up towards the end.

 

[Salem13]

I posted earlier that I think he needed more time and if we are in a rebuild what is wrong with moving Khodobin to give him that time?

Only time will tell.

If we did that today with a injured Rask we would have Subban and McIntyre going forward

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Sweeney was left with plenty of talent, Marchand and Pasta are scorers any GM would love to have. All he really needed to do was get a decent 3rd and 4th line and add a top Dman. So far, this new administration has failed to add anything to aid the core and propel them on a playoff run. I get fans like Sweeney and weren't fans of Chia, my only hope is they hold Sweeney to the same standards so we won't fall into hockey purgatory

Yes, all he needed to do was add a decent 3rd and 4th line (6 players) and a Top pair D.

Other than Pasta, what building blocks did Sweeney inherit? If you use the Chia timeline (5 years), Marchand will be 32 by the time the B’s are on track to win again. Rask 33, Bergeron 35, Krejci 34.

It is amazing to me that you think that Sweeney could have just walked in and continued to do what Chia was doing, trying to hold on for a last ditch run that wasn’t going to happen. The B’s window was over after the Prez Cup year. Sweeney has come in and started the process over by rebuilding a prospect pipeline that was pretty much barren except for Pasta.

Thanks Chia, you are the bestest ever.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Yes, all he needed to do was add a decent 3rd and 4th line (6 players) and a Top pair D.

Other than Pasta, what building blocks did Sweeney inherit? If you use the Chia timeline (5 years), Marchand will be 32 by the time the B’s are on track to win again. Rask 33, Bergeron 35, Krejci 34.

It is amazing to me that you think that Sweeney could have just walked in and continued to do what Chia was doing, trying to hold on for a last ditch run that wasn’t going to happen. The B’s window was over after the Prez Cup year. Sweeney has come in and started the process over by rebuilding a prospect pipeline that was pretty much barren except for Pasta.

Thanks Chia, you are the bestest ever.

this is what I'm afraid of going forward with the Bruins, Sweeney is going to get a pass for years to come.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

this is what I'm afraid of going forward with the Bruins, Sweeney is going to get a pass for years to come.

Yes, ignore all the stuff about rebuilding the prospect pool and integrating youth into an aging lineup and come away with that take. I mean, you can do that stuff overnight.

Good answer.

 

[Don Cherry]

Speaking of trades... when was the last time the Bruins made one?

I think it was the trade that brought us Jimmy Hayes.

 

[LouJersey]

I think it was the trade that brought us Jimmy Hayes.

An NHL player for NHL player trade yes it was....and it was universally applauded for getting rid of Savard's contract and the enigmatic Smith. I wish we kept Smith but whatever, 5/25 he would be getting killed here, even though he wears the A, is a top 6 forward and top line PP and PK'er.

 

[Tampbear]

Yes, all he needed to do was add a decent 3rd and 4th line (6 players) and a Top pair D.

Other than Pasta, what building blocks did Sweeney inherit? If you use the Chia timeline (5 years), Marchand will be 32 by the time the B’s are on track to win again. Rask 33, Bergeron 35, Krejci 34.

It is amazing to me that you think that Sweeney could have just walked in and continued to do what Chia was doing, trying to hold on for a last ditch run that wasn’t going to happen. The B’s window was over after the Prez Cup year. Sweeney has come in and started the process over by rebuilding a prospect pipeline that was pretty much barren except for Pasta.

Thanks Chia, you are the bestest ever.

I suppose we should just ignore Hamilton and Krug along with Bjork and Heinen? I'm not arguing Sweeney should be doing what Chia was doing, simply that Chiarelli deserves more respect for his time here. The prospect closet wasn't as good, but the team handed over to Sweeney was much better with many high value players, beyond the two already mentioned there is Bergeron, Marchand, Pasta, Rask, Krejci, and Lucic some of which he used to rebuild the prospect pool overnight. The team does look very good going forward but he wasn't able to accomplish this with nothing to start with. I don't mind Sweeney as GM at all, I can understand why Chiarelli was ousted even if I don't agree with all of the reasons, but I do think Chiarelli did a better job while here than he was given credit for.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

I suppose we should just ignore Hamilton and Krug along with Bjork and Heinen? I'm not arguing Sweeney should be doing what Chia was doing, simply that Chiarelli deserves more respect for his time here. The prospect closet wasn't as good, but the team handed over to Sweeney was much better with many high value players, beyond the two already mentioned there is Bergeron, Marchand, Pasta, Rask, Krejci, and Lucic some of which he used to rebuild the prospect pool overnight. The team does look very good going forward but he wasn't able to accomplish this with nothing to start with. I don't mind Sweeney as GM at all, I can understand why Chiarelli was ousted even if I don't agree with all of the reasons, but I do think Chiarelli did a better job while here than he was given credit for.

All those players were aging and most had been signed by Chia to long term deals with NMC’s. I already said that I thought Chia did a great job in the first half of his tenure in Boston, but once they got to the top he lost his fastball.

Krug was a FA that supposedly had a relationship with Sweeney who was doing a lot of scouting at the time. Hamilton was a no-brainer that fell into the B’s laps on draft day. They were supposedly very interested in Ryan Murphy, who has yet to establish himself as an NHL player. Thank God that wasn’t the pick.

Heinen and Bjork, as much as I like them both haven't done anything yet. The only real young productive player that Sweeney inherited was Pasta (who he and PJ scored in Sweden).

The situations are apples and oranges. Chia inherited a team with a bunch of young core guys and he had to go out and add pieces like Horton, Sides, Recchi, Peverley. Sweeney inherited those same guys, but now on the back 9 of their careers. In my mind, he’s trying to do the hardest thing in sports, rebuild while still icing a competitive team that can challenge for the playwoffs.

 

[Don Cherry]

An NHL player for NHL player trade yes it was....and it was universally applauded for getting rid of Savard's contract and the enigmatic Smith. I wish we kept Smith but whatever, 5/25 he would be getting killed here, even though he wears the A, is a top 6 forward and top line PP and PK'er.

Did Jimmy find a new team? I don't remember him being invited to anyones camp but I might have missed it.

 

[LouJersey]

Did Jimmy find a new team? I don't remember him being invited to anyones camp but I might have missed it.

3rd liner for the Devils

 

[Don Cherry]

3rd liner for the Devils

I see. Thanks

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Well, his last 3 years were a cup final (one of the greatest runs we've seen), Presidents trophy and missing the playoffs once by a point after 7 straight years in the playoffs. Hardly a disaster, and I doubt Sweeney even comes close to achieving Chia's so called worst years.

Sweeney has to clean up Chiarelli's mess. Chiarelli also joined the B's at the perfect time. He made a few very good moves, more poor ones overall in hindsight.

The Boychuk trade singlehandedly killed the season and he only managed to trade a #2 in his prime at $3 million for second round picks.

 

[Otherworld]

If we did that today with a injured Rask we would have Subban and McIntyre going forward

Vegas is dealing with the same issue. Time will tell.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Sweeney has to clean up Chiarelli's mess. Chiarelli also joined the B's at the perfect time. He made a few very good moves, more poor ones overall in hindsight.

The Boychuk trade singlehandedly killed the season and he only managed to trade a #2 in his prime at $3 million for second round picks.

No mess had been cleaned up. We have problems everywhere, many created by Sweeney. If ditching Chia was such a great idea I want to see results, not wait and see and excuses almost 3 years later. If he wins and dominates the NHL like Chia I will be all in on Sweeny, until then heck no, not buying any of this if they play poorly

 

[LouJersey]

I see. Thanks

No problem. I don't think he'll last there too long.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

No mess had been cleaned up. We have problems everywhere, many created by Sweeney. If ditching Chia was such a great idea I want to see results, not wait and see and excuses almost 3 years later. If he wins and dominates the NHL like Chia I will be all in on Sweeny, until then heck no, not buying any of this if they play poorly

Had Chiarelli stuck around I find it tough to imagine the Bruins would be any closer to a Cup! He had the team trending down sharply.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

No mess had been cleaned up. We have problems everywhere, many created by Sweeney. If ditching Chia was such a great idea I want to see results, not wait and see and excuses almost 3 years later. If he wins and dominates the NHL like Chia I will be all in on Sweeny, until then heck no, not buying any of this if they play poorly

- Chia year 1 (2006-07):

Hires Dave Lewis and misses playoffs.


- Chia year 2 (2007-08)

Fires Lewis/Hires Clode. Loses in 1st round to Habs in 7 games.


- Chia year 3 (2008-09)

Finished 1st in East. Upset in 2nd round by CAR.


- Chia year 4 (2009-10)


Finished 3rd in Northeast. Upsets BUF in 1st round. Epic collapse to PHI in 2nd round.


Chia year 5 (2010-11)

Finished 1st in Northeast (4th or 5th seed). Wins SC after beating MTL (7), PHI (4), TB (7), VAN (7).


Chia year 6 (2011-12)

Finished 1st in Northeast. Upset in 1st round to WAS.


Chia year 7 (2012-13)

Finished 2nd in Northeast during lockout shortened season. Somehow survives TOR upset in 1st round. Beats NYR in 5, PIT in 4, loses in 6 to CHI in SCF.


Chia year 8 (2013-14)

Finished 1st in NHL. Upset by MTL in 2nd round.


Chia year 9 (2014-15)

Missed playoffs by 2 Pts (5-9-1 last 15 games). Chia fired.


Not exactly the bed of roses that you make it out to be, with lots of ups and downs, and the team definitely trending down the last 2 seasons before Chia was fired. As I have said repeatedly, the B’s Chia took over and the B’s Sweeney took over were two completely different animals. Chia had a young core, the 5th pick in Kessel (equivalent to Pasta) who started producing right away, and the Cap space to sign Chara and Savard. I give him full props for making the right additions and leading the B’s to a Cup. However, this idea that Chia walks on water and Sweeney is being held to a different standard is ridiculous. I can tell you right now that if Sweeney had hired Dave Lewis and fired him a year later, people would want his head on a freaking platter. If Thomas doesn’t stand on his head and Horton doesn’t deliver Game 7 in OT, Clode likely gets fired, and who knows what happens?

It will be interesting to see where the B’s are in year 5 of Sweeney’s tenure (the year Chia won his Cup). I’m not sure they will win a Cup that year, but if things keep progressing they should be contenders every year.

 

[KrejciMVP]

- Chia year 1 (2006-07):

Hires Dave Lewis and misses playoffs.


- Chia year 2 (2007-08)

Fires Lewis/Hires Clode. Loses in 1st round to Habs in 7 games.


- Chia year 3 (2008-09)

Finished 1st in East. Upset in 2nd round by CAR.


- Chia year 4 (2009-10)


Finished 3rd in Northeast. Upsets BUF in 1st round. Epic collapse to PHI in 2nd round.


Chia year 5 (2010-11)

Finished 1st in Northeast (4th or 5th seed). Wins SC after beating MTL (7), PHI (4), TB (7), VAN (7).


Chia year 6 (2011-12)

Finished 1st in Northeast. Upset in 1st round to WAS.


Chia year 7 (2012-13)

Finished 2nd in Northeast during lockout shortened season. Somehow survives TOR upset in 1st round. Beats NYR in 5, PIT in 4, loses in 6 to CHI in SCF.


Chia year 8 (2013-14)

Finished 1st in NHL. Upset by MTL in 2nd round.


Chia year 9 (2014-15)

Missed playoffs by 2 Pts (5-9-1 last 15 games). Chia fired.


Not exactly the bed of roses that you make it out to be, with lots of ups and downs, and the team definitely trending down the last 2 seasons before Chia was fired. As I have said repeatedly, the B’s Chia took over and the B’s Sweeney took over were two completely different animals. Chia had a young core, the 5th pick in Kessel (equivalent to Pasta) who started producing right away, and the Cap space to sign Chara and Savard. I give him full props for making the right additions and leading the B’s to a Cup. However, this idea that Chia walks on water and Sweeney is being held to a different standard is ridiculous. I can tell you right now that if Sweeney had hired Dave Lewis and fired him a year later, people would want his head on a freaking platter. If Thomas doesn’t stand on his head and Horton doesn’t deliver Game 7 in OT, Clode likely gets fired, and who knows what happens?

It will be interesting to see where the B’s are in year 5 of Sweeney’s tenure (the year Chia won his Cup). I’m not sure they will win a Cup that year, but if things keep progressing they should be contenders every year.

like I said before, I only hope you hold Sweeney to the same ridiculous standards you hold our 2 time cup finalist GM to. Otherwise I can't take you seriously. If Chia went to 2 cup finals in Montreal he would be a legend, in Boston he was fired after missing the playoffs once after 7 straight appearances and disgraced.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

like I said before, I only hope you hold Sweeney to the same ridiculous standards you hold our 2 time cup finalist GM to. Otherwise I can't take you seriously. If Chia went to 2 cup finals in Montreal he would be a legend, in Boston he was disgraced.

What exactly was ridiculous about it? The team was aging, trending down, got upset the year before by a hated rival and then missed the playoffs. And he had been here for 9 years, the writing was on the wall.

I would say that Sweeney, taking over a team in decline, has been held to as high/higher standards as Chia was when he took over (hello Dave Lewis). If you can’t see that, I’m not sure how I’m supposed to take you seriously.

 

[Tampbear]

All those players were aging and most had been signed by Chia to long term deals with NMC’s. I already said that I thought Chia did a great job in the first half of his tenure in Boston, but once they got to the top he lost his fastball.

Krug was a FA that supposedly had a relationship with Sweeney who was doing a lot of scouting at the time. Hamilton was a no-brainer that fell into the B’s laps on draft day. They were supposedly very interested in Ryan Murphy, who has yet to establish himself as an NHL player. Thank God that wasn’t the pick.

Heinen and Bjork, as much as I like them both haven't done anything yet. The only real young productive player that Sweeney inherited was Pasta (who he and PJ scored in Sweden).

The situations are apples and oranges. Chia inherited a team with a bunch of young core guys and he had to go out and add pieces like Horton, Sides, Recchi, Peverley. Sweeney inherited those same guys, but now on the back 9 of their careers. In my mind, he’s trying to do the hardest thing in sports, rebuild while still icing a competitive team that can challenge for the playwoffs.

Firstly, who on the team when Chiarelli took over were anywhere close to guys like Lucic, Krejci, Bergeron, Krug, Ericsson, Rask, Pasternak, Hamilton. They make be aging and some on long term deals but they all definitely had value how else would Sweeney have gotten so many first round picks beyond that how would so many of them still be a part of the team if they were so old and not valuable? Outside of Bergeron which of the young players that Chiarelli inherited were playing on the team? I don't understand how trusting his employees is a take away for him either. He had Sweeney doing scouting for him he couldn't and trusted Sweeney's opinion so somehow we should be mad at Chiarelli because it wasn't directly him? I don't even know why I'm arguing with you about this, I don't understand why but you've already decided Sweeney is god and Chiarelli is a mess of a GM at this point and there is no debating with you.

 

[KrejciMVP]

What exactly was ridiculous about it? The team was aging, trending down, got upset the year before by a hated rival and then missed the playoffs. And he had been here for 9 years, the writing was on the wall.

I would say that Sweeney, taking over a team in decline, has been held to as high/higher standards as Chia was when he took over (hello Dave Lewis). If you can’t see that, I’m not sure how I’m supposed to take you seriously.

Firstly, who on the team when Chiarelli took over were anywhere close to guys like Lucic, Krejci, Bergeron, Krug, Ericsson, Rask, Pasternak, Hamilton. They make be aging and some on long term deals but they all definitely had value how else would Sweeney have gotten so many first round picks beyond that how would so many of them still be a part of the team if they were so old and not valuable? Outside of Bergeron which of the young players that Chiarelli inherited were playing on the team? I don't understand how trusting his employees is a take away for him either. He had Sweeney doing scouting for him he couldn't and trusted Sweeney's opinion so somehow we should be mad at Chiarelli because it wasn't directly him? I don't even know why I'm arguing with you about this, I don't understand why but you've already decided Sweeney is god and Chiarelli is a mess of a GM at this point and there is no debating with you.

I agree, thats why I keep saying please hold Sweeney to the same standards

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Firstly, who on the team when Chiarelli took over were anywhere close to guys like Lucic, Krejci, Bergeron, Krug, Ericsson, Rask, Pasternak, Hamilton. They make be aging and some on long term deals but they all definitely had value how else would Sweeney have gotten so many first round picks beyond that how would so many of them still be a part of the team if they were so old and not valuable? Outside of Bergeron which of the young players that Chiarelli inherited were playing on the team? I don't understand how trusting his employees is a take away for him either. He had Sweeney doing scouting for him he couldn't and trusted Sweeney's opinion so somehow we should be mad at Chiarelli because it wasn't directly him? I don't even know why I'm arguing with you about this, I don't understand why but you've already decided Sweeney is god and Chiarelli is a mess of a GM at this point and there is no debating with you.

Never said Sweeney was God, nor Chia a mess of a GM. That’s you putting words in my mouth.

Comprehension seems to be a challenge here sometimes, so once again:

1) Chia and Sweeney took over teams in completely different situations. Sweeney had an aging core and no Cap space. Chia was able to sign two huge FA’s with his Cap room and had the young core in place already that would lead them to a Cup.

2) For the umpteenth time, Chia did a GREAT job in adding pieces like Horton, Recchi, etc., but the last half of his tenure with B’s was a downward trend. It was time for him to go after 9 years.


Chia is gone, Sweeney is here and trying to get the team back to a Cup. That’s all I’m really concerned about at this point.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

I agree, thats why I keep saying please hold Sweeney to the same standards

Of course you do.

You can’t hold two GM’s who took over two different teams to the same standard. That would be asinine. Hold them both to high standards, but comparing the two is apples and oranges.