Gaborik/Carcillo fight

[Kaktus*]

QUOTE=nyr2k2;23348860]Again, Richards has been known to drop the gloves on his own accord. Marian Gaborik had fought once in his entire career entering last night. Gaborik-to-Richards isn't exactly an apples to apples comparison.[/QUOTE] I am sorry, what? Gaborik did not drop his gloves on his own accord?
It's not like Carcillo cheap shot him in any way. Gabby was not even hurt. The matter of fact Carcillo pulled his punches as soon as Gaborik went down.

Fine, you do not like Richards example try Christensen attack on Carter.. What did Carter do? Skated away laughing.

As far as forgetting the fight...you recognize that this is a thread dedicated to the fight, right? If you took a gander at our board you'd see we're in full meltdown mode right now regarding our offensive ineptitude and our generally wussy team construction. Don't think because you've seen a sample of our mindset in a thread dedicated to the fight that it's somehow the primary concern.

Seems like it is.

I understand what your saying and but Gaborik knew it was Carcillo and probably knows that he is going to start throwing anyway so might as well be in a postion to defend yourself. What would have happened if Gaborik didnt drop his glove and Carcillo started throwing them?

Gaborik defended him self? lol.. ok..

 

[ThisYearsModel]

Not much of a fight. The scrum happens, Carcillo makes a beeline for Gaborik and tried to rip his head off. Gaborik makes it clear he will not simply take the abuse, and Carcillo beats him up. Carcillo is a clown, and today he is laughing at the Rangers and at the officials. A non-fighter gets his butt kicked and the Flyers ended up with a power play. Typical Flyer and Ranger hockey. Been going on for years.

 

[nyr2k2]

I am sorry, what? Gaborik did not drop his gloves on his own accord?
It's not like Carcillo cheap shot him in any way. Gabby was not even hurt. The matter of fact Carcillo pulled his punches as soon as Gaborik went down.

Fine, you do not like Richards example try Christensen attack on Carter.. What did Carter do? Skated away laughing.

My point is that Gaborik is not and has never been a fighter. Richards is and has always been someone that fights. Which is why the comparison between the two lacks legs.

Christensen on Carter? A guy that doesn't fight on a guy that doesn't fight? Again, comparing that to Dan Carcillo and his 60+ NHL fights against Marian Gaborik and his one fight is ridiculous. You're making some terrible comparisons here.

If Carter tried to get into it with Gaborik, I'd have no problem whatsoever. But we're not talking about Carter, we're talking about Dan Carcillo, one of the most active fighters in the game.

Seems like it is.

Again, it seems like it is only if you pay no attention to discussion amongst Rangers fans taking place outside of this thread--this thread dedicated to the fight.

 

[infidelappel*]

I haven't read too much of this whole thread because, to be honest, most of it is too blind and biased to be worth it.

I don't see how anybody can have a problem with Carcillo, here. He did not make a bee line for Gaborik to attack him for no reason. OKT was busy in a scrum, and Gaborik jumps at his back and tries to give him a facewash. In response, Carcillo - the nearest person to Gaborik - grabs him and wraps him up and pulls him away from OKT. Is he supposed to just watch Gaborik continue to get the hands in his teammate's face from behind and wait for someone less tough than him to go deal with it, while his teammate is being scrummed with by two different players?

No. You don't do that. Carcillo steps in and wraps Gaborik up. They get the hands high on each other, go for the face wash, get one or two shots in with the gloves on - which happens all the time - and eventually Gaborik loses his temper and decides to drop them.

At that point, it's a fight, and Carcillo wins it handily. He isn't intending to start a fight at any point in this exchange, he's just trying to stop Gaborik from taking liberties with his own teammate. It doesn't matter who the player is; if you jump at a guy who's already tied up with another opponent, you're going to get grabbed/tackled/whatever by somebody.

If, say, Asham was in a scrum with Dubinsky or something and then Giroux came in and started grappling with Dubinsky from behind and then Sean Avery came in, pulled Giroux off, and then Giroux dropped the gloves first and got his teeth knocked in, I would have zero problem with it.

This is what happens when you lose your cool in a scrum and drop the gloves with someone better than you at fighting. That simple.

Edit: Just for the record, I am by no means a Carcillo fan or apologist. In fact, if you ask many from the Flyers boards (DUHockey9 especially), I have often said I wish Carcillo was not a Flyer because he is a clown and prone to making stupid decisions. But this is not one of them.

 

[phantomphan]

I haven't read too much of this whole thread because, to be honest, most of it is too blind and biased to be worth it.

I don't see how anybody can have a problem with Carcillo, here. He did not make a bee line for Gaborik to attack him for no reason. OKT was busy in a scrum, and Gaborik jumps at his back and tries to give him a facewash. In response, Carcillo - the nearest person to Gaborik - grabs him and wraps him up and pulls him away from OKT. Is he supposed to just watch Gaborik continue to get the hands in his teammate's face from behind and wait for someone less tough than him to go deal with it, while his teammate is being scrummed with by two different players?

No. You don't do that. Carcillo steps in and wraps Gaborik up. They get the hands high on each other, go for the face wash, get one or two shots in with the gloves on - which happens all the time - and eventually Gaborik loses his temper and decides to drop them.

At that point, it's a fight, and Carcillo wins it handily. He isn't intending to start a fight at any point in this exchange, he's just trying to stop Gaborik from taking liberties with his own teammate. It doesn't matter who the player is; if you jump at a guy who's already tied up with another opponent, you're going to get grabbed/tackled/whatever by somebody.

If, say, Asham was in a scrum with Dubinsky or something and then Giroux came in and started grappling with Dubinsky from behind and then Sean Avery came in, pulled Giroux off, and then Giroux dropped the gloves first and got his teeth knocked in, I would have zero problem with it.

This is what happens when you lose your cool in a scrum and drop the gloves with someone better than you at fighting. That simple.

Please stop trying to bring facts into this argument.

 

[NitHeel]

I haven't read too much of this whole thread because, to be honest, most of it is too blind and biased to be worth it.

I don't see how anybody can have a problem with Carcillo, here. He did not make a bee line for Gaborik to attack him for no reason. OKT was busy in a scrum, and Gaborik jumps at his back and tries to give him a facewash. In response, Carcillo - the nearest person to Gaborik - grabs him and wraps him up and pulls him away from OKT. Is he supposed to just watch Gaborik continue to get the hands in his teammate's face from behind and wait for someone less tough than him to go deal with it, while his teammate is being scrummed with by two different players?

No. You don't do that. Carcillo steps in and wraps Gaborik up. They get the hands high on each other, go for the face wash, get one or two shots in with the gloves on - which happens all the time - and eventually Gaborik loses his temper and decides to drop them.

At that point, it's a fight, and Carcillo wins it handily. He isn't intending to start a fight at any point in this exchange, he's just trying to stop Gaborik from taking liberties with his own teammate. It doesn't matter who the player is; if you jump at a guy who's already tied up with another opponent, you're going to get grabbed/tackled/whatever by somebody.

If, say, Asham was in a scrum with Dubinsky or something and then Giroux came in and started grappling with Dubinsky from behind and then Sean Avery came in, pulled Giroux off, and then Giroux dropped the gloves first and got his teeth knocked in, I would have zero problem with it.

This is what happens when you lose your cool in a scrum and drop the gloves with someone better than you at fighting. That simple.

/thread

 

[Kaktus*]

My point is that Gaborik is not and has never been a fighter. Richards is and has always been someone that fights. Which is why the comparison between the two lacks legs.

Christensen on Carter? A guy that doesn't fight on a guy that doesn't fight? Again, comparing that to Dan Carcillo and his 60+ NHL fights against Marian Gaborik and his one fight is ridiculous. You're making some terrible comparisons here.

If Carter tried to get into it with Gaborik, I'd have no problem whatsoever. But we're not talking about Carter, we're talking about Dan Carcillo, one of the most active fighters in the game.



Again, it seems like it is only if you pay no attention to discussion amongst Rangers fans taking place outside of this thread--this thread dedicated to the fight.

and my point is that Avery did it to the Flyers non fighter like Pitkanen and others.. He is known for that. He stepped up to Carcillo with his fingers cut, good for him.

Just cause Richards fights Avery does not mean he should.

 

[txpd]

wow...Carcillo was not looking for a fight at any point? If thats true, then he was hoping to be able to abuse Gaborik as much as possible if Gaborik won't drop the mits for a beating.

Carcillo cuts Gaborik away from the scrum like a cutting horse gets a calf away from the mother in a heard. He grabs him about the head and neck and seperates him from the group. The Flyers already have a 5 on 3 advantage with the Rangers D required to stay high.

Carcillo gets him clear and punches him with the gloved hand which is when Gaborik's gloves start to come off. If Carcillo is going to start punching, Gaborik wants to defend himself. When Carcillo sees the gloves coming off, he realizes he has hit the jack pot and does everything he can to damage Gaborik.

Yea Carcillo stops punching when Gaborik goes down. That is the code, right? Punching a guy laying on the ice is frowned upon. Punching a non-fighter star while he is laying on the ice is going to get you league action. Since Carcillo was already suspended for sucker punching Bradley this season, another cheap shot sucker punch would not be appreciated.

Carcillo may not have thought that he could get so lucky as to push Gaborik to drop his gloves, but he was certainly not an innocent that got dragged into a fight.

 

[sa cyred]

I haven't read too much of this whole thread because, to be honest, most of it is too blind and biased to be worth it.

I don't see how anybody can have a problem with Carcillo, here. He did not make a bee line for Gaborik to attack him for no reason. OKT was busy in a scrum, and Gaborik jumps at his back and tries to give him a facewash. In response, Carcillo - the nearest person to Gaborik - grabs him and wraps him up and pulls him away from OKT. Is he supposed to just watch Gaborik continue to get the hands in his teammate's face from behind and wait for someone less tough than him to go deal with it, while his teammate is being scrummed with by two different players?

No. You don't do that. Carcillo steps in and wraps Gaborik up. They get the hands high on each other, go for the face wash, get one or two shots in with the gloves on - which happens all the time - and eventually Gaborik loses his temper and decides to drop them.

At that point, it's a fight, and Carcillo wins it handily. He isn't intending to start a fight at any point in this exchange, he's just trying to stop Gaborik from taking liberties with his own teammate. It doesn't matter who the player is; if you jump at a guy who's already tied up with another opponent, you're going to get grabbed/tackled/whatever by somebody.

If, say, Asham was in a scrum with Dubinsky or something and then Giroux came in and started grappling with Dubinsky from behind and then Sean Avery came in, pulled Giroux off, and then Giroux dropped the gloves first and got his teeth knocked in, I would have zero problem with it.

This is what happens when you lose your cool in a scrum and drop the gloves with someone better than you at fighting. That simple.

Edit: Just for the record, I am by no means a Carcillo fan or apologist. In fact, if you ask many from the Flyers boards (DUHockey9 especially), I have often said I wish Carcillo was not a Flyer because he is a clown and prone to making stupid decisions. But this is not one of them.

Wow game set and match right here. Sadly though Ranger fans won't listen to you. They will most likely bend the truth still, like they have been doing. What you just posted is what EXACTLY happened.

 

[joshjull]

If I was a Ranger fan. I would be almost as pissed at Girardi as I would be at Carcillo. He had front row seats to the beating and didn't do a thing.

 

[infidelappel*]

wow...Carcillo was not looking for a fight at any point? If thats true, then he was hoping to be able to abuse Gaborik as much as possible if Gaborik won't drop the mits for a beating.

Carcillo cuts Gaborik away from the scrum like a cutting horse gets a calf away from the mother in a heard. He grabs him about the head and neck and seperates him from the group. The Flyers already have a 5 on 3 advantage with the Rangers D required to stay high.

Carcillo gets him clear and punches him with the gloved hand which is when Gaborik's gloves start to come off. If Carcillo is going to start punching, Gaborik wants to defend himself. When Carcillo sees the gloves coming off, he realizes he has hit the jack pot and does everything he can to damage Gaborik.

Yea Carcillo stops punching when Gaborik goes down. That is the code, right? Punching a guy laying on the ice is frowned upon. Punching a non-fighter star while he is laying on the ice is going to get you league action. Since Carcillo was already suspended for sucker punching Bradley this season, another cheap shot sucker punch would not be appreciated.

Carcillo may not have thought that he could get so lucky as to push Gaborik to drop his gloves, but he was certainly not an innocent that got dragged into a fight.

All animal kingdom references aside, I still don't see why this is an indictment of Carcillo. If anything, all you've done is strengthen the argument that he wasn't looking to do anything egregious here by acknowledging that he drew the line as soon as he won the fight and stopped, rather than try to take extra shots when Gaborik went down or linesmen intervened or what have you.

Yes, he cut Gaborik away from the pack. That's the objective in a scrum like this. Your comment about the D staying high is irrelevant; Gabork was taking advantage of numbers by jumping on Tollefsen's back, and Carcillo stepped in to pick him off of him. yes, he did it by grabbing his head and pulling him away. How many times have you seen a guy get put in a headlock in a scrum? Should we be outraged at every single player in the league? How else do you expect Carcillo to get Gaborik off of his teammate...ask nicely and hope he leaves?

He's coming to the defense of his teammate, and grabbing Gaborik and pulling him away. These guys are big, strong athletes. Note that he didn't grab Gaborik's neck and throw him on the ice, or take him down with a horse collar. He's simply doing what he has to do to immediately pull him away from a teammate - again, this happens constantly.

And no, I'm not saying that Carcillo is some poor schmuck who got dragged into a fight he wouldn't want anything to do with. Gaborik responds to the horse collar by getting his hands in Carcillo's face; Carcillo responds to that by putting a single jab at Gaborik from inches away that would hardly qualify as a rabbit punch...and is the sort of action that, once again, happens constantly in scrums. Gabork got pissed, dropped the gloves, and got pummeled.

It's not like Gaborik was like "OH MY GOD, HE'S GOING TO BEAT ME RIGHT NOW IF I DON'T DROP THEM!" Carcillo hadn't planned on this being a fight, and is visibly surprised when the gloves come off. And if you're Carcillo, and the opposing team's best player gives you a chance to take him off the ice for 5 minutes in that situation....then yeah, you're probably alright with it at this point.

But all the Rangers fans crying about how he made a straight line for Gabby and attacked him are just ridiculous. He pulled him off a teammate, they got pissed and got their hands up on each other, Carcillo pushed back, Gabby got pissed, and they fought.

Act like you've seen a scrum before.

 

[Kaktus*]

wow...Carcillo was not looking for a fight at any point? If thats true, then he was hoping to be able to abuse Gaborik as much as possible if Gaborik won't drop the mits for a beating.

Carcillo cuts Gaborik away from the scrum like a cutting horse gets a calf away from the mother in a heard. He grabs him about the head and neck and seperates him from the group. The Flyers already have a 5 on 3 advantage with the Rangers D required to stay high.

Carcillo gets him clear and punches him with the gloved hand which is when Gaborik's gloves start to come off. If Carcillo is going to start punching, Gaborik wants to defend himself. When Carcillo sees the gloves coming off, he realizes he has hit the jack pot and does everything he can to damage Gaborik.

Yea Carcillo stops punching when Gaborik goes down. That is the code, right? Punching a guy laying on the ice is frowned upon. Punching a non-fighter star while he is laying on the ice is going to get you league action. Since Carcillo was already suspended for sucker punching Bradley this season, another cheap shot sucker punch would not be appreciated.

Carcillo may not have thought that he could get so lucky as to push Gaborik to drop his gloves, but he was certainly not an innocent that got dragged into a fight.

Tell you what.. Gaborik had more balls then "to be or not to be" Bradley..

 

[ThisYearsModel]

Isn't that more of a reason for one of your star players to skate away from crap?

For all the NY fans who are disgusted that Carcillo got Gaborik to fight -- Avery tried to get Carter (who simply laughed him off) and Richards to go. Would you have been disgusted if he'd been successful in engaging either of them?

Well now, Richards doesn't like to fight. he does like to hit players when they are not looking or from behind (ask David Booth), but is always disinterested in stanking toe to toe. That's why he makes the PERFECT Flyer captain.

 

[DUHockey9]

Well now, Richards doesn't like to fight. he does like to hit players when they are not looking or from behind (ask David Booth), but is always disinterested in stanking toe to toe. That's why he makes the PERFECT Flyer captain.

So do you have the same distaste for Scott Stevens? Because he was one of the greatest D-men ever. He made a career of catching people not looking.

 

[lastcupever75]

Well now, Richards doesn't like to fight. he does like to hit players when they are not looking or from behind (ask David Booth), but is always disinterested in stanking toe to toe. That's why he makes the PERFECT Flyer captain.

$$

also
yes, there's no other way to get a player off another in a scrum then to dgrab him by the head

 

[BillD]

I am not a Rags fan at all, but Carcillo is a punk-ass scumdog.
What should have happened was some Rag player beating the crap out of Girioux.

 

[GKJ]

Well now, Richards doesn't like to fight. he does like to hit players when they are not looking or from behind (ask David Booth), but is always disinterested in stanking toe to toe. That's why he makes the PERFECT Flyer captain.

Well, that's just a flat out ignorant statement.














I mean that was just a dumb thing to say.

 

[Breeze 44]

I understand what your saying and but Gaborik knew it was Carcillo and probably knows that he is going to start throwing anyway so might as well be in a postion to defend yourself. What would have happened if Gaborik didnt drop his glove and Carcillo started throwing them?

Yeah OMG what would have happened if.... Brash dressed for the game and during the warm-ups he just starting swinging at everyone wearing orange and then he pulled a knife...omg

 

[Crosberry87]

Carcillo is the biggest turd in the NHL.

 

[MTL-rules]

Somehow, some day, we'll learn that Carcillo beated up his wife...

Disgusting human being, but the league wants fights and fans love it, so who cares, right?

 

[littleD]

Lol I just saw this.

Daniel Carcillo is the biggest ***** in the NHL lol.

What a dumbass.

 

[littleD]

If you guys can't have civil discussions without insulting each other, making crass generalizations about entire fan bases, or generally acting like little children, this thread will be closed and the discussion will end.

Got it?

Can I ask a question...

A forum like this, is ready made for threads not involving civil discussions. It's ready made for stupidity.

what is the real reason for having a boxing forum on a hockey message board?

 

[Mynameismark*]

Lol I just saw this.

Daniel Carcillo is the biggest ***** in the NHL lol.

What a dumbass.

You {MOD EDIT} that dont like fighting in the league irritate the hell out of me.

Carcillo is a dumbass because he beat up a star player that clearly wanted to go. Any 4th or third liner takes that challenege to place the other teams best player in the box for 5 minutes. Plus he got a PP out of it.

Yeah, what a dumbass.

 

[The Underboss]

Can I ask a question...

A forum like this, is ready made for threads not involving civil discussions. It's ready made for stupidity.

what is the real reason for having a boxing forum on a hockey message board?

Because some people can have civil discussions without crapping on one another.

 

[duffy9748]

It's a ****ing hockey game. You guys are acting like Gaborik is a 10 yr old kid out in the park and Carcillo is the crazy guy in town who never left home. Gaborik could have turtled if he wanted too, but he dropped the gloves and stood up for himself. Quit ****ing whining, its HOCKEY.