Proposal: Fowler for a Jets winger

[dracom]

Why would any Ducks fan want to trade Fowler for Trouba when we are already having trouble re-signing our RFAs? So I highly doubt any Ducks fan is suggesting a Fowler for Trouba trade. It's been non Ducks/Jets fans mostly making the proposals.

 

[dracom]

2 yrs of Fowler for 7 yrs of Roslivic who will be a 2nd line centre, please let us add to this. Hello.

More like 2 years of Fowler for a guy who has never played in the NHL or the AHL yet. Giving him 7 years as a 2nd line center value is crazy.

 

[Sojourn]

Why would any Ducks fan want to trade Fowler for Trouba when we are already having trouble re-signing our RFAs? So I highly doubt any Ducks fan is suggesting a Fowler for Trouba trade. It's been non Ducks/Jets fans mostly making the proposals.

Yeah, I don't get that. I'm sure I've missed a lot, but that doesn't seem like the kind of deal an informed Anaheim fan would make. It's completely contrary to Anaheim's needs, and it doesn't help us financially at all.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Love to add a 2/3 lhd young signed long term. Fowler isn't that, zero interest.



Oh yes, the old b/c I don't agree with your opinion means I'm being ignorant? Classic

Zero interest in Fowler, how many times do we need to say it? Trade him to the Leafs or maybe Benning will be a good GM to target to deal with.

Your ignorance has nothing to do with you not agreeing with my opinion, it is ignorant to not realize that perhaps ducks fans know more about their players than you do. I have my opinions on many jets players, many of them not positive ones, but I am not naive enough to believe that a jets fan couldn't enlighten me on said players, being thsyvthri watch them religiously and all...

 

[biturbo19]

Why would any Ducks fan want to trade Fowler for Trouba when we are already having trouble re-signing our RFAs? So I highly doubt any Ducks fan is suggesting a Fowler for Trouba trade. It's been non Ducks/Jets fans mostly making the proposals.

Just sifting through parts of this thread, i think that's probably the case.

As an actual proposal, Trouba/Fowler doesn't really make a lot of sense. However, as something of a reference point re: Fowler's value, i think it has more merit.

ie. Fowler's value is in the same sort of ballpark as Trouba. You can argue maybe not quite there, but in the ballpark. If you want Fowler, be prepared to pay something in the neighbourhood of what you'd want back for Trouba. Not expendable middling roster players - real quality.


It's fine for Jets fans to adore Ehlers/Connor and have no interest in trading them whatsoever...but that's probably the caliber of prospect it would take. And the drop-off in the Jets prospect pool beyond them is too much to work. You don't get a young Top-3 Defenceman without sacrificing something that really hurts to lose. Not roster filler, but a quality Top-6, maybe even Top-3 Forward.

Young, potentially star players have a lot of value to a small market team like the Jets though, and i can absolutely appreciate why they wouldn't want to move a guy like Ehlers/Connor for Fowler. That doesn't necessarily mean the "value" is way off overall though, as seems to be often suggested.

The only way it would really make sense for the Jets, is if they were to swap one of Ehlers/Connor for Fowler...then have a follow-up deal in place to swap Trouba for a different high end Forward prospect/player with ELC value somewhere else to "replace" what they gave up for Trouba. Which is probably way too convoluted to actually work, and ventures way into "armchair GM trading" territory.

I'd imagine still a lot easier to just find a way to make a Trouba deal work around a LHD that fits both team's needs in the first place.

 

[me2]

Tor: Trouba
Jets: Fowler + tor add
Ducks: jvr

Make it so.

 

[Kalv]

Tor: Trouba
Jets: Fowler + tor add
Ducks: jvr

Make it so.

So the Ducks need to free up salary cap and here you are offering us to get rid of a player we don`t actually want to part AND add even more salary cap and actual salary. Congratulations you done ****ed up now!

 

[Hunter368]

Your ignorance has nothing to do with you not agreeing with my opinion, it is ignorant to not realize that perhaps ducks fans know more about their players than you do. I have my opinions on many jets players, many of them not positive ones, but I am not naive enough to believe that a jets fan couldn't enlighten me on said players, being thsyvthri watch them religiously and all...

Are all ducks games blacked out unless you live in Cali or what? Not sure why some assume people have never watched duck games outside Cali. You realize some are on national tv right? You heard of the NHL package right? You heard of the internet right?

Either way, a seller has the right to set the asking price.....completely agree. Of course the buyer (me in this case on our fantasy trade forum) has the right to agree to said price or not.....and of course as previously stated I would have zero interest.

Not sure why that's so hard for you to accept.....rejection is a tough thing I guess. At no point have I insulted fowler (go find one post where I called him a name etc), I just don't agree with some ducks fans evaluation of his ability or value....when did that become a terrible thing?

Keep fowler or trade fowler to some other team......don't care either way.

 

[Hunter368]

Tor: Trouba
Jets: Fowler + tor add
Ducks: jvr

Make it so.

Huge no thx from jets. Easy pass

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Tor: Trouba
Jets: Fowler + tor add
Ducks: jvr

Make it so.

So how many times does it need to be said, That Anaheim has to shed salary here big time. To be able to lock up Rakell and Lindholm. JVR $4.25 million and Cam Fowler $4 million JVR doesnt work for cap space unless they want to take on both Fowler and Stoner and i doubt Lou touches Stoner.

 

[4thline]

I haven't been following who said what in this thread, just skimming through so maybe you're one of those guys who feels that Fowler is an elite 1D. My bad if I missed that. I personally agree with most Ducks fans that he's a solid 2/3 guy. I'd be happy to have him on the Jets and let him, JoMo and Enstrom fight for minutes on the left.

The problem is that we almost universally believe that Connor, Ehlers and Laine are going to develop into elite wingers. Actual all-stars even without the silly 4 team tournament nonsense the league did last year. Everything they've done in their careers up to this point shows they're on track for that, and you don't trade that for 2/3 defensemen with 2 years to UFA. It would be bad asset management.

My understanding of the Ducks' needs are cheap middle-six wingers and cap space. Almost everyone on the OP's list qualifies as that. Just because they're not playing in that role on the Jets, isn't an indication of the quality of player they are, it's a byproduct of the quality of player ahead of them. Additionally, the Jets are in a good position to accept a cap dump, and to offer draft picks to get what they're looking for.

There's a lot of guys talking about Winnipeg's B prospects, but I'd say pretty much none of those guys' names have come up yet in this thread.

Completely agreed with the 2/3 d evaluation. And in another post in this thread I suggested a 1st + Dano/Petan/ Roslovic + deal, as I think that's what it would take to get a d like that with two years on a good deal. The last + wouldn't be insignificant though. In my eyes those guys are B+/A- prospects, generally the top of the threshold of what gets traded, similar to Kapanen/ Brown, etc. The A/A+/A++ guys (the only ones that have enough value to trade straight across for a proven 2/3 d in a non deadline rental situation) generally don't get traded.

This discussion falls apart when surprising number of your compatriots subscribe the notion that Fowler is a 5/6 and guys like the three I listed are A/A+/A++ bluechip prospects. I also don't buy the whole "we'd have to protect him" reason. After Schiefele,Little, Wheeler and Perrault (4+4 scheme) there isn't a non exempt Jets forward that touches the value of a year of Fowler.

 

[Group Chat Legend*]

None of those guys from the OP gets Winnipeg Fowler

Only way I see it working is based on a deal centered around Fowler for one of Ehlers or Connor

 

[Ducks in a row]

Are all ducks games blacked out unless you live in Cali or what? Not sure why some assume people have never watched duck games outside Cali. You realize some are on national tv right? You heard of the NHL package right? You heard of the internet right?

Either way, a seller has the right to set the asking price.....completely agree. Of course the buyer (me in this case on our fantasy trade forum) has the right to agree to said price or not.....and of course as previously stated I would have zero interest.

Not sure why that's so hard for you to accept.....rejection is a tough thing I guess. At no point have I insulted fowler (go find one post where I called him a name etc), I just don't agree with some ducks fans evaluation of his ability or value....when did that become a terrible thing?

Keep fowler or trade fowler to some other team......don't care either way.

Considering we have had a Jets fan say "And Fowler's closer Stuart than a top four Dman" and how much some other Jets fans totally hate the idea of getting Fowler unless it is for a crazy underpayment I would say that some Jets fans either don't watch Fowler much and are using the stupid hero charts that says Schultz > Fowler or they are bad at judging defenseman.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Why would any Ducks fan want to trade Fowler for Trouba when we are already having trouble re-signing our RFAs? So I highly doubt any Ducks fan is suggesting a Fowler for Trouba trade. It's been non Ducks/Jets fans mostly making the proposals.

Exactly considering that more then likely Trouba will want at least $5.5 million per long term that's already $1.5 million more then what Fowler is making and Lindholm wanting $6+ million Trouba to Anaheim makes zero sense and their cap wont allow it.

 

[nbducksfan19]

Are all ducks games blacked out unless you live in Cali or what? Not sure why some assume people have never watched duck games outside Cali. You realize some are on national tv right? You heard of the NHL package right? You heard of the internet right?

Either way, a seller has the right to set the asking price.....completely agree. Of course the buyer (me in this case on our fantasy trade forum) has the right to agree to said price or not.....and of course as previously stated I would have zero interest.

Not sure why that's so hard for you to accept.....rejection is a tough thing I guess. At no point have I insulted fowler (go find one post where I called him a name etc), I just don't agree with some ducks fans evaluation of his ability or value....when did that become a terrible thing?

Keep fowler or trade fowler to some other team......don't care either way.

At no point did I indicate you or jets fans can't or don't watch ducks games. In fact, I know for certain you watched at least 4 playoff games... howesver, you are naive to think that watching games here and there gives you a better understanding of a player than fans who follow the team religiously.

Also, I encourage you to go back, I have said from my first post there was no deal to be had with the jets and being they this thread was started by a jets fan, isn't it your proposal being rejected?

 

[Hunter368]

At no point did I indicate you or jets fans can't or don't watch ducks games. In fact, I know for certain you watched at least 4 playoff games... howesver, you are naive to think that watching games here and there gives you a better understanding of a player than fans who follow the team religiously.

Also, I encourage you to go back, I have said from my first post there was no deal to be had with the jets and being they this thread was started by a jets fan, isn't it your proposal being rejected?

My offer wasn't rejected, one Jets fan who created the thread was rejected. Not sure what has to do with me. I fully support rejecting all offers I've seen to date involving us giving up any significant assets for Fowler......so looks like we agree after all.

 

[Hunter368]

Considering we have had a Jets fan say "And Fowler's closer Stuart than a top four Dman" and how much some other Jets fans totally hate the idea of getting Fowler unless it is for a crazy underpayment I would say that some Jets fans either don't watch Fowler much and are using the stupid hero charts that says Schultz > Fowler or they are bad at judging defenseman.

No single fan speaks for any fan base. But I do agree Fowler has some very good analytics/results for a few metrics and some analytics/metrics close to Stuart. There are multiple reasons why most Jets fans have zero interest in Fowler.

Expansion - Not protecting five D

Contract - Two years before he bolts via UFA. This team is one that depends on D&D and retaining rfas.....not by signing ufas

Role - IMO Fowler wheel house is offense, we have Buff signed long term......Fowler isn't replacing Buff on the top pairing in that role. We need more a defensive D or at most a good two way D with Buff, Fowler isn't that.

Cost - Why would we overpay for Fowler for two years service?

Window - Our window doesn't even open until Fowler is long gone. Next two years for the Jets is transforming the team from older players to young ones. We're starting line up has 4 rookies, plus our two goalies are very new...basically rookies or at least very little experience.

We have no generally accepted opinion on our board about how the Jets will do this year with so many young/rookie players but I think it's fair to say we won't be a playoff team during this growing process. Some have picked bottom five finish, IMO we will be bottom 10 finish. There's no big expectations to win this year or become a playoff team. Most realize this is a transition year.


Thus why blow good young assets on a D (regardless how you view him) for two years when there isn't any big expectations to contend in that period? If we were a few years from now, my answer likely be very different.

 

[Tasteless Beaver]

None of those guys from the OP gets Winnipeg Fowler

Only way I see it working is based on a deal centered around Fowler for one of Ehlers or Connor

top troll is top.
Ehlers or Connor, two potentially elite forwards on ELCs, for 2 years of Fowler (who is not elite).

I like Fowler, and disagree with a few Jets posters here about his value, but come on. The difference between Fowler and Trouba isn't that big, but we're not trading away our blue chips to fix a need that should otherwise be fixed by flipping (or playing?) Trouba.

 

[nbducksfan19]

My offer wasn't rejected, one Jets fan who created the thread was rejected. Not sure what has to do with me. I fully support rejecting all offers I've seen to date involving us giving up any significant assets for Fowler......so looks like we agree after all.

You were the one throwing around accusations that I couldn't take rejection...which made zero sense considering I haven't made a single trade proposal and do not intend to as it would be a waste of time to try to have an intelligent hockey conversation about a player you so clearly know very little about.

 

[nbducksfan19]

No single fan speaks for any fan base. But I do agree Fowler has some very good analytics/results for a few metrics and some analytics/metrics close to Stuart. There are multiple reasons why most Jets fans have zero interest in Fowler.

Expansion - Not protecting five D

Contract - Two years before he bolts via UFA. This team is one that depends on D&D and retaining rfas.....not by signing ufas

Role - IMO Fowler wheel house is offense, we have Buff signed long term......Fowler isn't replacing Buff on the top pairing in that role. We need more a defensive D or at most a good two way D with Buff, Fowler isn't that.

Cost - Why would we overpay for Fowler for two years service?

Window - Our window doesn't even open until Fowler is long gone. Next two years for the Jets is transforming the team from older players to young ones. We're starting line up has 4 rookies, plus our two goalies are very new...basically rookies or at least very little experience.

We have no generally accepted opinion on our board about how the Jets will do this year with so many young/rookie players but I think it's fair to say we won't be a playoff team during this growing process. Some have picked bottom five finish, IMO we will be bottom 10 finish. There's no big expectations to win this year or become a playoff team. Most realize this is a transition year.


Thus why blow good young assets on a D (regardless how you view him) for two years when there isn't any big expectations to contend in that period? If we were a few years from now, my answer likely be very different.

You were so close. I fully understand why the Jets shouldn't/wouldn't trade for Fowler and you points regarding the Jets are spot on. However, your prediction of his role is a strong indication that you do not know much about the Fowler's game. If you are looking for offensive D-men on the ducks, that is Vatanen. Fowler is the definition of a 2-way Dman. He has been put in the position of getting tough minutes with a bad D-parnter (Bieksa) and having a majority Dzone starts. However, I think he would be a great complimentary 2/3 2-way Dman, especially if he had an opportunity to play with a true #1 or a solid #2 (Not sure if I would call Buff that, but you might).

 

[Group Chat Legend*]

top troll is top.
Ehlers or Connor, two potentially elite forwards on ELCs, for 2 years of Fowler (who is not elite).

I like Fowler, and disagree with a few Jets posters here about his value, but come on. The difference between Fowler and Trouba isn't that big, but we're not trading away our blue chips to fix a need that should otherwise be fixed by flipping (or playing?) Trouba.

Thats what it would probably take for Anaheim to do it IMO. A trade is a two way street.

 

[Tasteless Beaver]

Thats what it would probably take for Anaheim to do it IMO. A trade is a two way street.

I would think that something else would have to be going Winnipeg's way under any normal circumstances.

Since the Ducks need to shed cap to sign their star D, and given that the season is underway, I don't think anyone is lined up to send top prospects to the Ducks for Fowler so that they can dress Lindholm (and make the Ducks better by consequence). The price for Fowler drops, but by no means is that price a single forward as listed in the OP. Winnipeg is draft and develop - Trouba seems like he's on his way out, so flipping another one of our 1st rounders that are developing nicely, is out of the question. Without Stoner coming with Fowler, I don't think there's a deal to be made.

 

[Hunter368]

You were so close. I fully understand why the Jets shouldn't/wouldn't trade for Fowler and you points regarding the Jets are spot on. However, your prediction of his role is a strong indication that you do not know much about the Fowler's game. If you are looking for offensive D-men on the ducks, that is Vatanen. Fowler is the definition of a 2-way Dman. He has been put in the position of getting tough minutes with a bad D-parnter (Bieksa) and having a majority Dzone starts. However, I think he would be a great complimentary 2/3 2-way Dman, especially if he had an opportunity to play with a true #1 or a solid #2 (Not sure if I would call Buff that, but you might).

I would prefer a two way D is is better in the corners, one on one battles, etc but that's cool we don't agree on it.

But at least you understand why the Jets wouldn't trade for Fowler, that's the main point.

 

[dracom]

I would prefer a two way D is is better in the corners, one on one battles, etc but that's cool we don't agree on it.

But at least you understand why the Jets wouldn't trade for Fowler, that's the main point.

We're fine with your reasoning for not wanting Fowler. It's the numerous posts from Jets fans that keep calling Fowler a bottom pairing D or a player similar to Staurt that is getting annoying.

 

[Hunter368]

We're fine with your reasoning for not wanting Fowler. It's the numerous posts from Jets fans that keep calling Fowler a bottom pairing D or a player similar to Staurt that is getting annoying.

I understand that, but I haven't called him that once. If you don't believe me find me one post where I called bottom pairing or equal to Stuart.

I don't hate Fowler, he's just a poor fit on our team for several reasons, thus I wouldn't give up much for him. I do a knowledge that most Ducks fans have a slightly higher opinion of him then I do, but we're talking about the differerce between 1st & 2nd pairing.......ive never stated bottom pairing.