Former Canucks: Players & Management (Kevin Bieksa retirement watch)

[Addison Rae]

I look forward to the no names team, it will be refreshing to go in as underdogs and make the gold medal so much sweeter!

There's nothing "sweet" about scrubs beating other scrubs.

 

[Luck 6]

So team Canada is basically all of the crappy NHLers that one of the worst teams in the league even casted off. This should be good.

 

[Hit the post]

I'm surprised Jordan Schroeder is still around (on a playoff NHL team no less - albeit on some pretty meager minutes). Guess he wasn't a complete bust after all (considering he wasn't that high a pick - 22nd overall); though there were two NHLers selected AFTER him in that 1st round.

 

[CherryToke]

real good.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

So team Canada is basically all of the crappy NHLers that one of the worst teams in the league even casted off. This should be good.

crappy coach too

 

[Hit the post]

crappy coach too

He's a solid AHL coach - just a crappy NHL head coach. Perhaps he'd be better suited as an assistant NHL coach.

 

[jd22]

I mean I love Olympic hockey for the last few years but with Canada being so dominant it's maybe gotten a little stale, so it could be interesting cheering for a Canadian team that's still good but more on even terms with the rest of the competition. So it's more like a bigger WJC tourney.

Someone did the math on this - presuming the Canadian players going are the best outside the NHL - which is not a given, as there are drafted Canadians still not in the NHL (yet nhl team property) - Canada would not be sending its E team, or even G team... this would be Canada's V team. This is the 22nd best team Canada could field.

No other country even comes close to that. Americans were 11 or something, Swedes 5th.

 

[mathonwy]

I'm actually pretty excited to see Raymond and Lapierre play for Canada. They still feel like Canucks to me all these years later. They were important parts of that run in 2011, and when I close my eyes, that's the team I like to think I'm watching. Lappy with that game winning goal in the finals against Boston...? I'm always gonna like those dudes.

MayRay doesn't get the love that he should.

He was never the same after that hit.

 

[Addison Rae]

MayRay doesn't get the love that he should.

He was never the same that hit.

Yup, Raymond is his prime was way better than Baertschi is right now. He was extremely solid defensively and was an excellent 2nd line winger.

Imagine if that 2011 team stayed healthy throughout the playoffs.

Daniel Sedin / Henrik Sedin / Alexandre Burows
Mason Raymond / Ryan Kesler / Mikael Samuelson
Christopher Higgins / Manny Malhotra / Jannik Hansen
Raffi Torres / Maxieme Lapierre / Jeff Tambelni

Dan Hamhuis / Kevin Bieksa
Alexander Edler / Christian Ehrhoff
Keith Ballard / Sami Salo
Aaron Rome / Christopher Tanev

Roberto Luongo
Cory Schneider

That's f***ing disgusting

 

[passive voice]

There's nothing "sweet" about scrubs beating other scrubs.

Out of curiosity, do you enjoy the WJCs?

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

Out of curiosity, do you enjoy the WJCs?

those aren’t scrubs. they’re the best under 20s outside the NHL. you’re seeing “the stars if tomorrow,” as tsn us always telling us.

these guys are the randos of yesterday.

i like international hockey as much as the next guy, but i’ve never watched the spengler cup ykwim?

tbh, and i guess i’m showing my age here, i probably wouldn’t have watched much of the 92 or 94 olympics either of not for lindros and kariya being on those teams.

 

[passive voice]

those aren’t scrubs. they’re the best under 20s outside the NHL. you’re seeing “the stars if tomorrow,” as tsn us always telling us.

these guys are the randos of yesterday.

i like international hockey as much as the next guy, but i’ve never watched the spengler cup ykwim?

tbh, and i guess i’m showing my age here, i probably wouldn’t have watched much of the 92 or 94 olympics either of not for lindros and kariya being on those teams.

I invite you to go back and look at Canadian/American/Swedish WJC rosters from 5-10 years ago. With Canada there's like 2-3 guys each year who become stars, another 6-7 that become useful NHLers, and 10-11 that become the sort of fringe guys being considered for these Olympics. With USA/SWE it's like 1-2; 5-6; 13. And those are the best teams.

 

[mathonwy]

Yup, Raymond is his prime was way better than Baertschi is right now. He was extremely solid defensively and was an excellent 2nd line winger.

MayRay always played bigger than he was and he was smart enough to differ to Princess Kesler.

Bae's got heart too but MayRay was a higher skilled and faster player.

It's a real shame how MayRay's career ended in Vancouver as that's what most people remember as opposed to what he actually did for the team.

Real strong recency bias.

Gods I'm old.

 

[M2Beezy]

Yup, Raymond is his prime was way better than Baertschi is right now. He was extremely solid defensively and was an excellent 2nd line winger.

Imagine if that 2011 team stayed healthy throughout the playoffs.

Daniel Sedin / Henrik Sedin / Alexandre Burows
Mason Raymond / Ryan Kesler / Mikael Samuelson
Christopher Higgins / Manny Malhotra / Jannik Hansen
Raffi Torres / Maxieme Lapierre / Jeff Tambelni

Dan Hamhuis / Kevin Bieksa
Alexander Edler / Christian Ehrhoff
Keith Ballard / Sami Salo
Aaron Rome / Christopher Tanev

Roberto Luongo
Cory Schneider

That's ****ing disgusting

Nahhh Raymond was useless

 

[mathonwy]

Nahhh Raymond was useless

MTB!!!!!!!!!

 

[CherryToke]

Yup, Raymond is his prime was way better than Baertschi is right now. He was extremely solid defensively and was an excellent 2nd line winger.

Sarcasm right?

 

[VanJack]

It actually does the heart good to see guys like Willie D and Vey back in the fray and headed to the Olympics.....whatever criticism they got in VanCity, they're decent guys who were in a bad place and a bad time. The KHL is a head-scratcher....guys like Linden Vey and Cam Barker light it up, and do virtually nothing on the smaller NA rinks.

 

[Addison Rae]

Sarcasm right?

Maybe it was before your time.

Raymond was a ~50 point winger who scored a lot at even strength, who was excellent defensively and could help on the PK. How is this not an elite 2nd line player? 50 points is boredline 1st like NHL production, people don't seem to grasp
yeah. Add in the other aspects he added and from 2009 to 2011 he was a very good player.

 

[Addison Rae]

I invite you to go back and look at Canadian/American/Swedish WJC rosters from 5-10 years ago. With Canada there's like 2-3 guys each year who become stars, another 6-7 that become useful NHLers, and 10-11 that become the sort of fringe guys being considered for these Olympics. With USA/SWE it's like 1-2; 5-6; 13. And those are the best teams.

Yes, but again these are still the best prospects countries have to offer at the tjme. The tournament is usually full of blue chip prospects who are tracking to be the next wave of great players.

 

[Hit the post]

While Baertschi hasn't the 50+ point barrier yet (like Raymond did once/45 points in another season), he is only 25. We don't know what his ceiling his.

I think Raymond was a 2nd/3rd line tweener that benefited from playing on a high scoring team like the Canucks. He got 45 points on the Laffs because that team was pretty much all offense - no/little defense play.

 

[CherryToke]

Maybe it was before your time.

Raymond was a ~50 point winger who scored a lot at even strength, who was excellent defensively and could help on the PK. How is this not an elite 2nd line player? 50 points is boredline 1st like NHL production, people don't seem to grasp
yeah. Add in the other aspects he added and from 2009 to 2011 he was a very good player.

One 50 point season, one 20+ goal season and two seasons with more than 40 points.. He scored 20+ goals only once. Scored 2 goals on the cup run in 24 games playing on Keslers wing (before the injury).

Excellent 2nd line winger.

 

[RobertKron]

While Baertschi hasn't the 50+ point barrier yet (like Raymond did once/45 points in another season), he is only 25. We don't know what his ceiling his.

I think Raymond was a 2nd/3rd line tweener that benefited from playing on a high scoring team like the Canucks. He got 45 points on the Laffs because that team was pretty much all offense - no/little defense play.

25 is generally more or less a forward’s prime.

 

[Addison Rae]

One 50 point season, one 20+ goal season and two seasons with more than 40 points.. He scored 20+ goals only once. Scored 2 goals on the cup run in 24 games playing on Kesler wing (before the injury).

Excellent 2nd line winger.

Okay and no one is arguing that he was this type of player for an extended period of time.

From 2009/2011 he was a ~50 point player who was excellent defensively and produced mostly at even strength. Every objective method of analysis suggests that 50 points is very good 2nd line production. When you factor that in with other attributes he most certainly was.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

I invite you to go back and look at Canadian/American/Swedish WJC rosters from 5-10 years ago. With Canada there's like 2-3 guys each year who become stars, another 6-7 that become useful NHLers, and 10-11 that become the sort of fringe guys being considered for these Olympics. With USA/SWE it's like 1-2; 5-6; 13. And those are the best teams.

well yeah, the “stars of tomorrow” part was a joke, a sarcastic reference to the tsn hype machine. but my point is, best on best tournaments make sense. they determine something.

and the WJC is a best on best tournament. sure, your WJC legend is three times as likely to end up being some random guy named dubé than jarome iginla, but that's still the best amateur players under 20 years old in the world, guys already in the NHL notwithstanding.

whereas how meaningful is an olympic gold medal if it doesn't mean you're the best hockey team in the world, or even the best amateur hockey team in the world? the point being, who will or will not play in the olympics this year is totally arbitrary. i compared it to the spengler cup; i honestly have no idea what the criteria for participating in that tournament are.

MayRay always played bigger than he was

that is not how i remember mason raymond at all.

 

[CherryToke]

Okay and no one is arguing that he was this type of player for an extended period of time.

From 2009/2011 he was a ~50 point player who was excellent defensively and produced mostly at even strength. Every objective method of analysis suggests that 50 points is very good 2nd line production. When you factor that in with other attributes he most certainly was.

2010/2011 - 17 goals in 94 games, including the playoffs. All before the back injury.

Keep trying to revise history though.