Confirmed with Link: [EDM/TBL] Sam Gagner For Teddy Purcell; Then TBL Trades Gagner to ARZ Part II

[Supermassive]

Something like this.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Something like this.

Does raab get one too? He was so sure that we'd be better off without Gagner and we weren't.

 

[Aerchon]

Some are still bitter, calling the thread that they participated in "a joke" while moving on to yammer on about how Marincin > Klefbom.

Some ran away with their tails between their legs.

But the one who t-rolled for months and months with gory/demeaning Gagner avatars/gifs/pics is now a ghost here. Never thought an Oilers fan would stoop so low as to constantly pick on a single OILER at the lowest point of his career and health. Almost sociopathic.

Not sure why you are including me in this sickness.

The pro Gagner camp raved how good he would be outside the Oilers.

News flash he sucked on the oilers and he sucked in Arizona.

I personally much prefer what Purcell brings compared to Gagner. For the exact same reasons I have always stated. He is winger.

Marincin is better than Klefbom. So far anyways. Hopefully both get significantly better or the Oilers are pooched.

 

[Tarus]

Not sure why you are including me in this sickness.

The pro Gagner camp raved how good he would be outside the Oilers.

News flash he sucked on the oilers and he sucked in Arizona.

I personally much prefer what Purcell brings compared to Gagner. For the exact same reasons I have always stated. He is winger.

Marincin is better than Klefbom. So far anyways. Hopefully both get significantly better or the Oilers are pooched.

Is Marincin better than Klefbom in the same way Arcobello would prove everyone wrong as the second line center on the Oilers?

 

[Aerrol]

Not sure why you are including me in this sickness.

The pro Gagner camp raved how good he would be outside the Oilers.

News flash he sucked on the oilers and he sucked in Arizona.

I personally much prefer what Purcell brings compared to Gagner. For the exact same reasons I have always stated. He is winger.

Marincin is better than Klefbom. So far anyways. Hopefully both get significantly better or the Oilers are pooched.

The bolded is a huge strawman that I have never seen anyone argue, not even Replacement who is probably Gagner's biggest fan. No one said Gagner would be automatically better as soon as he got off the Oilers. People said he'd be better if he was put in a place to succeed on a GOOD TEAM. You know, the same story as all the NHL level players we dump and yet they continue to play in the league despite not being good enough for the perennially awful Oilers.

I'd hardly call moving to Arizona an improvement.

 

[Worraps]

I didn't count on Arizona being so bad this year that Tippett would let Snowpants's defensive lapses slide ... but a bet's a bet.

 

[Replacement*]

I didn't count on Arizona being so bad this year that Tippett would let Snowpants's defensive lapses slide ... but a bet's a bet.

Wow I'm loving this. Looks good on ya.

jk aside thanks for standing up on the bet.

Thanks of course to Psycho Dad for the diabolical avatar.

 

[Oilfan2]

Not sure why you are including me in this sickness.

The pro Gagner camp raved how good he would be outside the Oilers.

News flash he sucked on the oilers and he sucked in Arizona.

I personally much prefer what Purcell brings compared to Gagner. For the exact same reasons I have always stated. He is winger.

Marincin is better than Klefbom. So far anyways. Hopefully both get significantly better or the Oilers are pooched.

What? I'm sorry but not even close. Klef is already miles ahead and, I suspect, will stay that way for their careers.
I actually think Marincin has regressed some this year compared to end of season last year. Klef, on the other hand, has greatly improved. Having said that, there was a notable drop in play the last month or so but I suspect that was being over-worked for lack of better options.

 

[Master Lok]

I repeat, going into the NHL season with 2 NHL centers is a mistake. If MacT trades Gagner and immediately replaces him with Roy, then the point is moot. He didn't, instead deciding to throw Leon to the wolves, waste a year of his ELC, and consequently costing us a lot more than just the initial trade.

MacT has made a lot of dumb moves and this is just another one. The issue isn't that he traded Gagner away, it's that he didn't replace him.

And I don't consider Gagner to be an adequate NHL centre. Can he score? Absolutely! But his lack of defensive awareness was a black hole on any line he centered. I'm 100% fine that Gagner is no longer on the team.

The strange thing is that Arcobello was centering Gagner in Arizona. Gagner was so bad defensively that Arizona was playing him on the wing.

 

[guymez]

And I don't consider Gagner to be an NHL centre. Can he score? Absolutely! But his lack of defensive awareness was a black hole on any line he centered. I'm 100% fine that Gagner is no longer on the team.

The strange thing is that Arcobello was centering Gagner in Arizona. Gagner was so bad defensively that Arizona was playing him on the wing.

This is exactly why Gagner was expendable. He was a liability on a team that had no possible way to shelter him even if he played on the wing.

Say what you want about Purcell but he isnt a defensive liability like Gagner was/is. That in and of itself is a plus.

 

[Supermassive]

I didn't count on Arizona being so bad this year that Tippett would let Snowpants's defensive lapses slide ... but a bet's a bet.

Ok, here's your avatar. Had to lose the picture in order to abide by size requirements, but I'm sure that's alright with you

 

[ekcut]

If forced to choose between Purcell or Gagner to play on THIS team, (and I'm not allowed to pick neither) I would pick Purcell.

I will not elaborate as to why, at the risk of sounding like I'm trying to justify Purcells existence in the NHL, other than say he is closer to what we need on this team than Gagner. He is an oval peg in a round hole...where as Gagner is a rhombus.


I'd rather have Penner. At least we'd get a few good quotes out of him.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

And I don't consider Gagner to be an adequate NHL centre. Can he score? Absolutely! But his lack of defensive awareness was a black hole on any line he centered. I'm 100% fine that Gagner is no longer on the team.

The strange thing is that Arcobello was centering Gagner in Arizona. Gagner was so bad defensively that Arizona was playing him on the wing.

This is exactly why Gagner was expendable. He was a liability on a team that had no possible way to shelter him even if he played on the wing.

Say what you want about Purcell but he isnt a defensive liability like Gagner was/is. That in and of itself is a plus.

The team gave up 13 more goals than last year and scored 5 fewer. Still last in the league in GA.

They didn't improve one bit in Gagner's absence. MacT failed when he didn't get an adequate center replacement. Simple as that. It doesn't matter if Gagner wasn't the best center (and nobody will argue that he was), the fact of the matter is MacT created a hole and didn't fill it.

It's indefensible, never mind that the player he got in return was arguably worse!

 

[AlowlyMcOilersfan]

at the end of the year, turns out to be a very lateral move


but with no replacement at centre, it might have been better not trading Gags

 

[Blue And Orange]

at the end of the year, turns out to be a very lateral move


but with no replacement at centre, it might have been better not trading Gags

At least we got Derek Roy now.

 

[misfit]

At least we got Derek Roy now.

Only until July 1.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

At least we got Derek Roy now.

Should've been the solution to begin with.

And since the season's over, MacT better resign him ASAP. Don't play the Curtis Glencross game.

 

[Blue And Orange]

Should've been the solution to begin with.

And since the season's over, MacT better resign him ASAP. Don't play the Curtis Glencross game.

Agreed, although I thought he was signed for one more year. If we let Derek Roy walk, expect more of the same crap going into next season.

 

[Aerchon]

What? I'm sorry but not even close. Klef is already miles ahead and, I suspect, will stay that way for their careers.
I actually think Marincin has regressed some this year compared to end of season last year. Klef, on the other hand, has greatly improved. Having said that, there was a notable drop in play the last month or so but I suspect that was being over-worked for lack of better options.

First off. I generally use a combination of my eyes and stats to rate how a player is doing. I don't really have favorites. I see very simply when a player is playing well or playing bad. I am unbiased.

As an example of that, I agree. Marincin has regressed from last year. Heck, even from the start of this year Marincin has fallen off a bit. Has had weak moments and strong moments (loved him against Getz/Perry). But his regression has been minor, with few glaring errors and actually a tiny bit of improvement offensively as the season has gone on.

Now, you mention a drop in play for Klefbom right after saying has greatly improved... Which is it?

Klefbom started slow, got really good, and fell flat on his face. He has been a dogs breakfast for a very extended period of time. Worse than Schultz in his last stint of at least 20 or so games. I am not sure if you stopped watching during that period or just ignored his putrid positioning, his tape to tape giveaways, or how he gets beat wide like Brad Hunt at times. Glaring, omfg did he just do that moments. Bad pinches, bad reads, bad... damn near everything... at times.

Good Klefbom versus bad Klefbom is night and day and unless you have been under a rock bad Klefbom has been here for the majority of the last 20 games of this season.

How can anyone ignore that stretch of hockey? There are many good reasons for that. He is a rookie, he is being over played, his quality of competition is going up (still not Marincins level) but tougher opposition than he was when he was succeeding. The loss of Petry hurt everyone.

I can say Klefbom at his best looks MUCH better offensively than Marincin, but also no where near as good defensively as Marincin. But for me, watching Klefbom run around like a chicken with his head cut off the last month or two has plummeted his overall season play by a lot.

I know some people don't like plus minus but is a nice simple stat to show the teams GA effectiveness with a player on the ice.

Klefbom is minus 21 facing weaker opposition than Marincin, who despite being a rookie as well is only minus 4.

Only minus 4 playing on this team with these goaltenders against the best of the wests best players...

It really comes down to preference. But Klefbom leaks more goals against than he creates at an alarming rate. Marincin creates a lot less offense but also gives up a ton fewer goals against.

Both need to be much better before I give either a green light towards a playoff picture but I don't know how you can say Klefbom is "miles ahead in that regard". When he is clearly miles behind Marincin defensively.

We are still desperately seeking a defenseman that can generate offense AND keep the puck from finding its way to the back of the net and Marincin is ever so slightly closer to that than Klefbom overall and most certainly right now.

 

[guymez]

The team gave up 13 more goals than last year and scored 5 fewer. Still last in the league in GA.

They didn't improve one bit in Gagner's absence. MacT failed when he didn't get an adequate center replacement. Simple as that. It doesn't matter if Gagner wasn't the best center (and nobody will argue that he was), the fact of the matter is MacT created a hole and didn't fill it.

It's indefensible, never mind that the player he got in return was arguably worse!

Sorry GK but this is a very simplistic argument. There are so many variables that speak to the lack of team defence.

Safe to say though that Gagner was not at all any part of that solution.
Even if the team kept Gagner MacT would have failed in terms of centre depth.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Sorry GK but this is a very simplistic argument. There are so many variables that speak to the lack of team defence.

Safe to say though that Gagner was not at all any part of that solution.
Even if the team kept Gagner MacT would have failed in terms of centre depth.

It's simplistic because that's the measure a lot of people here are using.

The center depth was bad to begin with but it got even worse when MacT decided that a raw rookie was a good replacement. Anyone (and everyone) knew what a terrible idea that was at the time and sure enough, we were right.

Seriously, two NHL centers going into an NHL season "Wasn't a mistake" by our GM's standards. Just imagine if we started the season sans RNH and Gordon like we finished it. No way we'd be any higher than 30th.

 

[McDoused]

I would still take Purcell over Gagner every day of the week. Yakupov didn't play exceptionally well with Gagner and would have been stuck behind Roy on the depth chart. Purcell has brought some leadership to the team and has been pretty consistent. I'm not a huge Purcell fan but it was a lateral move at worst. With Draisaitl and now possible Strome (not to mention lander) we really have no room for Gagner.

 

[guymez]

It's simplistic because that's the measure a lot of people here are using.

The center depth was bad to begin with but it got even worse when MacT decided that a raw rookie was a good replacement. Anyone (and everyone) knew what a terrible idea that was at the time and sure enough, we were right.

Seriously, two NHL centers going into an NHL season "Wasn't a mistake" by our GM's standards. Just imagine if we started the season sans RNH and Gordon like we finished it. No way we'd be any higher than 30th.

Gagner is not an NHL quality centre. He will likely be okay as a winger but on this team even that was not going to be helpful in any way.

Purcell brings more to the table than Gagner as a winger.

 

[Aerchon]

Gagner is not an NHL quality centre. He will likely be okay as a winger but on this team even that was not going to be helpful in any way.

Purcell brings more to the table than Gagner as a winger.

This.

I would still rather have Purcell as a top 9 winger than Gagner as a top 6 center... or as a center anywhere in the line up.

 

[Soundwave]

If forced to choose between Purcell or Gagner to play on THIS team, (and I'm not allowed to pick neither) I would pick Purcell.

I will not elaborate as to why, at the risk of sounding like I'm trying to justify Purcells existence in the NHL, other than say he is closer to what we need on this team than Gagner. He is an oval peg in a round hole...where as Gagner is a rhombus.


I'd rather have Penner. At least we'd get a few good quotes out of him.

Agreed, Penner was better than both.

But we can't bring him back because Mac T doesn't like him. Politics.