Duncan Keith

[LDF]

No. That would be Seabs. Keith is playing like a 34 year old #1 with a lot of miles on him. He's fine most nights. The most complaints about him are him on the PP and they have nothing to do with the majority of his play outside of that. If he's playing liked he's 52, seabs is playing like he's 92. This was a ridiculous statement by you ldf.

wow, that was harsh considering this was my smart arse comment.

but i still stand by my statement. i have seen and seem to recall on many goals against, that keith was blown away or the other team skated around him. btw, look at keith has a +/- of -7 .....

 

[ChiHawks10]

wow, that was harsh considering this was my smart arse comment.

but i still stand by my statement. i have seen and seem to recall on many goals against, that keith was blown away or the other team skated around him. btw, look at keith has a +/- of -7 .....

Wasn't trying to be harsh. But it is ridiculous to say that Keith is playing like hes 52. Although it's now obvious you were exaggerating and or being sarcastic to some degree. I think. I took the comment as you being serious.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

People are dumping on Keith now?

 

[Putt Pirate]

Keith has been mediocre at best. And has had a string of poor games. I can understand the frustration.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Keith has been mediocre at best. And has had a string of poor games. I can understand the frustration.

I'll bite. What do you mean by mediocre? Mediocre for Keith? Mediocre for NHL defenseman?

One of those I'd agree with and one is ridiculous

 

[Kathryn Tappen]

he's old now and has a lot of millage. same boat as slowbrook really. good think we have forsling

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

he's old now and has a lot of millage. same boat as slowbrook really. good think we have forsling

What a ludicrous statement

 

[hawksfan50]

Keith us mediocre now. .cause he no longer can drive the offense abd is no longer elite at defending .just merely serviceable ..So he will end up with mediocre or negative plus minus and that is the truth...open your eyes.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Keith is mediocre? As in a bottom pairing guy? Or mediocre as far as top pairing guys go? I don't agree with either, just trying to see who's on bath salts.

 

[Putt Pirate]

Keith is mediocre? As in a bottom pairing guy? Or mediocre as far as top pairing guys go? I don't agree with either, just trying to see who's on bath salts.

Has he been elite? No
Top pairing mediocre? Most of the time
Offensively challenged? Yes
Black hole on PP? Yes
Passing has been mediocre? Yes
Lost a step? Yes

That is how I see it.

 

[LDF]

Has he been elite? No
Top pairing mediocre? Most of the time
Offensively challenged? Yes
Black hole on PP? Yes
Passing has been mediocre? Yes
Lost a step? Yes

That is how I see it.

totally agree with everything you posted. that is why i am wondering if he is good enuf, with ref to Defense for a 2nd pairing d-men. can the Bhawks deal with him on the 2nd line.

 

[Robsker]

Duncs decline was inevitable. It was very, very impressive that his excellent play was for as long as it has been. he has played monster minutes and done so for forever. A clear and certain HOF career.

Currently, his decline relative to Duncs of old --- or even Duncs of last year --- is rather dramatic. That said, he is currently a slightly below average 1st pairing D-man. Still OK, generally... but that is it. Now....

no other D-man on the Hawks is currently a 1st pairing caliber player.

Keith, somewhat below average as he is (relative to 1st pairing D-men) is well ahead of any other Hawk. We literally do not have anyone else that is legit as a 1st pairing guy. Forsling is not developed enough to be legit now --- maybe 2 years from now... but not now. He is an average 2nd pairing guy now. Rutta is also an average 2nd pairing guy --- maybe (or slightly below average). Then...

big dropoff to the rest of the Hawks D.

Seabs, Murphy and Franson are all 3rd pairing caliber players --- and fairly average (maybe slightly below average) as measured against other 3rd pairing guys. That said, Murphy is young and seems to be emerging. he could be a slightly better than average 3rd pairing guy by seasons's end.

Where has Kempny been? Giving him a chance makes sense.

 

[Pez68]

Again...Keith is paired with a borderline #7 in Franson(no other team would sign him, even for league minimum.....) and often times getting the tough defensive matchups...

It's ridiculous. It's absurd. It's inexcusable. There is no way to judge how much Keith may have fallen off until he at least has a top-4 caliber D partner...

 

[Putt Pirate]

I agree with the Franson issue. But he has also played with Seabs quite a bit as well.....another #7 I guess. None of that has anything to do with 5 of the 6 points I made. Because Franson is better O than Keith is for the most part.

 

[Robsker]

Again...Keith is paired with a borderline #7 in Franson(no other team would sign him, even for league minimum.....) and often times getting the tough defensive matchups...

It's ridiculous. It's absurd. It's inexcusable. There is no way to judge how much Keith may have fallen off until he at least has a top-4 caliber D partner...

You have a point. But the Hawks only have one guy on the team who is a top 4-type guy who is on the right side --- Rutta --- and he is average as a #4. So... no matter what, Duncs has NO ONE who is a legit 1st pair partner as an option. He has to carry someone. And he can no longer do that well. carrying Franson though is crazy. Too much to ask of anyone. Frans should be our #7 guy.

 

[Putt Pirate]

And Franson plays every night. That is aaaaall on Q. I don't think Stan envisioned him being played every night.

 

[LDF]

Again...Keith is paired with a borderline #7 in Franson(no other team would sign him, even for league minimum.....) and often times getting the tough defensive matchups...

It's ridiculous. It's absurd. It's inexcusable. There is no way to judge how much Keith may have fallen off until he at least has a top-4 caliber D partner...

and in the last 2 games, that borderline #7 has played major minutes on defense this past weekend.

 

[LDF]

You have a point. But the Hawks only have one guy on the team who is a top 4-type guy who is on the right side --- Rutta --- and he is average as a #4. So... no matter what, Duncs has NO ONE who is a legit 1st pair partner as an option. He has to carry someone. And he can no longer do that well. carrying Franson though is crazy. Too much to ask of anyone. Frans should be our #7 guy.

and yet the FO did not address that middle pairing D-men.....

 

[LDF]

And Franson plays every night. That is aaaaall on Q. I don't think Stan envisioned him being played every night.

and that is a major disconnect between coach and GM >>>>>> AGAIN !!!

 

[LordKOTL]

My only real issue with Keith this year is his decision making...which is very 2011-like.

 

[LDF]

My only real issue with Keith this year is his decision making...which is very 2011-like.

for me, i had envision Seabs declining 2 yrs ago, Hammer declining last yr and Keith declining this and hitting rock bottom next yr.

the problem is, Keith is declining faster than expected, at least for me. however i would have love to see him in the middle pairing this season.

but it comes back to Q opinion and game-plan.

 

[Robsker]

and yet the FO did not address that middle pairing D-men.....

But what options did they have? They are Cap strapped. They tried with murphy --- and he is OK. Maybe in a year or so he will be a middle pair guy.

Cut the FO some slack --- they have very little to work with (owing to cap constraints) and the team is carrying huge contracts that were earned in the Cup years and are legacies now. That is how it works. this FO has done a great job extending the competitive years for this team in the cap era as long as they have. but the Cap catches up with everyone. Toews plays 5.5M under his pay. Seabs at 4.5M under his pay. Kane 2.5M under his pay --- that is 12.5M in opportunity cost that kills the Hawks. the FO can only do so much against that deficit. You cannot address middle pairing D-man overly with a 12.5M deficit. You have to pay that D-man and the Hawks have little $ to do so... so we go cheap and hope for the best.

Affixing a great deal of blame for the Hawks being a bubble team is not reasonable. the roster is a bubble team roster. Q could do much better with roster management and is past his day and should be replaced sooner rather than later... yes. But even with proper roster management, this team is not anywhere near the level of a contender. It is just the cap era settling in. Now invest in the youth, hope that some of our legacies retire soon, get a new coach and wait for the future.

 

[LordKOTL]

for me, i had envision Seabs declining 2 yrs ago, Hammer declining last yr and Keith declining this and hitting rock bottom next yr.

the problem is, Keith is declining faster than expected, at least for me. however i would have love to see him in the middle pairing this season.

but it comes back to Q opinion and game-plan.

If you don't have the option to do what you want you gotta play the hand you have.

Remember, the 'hawks won 3 cups without a #2C.

As long as you get Keith off the PP, he's not been an overly-massive trainwreck like Runblad or Kukkonen. In the same vein though he's needed more bailing out by the netminder than he should.

I think regardless of anything, they gotta start leaning more on guys like Forsling, Rutta, Kempny (if they decide to play him), and start grooming guys like The Joker ASAP.

And that's not on Keith...everyone gets old and he's been about as graceful at it as Hossa has. I just wish sometimes he made a bit better decision on the ice. Maybe it's over-committing because He's trying to cover for Franson or Seabrook botching things up (even though playing the same in 2011 would negate that excuse since he had much better to work with back then).

 

[TheSting]

Keith is mediocre? As in a bottom pairing guy? Or mediocre as far as top pairing guys go? I don't agree with either, just trying to see who's on bath salts.

 

[b1e9a8r5s]

Has he been elite? No
Top pairing mediocre? Most of the time
Offensively challenged? Yes
Black hole on PP? Yes
Passing has been mediocre? Yes
Lost a step? Yes

That is how I see it.

Keith has declined a bit, but I would still take him at his cap hit in a heart beat. So I think "mediocre" is off base, but I guess that's just semantics at the end of the day.