Proposal: Draisaitl for a cheaper 1 C with a + maybe

[IvanProvorov]

Couturier + Gostisbehere

 

[Brewins]

Krejci + Carlo is a fair offer.

It would be nice if DK was a couple years younger.

If I were forced to trade LD, this is a deal I would seriously consider.

If your not the only fan, then I think alot of boston fans would agree, a future of Drai-pasta is something I have ranted about often.


I said in my post earlier I'd think a small + would need to be added. like Drai and a 2nd or something along those lines.

 

[Mersss]

You would literally have to add Tkachuk to that and the Oilers would still say no.

Drai >>>>>>>> Bennett

and the Oilers have zero use for a pick that might turn into a player that they can use in 5 years.

Counter offer. Goudreau for RNH and a 2nd in 2020

Gaudreau is worth more then a 6M$ 2nd-3rd line C and a 2nd pick buddy and you know that!

 

[Deplorable Lenny]

Gaudreau is worth more then a 6M$ 2nd-3rd line C and a 2nd pick buddy and you know that!

Yes I do know that.

Did you know it was a sarcastic trade proposal in response to the ridiculous proposal I was responding to?

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Gaudreau is worth more then a 6M$ 2nd-3rd line C and a 2nd pick buddy and you know that!

And Draisaitl is worth more than a third line winger and a meh pick.

Bennett and a 1st is a miserable offer.

 

[Deplorable Lenny]

If your not the only fan, then I think alot of boston fans would agree, a future of Drai-pasta is something I have ranted about often.


I said in my post earlier I'd think a small + would need to be added. like Drai and a 2nd or something along those lines.

Krejci is 10 years older than Draisaitl. No thanks. I know Carlo is a good prospect but he is just that, a prospect.

If anything Boston would be adding big time. Especially considering the Krejci caphit for the next 4 seasons on the bad side of 30 years old.

 

[McSuper]

Couturier + Gostisbehere

Good offer . I know other fans will look at the cap hit of the 2 players but this lets us move a defensive man .

 

[Deplorable Lenny]

Couturier + Gostisbehere

One of the better offers I have seen for Drai.

Still wouldn't do it but I am intrigued.

 

[Starat327]

Good offer . I know other fans will look at the cap hit of the 2 players but this lets us move a defensive man .

I'm of the camp that thinks Ghost has a lot of offensive potential, and while i like Couturier, its pretty easy to Drai would be an obvious offensive improvement while losing minimal defensively.

Doing this largely hinges on what Drai would sign for. Assuming its 8 (roughly Couturier + Ghosts hits), the cap is a wash, but it makes things tight down the road (2 years - Simmonds and Provorov re-signs). I'd probably do it still, but i have a pretty hard man crush on Drai, admittedly.

 

[Brewins]

Krejci is 10 years older than Draisaitl. No thanks. I know Carlo is a good prospect but he is just that, a prospect.

If anything Boston would be adding big time. Especially considering the Krejci caphit for the next 4 seasons on the bad side of 30 years old.

Is playing a full nhl season on the 1st pair still a prospect? Argue regression but he didn't have crazy numbers, so there isn't an offensive regression "due" so he may have a sophomore slump, but he won't forget how to defend.

 

[Absurdity]

Krejci is 10 years older than Draisaitl. No thanks. I know Carlo is a good prospect but he is just that, a prospect.

If anything Boston would be adding big time. Especially considering the Krejci caphit for the next 4 seasons on the bad side of 30 years old.

I will start off by saying Draisaitl will probably re-sign with Edmonton, so discussing a trade involving Draisaitl and even Krejci who has a NMC, said he wants to finish out his contract in Boston, is kind of pointless.

I can understand if Edmonton does not want to get older. However, value-wise, Edmonton would be getting a #1B center who last season tied in scoring the most goals he has had in his career in a single season after getting hip surgery last offseason, and a young defenseman who looks to be a #3-4 defensive defenseman, #3D if he improves offensively, who is currently on his ELC, was a key part of Boston's PK last season, and played on the Bruins 1st-pairing (trusted by one of the stingiest coaches when it comes to defense Claude Julien). To me, that is more than fair value for someone like Draisaitl. Does it happen? Given the direction each team is heading, and the value each team places on their player(s), most likely no.

 

[Deplorable Lenny]

Is playing a full nhl season on the 1st pair still a prospect? Argue regression but he didn't have crazy numbers, so there isn't an offensive regression "due" so he may have a sophomore slump, but he won't forget how to defend.

Fair enough. Didn't realize he had played a whole season. For some reason I thought he was in the A for much of the year.

Still though, the main piece in any Draisaitl trade can't be someone 10 years older than him. Also, krejci makes over $7M for 4 more years. Thats a lot of coin for a guy who is over 30.

IF Drai was actually OTB and Krejci was a few years younger, you might be on to something.

 

[Deplorable Lenny]

I will start off by saying Draisaitl will probably re-sign with Edmonton, so discussing a trade involving Draisaitl and even Krejci who has a NMC, said he wants to finish out his contract in Boston, is kind of pointless.

I can understand if Edmonton does not want to get older. However, value-wise, Edmonton would be getting a #1B center who last season tied in scoring the most goals he has had in his career in a single season after getting hip surgery last offseason, and a young defenseman who looks to be a #3-4 defensive defenseman, #3D if he improves offensively, who is currently on his ELC, was a key part of Boston's PK last season, and played on the Bruins 1st-pairing (trusted by one of the stingiest coaches when it comes to defense Claude Julien). To me, that is more than fair value for someone like Draisaitl. Does it happen? Given the direction each team is heading, and the value each team places on their player(s), most likely no.

Yeah I'm not saying its a horrible deal. For me personally though, I can't see the main piece being a player 10 years older. Sure for a few years it might seem like a fair trade depending how well Carlo develops. What happens though in a few years when Krecji is gone and Drai is still in his mid 20s?

Id prefer Edmonton going the Crosby and Malkin route and keeping 2 star Centers for over a decade.

 

[crobro]

Bo Horvat and Adam Gaudette

 

[PatrikOverAuston]

Yeah I'm not saying its a horrible deal. For me personally though, I can't see the main piece being a player 10 years older. Sure for a few years it might seem like a fair trade depending how well Carlo develops. What happens though in a few years when Krecji is gone and Drai is still in his mid 20s?

Id prefer Edmonton going the Crosby and Malkin route and keeping 2 star Centers for over a decade.

The only Boston deal that really makes sense is something around Draisaitl for Pastrnak and McAvoy/Carlo. I'd be willing to add a bit from Edmonton's side, but that stud right-handed D prospect is still necessary to make up for the difference in production and positional value.

As much as it might hurt to break up our star center combo, being able to roll:

Maroon-McDavid-Pastrnak
Lucic-RNH-Puljujarvi

Klefbom-Larsson
Sekera-McAvoy/Carlo

For 3+ years is a very attractive option.

 

[Absurdity]

The only Boston deal that really makes sense is something around Draisaitl for Pastrnak and McAvoy/Carlo. I'd be willing to add a bit from Edmonton's side, but that stud right-handed D prospect is still necessary to make up for the difference in production and positional value.

As much as it might hurt to break up our star center combo, being able to roll:

Maroon-McDavid-Pastrnak
Lucic-RNH-Puljujarvi

Klefbom-Larsson
Sekera-McAvoy/Carlo

For 3+ years is a very attractive option.

Pastrnak and Draisaitl have very similar value with Draisaitl having the edge since he can play center. The 7 point difference does not warrant a blue chip prospect to be added to Pastrnak. The Bruins wouldn't make that trade based on team needs and that offer being a gross overpayment from a Bruins perspective.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Pastrnak and Draisaitl have very similar value with Draisaitl having the edge since he can play center. The 7 point difference does not warrant a blue chip prospect to be added to Pastrnak. The Bruins wouldn't make that trade based on team needs and that offer being a gross overpayment from a Bruins perspective.

Probably, but big 21 year old 1C's don't grow on trees and I think a gross overpayment would be exactly what would be needed to land Draisaitl.

Particularly from Boston. I'd imagine Chia hasn't forgotten or forgiven the whole Hamilton fiasco.

 

[Absurdity]

Probably, but big 21 year old 1C's don't grow on trees and I think a gross overpayment would be exactly what would be needed to land Draisaitl.

Particularly from Boston. I'd imagine Chia hasn't forgotten or forgiven the whole Hamilton fiasco.

I totally agree. Draisaitl is an important player for Edmonton and for their future. Having McDavid and Draisaitl as their #1 and #2 locked down long term will be vital to their long-term success.

With that said, I don't think there is a team out there that would be willing to offer a #1 RW who was top 5 in scoring for RWers at the age of 21 (Pastrnak) and a projected top-pairing defenseman (McAvoy) or a defenseman that has been playing on their top-pairing while being able to handle those minutes (Carlo).

On Chiarelli, I don't get where the animosity comes from Edmonton fans and Chiarelli regarding Hamilton. Chiarelli being let go was probably for the best for the team and himself. Rookie GM Sweeney took over and was trying to sign Hamilton, future Chara replacement and really only top 4RD left after Chiarelli traded Boychuk, but Hamilton didn't respond to any of his contract offers. Then the Bruins hear the guy who left the Bruins with no prospect pool and in cap hell was rumored to offersheet a player who was their future on defense. Sweeney tried to trade Hamilton for Arizona's 1st (3rd overall), but that fell through. Up until that point, the only two teams rumored of threatening an offersheet for Hamilton were Calgary and Edmonton. Six hours after the Arizona - Boston trade talks, Hamilton was traded to Calgary for #15, #45, and #52 instead of Edmonton for #16, #33, and #57. If you factor in draft position and teams' own draft boards, the only pick that was better than Calgary's was #33 instead of #45. The threat was real because Hamilton didn't want to be a Bruin.

And that's why the Bruins probably won't forgive Chiarelli. He gets let go for putting the Bruins in a bad spot, threatens to offersheet his former team's replacement for Chara, and then he holds a grudge because he feels like his former team should have done him a solid and give him their next franchise defenseman cause Hamilton didn't want to be a Bruin as if he already knew.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I totally agree. Draisaitl is an important player for Edmonton and for their future. Having McDavid and Draisaitl as their #1 and #2 locked down long term will be vital to their long-term success.

With that said, I don't think there is a team out there that would be willing to offer a #1 RW who was top 5 in scoring for RWers at the age of 21 (Pastrnak) and a projected top-pairing defenseman (McAvoy) or a defenseman that has been playing on their top-pairing while being able to handle those minutes (Carlo).

On Chiarelli, I don't get where the animosity comes from Edmonton fans and Chiarelli regarding Hamilton. Chiarelli being let go was probably for the best for the team and himself. Rookie GM Sweeney took over and was trying to sign Hamilton, future Chara replacement and really only top 4RD left after Chiarelli traded Boychuk, but Hamilton didn't respond to any of his contract offers. Then the Bruins hear the guy who left the Bruins with no prospect pool and in cap hell was rumored to offersheet a player who was their future on defense. Sweeney tried to trade Hamilton for Arizona's 1st (3rd overall), but that fell through. Up until that point, the only two teams rumored of threatening an offersheet for Hamilton were Calgary and Edmonton. Six hours after the Arizona - Boston trade talks, Hamilton was traded to Calgary for #15, #45, and #52 instead of Edmonton for #16, #33, and #57. If you factor in draft position and teams' own draft boards, the only pick that was better than Calgary's was #33 instead of #45. The threat was real because Hamilton didn't want to be a Bruin.

And that's why the Bruins probably won't forgive Chiarelli. He gets let go for putting the Bruins in a bad spot, threatens to offersheet his former team's replacement for Chara, and then he holds a grudge because he feels like his former team should have done him a solid and give him their next franchise defenseman cause Hamilton didn't want to be a Bruin as if he already knew.

People have used that journal article as 'evidence' that Chiarelli was dangling Sweeney off a cliff by his ankles - ill say to you what I said to them. Read it over again. Nowhere does it say Chiarelli threatened, was threatening, or was in the process of tendering an offer sheet.

The entire Bruins organization looked at Chiarelli like the Boogeyman simply because he wouldn't bend the knee to Neely and tried to keep together a proven winning lineup. Sweeney was a rookie trying to outmaneuver his old boss and panicked.

I will say Chiarelli probably did know that Dougie wanted out, and probably did use that knowledge to press the issue, but that article isn't evidence.

Either way there's precisely zero chance Draisaitl ends up a Bruin unless the overpay is just gargantuan.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Couturier + Gostisbehere

Not bad but I don't believe Couturier is capable of playing top six on a winner or that Ghost will get any better than he was his rookie season.

 

[Absurdity]

People have used that journal article as 'evidence' that Chiarelli was dangling Sweeney off a cliff by his ankles - ill say to you what I said to them. Read it over again. Nowhere does it say Chiarelli threatened, was threatening, or was in the process of tendering an offer sheet.

The entire Bruins organization looked at Chiarelli like the Boogeyman simply because he wouldn't bend the knee to Neely and tried to keep together a proven winning lineup. Sweeney was a rookie trying to outmaneuver his old boss and panicked.

I will say Chiarelli probably did know that Dougie wanted out, and probably did use that knowledge to press the issue, but that article isn't evidence.

Either way there's precisely zero chance Draisaitl ends up a Bruin unless the overpay is just gargantuan.

I didn't like the Hamilton (trade)...I knew the Bruins felt that Edmonton was going to offer sheet Hamilton. And they really felt trapped. And it (the trade) was a move they had to make right away."

Chiarelli didn't "threaten" the Bruins, but the Bruins felt Edmonton was going to offersheet Hamilton. If they felt it could happen, that means there must have been something behind those feelings and not that Chiarelli became some kind of "boogeyman" once he left Boston.

Chiarelli bend the knee to Neely? The only rumor out there about a potential move Chiarelli wanted to make that Neely nixed was a trade involving Ryan Spooner and a 2nd for Chris Stewart, which would have been downright horrible. What proof do you have that Neely wanted to control Chiarelli? Are you implying that Neely was the one who made all the moves or was trying to get more involved in Chiarelli's decisions? What proof do you have for either or both claims?

How was Chiarelli trying to keep a winning lineup when he trades a #4D in Boychuk for cap space but keeps a regressed Chris Kelly around with the same cap hit? Did Neely want Boychuk traded instead and tell Chiarelli how much to extend each player?

What proof do you have that Sweeney wanted to outmaneuver his old boss? Was it because he originally asked for Nurse + picks? The two final offers from Calgary and Edmonton were a 1st and two 2nds which weren't very much different at all which I explained in post #543. I don't see how Sweeney was trying to outmaneuver his old boss when those were the only two offers on the table.

I agree on Draisaitl. As I mentioned, I don't think Draisaitl gets traded, and Edmonton ends up signing him.

 

[PatrikOverAuston]

Pastrnak and Draisaitl have very similar value with Draisaitl having the edge since he can play center.

No, they really don't. Allow me to explain:

The 7 point difference does not warrant a blue chip prospect to be added to Pastrnak.

You mean the 7-point difference last year, and the 25-point difference the year before that? Oh, and then there was this past playoffs (1.23 PPG to 0.7).

Draisaitl has always been the superior player, and that's even before you get into the gulf in value between centers and wingers. You're darn right it would take a blue chip prospect.

The Bruins wouldn't make that trade based on team needs and that offer being a gross overpayment from a Bruins perspective.

So the Bruins don't need a young top-ten scoring center. Wow, that's quite a team you have there. Surprised they were knocked out in six. You'd think they could have gone all the way with that sort of depth.

and a projected top-pairing defenseman (McAvoy) or a defenseman that has been playing on their top-pairing while being able to handle those minutes (Carlo).

This wasn't in reply to me, but it's on the same subject so allow me to quote you:

You can "project" all you want, but neither Carlo nor McAvoy have top pairing defenseman value today. However, if you want to talk about real, actual events, Draisaitl has been a better player than Pastrnak despite them being the same age- and that, again, is even before weighing the difference in value between a C and W.

The potential of those two defensemen- and let's be clear, that's what it is today, potential- is the only thing that would make such a trade alluring to Edmonton. Otherwise, why would they bother?

However, I think we can both agree the Bruins wouldn't go for it. It's just too savvy a move for Sweeney and co. They're apparently more of the mind that drafting "safe" "third liners" is how you build a winner- oh, and taking worse deals just to spite former employees (which you admit they did, yet are unwilling to admonish them for). In the end, Edmonton will keep the better player, the better team... and the better GM.

 

[Absurdity]

No, they really don't. Allow me to explain:

You mean the 7-point difference last year, and the 25-point difference the year before that? Oh, and then there was this past playoffs (1.23 PPG to 0.7).

Draisaitl has always been the superior player, and that's even before you get into the gulf in value between centers and wingers. You're darn right it would take a blue chip prospect.

So am I supposed to ignore that Pastrnak played 7 less games than Draisaitl last season? Are we now supposed to ignore the development of players and what they may project to be? For example, should I look at Mark Scheifele's first two seasons (34pts, 49 points) and say he is not a superior player to so and so even though he broke out last season and became/is becoming one of the league's best centermen? Is Seguin not a great player because of his playoff points?

Draisaitl had an amazing playoffs, and Edmonton was a better team than the Bruins last season. I didn't deny any of that. Nor did I deny that Draisaitl didn't have more value than Pastrnak. If you read my post, I even said Draisaitl had the edge in value because of his versatility of playing center and wing. Nor did I say there wouldn't have to be some sort of add to Pastrnak to make value match.

So the Bruins don't need a young top-ten scoring center. Wow, that's quite a team you have there. Surprised they were knocked out in six. You'd think they could have gone all the way with that sort of depth.

You can "project" all you want, but neither Carlo nor McAvoy have top pairing defenseman value today. However, if you want to talk about real, actual events, Draisaitl has been a better player than Pastrnak despite them being the same age- and that, again, is even before weighing the difference in value between a C and W.

What team wouldn't want a player like Draisaitl? What you fail to understand are other teams' needs and that a scoresheet doesn't tell the whole story.

The Bruins have Bergeron and Krejci at center. Pastrnak is their #1 RW. The Bruins will have McAvoy and Carlo make up both of their top 4 RD.

Would getting Draisaitl be great for the Bruins? Absolutely. At the cost for Pastrnak + McAvoy/Carlo? No, and I'll explain.

Pastrnak is a #1 RW and was in the top 5 RW last season in scoring. After Pastrnak, the Bruins are looking at Backes, who is okay but not a driving force on offense, and prospects to fill on the right side. On defense, the Bruins will have McAvoy and Carlo makeup their top 4 on the right side going into next season. As good as Draisaitl is, for a team with Bergeron and Krejci as their top 6 centers, it is not worth creating more holes to improve an area that is not needed. The Bruins need Pastrnak and McAvoy/Carlo more than they need to improve at center. Even if Draisaitl would be brought in to be a RW and replace Pastrnak, the cost of losing a potential first-pairing replacement for Chara in McAvoy or shutdown cost-controlled defenseman in Carlo is too costly for a Bruins team also in need of defense. Hypothetically speaking, the closest example, which may not be a very good one, I can think of is Edmonton offering Draisaitl + Klefbom for someone like Scheifele or Backstrom. Does Edmonton do it? Hell no because as good as a Scheifele or Backstrom is, they lose a very important part of their defense in Klefbom for only a slight improvement at center.

On projections and value, I never said McAvoy or Carlo have 1st-pairing value. You are putting words in my mouth.

Do you think that prospect/player projection is not taken into account at all in trades or in how a team values its players? Nico Hischier was drafted 1st overall this draft and projects to be a #1C. You don't think New Jersey would covet him as one if a team asked New Jersey what the cost would be to trade for him? You think New Jersey would be like, "well you know...he was drafted in the 1st round so a 1st rounder will do"? The answer to that is no. The same goes for McAvoy and Carlo. What they project to be for the Bruins means a lot to them value-wise especially given the holes they have and will have on defense once Chara retires. Sergachev was just traded for Drouin, and that trade happened without Sergachev playing a single game in the NHL. McAvoy and Carlo don't have "top-pairing" value like you insist I was saying, but they do have value around the league especially to the Bruins.

 

[deadpenguin]

Just for ***** and giggles, does Kuznetsov interest you? Signed for $7.8mm/year for the next 8 years. If you want to make things really interesting, package Carlson in there as well. Isn't RD a need for Edmonton?



Evgeny Kuznetsov
John Carlson



Leon Draisaitl
??

This is terrible for the caps

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

This is terrible for the caps

Not so sure. Kuznetsov is terrific but so is Draisaitl. Carlson is a UFA at season's end and the Caps may not be able to resign him, in which case recouping some assets for him would be the right move.