Do the Habs go into the season "Goonless"?
- Thread starter respect the D
- Start date
- Status
I think it is hilariously myopic of people to think that the loss of Thorton means:
a. Boston isn't interested in fighting and intimidation
b. think that Boston is softer this year than last year
If you recall, it was it was a no-name meat head named Kevan Miller who concussed Moen. I believe he's still with the Bruins.
And then there's:
Lucic
Chara
McQuaid
I'm sure there are others. They can still give the Habs a beating on the scoreboard, and then rub their faces in it by beating them on the rink.
What's funny is that, reading that kind of post make it sound like we lost 0-4 to them last playoffs because their physical game was so much more superior...
What's funny is that, reading that kind of post make it sound like we lost 0-4 to them last playoffs because their physical game was so much more superior...
Count me in as one of those who thought:
a. A miracle a.k.a. C. Price took place in that series
b. Boston (particularly in the first two games) out muscled and most likely should have taken those two games.
I still think Boston has a much better team.
Cue the shock and horror.
I don't think that Boston has a much better team. I'd say they might still be slightly better than us and that's it. Let's not forget that they lost some toughness (Ignila, Thornton), Chara is getting old and Lucic had a kind of mental breakdown after the series.
If you go over their board, all the talk is about skill and speed and being done with goonery.
I could be totally wrong, but I feel that last year's playoffs will have a similar effect that our 2010 run had on the Capitals. Those last two games where we outscored the Bruins 7-1 really left a mark. It was not just the goalie squeezing a win while the team is being outshot 50-20. It was some very sound playoffs hockey and we were better than them in those two games, plain and simple.
So I think the Bruins will try to change and adapt their game a little bit. It might work, might not. Who knows. Next season will be interesting.
Price is Wright
Registered User
Price outplayed Rask (who rarely plays well against Montreal) but it wasn't like he was some sort of miracle. Montreal scored seven goals in the last two games. I guess Price scored five of them?
Those guys are not UFA's. Wouldn't waste a pick or prospect on a guy we need for 6-8 minutes a game and only about 30-40 games. Get Westgarth or Bissonnette. Maybe Toronto would just dump Orr or McLaren they won't keep both on the roster.
I thought that overall, the bruins skaters probably outplayed the habs skaters by a tad if we average out the entire series. Early on, we could have been in a real tough spot if not for Price, he was truly on his game. You're probably right in that Price wasn't as instrumental in closing the series out but he was invaluable in keeping us in the thing early on.
S Bah
Registered User
My biggest concern lies with the RW's, if they can help bring the Habs more puck possession icetime along with producing 5 on 5 scoring, all of a sudden teams have serious concerns about taking penalties. Usually Hab teams that thrive on scoring at even strength also thrive on the PP, which drastically reduces their opponent's desire to intimidate. This of course doesn't by any stretch of the imagination mean having players that are pugilists also, won't be necessary. Athlete's need to know that they can play their game, when abused and referees refuse to do their job, they need reassurance that someone will define the line that's crossed. It's sad that this is a big part of professional hockey, but nonetheless it is and GM's have to take this into account, if any hopes of being a playoff team with healthy players is indeed the goal.
Having said that our GM needs to find a way to level the playing field against teams that approach the game, with intimidation replacing good competitive hockey. It appears this message isn't lost on Marc Bergevin, a veteran NHL defenceman, or his cohorts in managing the Habs, all with varying degrees of experience in the NHL war zones. I count upon their vast accumulated knowledge in finding acceptable means of dealing with this problem. I don't include crying/whining to the referees whose deaf ears seem to favor underdog teams without the discipline to play within the accepted confines of long held rules. Go Bergy Go!!!... Get us that highscoring team with balanced toughness with talent to succeed, despite the worst intentions of those lazy teams, that use intimidation instead of hard work to succeed.
Having said that our GM needs to find a way to level the playing field against teams that approach the game, with intimidation replacing good competitive hockey. It appears this message isn't lost on Marc Bergevin, a veteran NHL defenceman, or his cohorts in managing the Habs, all with varying degrees of experience in the NHL war zones. I count upon their vast accumulated knowledge in finding acceptable means of dealing with this problem. I don't include crying/whining to the referees whose deaf ears seem to favor underdog teams without the discipline to play within the accepted confines of long held rules. Go Bergy Go!!!... Get us that highscoring team with balanced toughness with talent to succeed, despite the worst intentions of those lazy teams, that use intimidation instead of hard work to succeed.
Dominator13
Registered User
The 4 guys that I named can follow an NHL pace game though, Westgarth and Orr can't.
Price is Wright
Registered User
For about 200-300 minutes of ice time over a season, who cares?
Plus Wesgarth had 4 goals in 36 games of limited ice time, pretty good for a "goon".
VirginiaMtlExpat
Second most interesting man in the world.
Are they UFAs or do we need to trade for one? In the latter event, at what cost?
Edit. Didn't see MonctonScout's comment. There must be one of his options who can skate, no?
VirginiaMtlExpat
Second most interesting man in the world.
I would do a mid-level prospect, if we're talking about a young player who can skate well enough to stick with the team. Nolan played 64 games in the regular season with the Kings. Granted, he did not crack the lineup much in the playoffs, but few of this type of pugilist do.
Nolan doesn't give us anything that guys like Prust Weise and Tinordi already do.
We don't need another 4th line banger, we have too many of those, we need a true HW to be enforcer.
VirginiaMtlExpat
Second most interesting man in the world.
This is the trade-off. Playing ability (whereby he can and will be inserted in the lineup) vs heavyweight fighting ability. It isn't either or, but a spectrum with two poles, characterized by these two conflicting (or near-conflicting) requirements. A guy like that is somewhere in the middle of this spectrum, which is what I advocate.
I don't believe that you can just go for the largest player possible, if he is going to be a liability to the play the way that Parros was, however guys like Weise and Prust are closer to the pole that emphasizes playing ability, because of their size and ability, than the four suggested by Max Pac, all of whom are bigger than Weise and Prust. As for Tinordi, he is close to that optimum, but we really want him to be a defenseman who mostly stays on the ice. He is a fairly skilled defenseman, and he will soon be in our top-3 or 4.
a middle of the spectrum guy like ryan white that we let walk ? so we have a guy with those skills who is cheaper, good on the pk and has shown that he will stand up for his teamates, and you propose switching him for someone more expensive ?
Weise is a good 4th liner but hes the antithesis of the heavyweight fighting pole in your spectrum. we dont have a single true heavyweight, we have but one middleweight and one rookie who may, or may not be in the lineup. on the flip side we have a TON of guys who cannot be relied on to be anywhere within this spectrum as their are neither bangers, nor fighters.
150 -250 minutes a season is not something we have to be fantastically worried about, hell we have enigma bourque who EVERYONE expects will take way more minutes off than that next season but he gets a pass, somehow.
if you are of the mindset that we are good to go with this lineup, that's fine. but its also true that this lineup is extremely exploitable and by extension, you are also fine with saddling prust with the position of HAVING to punch up and likely come out worse for wear, for an entire season. and if prust cant go, we ask guys even less able ( weaver/weise) to have to shoulder that load. yikes
VirginiaMtlExpat
Second most interesting man in the world.
White is not middle-of-the spectrum either. While he is tough, he is relatively small. I'm thinking in terms of a guy in the 225-230 range, possibly 235, but who can skate better than Parros. Nowhere do I advocate standing pat with this lineup. If I did, I would not be posting in this thread. It would leave me indifferent.
VirginiaMtlExpat
Second most interesting man in the world.
That's exactly what I said. Go back and re-read my post, or is it too abstract? Please don't go misrepresenting what I write simply to start an argument. Life is too short, and I have other fish to fry.
Price is Wright
Registered User
That's Bissonette but his agent is waiting for a team that can guarantee him more than five minutes a game.
Connor Crisp should be a regular AHLer next season. Why not the Habs just bring him up when needed?
VirginiaMtlExpat
Second most interesting man in the world.
The first is along the lines of what I have in mind. Crisp needs to play more in the AHL in order to graduate. Bissonnette will get more desperate over time. I would send out feelers anyway, but no guarantees. It should be enough for him that this team is on the threshold of competing for a Cup.
Connor Crisp is not a heavyweight. Crisp also is able to score points. There is no way in hell that I would waste Crisp as the enforcer for the Habs. Crisp is part of the movement (size + toughness + skill) that will arrive in Montreal in the next 2-3 years that will eliminate the need to have a discussion regarding an "enforcer".
I would definitely try to bring Bissonette here. Explain to him what his primary role on the team is and if he scores some points, the minutes will increase. At least he appears to be motivated to become more than a One-Dimensional player........the player coveted by the likes of Kriss E and others.
c3z4r
Registered User
Is we're talking AHL prospects, then Nevins is twice the fighter Crisp is, so if anything call up Nevins to play a Kyle Clifford type role for us.
The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of Bissonnette. I like his versatility, he was actually a D in Junior. I'm against the idea of bringing back Murray/Bouillon because I want Tinordi and Beaulieu to have every opportunity available but, there will be injuries. Having a guy in our lineup who can be 7D if absolutely necessary isn't a terrible option. Kind of similar to Christoph Schubert when he was with Ottawa.
Coyotes fans said Bissonette pulled a Laraque. He doesn't want to fight all that much anymore.
If you're gonna get an enforcer, might as well get the best one, not one that doesn't want to do his job.
- Status
