Cincinnati, Kansas City, and Omaha have shown interest in NHL expansion

[Headshot77]

Apparently, it's frowned upon to organize fans to visit other NHL arenas begging for relocation. Who knew?



In all seriousness, QC is always mentioned as having interest. Why it never gets beyond the "preliminary talks" phase with the league is beyond me, but it seems to me there's a failure somewhere in the application process.

Vegas and Seattle completed their applications and were granted franchises. Why did QC not complete theirs? Quebec Hockey Club 3.0 could already be playing NHL games if only someone had done the work.

They completed theirs. Their application was "deferred" which is a polite way of saying no.

 

[dj4aces]

They completed theirs. Their application was "deferred" which is a polite way of saying no.

That's a new one. I've heard several things, including an incomplete application and a nonpayment of application fee during the Vegas process, and a failure to apply at all during the Seattle process.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

Coyotes playing in a 5k seats arena make every arena in the same range suitable for NHL. The league set that standard on their own.

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[Dirty Old Man]

Omaha. Finally, an American city that has even less chance of getting a team than Saskatoon let alone QC.

Oh, come now, the NBA used to be there

 

[Tawnos]

That's a new one. I've heard several things, including an incomplete application and a nonpayment of application fee during the Vegas process, and a failure to apply at all during the Seattle process.

No it was definitely deferred. At the time Bettman cited Canadian dollar volatility and geographic imbalance.

Obviously only the imbalance issue isn’t part of it any more, but there are still questions about the exchange rate.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

In all honesty I think Quebec made more money for the league during their 80s-90s stint than Coyotes have since 1996 and yet Phoenix is a top10 market size wise.


Coyotes playing in a 5k seats arena make every arena in the same range suitable for NHL. The league set that standard on their own.

Um, no. If Coyotes can’t find NHL sized arena soon they are gone.

Smaller arena as temporary venue would be fine for any market if NHL wants to be there.

 

[Mightygoose]

Apparently, it's frowned upon to organize fans to visit other NHL arenas begging for relocation. Who knew?



In all seriousness, QC is always mentioned as having interest. Why it never gets beyond the "preliminary talks" phase with the league is beyond me, but it seems to me there's a failure somewhere in the application process.

Vegas and Seattle completed their applications and were granted franchises. Why did QC not complete theirs? Quebec Hockey Club 3.0 could already be playing NHL games if only someone had done the work.

Quebec did complete their expansion application at the same time as Vegas and went through the phases and It was 'deferred'.

Seattle had a different process for them alone.

 

[Bixby Snyder]

I think what happened with the Quebec bid was the group involved realized they could not afford it after you factored in the exchange rate and bailed.

 

[dj4aces]

I think what happened with the Quebec bid was the group involved realized they could not afford it after you factored in the exchange rate and bailed.

That's more in line with what I'd heard, hence my comment.

Maybe when the application process is started this time around, they'll be able to get in.

 

[HarrySPlinkett]

I would just like to say, you can’t give Omaha a team and continue to pretend Quebec City can’t have one.

It doesn’t matter how how little French you speak, or what the taxes are.

Nobody who’s ever been to both places would conclude anything except Quebec City >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Omaha in every way that matters and also every way that doesn’t.

Omaha is terrible.

 

[hockeyguy0022]

Omaha. Finally, an American city that has even less chance of getting a team than Saskatoon let alone QC.

Ironically this...

 

[ArmadilloThumb]

I'm pro expansion to 36 (right now the NHL is effectively in 23 US markets). I'm also strongly in favor of the Coyotes remaining in the Phoenix area. Generally speaking, and for a range of reasons I believe the best places to expand to are: Houston, SLC, Atlanta, & Austin . Omaha does have an NHL history though - with lots of HOF players...

 

[BKIslandersFan]

I would just like to say, you can’t give Omaha a team and continue to pretend Quebec City can’t have one.

I agree.

But its not happening so its a moot point.

 

[mouser]

That's a new one. I've heard several things, including an incomplete application and a nonpayment of application fee during the Vegas process, and a failure to apply at all during the Seattle process.

My understanding is the appropriate application fees were paid and the application was technically treated as “deferred” by the NHL. I haven’t seen a media report on precisely what rights are granted by being “deferred”. I doubt the NHL would allow QC to acquire an expansion team in the future at the previous expansion fee. I’d guess the deferral means the NHL would waive any application fees for a future expansion bid.

I researched the Quebecor financial statements at the time of the expansion bid process and I don’t believe the company was in a situation to pay the $500m expansion fee for a new team. Between the time when the new arena construction was first approved and the expansion process completed the CAD<>USD exchange rate had significantly shifted, 20+ cents/dollar IIRC. This was already putting financial pressure on Quebecor‘ business, as many of their expenses had to be paid in USD, while collecting revenue in CAD. The NHL expansion fee would also have to be in USD.

Did PKP have the money available? Unsure, and also unsure if the NHL BoG would have any concerns over him as principle owner. Was there another prospective owner with the funds available to partner with Quebecor? Haven’t seen this fully answered either, but don’t recall other names being reported during the bid process.


Edit:
- When the Videotron center broke ground on Sep 12th 2012 the exchange rate was 0.976 CAD to 1 USD.
- When the NHL approved the Vegas expansion team in June 2016 the exchange rate was ~1.30 CAD to 1 USD.

That’s a 33% currency exchange swing in less than four years.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

I would just like to say, you can’t give Omaha a team and continue to pretend Quebec City can’t have one.

It doesn’t matter how how little French you speak, or what the taxes are.

Nobody who’s ever been to both places would conclude anything except Quebec City >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Omaha in every way that matters and also every way that doesn’t.

Omaha is terrible.

Corporate support is important. My guess is hockey would be huge in Omaha and SLC. Utah has the jazz. Omaha got nothing. It makes sense.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Reading this topic through again, did Bettman just play everybody here? Everyone is focused on Omaha, the one option which absolutely and clearly won’t happen, and nobody’s really talking about Kansas City, Cincinnati, or Salt Lake City anymore as bad options, when I fundamentally guarantee that any of the three would’ve been laughed out of the forum five years ago (though I have been pumping SLC’s tires as a very long-term expansion target for years now, and I am always in favor of more Central Time Zone teams, so KC has my support).

Watch Cincinnati get a team and the general reaction will then be that at least it wasn’t Omaha.

 

[BMN]

Reading this topic through again, did Bettman just play everybody here? Everyone is focused on Omaha, the one option which absolutely and clearly won’t happen, and nobody’s really talking about Kansas City, Cincinnati, or Salt Lake City anymore as bad options, when I fundamentally guarantee that any of the three would’ve been laughed out of the forum five years ago (though I have been pumping SLC’s tires as a very long-term expansion target for years now, and I am always in favor of more Central Time Zone teams, so KC has my support).

Watch Cincinnati get a team and the general reaction will then be that at least it wasn’t Omaha.

Someone told Gary "mutual (incredulity) of Omaha is what you can count on when the going's rough selling the other markets."

* crickets *

...aaaaannnnd I'm outta here...

 

[hammer42]

A 40 team NHL. within the next 10-20 years stands a good chance of happening as with every major sports league over the next 20 years as well but the cities that are listed few of them will never happen & here is a list of them & why .

Atlanta - Failed twice to risky & the NHL. won't go for it for a third
Salt Lake City - Getting MLB expansion team no room for NHL. team
Omaha - To small of market for a major sports team
San Diego - Enough teams in California with 3 no need for 4th
Cincinnati - New arena most likely for an NBA. team not an NHL. team

 

[hammer42]

Here is a proper list of future NHL. cities & why

*Houston - most likely getting the coyotes next season & is a proven Hockey market
Kansas City - It failed once but deserves a 2nd chance

Portland - A traditional hockey market that is proven

Quebec City - New arena all set to go for a 2nd crack at the NHL.

Hamilton - A $300 million dollar renovation all set to go in May & well be done in October 2025 & Hamilton is a traditional hockey market that would Be very lucrative for the NHL.

Milwaukee - Small but a proven hockey market & is in a border state

Cleveland - Proven hockey market & deserves a 2nd chance

Hartford - Again proven hockey market if they build an arena they deserve another crack at the NHL

 

[tmlfan98]

The reason why QC keeps getting "snubbed" (see this sentiment everywhere when expansion comes up) is because the NHL wants to expand into more American markets specifically.

It's pretty obvious Bettman feels he has some catching up to do compared to the other major pro leagues in NA in terms of number of American markets they reach. This talking point has also been parroted numerous times by league insiders.

NFL: 32 American teams
NBA: 29 American teams
MLB: also 29
NHL: 25 American teams

 

[JMCx4]

Here is a proper list of future NHL. cities & why ...

Milwaukee - Small but a proven hockey market & is in a border state ... Cleveland - Proven hockey market & deserves a 2nd chance

Please explain further. Are Southern Ontario hockey fans going to charter a Great Lakes passenger ferry to attend hockey games regularly in MWAH-kee? And since when did "deserving" become a factor in NHL expansion/relocation considerations?

 

[hammer42]

Hockey in the United States is just not that popular no matter how Bettman & his cronies like to make you think they are niche markets that means bigger the market dose not mean it is a good hockey market just look at Atlanta & Phoenix for example & the NHL. has to realize that & that it will not rise in popularity like it did in the Gretzky era ever again & have shift there focus to where the money is that is in more traditional & proven hockey markets where there is low risk of the team failing & relocating .

 

[Bixby Snyder]

Hockey in the United States is just not that popular no matter how Bettman & his cronies like to make you think they are niche markets that means bigger the market dose not mean it is a good hockey market just look at Atlanta & Phoenix for example & the NHL. has to realize that & that it will not rise in popularity like it did in the Gretzky era ever again & have shift there focus to where the money is that is in more traditional & proven hockey markets where there is low risk of the team failing & relocating .

 

[Final Baton]

The reason why QC keeps getting "snubbed" (see this sentiment everywhere when expansion comes up) is because the NHL wants to expand into more American markets specifically.

It's pretty obvious Bettman feels he has some catching up to do compared to the other major pro leagues in NA in terms of number of American markets they reach. This talking point has also been parroted numerous times by league insiders.

NFL: 32 American teams
NBA: 29 American teams
MLB: also 29
NHL: 25 American teams

This is what I believe as well. I mentionned this on here 4 months ago and was met with skepticism. I'm doubling down on it now.

 

[BB79]

A 40 team NHL. within the next 10-20 years stands a good chance of happening as with every major sports league over the next 20 years as well but the cities that are listed few of them will never happen & here is a list of them & why .

Atlanta - Failed twice to risky & the NHL. won't go for it for a third
Salt Lake City - Getting MLB expansion team no room for NHL. team

I have to disagree with these 2. If someone has the money I can see Bettman giving Atlanta another chance. Although I think it's foolish.

What bearing does SLC getting an MLB team have on getting an NHL team? They play in 2 completely different seasons and arenas. I bet SLC gets a team in the next 10 years.

And a 40 team league just ensures I'm tuning out. The schedule is already watered down with teams I don't care about now. Goodbye rivalries forever if this happens. Hello watered down boring hockey