Confirmed with Link: Casey Mittelstadt (2017, 8th) - Signed, #37

[HaNotsri]

Imagine believing we will have that many players worth protecting by 2020.

I envy your optimism.

If we add a defender we might want to protect 8 players. Guhle, Scandella, x, Ristolainen, Eichel, ROR, Reinhart, Asplund/Nylander.

Adding Casey means putting all our good forward prospects on the table.

7+3 means loosing one of our top 4 defensemen (hopefully) or a forward prospect.

I don’t think I’m being too ”optimistic”

 

[AustonsNostrils]

If we add a defender we might want to protect 8 players. Guhle, Scandella, x, Ristolainen, Eichel, ROR, Reinhart, Asplund/Nylander.

Adding Casey means putting all our good forward prospects on the table.

7+3 means loosing one of our top 4 defensemen (hopefully) or a forward prospect.

I don’t think I’m being too ”optimistic”

Neither of those two would need to be protected in 2020, would still be on ELC contracts.

 

[joshjull]

If we add a defender we might want to protect 8 players. Guhle, Scandella, x, Ristolainen, Eichel, ROR, Reinhart, Asplund/Nylander.

Adding Casey means putting all our good forward prospects on the table.

7+3 means loosing one of our top 4 defensemen (hopefully) or a forward prospect.

I don’t think I’m being too ”optimistic”

You're making too many assumptions to take this in one direction to posit those might be the players we look to protect. There are so many permutations that can play out over the next couple off-seasons, trade deadlines and seasons that will impact who we would be looking to protect after a 19-20 season concludes. Things may look very different than your assumptions when the expansion draft rolls around.

I don't think the expansion draft can be dismissed out of hand when talking about signing Casey. But I think there is too much that can change between now and then to let it weigh that heavily on what we do with him right now.

 

[Chainshot]

I'm curious what the sales pitch would be from any GM to get a player and his agent to pass up starting his ELC early. I know it can be done as evidenced by Frederic signing one.

Maybe its... "our NHL team is a tire fire right now and you really don't want to expose yourself to that. So go down to our slowly descending into a tire fire farm team and help turn it around"

Say something like....

"You are just one full calendar year from playing high school hockey and while the transition to the NCAA level was very good, we would like you to get your feet wet down the stretch with the AHL club. We think your skills would be a dynamic addition to that team and the experience will help springboard you into the NHL lineup sooner rather than later. We think you have what it takes and you could be the piece to help put the Amerks over the top. We will work with you in good faith on your next contract and make sure to take care of you if you are willing to sign this now."

Or something.

I'm guessing that burning a year of the ELC would happen with a player that has to be convinced to leave.

It's often a carrot in UDFA negotiations, like Smith last year or Nelson the year prior.

 

[HaNotsri]

Neither of those two would need to be protected in 2020, would still be on ELC contracts.

I think 2+ years of professional hockey means that you’re not exempt.
From nhl.com:
All first- and second-year professionals, as well as all unsigned draft choices, will be exempt from selection (and will not be counted toward their club's applicable protection limits).

 

[Rasmus CacOlainen]

You're making too many assumptions to take this in one direction to posit those might be the players we look to protect. There are so many permutations that can play out over the next couple off-seasons, trade deadlines and seasons that will impact who we would be looking to protect after a 19-20 season concludes. Things may look very different than your assumptions when the expansion draft rolls around.

I don't think the expansion draft can be dismissed out of hand when talking about signing Casey. But I think there is too much that can change between now and then to let it weigh that heavily on what we do with him right now.

The sell is extra development time so said player can hit the NHL earlier (i.e. possibly next season).

 

[26CornerBlitz]

 

[joshjull]

Say something like....

"You are just one full calendar year from playing high school hockey and while the transition to the NCAA level was very good, we would like you to get your feet wet down the stretch with the AHL club. We think your skills would be a dynamic addition to that team and the experience will help springboard you into the NHL lineup sooner rather than later. We think you have what it takes and you could be the piece to help put the Amerks over the top. We will work with you in good faith on your next contract and make sure to take care of you if you are willing to sign this now."

Or something.

Sign this man up to lead the talks. Well said and well argued.

It's often a carrot in UDFA negotiations, like Smith last year or Nelson the year prior.

I know its the case with the UDFAs. I'm just wondering how much of a role it can play with guys in Casey's situation.

 

[JLewyB]

Neither of those two would need to be protected in 2020, would still be on ELC contracts.

The last expansion draft was based off of pro seasons. Both would need to be protected I believe if those rules would apply again

 

[Chainshot]

Sign this man up to lead the talks. Well said and well argued.



I know its the case with the UDFAs. I'm just wondering how much of a role it can play with guys in Casey's situation.

It's all about laying out the master plan and getting buy-in.

My expectation is that they sign him and he's in the Sabre lineup to end the season and that's it. I want them to surprise me with some deeper thinking and salesmanship.

 

[joshjull]

It's all about laying out the master plan and getting buy-in.

My expectation is that they sign him and he's in the Sabre lineup to end the season and that's it. I want them to surprise me with some deeper thinking and salesmanship.

I'm not worried about the deep thinking part. I'm pretty sure the idea of Casey on a ATO then starting his deal next year is what our management team wants. Its going to come down to the salesmanship though for sure. That will hinge in part on what Casey wants to do or how ready he is to leave college.

Has there been anything throughout the year on Casey's wanting to stay, go or being indifferent either way.

 

[dotcommunism]

dotcommunism can clarify BUT now I read this again, IF Mittelstadt were to sign with the Sabres now, the contract would be a 2017-18 season contract. Casey was 18 as of September 15th of the 'signing year' which I think is 2017-18, I know you are assuming it's 2018 but that makes no sense at all. Had Casey been a CHL player, he would have signed an ELC over the summer, the team would have sent him back to junior, his junior team doesn't make the playoffs so we call him up for some games at the end of the season, it would be under 10 games, so his contract slides.

It doesn't matter what season the contract was signed, only the calendar year matters. In 2018, Mittelstadt turns 20. He's not eligible for a contract slide regardless of the season the contract takes effect.

what would be the rationale for this rule? it penalizes the Sabres for having an NCAA player rather than a CHL player, the CHL kid can play 9 NHL games in his draft +1 season and the NCAA kid can't without the team losing an ELC season. makes no sense.

The whole point of the slide rule is to allow teams to see if a player is ready at the start of the season and if he isn't allow the team to return him to juniors without burning an ELC year. Yes, players can be called up after their CHL season is complete, but that doesn't happen very often (because good players are often playing in the CHL playoffs and there's usually little reason to call such a player up to the NHL vs the AHL when their CHL season is complete).

Regarding the point of the rule (why players who are 19 as of September 15, but turn 20 before the completion of the year aren't eligible for a contract slide) it's because such players are eligible to play in the AHL the year in which they sign their SPC, and they don't want contracts sliding for players who were always slated for the AHL that season (that's not the point of the contract slide). As for how it specifically affects Mittelstadt it's an edge case that's the result of a confluence of circumstances.

Also another interesting wrinkle is that if Mittelstadt signs an ELC that commences this season, he would have four seasons of waiver exemption (including this season), meaning that he would be waiver exempt for one season following the completion of his ELC.

 

[valet]

I think that the best case scenario for Casey and the Sabres is that he signs this Summer and starts the year in Rochester. He could be ready for the NHL, but my intuition says he isn't and could use some time in the minors. He's clearly our best prospect, but could he handle the physicality of the NHL after an off-season of training?

 

[EichHart]

I think that the best case scenario for Casey and the Sabres is that he signs this Summer and starts the year in Rochester. He could be ready for the NHL, but my intuition says he isn't and could use some time in the minors. He's clearly our best prospect, but could he handle the physicality of the NHL after an off-season of training?

Yeah, let him play with Nylander and hopefully get both of them going and be first call ups next season.

 

[old kummelweck]

Gophers appear to be going nowhere fast. They need to cut bate with this coaching staff. I'm certainly of the opinion that MN could be the WRONG place for Mittlestadt to continue his development. If he were at BU or BC, maybe I'd be OK with him staying, but I really got the sense watching Lucia this season that he never knew how to use Casey. He comes across as being incredibly stubborn: rolling 4 lines no matter the situation.

 

[Zip15]

I'm curious what the sales pitch would be from any GM to get a player and his agent to pass up starting his ELC early. I know it can be done as evidenced by Frederic signing one.

Maybe its... "our NHL team is a tire fire right now and you really don't want to expose yourself to that. So go down to our slowly descending into a tire fire farm team and help turn it around"

Further to what Chain said, I think you just level with him that the AHL is the best place for him for the remainder of the season. Internally, I'm sure Botts likely knows that he has a bit more leverage here than he would with a college junior (rising senior) or UDFA. Since the WJC, most signs point to Casey turning pro (e.g., Tkachuk's Instagram post). The uncertainty surrounding Minnesota's hockey program and Lucia's future probably only increases the chances that he gets out of Dodge. I'd like to see Botts dig in here, because I just don't think Casey is going back to Minnesota next season and Rochester is the best place for him this year.

Ya that’s where I am at, I don’t think either way is worth losing sleep over...if he turns out being the real deal and burning a year his second contract might end up being cheaper too.

I certainly wouldn't lose any sleep, but it'd be disappointing if Mittelstadt effectively says that he would prefer to play a few meaningless NHL games in order to burn an ELC year rather than going to Rochester and playing games that matter. I wouldn't begrudge him for that decision, but it'd be disappointing.

 

[Bonin21]

Some players probably like the idea of never playing an AHL game. All the power to him if he wants to finish the year in the show and try to stay up all next year.

 

[Zip15]

Some players probably like the idea of never playing an AHL game. All the power to him if he wants to finish the year in the show and try to stay up all next year.

Such is certainly his right if he wants to anchor himself to the position of NHL-or-no-contract. But I think that'd be a silly position given what's going on within the Minnesota program.

 

[Bonin21]

Such is certainly his right if he wants to anchor himself to the position of NHL-or-no-contract. But I think that'd be a silly position given what's going on within the Minnesota program.

Finish the year in the NHL means leave college.

 

[Zip15]

Finish the year in the NHL means leave college.

I know. I didn't say otherwise. I'm stating that Casey would be silly to take that position given that (a) I think he wants to turn pro now, and (b) there's a lot of uncertainty surrounding the Gophers program going forward. I'd like to see Botts show some spine here and dig in on the "ATO, then ELC starting next year" position. I think Casey takes it.

 

[old kummelweck]

I know. I didn't say otherwise. I'm stating that Casey would be silly to take that position given that (a) I think he wants to turn pro now, and (b) there's a lot of uncertainty surrounding the Gophers program going forward. I'd like to see Botts show some spine here and dig in on the "ATO, then ELC starting next year" position. I think Casey takes it.

I don't think he needs to. They can sign him to his first contract and he can play 9 games in the NHL without burning a season.

 

[Bonin21]

Exactly

 

[Moskau]

Sign and trade.

 

[Vito_81]

I don't think he needs to. They can sign him to his first contract and he can play 9 games in the NHL without burning a season.

Even if he signs today, He’s not getting into Monday’s game. Only 10 games left after that point.

I expect him to sign early this coming week, and after a few practises he plays his first game in Buffalo Friday night and then in NYC the next night. How does that sound, Kid?

 

[dotcommunism]

I don't think he needs to. They can sign him to his first contract and he can play 9 games in the NHL without burning a season.

No, they can't.