Can we now confirm that Crosby was saving himself for the playoffs?

[Fordy]

a lot of non pens fans are throwing a fit because he didn’t try in the regular season. can’t say i’m surprised

 

[North Cole]

I didn't say you said he was mailing it in. I said you're getting fixated on people describing him as mailing it in, when a better description of his play was pacing himself.

As for the rest, it's funny how you think you have a better handle on Crosby's performance this year than fans who literally watched every single Pens game. Maybe I should go into an Oilers discussion and tell everyone who watched all Oiler games that they're wrong about their assessment of their team.

I'm getting fixated on people thinking any player at a professional level is good enough to consciously take weeks off and still make the playoffs because he can just take over games anytime and anyplace. Parity is at an all time high, and your going to argue that Crosby can "pace" himself to limp into the playoffs and then go on a run. He is that special and his game is that nuanced, huh?

As for the rest of your post. Seriously.....?

This is the Stanley cup playoffs board in "Forums" section..... should the Mods, shut the main boards down? Apparently, if you didn't watch a player for all 82 games, you can't comment on him in the public area... This isn't the team boards buddy; maybe you should keep this discussion on your HFpens if you want an echo chamber, otherwise it isnt a pens-fans only dicussion. Wow, that's some next level entitlement......

 

[Bumpus]

Being elite and having an elite work ethic is not peanut butter. You dont spread it over your toast one day when you decide you need it, but leave it in the cupboard the next day because "regular season".... You either have it all the time or you don't. The people that don't have it, don't make the nhl.

Except somehow, despite your expert analysis, we seem to be witnessing just that.

 

[North Cole]

Except somehow, despite your expert analysis, we seem to be witnessing just that.

drinks during the finals at Crosby's house! I need some an elite screwdriver (the drink).

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I'm not the one saying he mailed it in. The guy I responded to said that, quote him.

"Disinterested", "cruise-control", "cup hangover". Are you the Pens psychologist? The **** you know Malkin was disinterested? This is what I'm talking about, no one in the league is good enough to shutdown for three months straight and then decide to turn on elite play like it comes out of the kitchen tap.

Malkin and Crosby struggled, but to say they did it conciously in an effort to "rest" is bull****. There's a difference between, "man I'm tired today and just don't have it" and, "hey Crosby, I got some Russian hookers at my place, save your energy for after the game, eh? It's only the regular season". Malkin has 9+ million reasons to be interested.

I also love how the art Ross and hart trophies are marginalized now. When did they become meaningless? Pens have the most art rosses of any team in the league, bet it wasn't a "useless regular season award" when you guys were winning them every year.

Ya this is a bunch of nonsense, sorry.

Of course an elite player can coast and turn it on when he wants. Kessel has been doing that his entire career.

Art Ross trophies are pretty meaningless when you are chasing a three peat and hockey immortality like Crosby and Malkin are doing.

But ya, be angry they coasted I guess and pretend it’s some impossible thing that only Phil Kessel can pull off.

 

[Bumpus]

drinks during the finals at Crosby's house! I need some an elite screwdriver (the drink).

We'll put you on the "wait list."

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I'm getting fixated on people thinking any player at a professional level is good enough to consciously take weeks off and still make the playoffs because he can just take over games anytime and anyplace. Parity is at an all time high, and your going to argue that Crosby can "pace" himself to limp into the playoffs and then go on a run. He is that special and his game is that nuanced, huh?

As for the rest of your post. Seriously.....?

This is the Stanley cup playoffs board in "Forums" section..... should the Mods, shut the main boards down? Apparently, if you didn't watch a player for all 82 games, you can't comment on him in the public area... This isn't the team boards buddy; maybe you should keep this discussion on your HFpens if you want an echo chamber, otherwise it isnt a pens-fans only dicussion. Wow, that's some next level entitlement......

Where did I say you can't comment? I just said it's funny that you think you have a better handle on how Crosby played this season than people who watched all his games.

Or did I make a bad assumption? Did you also watch all the Penguins games this year and are drawing your conclusions based on that?

I'll ask again: if you don't believe Crosby was pacing himself, then why does he look way more engaged and more focused on his attention to detail in the playoffs compared to the bulk of his regular season games?

 

[Todd Parchment]

Sidney Crosby the person the player the man was not “saving himself” for the playoffs like a virgin.

He had ups and down during the season and is on an upswing right now but might suck during the next series. I don’t think any player in the NHL saves themselves for the playoffs because it’s hard enough to make it there in the first place.

You cannot coast to the playoffs.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

I'm getting fixated on people thinking any player at a professional level is good enough to consciously take weeks off and still make the playoffs because he can just take over games anytime and anyplace. Parity is at an all time high, and your going to argue that Crosby can "pace" himself to limp into the playoffs and then go on a run. He is that special and his game is that nuanced, huh?

As for the rest of your post. Seriously.....?

This is the Stanley cup playoffs board in "Forums" section..... should the Mods, shut the main boards down? Apparently, if you didn't watch a player for all 82 games, you can't comment on him in the public area... This isn't the team boards buddy; maybe you should keep this discussion on your HFpens if you want an echo chamber, otherwise it isnt a pens-fans only dicussion. Wow, that's some next level entitlement......

He clearly can. Why do you think the Penguins were 23rd in GD in the first half of the season, and 3rd in the 2nd half? Remember, the same team won the last two cups, so was this luck, was it a coaching change, or maybe, just maybe it was their effort level.

 

[authentic]

Sidney Crosby the person the player the man was not “saving himself” for the playoffs like a virgin.

He had ups and down during the season and is on an upswing right now but might suck during the next series. I don’t think any player in the NHL saves themselves for the playoffs because it’s hard enough to make it there in the first place.

You cannot coast to the playoffs.

Honestly, if anyone can it's the back to back Stanley Cup and Conn Smythe winners. It's not hard to imagine with all the hockey they played in the past 2 seasons and given how poorly the team was in the first half, especially when their core group is now 30+. He does look like he's trying harder from what I've seen (and yes I realize you can say that for most players, but not nearly all of them get the results). This in no way means he can play like this every game or every series, so what you say here can still remain true even if what they are trying to tell you is as well.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Where did I say you can't comment? I just said it's funny that you think you have a better handle on how Crosby played this season than people who watched all his games.

Or did I make a bad assumption? Did you also watch all the Penguins games this year and are drawing your conclusions based on that?

I'll ask again: if you don't believe Crosby was pacing himself, then why does he look way more engaged and more focused on his attention to detail in the playoffs compared to the bulk of his regular season games?

It is pretty amazing how all the fans of other teams tell Penguins fans how the team didn't coast, when we watched them all year.

Anyone want to offer an alternative explanation why they were so bad the first half of the season?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

It is pretty amazing how all the fans of other teams tell Penguins fans how the team didn't coast, when we watched them all year.

Anyone want to offer an alternative explanation why they were so bad the first half of the season?

That's my issue with this entire discussion. People are simply saying "teams don't coast", but are not offering explanations for why the Pens' work ethic and attention to detail is night and day compared to much of the regular season.

If you're going to argue that Crosby (and the Pens) didn't pace themselves, then at least offer a legitimate reason for why they looked like ass for a lot of the regular season but suddenly resemble their back-to-back Cup winning form once the playoffs began.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

That's my issue with this entire discussion. People are simply saying "teams don't coast", but are not offering explanations for why the Pens' work ethic and attention to detail is night and day compared to much of the regular season.

If you're going to argue that Crosby (and the Pens) didn't pace themselves, then at least offer a legitimate reason for why they looked like ass for a lot of the regular season but suddenly resemble their back-to-back form once the playoffs began.

I think we both know why one particular fanbase can't come to grips with Crosby not trying in the regular season, I'm not sure about the others though.

 

[North Cole]

Where did I say you can't comment? I just said it's funny that you think you have a better handle on how Crosby played this season than people who watched all his games.

Or did I make a bad assumption? Did you also watch all the Penguins games this year and are drawing your conclusions based on that?

I'll ask again: if you don't believe Crosby was pacing himself, then why does he look way more engaged and more focused on his attention to detail in the playoffs compared to the bulk of his regular season games?

Prett simple English. It's a backhanded insult saying I'm not qualified to judge his play because I missed games 12, 24-47, 68, 71, 72, and 79-82. If I'm not qualified to judge his play then I shouldn't be commenting on this thread. But it's a main boards thread, so go try and censor someone else.

He looked pretty engaged and focused when he was scoring all those out of the air GOTYs we got 20 threads about. I've watched him away from the puck, his defensive game never really suffered, just because there was times the offense weren't there, doesn't mean he wasnt focused. Do you think Mackinnon wasn't very focused in his final games of the season, until the last game against the blues. He was resting until they had a must win and then he turned it up?

Ya this is a bunch of nonsense, sorry.

Of course an elite player can coast and turn it on when he wants. Kessel has been doing that his entire career.

Art Ross trophies are pretty meaningless when you are chasing a three peat and hockey immortality like Crosby and Malkin are doing.

But ya, be angry they coasted I guess and pretend it’s some impossible thing that only Phil Kessel can pull off.

Good thing Kessel wasn't floating at the start of the year, you guys woulda been screwed.

Nice, so the argument is that im angry and i posted nonsense. Cool story. Art Ross should just be done away with, players don't even want to win it anymore, right? Individual awards are the reason OV isn't that far behind him. I would like to see Crosby win another to be honest, he works hard for it. Problem is, he keeps winning and you gnats keep getting louder and more obnoxious. BRB, going to counseling for my anger issues....

We'll put you on the "wait list."

How much is cover? My buddy Steckel wants to come too, can you get him on the list?

 

[North Cole]

He clearly can. Why do you think the Penguins were 23rd in GD in the first half of the season, and 3rd in the 2nd half? Remember, the same team won the last two cups, so was this luck, was it a coaching change, or maybe, just maybe it was their effort level.

You mean, when Malkin went from 20 points back in the scoring race, to one behind kucherov. There is a reason Malkin was almost a hart nominee.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

You mean, when Malkin went from 20 points back in the scoring race, to one behind kucherov. There is a reason Malkin was almost a hart nominee.

Because he also gave more effort starting in January when his team was outside a playoff spot?

 

[Cursed Lemon]

Crosby flat out said it’s really hard to get up his intensity for the regular season. Anyone who has watched him play extensively in the past, could easily tell he wasn’t going all out this season.

You want to throw out hyperbole like he planned to lose games is just silliness and eye roll worthy.

He has played more hockey the last two seasons than anyone in NHL history thanks to the Pens b2b runs and Gary’s Olympics.

You have to be out of your mind or completely delusional to think a 30 year old Crosby could play his typical style all season long and not get burned out come playoff time.

It’s not realistic, he’s still human, but somehow this keeps being forgotten, like he plays in EA NHL with fatigue and injuries shut off.

Feel free to point out where I said that Crosby isn't allowed to naturally slow down a little bit because of the amount of hockey he's played.

But maybe...just maybe...that's why he was only 10th in scoring this year. Not because he was "pacing himself".

 

[North Cole]

Because he also gave more effort starting in January when his team was outside a playoff spot?

Did he? Want to make the thead or should I?

"Can we now confirm that Malkin was saving himself for January 1st?"

That has a special ring to it, doesnt it? Oh wait, I'm an oilers fan, so I just can't come to terms with this situation.. laughable

 

[deepelemblues]

Some parts of this thread I really do not get.

Garbage time goals?

Playing against teams the Penguins are significantly better than?

To discredit Crosby's production?

Do you want to institute some kind of system where a goal or an assist in "garbage time" only counts as half a goal or an assist on a player's stat sheet? .75? .8? Or against a "bad" team? Does that only count as 1/3 of a point? Or should they not count at all except on the scoreboard? Should they not even count there too? "All goals scored by your team when your team has a 4 goal lead do not count." Uh...

How about a goal or an assist against a top 5 (statistically) defense or goalie? Should that count as 1.25? 1.5? What about the BEST defense or the BEST goalie in the league? Should it count as 2 then?

How do you quantify when a team is "saving its legs" for the next game? Just how much were they "saving"? How does that factor into how many goals and assists should 'really' be recorded on a player's stat sheet? Does it reduce the value of a point by 25%? 40%?

Does this system apply to every player in the league, or just to elite players that people have ridiculous axes to grind against, or just to Sidney Crosby?

Sure let's just introduce a bunch of variables that are totally unquantifiable save through subjective and arbitrary value-assigning... all for the purpose of not having to acknowledge that Sidney Crosby is either the best player in the world, or a top 5 player at worst.

Geez Louise.

A goal and an assist are a goal and assist, they're each worth 1 point to a player's stat sheet regardless of the game situation when they were scored, the team they were scored against, or the player scoring them. They don't exist on some sliding scale. This is all insanity.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Prett simple English. It's a backhanded insult saying I'm not qualified to judge his play because I missed games 12, 24-47, 68, 71, 72, and 79-82. If I'm not qualified to judge his play then I shouldn't be commenting on this thread. But it's a main boards thread, so go try and censor someone else.

He looked pretty engaged and focused when he was scoring all those out of the air GOTYs we got 20 threads about. I've watched him away from the puck, his defensive game never really suffered, just because there was times the offense weren't there, doesn't mean he wasnt focused. Do you think Mackinnon wasn't very focused in his final games of the season, until the last game against the blues. He was resting until they had a must win and then he turned it up?



Good thing Kessel wasn't floating at the start of the year, you guys woulda been screwed.

Nice, so the argument is that im angry and i posted nonsense. Cool story. Art Ross should just be done away with, players don't even want to win it anymore, right? Individual awards are the reason OV isn't that far behind him. I would like to see Crosby win another to be honest, he works hard for it. Problem is, he keeps winning and you gnats keep getting louder and more obnoxious. BRB, going to counseling for my anger issues....




How much is cover? My buddy Steckel wants to come too, can you get him on the list?

1) No, when you don't have all the information, maybe you should defer to others.

2) Those were in late March, when he started trying again. Those wouldn't have happened earlier in the season since he wasn't going to the net. Also, there have been a lot of shifts where Crosby just slowly glides in loops around the NZ for 20 seconds and goes to the bench. Playoffs start, all of a sudden he's busting his ass up the ice away from the puck. I wonder what changed.

You do seem to be angry though that the Art Ross isn't the ultimate goal for players. When you have won all there is to win, including the last 2 championships, why risk injury or fatigue yourself when you can conserve your body for the real season?

 

[authentic]

Prett simple English. It's a backhanded insult saying I'm not qualified to judge his play because I missed games 12, 24-47, 68, 71, 72, and 79-82. If I'm not qualified to judge his play then I shouldn't be commenting on this thread. But it's a main boards thread, so go try and censor someone else.

He looked pretty engaged and focused when he was scoring all those out of the air GOTYs we got 20 threads about. I've watched him away from the puck, his defensive game never really suffered, just because there was times the offense weren't there, doesn't mean he wasnt focused. Do you think Mackinnon wasn't very focused in his final games of the season, until the last game against the blues. He was resting until they had a must win and then he turned it up?



Good thing Kessel wasn't floating at the start of the year, you guys woulda been screwed.

Nice, so the argument is that im angry and i posted nonsense. Cool story. Art Ross should just be done away with, players don't even want to win it anymore, right? Individual awards are the reason OV isn't that far behind him. I would like to see Crosby win another to be honest, he works hard for it. Problem is, he keeps winning and you gnats keep getting louder and more obnoxious. BRB, going to counseling for my anger issues....




How much is cover? My buddy Steckel wants to come too, can you get him on the list?

MacKinnon played with the flu apparently at the end of the season

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Did he? Want to make the thead or should I?

"Can we now confirm that Malkin was saving himself for January 1st?"

That has a special ring to it, doesnt it? Oh wait, I'm an oilers fan, so I just can't come to terms with this situation.. laughable

Can you point to the area on the doll where you were triggered?

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Prett simple English. It's a backhanded insult saying I'm not qualified to judge his play because I missed games 12, 24-47, 68, 71, 72, and 79-82. If I'm not qualified to judge his play then I shouldn't be commenting on this thread. But it's a main boards thread, so go try and censor someone else.

Or it's the fact you're arguing a point against people who watched every single game. It's not an "insult" or a suggestion that you have no clue about hockey or any other such imagined insults you think I'm lobbing at you. It's a statement of fact that people who watch 100% of a team's games will (more often than not) have a better handle on that team that someone who hasn't watched as many games.

It's the same reason why I posted once in the Capitals series thread about Holtby should have started, but haven't insisted since many Caps fans argued that Grubauer was the right choice. I figure, okay, they've seen the Caps play all 82 games, so maybe, just maybe, they have a better take on the team than I do.

He looked pretty engaged and focused when he was scoring all those out of the air GOTYs we got 20 threads about. I've watched him away from the puck, his defensive game never really suffered, just because there was times the offense weren't there, doesn't mean he wasnt focused. Do you think Mackinnon wasn't very focused in his final games of the season, until the last game against the blues. He was resting until they had a must win and then he turned it up?

Pacing does not equal literally not putting an ounce of effort in any game this season. No one is saying Crosby was crap all 82 games, but it was clear that the same consistent work ethic he's been known for his entire career wasn't there nearly as much this season as in the past. He'd have one or two "vintage Crosby" games, then go on a 4 or 5 game stretch of looking like he was trying to compete with Kessel for laziest player.

And his defense DID suffer. This was the first year since his rookie year that he didn't end up as a plus (ended at even on the year). And while I realize +/- is a dubious stat, it showed that this season, more than any in his career since he was 18, that Crosby was on the ice for more goals against than he normally is.

As for those GOTY threads, Crosby's a talented guy. He's capable of scoring a highlight reel goal even in games where he was largely invisible.

 

[North Cole]

Feel free to point out where I said that Crosby isn't allowed to naturally slow down a little bit because of the amount of hockey he's played.

But maybe...just maybe...that's why he was only 10th in scoring this year. Not because he was "pacing himself".

Dude, dont kick the nest. I did, and now I have 4 people spamming me. Helllllloooo? Can you heaaarrrrr meeeee? I'mmmmmmmmm stuck in the penssssss echooooo chamberrrrrrrrrr.... help meeeeeeeee!

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

Some people just don't want to accept the pens can turn it on for the playoffs and have several extra gears they don't show in the regular season. I wonder how many consecutive playoff series they have to win for people to come around.