Proposal: Calgary Flames Offseason Re-Tool

[RasmusAndersson]

1.
To Florida:
Sean Monahan
2021 3rd (CGY)

To CGY:
2021 1st (FLA)
Grigori Denisenko
Markus Nutivaara

Florida gets their 2C and will allows Lundell to develop as 3C and eventually into that role. CGY gets 1st+ RW prospect+small cap dump 3rd pair RD.

2.
3 Way Trade:
To ANA:
Anthony Mantha

To CGY:
Rickard Rakell
Conditional 2022 2nd - ANA (if Rakell doesn't re-sign next off-season)

To Det:
Rasmus Andersson

Detroit gets a top-4 Right D for Mantha, Calgary gets the top-6 RW we need, and Anaheim gets a similar top-6 winger with longer term. Creates a hole on the Flames RD but also opens up an expansion spot on the back end.

3.
To Minnesota:
2021 1st (FLA)
Mikael Backlund

To CGY:
Matt Dumba

Minnesota gets a top-9C and a 1st for Dumba, Flames protect Dumba and Minnesota can do 7-3-1 and keep their wingers

Sign Phillip Danault (5 years, 5.5 mil)
Re-sign Derek Ryan (1 year, 1.5 mil)
Sam Bennett (1 year, 2 mil)


Gaudreau-Lindholm-Rakell
Tkachuk-Danault-Mangiapane
Dube-Bennett-Denisenko
Lucic-Ryan-Leivo/Ritchie/Phillips

Hanifin-Tanev
Giordano-Dumba
Valimaki-Nutivaara
Kylington

Markstrom
Rittich

Protect Gaudreau, Lindholm, Rakell, Tkachuk, Mangiapane, Dube, Bennett, Hanifin, Tanev, Dumba, Markstrom. Draft a C with our top-10 pick and then we'd have two good top-9 C prospects with him and Zary

Click to read more...

 

[AKL]

Can't see why Minnesota would be interested in that deal. Would rather keep Dumba and protect him ourselves.

 

[Bond]

I would rather have Mantha than Rakell and picks can't be conditional on players resigning anymore

 

[Deen]

Your third deal requires the first one to go through, and I think you're off there.

 

[violaswallet]

Too much from Florida for Monahan at his cap: Monahan would be an ideal 2C but over 6M is tough with Barky re signing. We need cheap first round talent to navigate it; we only pick up a Marchy/Dadonov/Verhaege every two or three years sadly

 

[RasmusAndersson]

Can't see why Minnesota would be interested in that deal. Would rather keep Dumba and protect him ourselves.

And lose one of Greenway/Foligno? I feel like a proven top-9C is a need for you guys and this way you don't have to expose a top-9 winger also. Plus a 1st which would give you 3? I feel like it's decent value but fair if you'd rather keep Dumba I just think it may be tricky expansion-wise

 

[AKL]

And lose one of Greenway/Foligno? I feel like a proven top-9C is a need for you guys and this way you don't have to expose a top-9 winger also. Plus a 1st which would give you 3? I feel like it's decent value but fair if you'd rather keep Dumba I just think it may be tricky expansion-wise

Yeah I do feel like I would prefer to keep a top pair RD over a 3rd line LW, I really do.
Your 32 year old 3C making almost 5.5M for the next three years isn't appealing, it's a poorly disguised cap dump.

 

[RasmusAndersson]

Your third deal requires the first one to go through, and I think you're off there.

Fair, I think Deniskno is a legit top-6 RW and so that+1st+3rd pair D upgrade is tempting for me. I don't know if there's many better prospects we could get in addition to a 1st for Monahan. Also the extra 4 mil in cap is huge for pursuing a replacement top-6 C. 4 mil+1st+future 2nd line RW is pretty great value for Monahan imo.

Too much from Florida for Monahan at his cap: Monahan would be an ideal 2C but over 6M is tough with Barky re signing. We need cheap first round talent to navigate it; we only pick up a Marchy/Dadonov/Verhaege every two or three years sadly

Understandable. Even with Flames taking Nutivaara back? I feel like you guys have most of your core locked down and even with a 5 mil increase for Barkov in 2 summers that's pretty doable with Connolly Stralman and Nutivaara off the books no? That's almost 12 mil right there. I feel like you guys have more cap flexibility than most of the league to be honest, but get not wanting to add a big commitment

 

[RasmusAndersson]

Yeah I do feel like I would prefer to keep a top pair RD over a 3rd line LW, I really do.
Your 32 year old 3C making almost 5.5M for the next three years isn't appealing, it's a poorly disguised cap dump.

Not every player over 30 is automatically a cap dump lol he's still a very productive 2C. 1st+2/3C+the ability to keep Greenway or Foligno? Seems like pretty solid value. Fair if you don't wanna move Dumba but there's been plenty of rumours about him and Backlund on his own could probably fetch a 1st+cap dump, so 2 1sts and a middle-6 LW for Dumba seems more than fair value-wise compared to other offers I've seen. Especially if you're gonna try to make a run in the coming years and help insulate Rossi before throwing him to the wolves. Dumba's sick tho I don't blame you I just think it's not that far off especially if the need for a C upgrade becomes apparent for you

 

[AdmiralsFan24]

Not every player over 30 is automatically a cap dump lol he's still a very productive 2C. 1st+2/3C+the ability to keep Greenway or Foligno? Seems like pretty solid value. Fair if you don't wanna move Dumba but there's been plenty of rumours about him and Backlund on his own could probably fetch a 1st+cap dump, so 2 1sts and a middle-6 LW for Dumba seems more than fair value-wise compared to other offers I've seen. Especially if you're gonna try to make a run in the coming years and help insulate Rossi before throwing him to the wolves. Dumba's sick tho I don't blame you I just think it's not that far off especially if the need for a C upgrade becomes apparent for you

Foligno has never hit 30 points and is currently shooting like 30%. I don't really think the Wild would care if he was taken and they would likely be ecstatic if he was because that would let them keep Greenway, Eriksson-Ek and Dumba.

As far as rumors about Dumba. There have seemingly been rumors about him being traded since he was drafted which to me would mean that either the Wild value him incredibly highly, in which case Backlund and a late 1st wouldn't even be close being to an offer the Wild would be willing to accept or that the rumors of him being available are complete bullshit.

 

[Mazatt]

I feel like the value of the 3-way deal is way off. Andersson has struggles this year, but making an all in move of our best young defensemen (not highest ceiling, mind you) that is locked in at a reasonable cap hit for a rental and a 2nd is... weird given the 1st trade is a straight sell, and we are then making a move for Dumba that needs to happen in order for losing Andersson to be tolerable. Either way, trading ~6 years of Andersson for 1 year of Rakell is... not good.

 

[violaswallet]

Fair, I think Deniskno is a legit top-6 RW and so that+1st+3rd pair D upgrade is tempting for me. I don't know if there's many better prospects we could get in addition to a 1st for Monahan. Also the extra 4 mil in cap is huge for pursuing a replacement top-6 C. 4 mil+1st+future 2nd line RW is pretty great value for Monahan imo.




Understandable. Even with Flames taking Nutivaara back? I feel like you guys have most of your core locked down and even with a 5 mil increase for Barkov in 2 summers that's pretty doable with Connolly Stralman and Nutivaara off the books no? That's almost 12 mil right there. I feel like you guys have more cap flexibility than most of the league to be honest, but get not wanting to add a big commitment

Connolly’s contract is through 2023 so maybe he could be the cap dump? Nutivaara’s contract isn’t a problem because next season isn’t as tight: 2022-2023 is bad.

Monahan is a good player so it’s tempting. It’s also tough because I could see Deni as a long term piece that we left develop and I think we would be better off keeping cheap talent like Deni and Tippett for next five years so we could try to reach sign Huberdeau than go all in for the next two years!

 

[RasmusAndersson]

I feel like the value of the 3-way deal is way off. Andersson has struggles this year, but making an all in move of our best young defensemen (not highest ceiling, mind you) that is locked in at a reasonable cap hit for a rental and a 2nd is... weird given the 1st trade is a straight sell, and we are then making a move for Dumba that needs to happen in order for losing Andersson to be tolerable. Either way, trading ~6 years of Andersson for 1 year of Rakell is... not good.

Fair, I'm just a huge Rakell guy and believe he would be one of the best RW's we could possibly target. Rakell>>Mantha imo, and if we had competent management I would trust that we wouldn't just let him walk for nothing in the summer and could re-sell him for 1st+ at the deadline if absolutely necessary. But ya in reality you're right too risky to move Rasmus for a player with so little term. Hard to find that RW tho, I have doubts about Mantha and I doubt a guy like Arvidsson is available. My concern is that we're gonna be stuck with someone like Kyle Palmieri who is slightly too old and not the answer long-term.

 

[RasmusAndersson]

Foligno has never hit 30 points and is currently shooting like 30%. I don't really think the Wild would care if he was taken and they would likely be ecstatic if he was because that would let them keep Greenway, Eriksson-Ek and Dumba.

As far as rumors about Dumba. There have seemingly been rumors about him being traded since he was drafted which to me would mean that either the Wild value him incredibly highly, in which case Backlund and a late 1st wouldn't even be close being to an offer the Wild would be willing to accept or that the rumors of him being available are complete bullshit.

I think you're undervaluing what Foligno brings to your offense but I digress. I love Dumba and I know you guys are having a good year and aren't looking to sell so I do get saying no, but I still don't think the value is that bad. Backlund definitely has some value, on here I've seen offers of like 1st+Compher+meh prospect from Colorado or like 1st+Connolly+pick from FLA. I get not wanting to be in sell mode but essentially two-firsts + depth forward and the flexibility to keep Foligno (a play driving middle-6 C) honestly seems like pretty good value.

In reality Dumba's just the perfect target for us and is from Calgary so I'm just trying to manifest it but I know its more than likely Minnesota views him as too much of a core piece (and rightfully so). I'd also do just Monahan for Dumba but I know Monahan's value may be too low now and people question if Minny even wants Monahan in the first place

 

[soothsayer]

Flames badly need a culture change. Kudos to the OP for recognizing that need by making a proposal that sends off Andersson and Backlund. These aren't horrible proposals.

 

[Sota Popinski]

I think you're undervaluing what Foligno brings to your offense but I digress. I love Dumba and I know you guys are having a good year and aren't looking to sell so I do get saying no, but I still don't think the value is that bad. Backlund definitely has some value, on here I've seen offers of like 1st+Compher+meh prospect from Colorado or like 1st+Connolly+pick from FLA. I get not wanting to be in sell mode but essentially two-firsts + depth forward and the flexibility to keep Foligno (a play driving middle-6 C) honestly seems like pretty good value.

In reality Dumba's just the perfect target for us and is from Calgary so I'm just trying to manifest it but I know its more than likely Minnesota views him as too much of a core piece (and rightfully so). I'd also do just Monahan for Dumba but I know Monahan's value may be too low now and people question if Minny even wants Monahan in the first place

We would certainly rather have Monahan than Backlund.

 

[Fatass]

I wonder how much say Sutter will have in who stays and who goes? Which players does it seem like he wants?

 

[Bazeek]

Foligno has never hit 30 points and is currently shooting like 30%. I don't really think the Wild would care if he was taken and they would likely be ecstatic if he was because that would let them keep Greenway, Eriksson-Ek and Dumba.

As far as rumors about Dumba. There have seemingly been rumors about him being traded since he was drafted which to me would mean that either the Wild value him incredibly highly, in which case Backlund and a late 1st wouldn't even be close being to an offer the Wild would be willing to accept or that the rumors of him being available are complete bullshit.

Foligno's good in his role, but he's definitely not someone you stress out about losing. Also not a bad player to have on an expansion team.

The rumors around Dumba have mostly been roster driven: Minnesota's long needed centers and has been pretty flush with defensemen. The same stuff's floated around about Brodin and Spurgeon for the same reasons. But with those two guys recently getting extensions that include no-movement clauses it's hard not to see Dumba being the odd one out. Continuing to spend almost $30m in cap on our top-4 isn't impossible, but it's going to be difficult if we want to improve up front and down the middle. And we've got some NHL ready RD prospects that are probably ready for promotions, so it's not hard to do the math there.

I don't know that Backlund + 1st is the right price for him, but at this point I'm about 90% sure that if Dumba's on the roster during the expansion draft he'll get exposed. I don't agree with it or like it, but I'm pretty sure it'll happen.

 

[16thOverallSaveUs]

I’d be really interested in Dumba for Monahan

 

[DFF]

I wonder how much say Sutter will have in who stays and who goes? Which players does it seem like he wants?

Only Ritchie is untouchable for him

 

[DFF]

I believe Monahan can be better once removed from Johnny. He depends too much on Johnny and the league has that combo figured out.

they need a solid top 6 forward if not a center if they trade him though

 

[RasmusAndersson]

I believe Monahan can be better once removed from Johnny. He depends too much on Johnny and the league has that combo figured out.

they need a solid top 6 forward if not a center if they trade him though

Idk I want a good top-6 forward too but that player would have to be worth more than 1st+prospect+4-5 mil in cap space and I’m not sure Monahan returns that. If we’re looking at a guy like Mantha or Laine it’s pretty lateral and we have 0 flexibility or extra assets, I think at that point I’d rather get the nice futures package and have the freedom to pursue a good FA this summer as well. If it comes down to 1st+Good RW prospect+UFA like Danault Hall Schwartz or Landeskog i think that’s way more value than simply Mantha or Laine who both come with lots of risk and big contracts. Actually Laine I’d have to think hard about it but I don’t see those teams willing to pay up for Monahan. Too old for Detroit and too lateral for CBJ.

 

[DFF]

Idk I want a good top-6 forward too but that player would have to be worth more than 1st+prospect+4-5 mil in cap space and I’m not sure Monahan returns that. If we’re looking at a guy like Mantha or Laine it’s pretty lateral and we have 0 flexibility or extra assets, I think at that point I’d rather get the nice futures package and have the freedom to pursue a good FA this summer as well. If it comes down to 1st+Good RW prospect+UFA like Danault Hall Schwartz or Landeskog i think that’s way more value than simply Mantha or Laine who both come with lots of risk and big contracts. Actually Laine I’d have to think hard about it but I don’t see those teams willing to pay up for Monahan. Too old for Detroit and too lateral for CBJ.

I think he should return something decent. He still produces somewhat and it’s not like he has been around the block.

I am assuming they still want to compete, the other option is a total rebuild. I am fine with that too. Some generational players coming 2022/2023

 

[zar]

I believe Monahan can be better once removed from Johnny. He depends too much on Johnny and the league has that combo figured out.

they need a solid top 6 forward if not a center if they trade him though

You honestly think Monahan will be better once removed from Gaudreau. Yikes!

 

[DFF]

You honestly think Monahan will be better once removed from Gaudreau. Yikes!

Yes I do ...just like Drai can be a good player without mcdavid...oh wait