C Ryan Poehling - St. Cloud State, NCAA (2017, 25th, MTL)

[Jigger77]

Diagnosed with a concussion.

The player I was most excited about this year. Sigh. He kept playing after, not sure if that's a good or bad thing.

That Hunt kid was running around all game and that was a dirty hit. Wish someone would have had "a word" with him.

 

[montreal]

Has been called up after a shaky at times start to his AHL career.

 

[Dominance]

Hype train fell off the rails, eh?

 

[Hostile Offer]

Hype train fell off the rails, eh?

Concussed to start the year. Looked really good at the camp before that.

 

[Hfbsux]

Hype train fell off the rails, eh?

Upside hasn't changed: 2-3C

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Concussed to start the year. Looked really good at the camp before that.

I always am wary of judging a player's performance after they have sustained a concussion in that same year. Even if they are "physically" well, it can affect them mentally and mess with confidence. It's not always the case, but I've seen players be more tentative after that injury, which is natural.

 

[Wats]

I always am wary of judging a player's performance after they have sustained a concussion in that same year. Even if they are "physically" well, it can affect them mentally and mess with confidence. It's not always the case, but I've seen players be more tentative after that injury, which is natural.

He's starting to put up numbers recently (6 points in last 8 games). Habs might call him up though and stop the momentum.

 

[Tim Wallach]

Hype train fell off the rails, eh?

It's silly how so many on these boards are addicted to hyperbole. Either a guy is the best thing ever or a total bust. No middle ground. And posts like this really are just attempts to change the narrative to the latter.

Most sane fans knew all along the guy has that 2-3C upside and will be a well-rounded NHLer for years. He still will be. While the concussion set him back a bit in his development, I think his offensive game needed a year under Bouchard in the A regardless. And the team seems to have figured out that rushing a 20-year-old who looks physically ready but whose offensive game has not yet matured is a bad idea.

There is no need for a hype train or a slam train here. He's 20 and he's just fine.

 

[Dominance]

It's silly how so many on these boards are addicted to hyperbole. Either a guy is the best thing ever or a total bust. No middle ground. And posts like this really are just attempts to change the narrative to the latter.

Most sane fans knew all along the guy has that 2-3C upside and will be a well-rounded NHLer for years. He still will be. While the concussion set him back a bit in his development, I think his offensive game needed a year under Bouchard in the A regardless. And the team seems to have figured out that rushing a 20-year-old who looks physically ready but whose offensive game has not yet matured is a bad idea.

There is no need for a hype train or a slam train here. He's 20 and he's just fine.

Yep. He’s still on pace to be the good 3C every team wants and he was drafted as and all his numbers, ever, have suggested as his upside. But you only need to go back a few pages to see some truly ridiculous statements based solely on the most undeserving WJC MVP performance ever and a crazy NHL debut.

 

[DramaticGloveSave]

I always am wary of judging a player's performance after they have sustained a concussion in that same year. Even if they are "physically" well, it can affect them mentally and mess with confidence. It's not always the case, but I've seen players be more tentative after that injury, which is natural.

He's definitely not been the same. Early in camp, he was looking like he was continuing right where he left off the year before with the hat trick game. That preseason game where he got the concussion, he was absolutely dominant. Since then he's been a lot more tentative. I think it'll just take some time.

 

[JoelWarlord]

Most sane fans knew all along the guy has that 2-3C upside and will be a well-rounded NHLer for years. He still will be.

The Habs board voted him the #1 prospect ahead of Caufield. The hype train was absolutely ridiculous at the start of the year.

I said a Lars Eller level player in the good 3C who can fill in at 2C level is a realistic projection and was told that would be a massive disappointment. You'd swear to god the player was a lock to become 18-19 Ryan O'Reilly with how the Habs board talked about him going into the season.

I'm still absolutely baffled by that prospect rating. Dude had 8 goals in college in his draft + 2 season and he was voted ahead of Caufield.

 

[HabsMD97]

The Habs board voted him the #1 prospect ahead of Caufield. The hype train was absolutely ridiculous at the start of the year.

I said a Lars Eller level player in the good 3C who can fill in at 2C level is a realistic projection and was told that would be a massive disappointment. You'd swear to god the player was a lock to become 18-19 Ryan O'Reilly with how the Habs board talked about him going into the season.

I'm still absolutely baffled by that prospect rating. Dude had 8 goals in college in his draft + 2 season and he was voted ahead of Caufield.

pretty much every habs fan who voted him the #1 prospect and kept hyping him were the ones who saw him 1 game at the end of last year and maybe the WJC game against sweden while ignoring his 2 years in college. Every knowledgable habs fans who had watched him play in college knew his actual ceiling was closer to a 3c with maybe 2c potential.

 

[ottawa]

The Habs board voted him the #1 prospect ahead of Caufield. The hype train was absolutely ridiculous at the start of the year.

I said a Lars Eller level player in the good 3C who can fill in at 2C level is a realistic projection and was told that would be a massive disappointment. You'd swear to god the player was a lock to become 18-19 Ryan O'Reilly with how the Habs board talked about him going into the season.

I'm still absolutely baffled by that prospect rating. Dude had 8 goals in college in his draft + 2 season and he was voted ahead of Caufield.

pretty much every habs fan who voted him the #1 prospect and kept hyping him were the ones who saw him 1 game at the end of last year and maybe the WJC game against sweden while ignoring his 2 years in college. Every knowledgable habs fans who had watched him play in college knew his actual ceiling was closer to a 3c with maybe 2c potential.

If you read through the thread, many people who voted him as #1 clearly stated that this was based on NHL-readiness or because he was a safe middle 6 center whereas Caufield definitely had more skill and the higher upside but was a riskier bet, which is why he fell to second.

It's easy to troll and just post a random poll result with no context.


Here are some quotes from people that voted for Poehling in that thread to further prove my point

Poehling 1st shows people voted for the most NHL-ready, not the highest upside.

Poehling and Brook are much further along than the other top prospects but I think Caufield has highest ceiling.

Poehling, just about as close to NHL ready as you can get, playing a premium position.

Pure talent can’t be the only factor...otherwise a bunch of career AHLers would make these types of lists. Players don’t always reach the potential they have.

NHL readiness and opportunity are factors that need to be taken into consideration. Its the weight of these factors that are to each own view and that is also what makes a great or bad list.

Poehling needs to be #1 on this list. But, that doesn’t necessarily mean he will have the most productive career.

Funny, I thought I'd be in the minority voting for Poehling. He's the only one that comes with no question mark. He might not have the highest ceiling, but he's the most NHL ready and his upside could be as high as the others.

Poehling for me. Hes the most ready prospect and plays center. I think he has shown a much better offensive upside in the last 6 months and I'm betting on that to continue. I think he can play the hard minutes and put up 50+ points in his prime. That's huge in my eyes.

I can continue but I think I've more than made my case.

 

[Hfbsux]

pretty much every habs fan who voted him the #1 prospect and kept hyping him were the ones who saw him 1 game at the end of last year and maybe the WJC game against sweden while ignoring his 2 years in college. Every knowledgable habs fans who had watched him play in college knew his actual ceiling was closer to a 3c with maybe 2c potential.

People who watched him play last year knew he was stuck with plugs (his brothers) as linemate in a defensive role for most of the year. He wasn't playing on the top line with the top guys (Jackson, Lizotte or Newell) like he did the year before. I had him over Caufield because my expectation of Caufield weren't that high. I thought Poehling could end up 2/3C while I had a lot of question mark about Caufield.

I don't get your last sentence as I haven't seen anybody on the habs board saying he was our future 1C. Just the usual 2way center with size and speed that can create offense.

 

[JoelWarlord]

If you read through the thread, many people who voted him as #1 clearly stated that this was based on NHL-readiness or because he was a safe middle 6 center whereas Caufield definitely had more skill and the higher upside but was a riskier bet, which is why he fell to second.

Sure, but many people told me that if he develops into Lars Eller who is pretty much what should be understood by "middle six C" (because if you meant legitimate 2C you'd just say 2C) I was told it would be a serious disappointment. I'm sure some people did vote for him based on that high floor and understanding that the floor being a 3C means he could be a 3C and not a diet Ryan O'Reilly, but like I said I've also been told that his potential is much higher and that if he becomes an Eller tier player it would be a bust.

I can pick quotes of people citing Poehling's high upside in that same thread. There were people saying he could be a 60pt center, saying he "could be what Pacioretty should have been" (lmao). The fourth post in the tiebreaker thread said Poehling could become O'Reilly 2.0. The 14 and 15th post call him a 200ft beast and say he has top 6C written all over him with 1C potential. Later posts say "50-60pt guy, defensive pillar, playoff warrior", tons of comparisons to prime Plekanec, etc. Another said Joe Pavelski is his ceiling. That doesn't really sound like a bunch of people who think he's somewhere between Lars Eller and Philip Danault which is what's implied by "middle six C".

Fundamentally I just don't see these things meshing, I don't think it's reasonable to vote a guy with "middle six C" potential (if you're truly understanding that to mean good chance he's "just" a 3C) as the top prospect unless it's a very weak system. I think a lot of hedging is baked into calling his potential a "middle six C" while voting him #1 and gushing about his two way play and potential with comparisons to the guy that just won the Conn Smythe and Selke which I think are just patently absurd comparisons.

It's easy to troll and just post a random poll result with no context.

I'm not trolling, I'm illustrating that the Habs board was completely over the moon about him before the season and he was always overhyped. I bring it up because I'm frustrated with this trend of Habs prospects being overhyped and then considered "busts" for not living up to ridiculous hype, when if you get a Lars Eller that late in the 1st round you should be thrilled!

If people did genuinely view him as a safe middle six C and just had concerns about Caufield/Suzuki in the NHL then I'd get it even if I disagree with it. But it seems like at least a plurality if not a majority of the votes for him at #1 in that thread actually did so with Philip Danault as his floor and Ryan O'Reilly as his ceiling which is just a baffling projection for him in my opinion.

 

[Hostile Offer]

It's silly how so many on these boards are addicted to hyperbole. Either a guy is the best thing ever or a total bust. No middle ground. And posts like this really are just attempts to change the narrative to the latter.

Most sane fans knew all along the guy has that 2-3C upside and will be a well-rounded NHLer for years. He still will be. While the concussion set him back a bit in his development, I think his offensive game needed a year under Bouchard in the A regardless. And the team seems to have figured out that rushing a 20-year-old who looks physically ready but whose offensive game has not yet matured is a bad idea.

There is no need for a hype train or a slam train here. He's 20 and he's just fine.

I certainly hope so, as the Habs have made this mistake time and time again in the last few years.

 

[MatthewFlames]

I'm not trolling,

Yes, you are.

 

[JoelWarlord]

Yes, you are.

I said I think the hype was out of hand as evidenced by him being voted the #1 prospect ahead of Caufield. Do I need to preface this by saying I'm a Canadiens fan frustrated with my own fanbase overhyping players then dumping on them for failing to live up to that hype? I'm not saying this to dump on the player, I like him a lot and I compare him to Lars Eller as very high praise, a great two way 3C for a contender who can step up to 2C in a pinch is something I value a lot. I worry that if he "only" becomes that fans will be upset because they wanted Ryan O'Reilly. If that's trolling then so be it.

I was given examples by another poster of people with reserved takes on his potential, but I have examples from the same threads (the prospect ranking I was talking about in the first place) with about the same number of people using names like prime Plekanec, Joe Pavelski, Ryan O'Reilly, and "what Pacioretty should have been" and gushing over his top 6 or 1C potential. Just look at some of the other posts in this thread, a few pages back we have Jordan Staal comparisons, "60P and Selke nominee", etc. In what way is it trolling to say it's silly to call J. Staal or ROR comparisons for Poehling overhyped or say it's overhyping him to vote him a better prospect than Caufield?

Fundamentally there's just a disconnect between these things. Either Canadiens fans overhyped this guy to the point they bought top 6/1C potential (thus justifying his #1 spot, I take Ryan O'Reilly over Alex DeBrincat for sure) or they view him as a solid two way middle six C prospect who's floor is Lars Eller and ceiling is Philip Danault, in which case I think it is a real stretch to take that player as the #1 prospect over a guy who scored 72 goals, or Suzuki after his final OHL season, to say nothing of Brook, Primeau, or Romanov.

 

[AveryStar4Eva]

For his draft position a Lars Eller type is a pretty good get. Nobody knows more than Habs fans how important centre depth is so getting a big solid kid like him to fill the 3C spot and kill penalties is easily worth a late first rounder.

 

[greasysnapper]

Hype train fell off the rails, eh?

People that watched him in College knew what they were getting.


This is me in August, and the same for most of his career. I like the player a lot but there was massive hype. I know some people like Steve K (great guy, actually watches hockey had Poehling like in the top 40 prospects league wide-- that kind of hyperbole was hypecity which lead to a lot of the Montreal posters thinking they had a real superstar. That and the WJC and Hattrick game.

That being said I see him as being a solid 3rd line two-way center, maybe even a 2C at times in his career. He plays the game the right way, does a lot of things and is exactly the type of player I'd want on my team if I were building it.

 

[AlexGretzchenvid]

Yep. He’s still on pace to be the good 3C every team wants and he was drafted as and all his numbers, ever, have suggested as his upside. But you only need to go back a few pages to see some truly ridiculous statements based solely on the most undeserving WJC MVP performance ever and a crazy NHL debut.

Undeserving MVP. Wow.

 

[Favster]

Sure, but many people told me that if he develops into Lars Eller who is pretty much what should be understood by "middle six C" (because if you meant legitimate 2C you'd just say 2C) I was told it would be a serious disappointment. I'm sure some people did vote for him based on that high floor and understanding that the floor being a 3C means he could be a 3C and not a diet Ryan O'Reilly, but like I said I've also been told that his potential is much higher and that if he becomes an Eller tier player it would be a bust.

I can pick quotes of people citing Poehling's high upside in that same thread. There were people saying he could be a 60pt center, saying he "could be what Pacioretty should have been" (lmao). The fourth post in the tiebreaker thread said Poehling could become O'Reilly 2.0. The 14 and 15th post call him a 200ft beast and say he has top 6C written all over him with 1C potential. Later posts say "50-60pt guy, defensive pillar, playoff warrior", tons of comparisons to prime Plekanec, etc. Another said Joe Pavelski is his ceiling. That doesn't really sound like a bunch of people who think he's somewhere between Lars Eller and Philip Danault which is what's implied by "middle six C".

Fundamentally I just don't see these things meshing, I don't think it's reasonable to vote a guy with "middle six C" potential (if you're truly understanding that to mean good chance he's "just" a 3C) as the top prospect unless it's a very weak system. I think a lot of hedging is baked into calling his potential a "middle six C" while voting him #1 and gushing about his two way play and potential with comparisons to the guy that just won the Conn Smythe and Selke which I think are just patently absurd comparisons.


I'm not trolling, I'm illustrating that the Habs board was completely over the moon about him before the season and he was always overhyped. I bring it up because I'm frustrated with this trend of Habs prospects being overhyped and then considered "busts" for not living up to ridiculous hype, when if you get a Lars Eller that late in the 1st round you should be thrilled!

If people did genuinely view him as a safe middle six C and just had concerns about Caufield/Suzuki in the NHL then I'd get it even if I disagree with it. But it seems like at least a plurality if not a majority of the votes for him at #1 in that thread actually did so with Philip Danault as his floor and Ryan O'Reilly as his ceiling which is just a baffling projection for him in my opinion.

He still can become a 60 point center. First year pro, slowed down by a concussion and dissapointment of not making the big team. Give the kid a break man. He has been much better recently and will only get better.

 

[Dominance]

Undeserving MVP. Wow.

You disagree?

He scored 8 points in 7 games. 4 of those points came in a whacky ten-minute span in that crazy comeback attempt against the Swedes. 4 points in the other 6 games combined. Not productive or particularly impressive in the meaningful games. Not on the gold medal-winning team. Outscored by multiple other players including a prominent player on the gold medal-winning team. Didn’t notably outproduce anybody on his team. Not even distinctly the best player on his own team.

So yeah, one of the most questionable WJC MVP selections ever.

 

[Favster]

Poehling has had a slow start, let's all **** on the 20 year old. This place is hilarious.

 

[montreal]

he was stuck with plugs (his brothers) as linemate in a defensive role for most of the year

that's not true. He didn't play with them until after the WJC's. He was also on the top PP unit, on the 2nd highest scoring team in the NCAA or there abouts. I pointed it out over and over that Hab fans were getting carried away with him as I had NCHC.tv and watched a lot of his games but felt his offensive upside wasn't as high as many on our board thought.