News Article: Bruce Garrioch is again stirring the Jets rumour pot.

[BrokerD]

What about a team trying to make the playoffs who's defense consists of:
Clitsome-Buff
Stuart-Bogosian
Meech-Postma

Cause that's what we'd be looking at...

I fully believe if we make the playoffs Chevy's move is 100% validated. If we don't its more open to debate IMO.
As has been mentioned extensively, we don't know what was offered for Hainsey. We're assuming a second, but perhaps he wasn't as in demand as we thought. Second, too much emphasis is put on picks. An additional second round pick is nice, but the likelihood of that player contributing to the Jets isn't particularly high. Its not worth getting THAT worked up over.

You are forgetting about Kulda and possibly Troubs/Redmond. Squeaking into the playoffs isn't a priority for me..... we ARE NO WHERE NEAR a contender this year. I could give a **** if TN wants to make the playoffs only to reap the benefits of two playoff games. IMO we don't make the playoffs and come July we are left with nothing to show for Hainsey. Call it what you want but in my books that is poor team management. Oh, and I am not assuming a second rounder was offered for Hainsey.... but I would imagine there was something of value on the table and Chevy passed

 

[Gm0ney]

You are forgetting about Kulda and possibly Troubs/Redmond. Squeaking into the playoffs isn't a priority for me..... we ARE NO WHERE NEAR a contender this year. I could give a **** if TN wants to make the playoffs only to reap the benefits of two playoff games. IMO we don't make the playoffs and come July we are left with nothing to show for Hainsey. Call it what you want but in my books that is poor team management. Oh, and I am not assuming a second rounder was offered for Hainsey.... but I would imagine there was something of value on the table and Chevy passed

I would suggest that the benefits of the organization making the playoffs far exceeds a low 2nd round draft pick (in a draft where we already have three 2nd round picks).

Kane, Burmi, Pavelec, Little, Bogo - these guys have never made the playoffs in the NHL. The playoffs are a different level of hockey - where else are they going to get that experience? Don't we want these players to get a taste at some point?

Also, this organization has made the playoffs once in 13 seasons so far. Time to start making the playoffs with regularity and shirk the image of perennial loser. Culture of winning - what's that worth? More or less than 54th overall?

 

[ajmidd12]

[mod]

Needless to say I don't see Hainsey in a Jets uniform beyond this season, and I'm okay with that.

We have Trouba and Postma who could easily fill that void.

I'm more concerned with improving our offense than tinkering with our defense. Now this whole post could be wrong and we could be surprised with Ron taking a substantial pay cut and resigning here, highly unlikely, but possible.

 

[Grind]

[mod]

Needless to say I don't see Hainsey in a Jets uniform beyond this season, and I'm okay with that.

We have Trouba and Postma who could easily fill that void.

I'm more concerned with improving our offense than tinkering with our defense. Now this whole post could be wrong and we could be surprised with Ron taking a substantial pay cut and resigning here, highly unlikely, but possible.

Are you serious?

your completely comfortable trusting 19 yearold rookie or a 24 yearold who has been sheltered extremely with top 2 LHD minutes in a shut down role even though neither has ever played on the left side of the ice?

I just want to be absolutely sure that's what your saying.

 

[ajmidd12]

Are you serious?

your completely comfortable trusting 19 yearold rookie or a 24 yearold who has been sheltered extremely with top 2 LHD minutes in a shut down role even though neither has ever played on the left side of the ice?

I just want to be absolutely sure that's what your saying.

Yes, that's what I am saying. It's no secret I'm not much of a fan of Ronald Hainsey. His sloppy play style isn't worth HALF of what he makes.

Watch him closely tomorrow, you'll see him throw the puck up the middle of the ice more than twice. Right in front of his own net, he is a scary player on defense. He has made some good moves I will admit that, but at the price he wants I would rather us train a young up and comer.

 

[Flair Hay]

I think people are really overestimating the asset management part of NHL hockey here. Having another 2nd or 3rd round would help. But I can't see how it's a huge mistake when he's contributing. I mean, we already traded Oduya last year for extra picks and replaced him pretty adequately with Clitsome.

At some point we have to worry about getting a better mentality during 60 mins of game time (hopefully playoffs helps accomplish this) instead of accumulating more extra picks.

 

[Grind]

Yes, that's what I am saying. It's no secret I'm not much of a fan of Ronald Hainsey. His sloppy play style isn't worth HALF of what he makes.

Watch him closely tomorrow, you'll see him throw the puck up the middle of the ice more than twice. Right in front of his own net, he is a scary player on defense. He has made some good moves I will admit that, but at the price he wants I would rather us train a young up and comer.

Disagree.

Your welcome to believe what you want but Hainsey has done a pretty decent job. Not equivalent to his cap hit but decent.

And just to get this strait, you want to use 20+ minutes of ice time on an NHL roster to "train" someone?

"training" is what junior and the AHL or for. maybe we should "train" these guys before throwing them into a top 10 role on the team- just a thought.

I don't think you understand the difference in playing your offside, it's not easy - especially for RHD dmen who generally never have to learn the offside (due to their rareness) as opposed to LHD dmen who do (due to most teams not having enough righties).

Asking fringe/unproven RHD to immediatly step into top four LHD d roll is like asking a similarly unproven winger to step in and be your secondline center.

Would you be A ok with turning Eric Tangradi into our second line center next year?

 

[KingBogo]

It totally makes sense to me why Chevy stood pat at the trade deadline. We are a bubble team, that was in a playoff position at the deadline so you owed it to the players not to sell the farm for magic beans (picks), but at the same time he knew the team was not a real contender so you don't mortgage the future on a rental who will be long gone by next training camp.

I think Chevy tried to make hockey moves that made sense long term but prices are high at the deadline. I think we will see some moves from Chevy at the draft when our abundance of picks will be over valued.

 

[BrokerD]

I would suggest that the benefits of the organization making the playoffs far exceeds a low 2nd round draft pick (in a draft where we already have three 2nd round picks).

Kane, Burmi, Pavelec, Little, Bogo - these guys have never made the playoffs in the NHL. The playoffs are a different level of hockey - where else are they going to get that experience? Don't we want these players to get a taste at some point?

Also, this organization has made the playoffs once in 13 seasons so far. Time to start making the playoffs with regularity and shirk the image of perennial loser. Culture of winning - what's that worth? More or less than 54th overall?

I don't know how having your A** handed to you helps you grow as a young player

This year is a deep draft... and the Jets aren't exactly loaded with young talent (you can thank Atlanta for that). One can't underestimate the power of draft picks.

My main point is that I could care less if I see a SE banner in the stands this year. I am hoping for bigger and better things to come; building with the draft is how I see this team getting there, IMO.

 

[tacogeoff]

I don't know how having your A** handed to you helps you grow as a young player

This year is a deep draft... and the Jets aren't exactly loaded with young talent (you can thank Atlanta for that). One can't underestimate the power of draft picks.

My main point is that I could care less if I see a SE banner in the stands this year. I am hoping for bigger and better things to come; building with the draft is how I see this team getting there, IMO.

well on the bright side we do have some good young talent from Atlanta left in Kane, Bogo, Little, Burmi, Redmond, Postma, Kulda, Pavs, Toby. Its not all that bad

or do you mean in the minors?

I would love to see a SE banner in the stands as it will be the last one recieved by a team in NHL history.

 

[tbcwpg]

I don't know how having your A** handed to you helps you grow as a young player

This year is a deep draft... and the Jets aren't exactly loaded with young talent (you can thank Atlanta for that). One can't underestimate the power of draft picks.

My main point is that I could care less if I see a SE banner in the stands this year. I am hoping for bigger and better things to come; building with the draft is how I see this team getting there, IMO.

Failure is an excellent teacher. You'll never know just how tough the playoffs are unless you're there.

 

[BrokerD]

well on the bright side we do have some good young talent from Atlanta left in Kane, Bogo, Little, Burmi, Redmond, Postma, Kulda, Pavs, Toby. Its not all that bad

I would love to see a SE banner in the stands as it will be the last one recieved by a team in NHL history.

Hey Ziggy.... I'm talking about 'farm team' deep. The players you mentioned can't be traded away for prospects... we still have to ice a team

 

[BrokerD]

Failure is an excellent teacher. You'll never know just how tough the playoffs are unless you're there.

If failure is such a great teacher than we should of had Scheifele in the lineup for the past two years

 

[tacogeoff]

Hey Ziggy.... I'm talking about 'farm team' deep. The players you mentioned can't be traded away for prospects... we still have to ice a team

Got ya. You just said Jets in the post I replied to.

 

[ajmidd12]

Disagree.

Your welcome to believe what you want but Hainsey has done a pretty decent job. Not equivalent to his cap hit but decent.

And just to get this strait, you want to use 20+ minutes of ice time on an NHL roster to "train" someone?

"training" is what junior and the AHL or for. maybe we should "train" these guys before throwing them into a top 10 role on the team- just a thought.

I don't think you understand the difference in playing your offside, it's not easy - especially for RHD dmen who generally never have to learn the offside (due to their rareness) as opposed to LHD dmen who do (due to most teams not having enough righties).

Asking fringe/unproven RHD to immediatly step into top four LHD d roll is like asking a similarly unproven winger to step in and be your secondline center.

Would you be A ok with turning Eric Tangradi into our second line center next year?

By your example should we also throw Schiefele into second line center? Or have him play a season in the Rock to "train" him into the player we need? I bet Trouba and or Postma surprises you, guys like that will do anything it takes to become a key roll in the team, they want a permanent spot in the roster.

And yes, I know what its like to play your off wing, I've done it. Albeit not at the NHL level, but Junior is tough enough. I played as an off wing forward and center man, usually off wing, while tough it isn't impossible.

 

[PaperRockChamp]

I believe another factor in keeping Hains and Antro was to show loyalty/commitment to players. Keeping them around to battle for a playoff spot was huge. The more we can do to make this franchise an attractive destination for players, the better.

 

[Grind]

By your example should we also throw Schiefele into second line center? Or have him play a season in the Rock to "train" him into the player we need? I bet Trouba and or Postma surprises you, guys like that will do anything it takes to become a key roll in the team, they want a permanent spot in the roster.

And yes, I know what its like to play your off wing, I've done it. Albeit not at the NHL level, but Junior is tough enough. I played as an off wing forward and center man, usually off wing, while tough it isn't impossible.

Your kinda missing the point here.

ABout schiefele, yes, that's exactly what its like - which is something i also disagree with. Expecting Trouba/postma to take hainseys spot is like expecting schiefele to be our second line c, if schiefele was a winger. Expecting your prospects to take spots above what they've proven to play at is a recipe for disaster. That's my point.


I don't disagree that they may be able to take the spot, but relying on them to is foolish.

furthermore my point was playing off D side is alot trickier then playing your off wing. Out of necessity, most forwards have a decent amount of experience in playing their off wing throughout their careers, with d pairings its not so similar.

 

[ajmidd12]

Your kinda missing the point here.

ABout schiefele, yes, that's exactly what its like - which is something i also disagree with. Expecting Trouba/postma to take hainseys spot is like expecting schiefele to be our second line c, if schiefele was a winger. Expecting your prospects to take spots above what they've proven to play at is a recipe for disaster. That's my point.


I don't disagree that they may be able to take the spot, but relying on them to is foolish.

furthermore my point was playing off D side is alot trickier then playing your off wing. Out of necessity, most forwards have a decent amount of experience in playing their off wing throughout their careers, with d pairings its not so similar.

Fair enough, let's agree to disagree.

Time will tell, let's see what happens. But I still feel that if necessary (Hainsey gone) we have depth that can fill the voids on D.

 

[Grind]

Fair enough, let's agree to disagree.

Time will tell, let's see what happens. But I still feel that if necessary (Hainsey gone) we have depth that can fill the voids on D.

I'd be less concerned about it if it weren't for Toby's evolution into a bit of an injury risk. With a worst case scenario of Toby - Clitsome, i can deal with that. But knowing that losing toby for 10-20 games is starting to look like a given i'm just terrified of having a top 4 where your best proven LHD is Grant Clitsome.... that's what scares me.

 

[sully1410]

[mod]

Needless to say I don't see Hainsey in a Jets uniform beyond this season, and I'm okay with that.

We have Trouba and Postma who could easily fill that void.

I'm more concerned with improving our offense than tinkering with our defense. Now this whole post could be wrong and we could be surprised with Ron taking a substantial pay cut and resigning here, highly unlikely, but possible.

I'm not sure where this idea is that Hainsey won't re-sign here because of the lockout, but I think it's off base. Garrioch is not really a credible source, most of his stuff is just blowing smoke...especially when it's about a team that's not the leafs.

If Hainsey doesn't re-sign here it's because he has a better opportunity somewhere else. If he signs with a contender most I which are right near the cap he'll probably have to take a significant pay cut regardless. If he doesn't and signs with a different team, for a bit more money...he'll be in the exact same position as he is here. Except that team may or not be as close as we are to really contending.

What's more...Neither Trouba or Postma is anywhere close to having top four minutes let alone top pairing minutes if Toby goes down again...which he seems to do alot of.

 

[knorthern knight]

In terms of the good of the whole, unions generally frown upon any actions by members that put downward pressure on compensation - e.g. taking a "hometown discount."

That may have been the case 2 lockouts ago, but not now. The players' slice of the pie is fixed at 50% of HRR next year and for the rest of the CBA. If Hainsey takes less, then other players take more via end-of-season HRR adjustments. If anything, other players should be happy.

IAlso, there's the personal financial benefit of receiving an extra $8.2 million (from the example above). That's a lot of dough to leave on the table no matter what.

Now you're making sense. An NHL player always has to face the possibility that the next time he steps on the ice, he may have a career-ending injury. If I was in his shoes (errr skates), I'd try to build the biggest nest-egg possible.

 

[tbcwpg]

If failure is such a great teacher than we should of had Scheifele in the lineup for the past two years

Haha I see where you're going with this but it's different. Scheifele DID fail. He learned his lesson. If it weren't for ELC rules, he probably would have stayed with the team longer. He's been here and failed a bit, he's learning. Now he's just getting leadership and playing time.

 

[Tintin's Ghost]

Is Hainsey still considered a top 4? Seems like's been passed by Clitsome a few weeks ago. His skillset is replaceable, his offence more than replaced by Clits or Postma. Jets D will be fine for next year

 

[sully1410]

Is Hainsey still considered a top 4? Seems like's been passed by Clitsome a few weeks ago. His skillset is replaceable, his offence more than replaced by Clits or Postma. Jets D will be fine for next year

He's really the only stay at home defender we have. He blocks a lot of shots, plays a big role on the PK, and eats a ton of minutes.

If we get rid of him, there had better be an upgrade coming back.