Confirmed with Link: Blues trade Kostin to Edmonton for Samorukov

[Majorityof1]

Pretty sure kostin wanted a change of scenery. We had a player who we felt didn’t fit and both the team and the player wanted a change. So we made a trade for a position of need which was left defense. It hasn’t worked out for us so far but good on kostin for improving

Tarasenko wanted a change over a year ago. We didn't move him. So the "he wanted a change" excuse isn't the whole thing. A bad trade is a bad trade. Time will tell how bad this one is, but "he wanted out" doesn't really change anything for me. Also, it might be a bit of a red flag that if we seem to be on the losing end of these change of scenery trades more often than not. Maybe we aren't giving talented players the room to grow that they need.

 

[Mike Liut]

Pretty sure kostin wanted a change of scenery. We had a player who we felt didn’t fit and both the team and the player wanted a change. So we made a trade for a position of need which was left defense. It hasn’t worked out for us so far but good on kostin for improving

I wasn’t aware he requested a trade. If so, then that makes a little more sense. I would have said STFU and play. You’ll get your chance

 

[Majorityof1]

I wasn’t aware he requested a trade. If so, then that makes a little more sense. I would have said STFU and play. You’ll get your chance

I have seen zero eveidence that he requested a trade. Its speculation. But even if true, it doesn't matter. He can't force a trade, and he certainly can't force a bad one. I want our organization to honor trade requests when possible, but I also want them to get something out of it as well.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

I think its too early to say Samorukov is nothing. He's been playing extremely well in the AHL Tucker is just ahead of him in the depth charts (and for got reason, Tucker looks frigging good imho) and with how fragile our LHD is I wouldn't be surpass if he plays this year in the NHL.

 

[Eldon Reid]

He had plenty of time. He wasted it. we will see whether he can keep this up. Sometimes it takes a trade to wake up a knucklehead before they finally get it.

That is the case with Thompson too. I know I heard Mike McKenna talk about it on radio saying who was this kid in San Antonio or something. I don't know if anyone else heard this. It was something about he just wasn't getting it and putting it together. We traded him away to Buffalo for O'Reilly. Took a few years, but he finally put it together last season.


If anyone can remember him saying that, I am 99% he said that whether it was on Sirius or 1011 ESPN. I can't remember.

 

[PJJJP]

Maybe trading Kostin was a mistake but we won't know for sure until later. Right now Kostin is running a xG% of 46% with an actual goal percentage of 60%. He's outperforming it by 14% which most players rarely do over the course of a season. He's also shooting at a 23.7% rate. He is definitely on a heater right now but he will come back down to earth.

 

[Mike Liut]

My point was, I just don’t understand what the rush to move him was.

 

[PJJJP]

My point was, I just don’t understand what the rush to move him was.

I don't know the behind the scenes. But from articles the blues weren't impressed with him during Camp and other players did more/improved more than him during the offseason. They put him on waivers for the purpose of assigning him to Springfield and then traded him 2 days later. Maybe they felt he would never progress and that Dimitri would fill a need on our depth chart and was a better player. So far Kostin looks to be the better player but these types of deals happen all the time. Kostin played in the Oilers AHL and had 4 points in 9 games with 15 PIM and a -4 rating. He was exactly lightning the world on fire and they had to recall him because they have no depth and had injuries. He took that chance and ran with it. He seems to have found good chemistry with Nugent-Hopkins despite the analytics being quite bad with that line. He's playing with a lot better players and potting in the goals. Maybe the blues should have put him with Thomas/Buch or had him on the ROR line instead of Leivo, instead of having him play with the likes of Walker, Toropchenko, etc. At the beginning of the year the blues didn't really have a spot in the top 9 for him because they had Neighbors over Kostin. It's just a dude getting a better chance with better players and making the most of it.

 

[Mike Liut]

I don't know the behind the scenes. But from articles the blues weren't impressed with him during Camp and other players did more/improved more than him during the offseason. They put him on waivers for the purpose of assigning him to Springfield and then traded him 2 days later. Maybe they felt he would never progress and that Dimitri would fill a need on our depth chart and was a better player. So far Kostin looks to be the better player but these types of deals happen all the time. Kostin played in the Oilers AHL and had 4 points in 9 games with 15 PIM and a -4 rating. He was exactly lightning the world on fire and they had to recall him because they have no depth and had injuries. He took that chance and ran with it. He seems to have found good chemistry with Nugent-Hopkins despite the analytics being quite bad with that line. He's playing with a lot better players and potting in the goals. Maybe the blues should have put him with Thomas/Buch or had him on the ROR line instead of Leivo, instead of having him play with the likes of Walker, Toropchenko, etc. At the beginning of the year the blues didn't really have a spot in the top 9 for him because they had Neighbors over Kostin. It's just a dude getting a better chance with better players and making the most of it.

We spent a 1st on him, we should have given him more time. 40 games isn’t enough.

 

[Blueston]

We spent a 1st on him, we should have given him more time. 40 games isn’t enough.

We gave him 6 years.

 

[Xerloris]

My point was, I just don’t understand what the rush to move him was.

If he requested a trade Armstrong has said numerous times that if he can make it work he will to make the player happy. I guess he thought the Dman we got in return was a good enough return and hopefully that guy can help us out in the future. Also, if Kostin really is playing with McDavid who actually gives a shit what he's doing because we all know it's McDavid doing the heavy lisfting. I mean f*** I could pot 30 on McDavids wing just by standing on the crease with my stick on the ice. You just have to be willing to be cross checked to death.

 

[GoldenSeal]

We gave him 6 years.

This.

 

[Caser]

It is already a win-win trade for both sides: Kostin clearly didn't get along well with Berube, therefore he didn't have much value for the Blues, so to get something more or less decent in return is a win here. Obviously a win for the Oilers too.

 

[Mike Liut]

We are speculating too much to justify a dumb trade. We have no idea if he requested a trade or didn’t get a long with people.

 

[PJJJP]

We are speculating too much to justify a dumb trade. We have no idea if he requested a trade or didn’t get a long with people.

I honestly don't think Kostin produces the same if he stays on the blues. With us he would have been stuck in the AHL and only recently called up because of the injuries. We probably wouldn't have played him with top 6 players and I think that's the only reason Kostin is producing for the oilers. He is simply playing with better players who can make plays that he can finish. I don't think Berube would have put him on the top 2 lines. We already have Thomas/Buch/Kyrou and the 2nd line is Saad/Schenn/Barbashev. Maybe we could move Barbashev to the 3rd line but I don't think we would have done that. Kostin would have been stuck on the 3rd and 4th line.

 

[Blueston]

We are speculating too much to justify a dumb trade. We have no idea if he requested a trade or didn’t get a long with people.

I think it's clear he wanted to move on and his agent let that be known to DA. I would also point out that Kostin cleared waivers right before the trade. So not like other clubs valued him all that highly. We came to realization that he would never be the player here that we hoped and dealt him for another player that we thought might have a shot. If he blossoms elsewhere, so be it.

 

[Linkens Mastery]

Any success he had in Russia never fully translated to the Blues. They parted ways with him after training camp.

“I don’t know. Seriously, I don’t have an answer on this,” he said when asked why things didn’t work out in St. Louis. “You need to ask the coaching staff in St. Louis.”

He blames the coaching staff for his lack of production. Lol

 

[Thallis]

We are speculating too much to justify a dumb trade. We have no idea if he requested a trade or didn’t get a long with people.

Kostin is under .5 PPG while shooting almost 25%. Dude is not good.

 

[Mike Liut]

I honestly don't think Kostin produces the same if he stays on the blues. With us he would have been stuck in the AHL and only recently called up because of the injuries. We probably wouldn't have played him with top 6 players and I think that's the only reason Kostin is producing for the oilers. He is simply playing with better players who can make plays that he can finish. I don't think Berube would have put him on the top 2 lines. We already have Thomas/Buch/Kyrou and the 2nd line is Saad/Schenn/Barbashev. Maybe we could move Barbashev to the 3rd line but I don't think we would have done that. Kostin would have been stuck on the 3rd and 4th line.

I’m looking beyond this year when ROR, Tarasenko, Barbs and Acciari are gone

 

[Blueston]

I’m looking beyond this year when ROR, Tarasenko, Barbs and Acciari are gone

we are gonna be in a world of hurt next year. i don't think kostin moves the needle.

 

[TK 421]

I don't think there's a team in the league that hits on late 1st's as well as the Blues.

Not referencing Kostin necessarily, just in general our picks find their way onto NHL rosters with stunning regularity.

 

[Reality Czech]

I honestly don't think Kostin produces the same if he stays on the blues. With us he would have been stuck in the AHL and only recently called up because of the injuries. We probably wouldn't have played him with top 6 players and I think that's the only reason Kostin is producing for the oilers. He is simply playing with better players who can make plays that he can finish. I don't think Berube would have put him on the top 2 lines. We already have Thomas/Buch/Kyrou and the 2nd line is Saad/Schenn/Barbashev. Maybe we could move Barbashev to the 3rd line but I don't think we would have done that. Kostin would have been stuck on the 3rd and 4th line.

Agree. Hypothetically, if a rash of injuries on the Blues had forced Kostin into a middle six role for a month or two I'm sure his production would have gone up somewhat. But our forward depth has been so good in recent years, that all we really had to offer him was 4th line minutes. If he had been effective as a 4th liner he might have gotten a bump in ice time, but that never happened. He never really clicked or made an impact on most games.

Toropchenko fit in almost instantly and looked like he belonged, despite being worse offensively than Kostin. He does the things the coaches wanted Kostin to do and seems to "get it" a lot more than Kostin did. With Torpo, Leivo, Pitlick, Walker and others in the mix, Kostin became expendable and it makes total sense we would flip him for a similar prospect at a position where we need more help.

That being said, I'm not surprised Kostin is having more success in Edmonton. He may never be a star player, but he's definitely got more potential than he's shown so far.

 

[Majorityof1]

As a comparison to Kostin, look at Nichushkin. Both are big, strong, good skating Russian wingers. Nichushkin was a much higher pick and had much higher expectations. But he never fulfilled them as a youngster. He never hit .5 ppg in the NHL until last year when he was 26, He even went back to the KHL for a little bit. But he was a vital part of Colorado's 2nd level of talent on their cup team last year and is a ppg this season in albeit limited games due to injury.

Big players take longer to develop. Giving up on them for players with less potential who are also struggling is just dumb. We gave up on Tage, thankfully we got something good out of it. But look at him now. It took until he was 23/24 with over 100 NHL games to do antything, and now he is a top player in the league.

Development isn't straight line and isn't the same for all players. Saying a player is XX age so they are what they are has proven to be not true again and again. Even if it were true, why would you trade a player who hasn't hit on their potential for one with less potential who is further from their potential and the same age. It makes no sense. Saying Samorukov was a position of need is BS because if we needed him so bad, how come we haven't used him? Kostin would have been in NHL games if we kept him with our injuries. We have been just as injured on D, and we have not seen Samorukov.

 

[Brockon]

Any success he had in Russia never fully translated to the Blues. They parted ways with him after training camp.

“I don’t know. Seriously, I don’t have an answer on this,” he said when asked why things didn’t work out in St. Louis. “You need to ask the coaching staff in St. Louis.”

He blames the coaching staff for his lack of production. Lol

I think it dates back further than the current coaching staff. If I remember correctly, the Blues had asked Kostin to play his D+1 season (2017-18) in the OHL, I'd assume with the intent of giving him big minutes to adjust to the smaller ice surface and become more accustomed to the North American game. Additionally, he'd suffered a separated shoulder in his draft year limiting him to a total of 18gp across the KHL, VHL and MHL... Which likely contributed to management wanting to take a slower route with his development.

Kostin outright refused and insisted on an AHL placement, because he wanted the clear cut fast track to the NHL. I think his development never recovered and he didn't adjust to the north American game nearly as quickly as we'd hoped. Playing with a high IQ player like McDavid with an overwhelming amount of talent opens up space for Kostin to exploit more along the lines of the space available overseas.

 

[rumrokh]

As a comparison to Kostin, look at Nichushkin. Both are big, strong, good skating Russian wingers. Nichushkin was a much higher pick and had much higher expectations. But he never fulfilled them as a youngster. He never hit .5 ppg in the NHL until last year when he was 26, He even went back to the KHL for a little bit. But he was a vital part of Colorado's 2nd level of talent on their cup team last year and is a ppg this season in albeit limited games due to injury.

Big players take longer to develop. Giving up on them for players with less potential who are also struggling is just dumb. We gave up on Tage, thankfully we got something good out of it. But look at him now. It took until he was 23/24 with over 100 NHL games to do antything, and now he is a top player in the league.

Development isn't straight line and isn't the same for all players. Saying a player is XX age so they are what they are has proven to be not true again and again. Even if it were true, why would you trade a player who hasn't hit on their potential for one with less potential who is further from their potential and the same age. It makes no sense. Saying Samorukov was a position of need is BS because if we needed him so bad, how come we haven't used him? Kostin would have been in NHL games if we kept him with our injuries. We have been just as injured on D, and we have not seen Samorukov.

Reasonable. Except. Bortuzzo is shockingly bad. Tucker and Rosen have been better basically on a minute-by-minute basis. Yet Rosen sat for Bortuzzo and Tucker was sent down for him. Sometimes those decisions are based on contract/cap stuff, but sometimes teams just stick with certain players to their detriment. Maybe they actually ought to play Samorukov? I can't say either way, but multiple teams make bad personnel calls every year. It's possible it was a fine or even good trade unrelated to that.