Biggest national team snubs ever?

[Howie Hodge]

.....except Hull and Deadmarsh have American mothers and are dual-citizens.

So does Jason Pominville...

 

[Bjorn Le]

Galchenyuk not playing for Russia at the World Juniors. Wikipedia is wrong when it says he has a Belarussian mother and doesn't have Russian citizenship, he gave an interview during his draft year where he said his mother was Russian and he was a dual USA-Russia citizen. He was born in the US, moved away as a baby, and didn't come back until he was 15, when he played for six months in Chicago in order to be eligible for the domestic OHL draft. Has lived in Canada ever since. He's played in the US for less than Crosby did as a child (Crosby attended Shattuck).

Hull bothers me more than people like Deadmarsh or Pomminville because Hull was actually a superstar, and that Hull considers himself to be Canadian, and freely admits that his decision to play for the US has nothing to do with feeling more attached to the country. And to boot, his mother, who is his only link to the states, stayed in Canada after her separation from Bobby. She became as Canadian as any other.

Trottier on Team USA in 1984. Born and raised in Canada, PLAYED for Canada three years earlier. Decides to play on team USA in a country he hadn't even lived in for a decade yet.

Olaf Kolzig. He might be known for being born in South Africa but he was raised in Canada. Was it something along the lines of Robyn Regehr (born in Brazil because his father was a missionary but raised in Canada) because he was Canadian tried and true. But he plays in Germany? Again this was based on his mother's citizenship or something like that? I get it, Kolzig knows he probably isn't cracking Canada, but so what?

Trottier says it's because of his American wife, but I suspect there might have been a more mercenary motive behind his decision. Got American citizenship through his indigenous descent from a group that was located on both sides of the border.

Kolzig couldn't represent Canada because he didn't have Canadian citizenship. Still doesn't as far as I'm aware. His parents are both German (born in Germany). There was quite a significant number of European immigrants to South Africa in the 1960s (high skill labour imports basically), but many of those families didn't stay and moved to Canada in the 1970s and 1980s (increasing violence, instability and international isolation among the push factors). Steve Nash came to Canada for similar reasons. It's also very likely Kolzig would have played for Canada at the World Juniors and several World Championships if he had applied for Canadian citizenship.

Or the best Canadian soccer player ever, Owen Hargreaves. England's best player at the 2010 World Cup.

Certainly not the only Canadian who decided to play for someone else for career reasons. Lennox Lewis (who represented GB as a pro because it was more marketable), Greg Rusedski, etc.

 

[JackSlater]

Kolzig couldn't represent Canada because he didn't have Canadian citizenship. Still doesn't as far as I'm aware. His parents are both German (born in Germany). There was quite a significant number of European immigrants to South Africa in the 1960s (high skill labour imports basically), but many of those families didn't stay and moved to Canada in the 1970s and 1980s (increasing violence, instability and international isolation among the push factors). Steve Nash came to Canada for similar reasons. It's also very likely Kolzig would have played for Canada at the World Juniors and several World Championships if he had applied for Canadian citizenship.

I've read that Kolzig was in the process of trying out for the Canadian junior team (perhaps not on ice but one of the guys Hockey Canada was talking with) before either side realized that he wasn't eligible. No idea if Kolzig ever would have played for Canada had he been eligible though.

 

[Bjorn Le]

I've read that Kolzig was in the process of trying out for the Canadian junior team (perhaps not on ice but one of the guys Hockey Canada was talking with) before either side realized that he wasn't eligible. No idea if Kolzig ever would have played for Canada had he been eligible though.

Not sure, but doesn't surprise me. If he moved to Canada when he was 7-8, it wouldn't be that crazy that Hockey Canada assumed he was a citizen. I don't know if he personally would have chosen Canada (he grew up speaking German at home and identifies as German), but on skill alone he would have made multiple team Canada. Not the Olympic team, but WJC and WC at least.

 

[Milos Krasic]

I don't know about snub, but it's kind of strange if you think about Vyacheslav Kozlov. He basically only played the 1996 World Cup (1 game at the 1994 WC).

 

[Big Phil]

Trottier says it's because of his American wife, but I suspect there might have been a more mercenary motive behind his decision. Got American citizenship through his indigenous descent from a group that was located on both sides of the border.

I often wonder, if there were other reasons. Sather was coaching Canada in 1984 and we all know about that Oilers/Isles rivalry. There was pure hate there, even in that Canada Cup dressing room. Does that factor in for an Islander not wanting to play for a team coached by an Oiler? I think it is underrated just how much disdain the Isles had for a team that robbed them of 5 straight.

 

[Big Phil]

Leaving Giroux off was a mistake. I am guessing that there were a few factors. Giroux hurt his hand in the summer and missed the summer camp and his 2013 season wasn't as strong as his 2012 season or his 2014 season. Canada also historically goes for playmakers at centre and speed/size/goal scoring on the wing, meaning that playmaking wingers (St. Louis most prominently, also Recchi a few times) get cut and playmaking centres (think Francis, Oates, Savard in the past) often get cut. Of course though Giroux has played well for Canada in the past and he actually did have significant wing experience in addition to his experience at centre. Giroux's tremendous season this year as a LW makes the Kunitz selection look even worse. The 2014 team was very well picked overall though.

Giroux and Crosby really had a rivalry going in the 2012 playoffs. Lots of animosity there. Giroux accused Crosby of hacking his wrists constantly on faceoffs which caused him some problems. That could have played into it as well.

 

[Big Phil]

Tyler Myers, that one still bothers me to this day...

Grew up half in the States and half in Canada, no? That one at least has some merit. He learned the game of hockey up here, so I can understand that one.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

Grew up half in the States and half in Canada, no? That one at least has some merit. He learned the game of hockey up here, so I can understand that one.

So, I guess you don't have an issue with the Footes?

 

[jj cale]

So, I guess you don't have an issue with the Footes?

No real reason to have an issue with them for us, their Father is Canadian and it seems his children identify as such, you see Swedes players kids that grew up in Canada still play for Sweden.

The Foote boys are Canadian, they are playing for who they should play for, really respect them. All the Canadian players kids regardless of where they grew up should be playing for Canada, it's their birthright and duty to do so IMO.

 

[Eye of Ra]

Mark Messier, 1998 olympics.

 

[AmericanDream]

Grew up half in the States and half in Canada, no? That one at least has some merit. He learned the game of hockey up here, so I can understand that one.

no birthright. period.

 

[JackSlater]

So, I guess you don't have an issue with the Footes?

Hockey Canada shouldn't have anything to do with them, or Chychrun, or Comrie or a few others. USA has been the worst in this regard but I'm sure that every country would do it if given the opportunity. There is picking and choosing being done in the thread though, which is common. People usually absolve their own group of things that they wouldn't absolve others for.

 

[Big Phil]

No real reason to have an issue with them for us, their Father is Canadian and it seems his children identify as such, you see Swedes players kids that grew up in Canada still play for Sweden.

The Foote boys are Canadian, they are playing for who they should play for, really respect them. All the Canadian players kids regardless of where they grew up should be playing for Canada, it's their birthright and duty to do so IMO.

I can't say I know their story other than their dad is Canadian and he played partially in Canada then the U.S. What do they consider themselves to be? Where were they born?

 

[Big Phil]

no birthright. period.

Stan Mikita wasn't born in Canada. Neither was Dany Heatley. But they were raised here and learned the game here. So they are Canadian as the day is long as far as I am concerned. If I remember correctly Myers was 8 (?) when he came to Canada, no? That's got a lot of merit to play on team Canada and wouldn't that be the more likely choice?

 

[AmericanDream]

Stan Mikita wasn't born in Canada. Neither was Dany Heatley. But they were raised here and learned the game here. So they are Canadian as the day is long as far as I am concerned. If I remember correctly Myers was 8 (?) when he came to Canada, no? That's got a lot of merit to play on team Canada and wouldn't that be the more likely choice?

sorry, neither of them should have been able to.

either you can play for a country due to blood (mother/father) or you were born there and moved elsewhere...but just becoming a citizen...sorry that I will never agree with one bit. good for Myers if that is what he wants to do, but he has no birthright to play for Canada and she shouldn't be allowed to, nor anyone else reversed for the US. but that is me.

 

[JackSlater]

sorry, neither of them should have been able to.

either you can play for a country due to blood (mother/father) or you were born there and moved elsewhere...but just becoming a citizen...sorry that I will never agree with one bit. good for Myers if that is what he wants to do, but he has no birthright to play for Canada and she shouldn't be allowed to, nor anyone else reversed for the US. but that is me.

Heatley was only born in Germany because his parents, both Canadian as far as I know, were in the military. I find this take to be extremely strange overall, as if blood had nationality or birthplace had a significant impact on a player's hockey development. Those are two of the least relevant factors in where a player should play.

 

[AmericanDream]

Heatley was only born in Germany because his parents, both Canadian as far as I know, were in the military. I find this take to be extremely strange overall, as if blood had nationality or birthplace had a significant impact on a player's hockey development. Those are two of the least relevant factors in where a player should play.

those are my factors, plain and simple.

there are always extenuating circumstances or other situations that make sense - Heatley obviously makes more sense than Myers. Sean Day playing for USA makes sense, just doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

not here to debate what should/is - we have rules in place that is how it works. but I still see too many people bitching about players who were either born in a country or have parents born in that country who have the RIGHT to play for whichever one they want. don't have to like it I guess, but these are the rules.

I am also a firm believer in parents/bloodlines playing a big role in what you become- born with a God given skill - but that is a debate for another day.

 

[JackSlater]

those are my factors, plain and simple.

there are always extenuating circumstances or other situations that make sense - Heatley obviously makes more sense than Myers. Sean Day playing for USA makes sense, just doesn't mean I have to agree with it.

not here to debate what should/is - we have rules in place that is how it works. but I still see too many people *****ing about players who were either born in a country or have parents born in that country who have the RIGHT to play for whichever one they want. don't have to like it I guess, but these are the rules.

I am also a firm believer in parents/bloodlines playing a big role in what you become- born with a God given skill - but that is a debate for another day.

Even ignoring the nonsense that Mikita, who never played hockey before arriving in Canada and learned all of his hockey in Canada, shouldn't be eligible for Canada while someone like Pominville, who grew up and learned all his hockey in Canada and wanted to play for Canada and wasn't even aware that he was eligible to play for USA, should be eligible to play for USA because his mother had citizenship, this really makes no sense. I can understand being touchy because USA has disproportionately benefited from the situation and people are always going to bring it up, but it is a ridiculous take.

Given your last sentence you must also be burned up by Mark Howe and Brett Hull playing for USA given that we know where their natural ability came from.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

My personal take is if they are eligible so be it.

 

[AmericanDream]

Even ignoring the nonsense that Mikita, who never played hockey before arriving in Canada and learned all of his hockey in Canada, shouldn't be eligible for Canada while someone like Pominville, who grew up and learned all his hockey in Canada and wanted to play for Canada and wasn't even aware that he was eligible to play for USA, should be eligible to play for USA because his mother had citizenship, this really makes no sense. I can understand being touchy because USA has disproportionately benefited from the situation and people are always going to bring it up, but it is a ridiculous take.

Given your last sentence you must also be burned up by Mark Howe and Brett Hull playing for USA given that we know where their natural ability came from.

Both with American mothers, so yes I firmly believe their heritage of a mixture of the two helped them to be the players they were...have to be born with it, and they were.

 

[JackSlater]

Both with American mothers, so yes I firmly believe their heritage of a mixture of the two helped them to be the players they were...have to be born with it, and they were.

Mixture of what? Blood is blood, it has no nationality. They are sons of two of the greatest physical specimen in hockey history, it's fairly obvious where their hockey ability came from. That doesn't matter anyway given the ridiculous nature of using blood as a criteria.

 

[AmericanDream]

My personal take is if they are eligible so be it.

yep, I don't bitch about this stuff, just have my personal beliefs on it- these kids typically make these decisions based on what helps them advance their career farther and I can't fault them. I am sure they have a sense of pride for one country or the other, but there are rules in place for a reason as long as the qualify with them then there is nothing to say on it...unfortunately that doesn't stop some on here from bitching over them.

 

[Uncle Rotter]

Tony Esposito in 1981. Same reasons. They got dual citizenship by playing on an American team. But you learned the game - and all the money that came with it - in Canada. Plus Esposito played for Canada as well.

According to Tony, it was Bill Wirtz's idea.

 

[Uncle Rotter]

Hull is at least better than Deadmarsh. With Deadmarsh he was born and raised in Canada and played his junior hockey in Canada (although it was technically Portland but it was the CHL none the less). He admits to cheering for Canada in the 1991 Canada Cup vs. USA. Two years later when Canada doesn't pick him for their WJC team and he plays for Team USA three times.

Fun fact: he didn't score a point in his first two appearances.