WhatTheDuck
9 - 20 - 8
JVR wasn't a rental at the time so your point is completely irrelevant to the discussion of his current value.
Value of: Auction: James van Riemsdyk
- Thread starter DougGilmour93
- Start date
JVR wasn't a rental at the time so your point is completely irrelevant to the discussion of his current value.
You're right. And I was being pretty tongue in cheek with the comment. I thought that was pretty obvious.
Point is there will never be a perfect precedent. There's passable 2nd pairing D that might be worth about the same as JVR. I've already said I don't think Vatanen will happen. So why is everyone so up tight?
WhatTheDuck
9 - 20 - 8
It's not always easy to tell who's attempting to be taken seriously around here, I missed the sarcasm this time.
I'd go a step further and say JVR could bring back more than just a passable top 4 guy, if such a player likewise only had a year left on their deal.
But I'm not even asking for a perfect precedent of a rental winger bringing back a legit top 4 D with term, how about even a loose one? No one is uptight, all I'm asking is why would anyone "expect" JVR to bring back a quality top 4 D with three years of term, without anything resembling a precedence for a player in his situation fetching such a return? Is there any reasoning behind that expectation other than need and hope?
PensPlz
Registered User
Ok, that's fair. I should maybe add the sarcasm icon, but that looks rude to me whenever I see it. No worries.
I think we probabky agree in principal here. JVR could probably lad a 2nd pairing D. But no, I don't think many (if any) expect it will be a young guy with term on a good deal.
But there has been a lot of defenders flying around in trades and trade rumors. So maybe one lands in TO amid the turmoil. I, for one, would be happy with less than Vatanen.
Wish there were more bids in this auction thread. Because the idea seems to be to let other teams set the price, not have Leafs post their hopes and dreams.
JVR isn't worth a 1st + 2n 2nd (so less value then Hamonic) BTW, there is no way CGY finishes top10 in the league next season. CHi-PIT-NSH-WSH-NYR-SJS-CBJ-MTL-EDM-STL-MIN are all teams thata re practicly at 100% sure to finish ahead of the CGY Flames
Scandella (a good top4) was traded eith a CAP DUMP (hence lowering his value)
Hjalmarsson is a great #4 that was also traded for CAP REASON, and Hawks got a youngr bottom pairing with top4D upsaide AND a good bottom 6er for him
Schlemko and Emelin arent top4D
Methot MIGHT be the only one here where his value COULD be similar to JVR unless you want to get a bad contract along with said top4D (ala Scandella)
NOONE will give the Leafs a top4D for a pending 8M$ UFA
Well done. Very well done.
The Habs have been entertaining enough this off-season that even non-habs fans know whats happening over there
.To the rest of this JVR will return a top 4 d/no he won't debate... I'm gonna go against my fellow leafs fans here. I just can't see it happening. I mean who is potentially available at this point and would the team they are on give up a middle pairing guy for 1 year of JVR? Not likely. The only ones I can think of are demers or bogosian. Both are pretty risky acquisitions for JVR who is a very low risk acquisition both in terms of consistency and term. I can't believe how little hjalmarsson went for. We should've been in on that, but he's gone now.
I think we can get a good futures package... and I still absolutely think we should trade JVR for that. Don't get me wrong he's a valuable player and we could use him... but if we keep JVR, Rychel and Leivo are as good as gone for nothing. They need waivers and we can't fit them on the roster. Sure they aren't JVR, but we have some offensive depth, and particularly winger depth. Moving JVR doesn't hurt as much as losing a player of his talents normally does, and trading him not only recoups assets, but avoids losing a fairly promising young guy for nothing. If we can get a guy like fabbro (just an example, NSH fans seem to want a C more), possibly even with a pick then I'm pretty happy.
If we really want a top 4 guy, trade for a prospect who projects as one and already has a year or two of development under their belt. Sure they aren't ready now... they also come cheaper, and are on an ELC when they break in. I want the leafs to be good now too, that doesn't mean our window is ending now. If we can trade a year of JVR for a top 4 guy with years of team control and a cheap contract with the only downside being we have to wait say 2 years for the guy to break in we should be doing that. We are one season, a great season but one season, removed form last place. We should still be trading UFAs we have the depth to replace for young assets in areas of need.
Depends what picks you are talking about... JVR isn't returing 5th overall, but he's sure as hell worth more than #31 and #61.
And I'll be shocked if every team you listed finishes ahead of the flames... absolutely shocked. NSH only picked later because they made the finals, WSH just lost half their top 6 D, NYR C depth is trash all of a sudden. Is SJS better than last year? MTL still has an issue with scoring and they gave up as much as they acquired. Unless drouin plays C their depth down the middle is still horrible. I'm not saying Calgary will finish ahead of all these teams, but Calgary is one team that lost nothing to expansion, and has definitively gotten better this off season. A bunch of the teams you listed are definitely worse than they were last year. If you think every one will finish ahead of Calgary I just don't see it happening...
Tripod
I hate this team
Yeah well the draft just passed so the Leafs missed that window. Now they have to hope a team has an extra top 4 Dman they want to move this summer. Hmmm....not a lot of options.
So that leaves in season and the deadline. Contenders are not trading D depth for a possible rental. Like always, they will trade picks/prospects for rentals.
Sens of Anarchy
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- Jul 9, 2013
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Market value is constantly changing. There are no absolutes.. I said a 1st + , the + is not huge. Do you have a better offer? I don't particularly care what might have happened in a situation you think is comparable which you have not identified to peg his value,,,so this offer is not fair is all you are saying...give me something to work with.
supermann_98
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To
James Van Riemsdyk
To
1st Round Pick 2018
I'll take that lottery ticket
supermann_98
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supermann_98
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Leafs24Seven*
Registered User
I do not blame you, JVR would hurt your chances at a top lottery pick.
#tankcity
Leafs24Seven*
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Leafs24Seven*
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Halla
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yup. the guy who has it in for the leafs has it backwards.
JVR for Hamonic was the offer. Isles asked about the leafs 1st, leafs said no dice.
leafs are very fortunate Nonis/Burkie arent running the team anymore because we wouldnt have JVR or Liljegren
Halla
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- Jan 28, 2016
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The Leafs are not about to help Buffalo and that trade would be helping you twice!
I like the inclusion of the 1st rd pick though. Buffalo pretty much always picks in the top 10
Leafs24Seven*
Registered User
Not when you are getting a full season and playoffs out of him and at that very low cap hit for what he brings. A contending team needing a top 6 LW would be much better with a JVR on their team.
I hope the Leafs find a way to keep him, it pretty much ensures Hyman drops off the top line and Marleau or JVR joins Matthews and Nylander.
Leafs24Seven*
Registered User
I like the inclusion of the 1st rd pick though. Buffalo pretty much always picks in the top 10
Great point!
Just curious ,there's no way Winnipeg can have Buff,Myers,Trouba on there right side past next year right? Thats roughly 20 mill on there right side going forward. I think the leafs would hope to offer something for either Myers or Trouba.
Sens of Anarchy
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Hunter368
RIP lomiller1, see you in the next life buddy.
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All depends on two things:
- Trouba signing long term or not.
- Myers health
If Trouba signs long term, decent chance Myers is traded. If Trouba clearly won't resign & Myers is healthy, maybe Trouba is traded. If Myers health sucks & Trouba won't resign long term, Jets likely keep Trouba for three more years until he's a UFA. Perfect world Trouba resigns long term this summer and Myers is traded next summer (When Trouba's stupid cheap contract ends & his new big contract would start). As long as there's any hope to resign Trouba he won't be traded barring a MASSIVE return (Marner/Nylander wouldn't cut it). Worse case we keep Trouba (#1D) for three more years and then trade him for a good return.
No interest in trading either this year, we still have about 11 million in cap space to spare last time I checked.
Not sure why you posted this in the jvr thread, hope your not thinking we would any part of jvr as a return on Trouba. No interest in jvr, period.
CupsOverCash
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DougGilmour93
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Could a sign a trade work with JVR heading to Carolina to play with his brother? If so, could we pry a dman from them?
Pesce?
Faulk?
Hanifan?
Slavin?
What would need to be added to acquire one of the above.
Or what could Carolina add if we went in a different direction and tried to acquire youth/picks?
Bean?
McKeown?
Pesce?
Faulk?
Hanifan?
Slavin?
What would need to be added to acquire one of the above.
Or what could Carolina add if we went in a different direction and tried to acquire youth/picks?
Bean?
McKeown?
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